Digital Storm Twister @ [H] Consumer

Digital Storm Twister - As [H] Consumer gets rolling again after the holiday break, we bring you another new integrator that you might have seen in review magazines. It’s performed strongly there, but let’s see how it holds up under the [H] Consumer magnifying glass.

"This was our first experience with Digital Storm, and it was on-the-whole very positive. We’d like to see some changes in the purchasing process, but almost everything post-sale was well done. Digital Storm delivered a stable, very well-priced gaming machine. While there aren’t many “extras” that set the Twister Lite apart from the masses of systems that cross our evaluation tables, it did a fairly good job of doing exactly what we paid for it to do."

Trung?!
Is she the Digital Storm technical-support Orc? jk
Anyway, it was good to see a system that came through with no issues besides sloppiness.
Is that massive VGA cooler really necessary? I don't have much experience with the 7900 series, are they that hot to need this kind of cooling?

In my opinion most videocards benefit from aftermarket coolers like that Zalman unit. They usually drop temps by about 10C, and are very quiet. I've always used aftermarket coolers on my videocards. They're more for noise reduction than cooling, though they do drop temps significantly.

Yes, it's necessary (IMO). The 7900 GT's stock coolers from the majority of the board partners plain SUCK, they're often quite loud (not Radeon dustbuster loud but still..). Also, if they're higher line models, and set for a ~1.4v (vs NVIDIA spec of 1.2v ?) core they heat up VERY quickly on the OEM cooler (either the 'normal' one or the slightly better one that covers the memory) -- all in all inadequate for such powerful cards (the GTX/GTO coolers are leaps and bounds better!). Hence why Gigabyte sticks the Zalman (VF700 it looks like?) unit on their 7900 GTs (at least that particular model) from the factory.

ON TOPIC though, fairly nice review (and system). Still doesn't make me want to not build-my-own, but I could consider them (maybe) if someone wanted a recommendation for a pre-built system that will see more than M$ Word or something. I don't like the fact that a lot of the SIs like to tack on an extra charge for better wiring either, they should as mentioned at least do a bit better job in tidying up without upping the cost. I have to agree with the tackiness of the switch placement too, I did that when I had a UV CC in my setup -- only because I was lazy and don't own a dremel (nor appropriate hole saw/bits @ the time).

Lastly, CoolMax . The one thing that would make me not touch their systems with a 10-foot-pole..And depending on the model, the 550w TT PSUs as well (yes if they're at least one of the CWT made models; just got in an Armor case last night tho so not totally anti TT ).

Out of curiosity, what kind of credit card problems did you have? It seems like you have to resolve some sort of CC problem with every system you buy...

The devil, it appears, is in the details--there are lots of little niggles with this system. An open accessories box (which seems like a fluke). A not-perfectly-neat windows sticker (is it possible to apply one of those so it doesn't look sloppy?). Less-than-impressive wire management (although not bad, to be honest). A switch floating in the middle of the case (what the...?).

However, having read the review, I don't think I would have any problems recommending Digital Storm. They delivered a custom-built, nice-looking, stable system and great support for a very reasonable price.

That tech support stuff was hilarious to read. Nicely done! I'd use them if I wasnt building myself.

Good review... completely boring, utterly vanilla system and integrator.

[H]ard OCP said:

However, be aware that you will likely have to upgrade your power supply, as 450W won't cut it for demanding cards.

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Kyle, I'm going to ask what I think is an obvious question: If a system with an 8800GTX at full load is using 345 watts from the wall (which, assuming it's got 80% efficiency, means the actual system draw is a mere 276 watts), then why wouldn't a 450 watt PSU (and I'm assuming the PSU is a quality PSU) be more than enough for "demanding cards"? Given that PSUs are rated by their output, not what they draw from the socket, I don't see why the included PSU couldn't handle any of the upcoming DX10 cards.

If your estimate of 150 watts for the 8800gtx is from the wall, then it could probably handle SLI, though you'd only have about 50 or 60 watts to spare (again, I'm assuming this PSU is accurately rated). If it's from the PSU, it'd still be under 450 watts, but barely.

Dark Prodigy said:

Good review... completely boring, utterly vanilla system and integrator.

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I'm not sure that's fair at all.

I just priced out a build there with a Striker Extreme, 8800 GTX, 2G Crucial 1066 and upgraded cooling for ~$2500. They have a very nice selection of components.

For that price you get alot of quality components and perhaps more importantly, some obvious stress and compatibility testing prior to shipping. Given the 680i problems these days getting a guaranteed fast + stable rig with those components is hardly insignificant.

Fair is fair! Price that stuff out yourself and you are looking at least at ~$2300?

EDIT:
Whoops that was at iBuyPower, the LAST place on earth I'd ever order from. NEVERMIND!!!!

SECOND EDIT:
For DigitalStorm -> StrikerExtreme, 8800 GTX, 2GB Corsair 800 XMS2, 750W PCPC on air = $2737. Still very pretty good price.

nilepez said:

Kyle, I'm going to ask what I think is an obvious question: If a system with an 8800GTX at full load is using 345 watts from the wall (which, assuming it's got 80% efficiency, means the actual system draw is a mere 276 watts), then why wouldn't a 450 watt PSU (and I'm assuming the PSU is a quality PSU) be more than enough for "demanding cards"?

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The trick comes in how much current the PSU can supply on each rail. Modern CPUs and GPUs both suck most of their power off the 12V rail (CPUs used to pull off the 5V and 3.3V rails). And while your PSU may be able to supply 450W total, it may not be able to satisfy the demand on the 12V rail.

Less-than-honest manufacturers will get the wattage rating for a PSU by adding up the maximum power each rail can supply. The problem is that nearly all PSUs cannot supply maximum power on all rails at the same time. For example, your +12V rail may be rated at 20A (for 240W total) and your +5V rail at 20A (for another 100W), but you'll see something on the PSU label that says "maximum combined power from 12V and 5V rails: 250W" or somesuch.

Mohonri said:

The trick comes in how much current the PSU can supply on each rail. Modern CPUs and GPUs both suck most of their power off the 12V rail (CPUs used to pull off the 5V and 3.3V rails). And while your PSU may be able to supply 450W total, it may not be able to satisfy the demand on the 12V rail.

Less-than-honest manufacturers will get the wattage rating for a PSU by adding up the maximum power each rail can supply. The problem is that nearly all PSUs cannot supply maximum power on all rails at the same time. For example, your +12V rail may be rated at 20A (for 240W total) and your +5V rail at 20A (for another 100W), but you'll see something on the PSU label that says "maximum combined power from 12V and 5V rails: 250W" or somesuch.

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Ok, well I'm assuming this PSU is a quality product. Though with that said, I completely forgot to consider that almost none can deliver full power over the 12v rail. That said, I'm not certain how much of the power is from other rails (which makes an exact estimate difficult). I know that an OCZ 450 can handle over 300w on the 12v rail, which is certainly enough for an 8800gtx (given the review of that card).

But I withdraw my question, because I now get the impression that the PSU in this system is an OK psu, but not up to the OCZs, Antecs and seasonics of the world (to name but a few quality brands).

ToddMcF2002 said:

I'm not sure that's fair at all.

I just priced out a build there with a Striker Extreme, 8800 GTX, 2G Crucial 1066 and upgraded cooling for ~$2500. They have a very nice selection of components.

For that price you get alot of quality components and perhaps more importantly, some obvious stress and compatibility testing prior to shipping. Given the 680i problems these days getting a guaranteed fast + stable rig with those components is hardly insignificant.

Fair is fair! Price that stuff out yourself and you are looking at least at ~$2300?

.

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Well, if pricepoint and bargains are all of what you look for in a PC then fine. I never said it was overpriced. I DID say boring and utterly vanilla becuase I think its true. If someone wants a prebuilt system with off-the-shelf parts with minimum premium, then that's ok for THEM. Just not ok for ME.

When I browsed around the Digital Storm website, design and integration of their systems are built in a way that any of us can pick up parts from newegg and build ourselves..and most of us do. If I am buying a pre-built system, I need something from the integrator that sets them apart from the rest. Meaning what can your system offer me besides a warranty and the hassle of not building it myself. What makes your brand of boutique PC stand out....

IMO boutique PC's should be stylish, finely tuned, stable and branded with the integrators identity..and Digital Storm is NOT all those things...

Hmm...got out of work and finish eating dinner. Got a chance to read the whole article; good read. I appreciate your kind remarks regarding the technical support issues.

"Trung?!
Is she the Digital Storm technical-support Orc? jk"

My oh my...that gave me a good laugh. I'm not sure if that is a typo or not, but last I check...I'm a guy. My life for the hoard?

I would agree with what Dark Prodigy said. A computer enthusiast would know how to build all these things, but would he actually pay a very high premium for the "wow" factor....IMO, I dont think they will. Some changes will be rolling out for those that are willing to pay a premium for the wow factor.

Hi Trung!

The Article said:

If one of our moms call for tech support, she might be willing to be walked through the hands-on work inside the system, but she’ll also do exactly what she’s told. She might fry the system and create a whole new set of problems.

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Your mom plays BF2 and Oblivion??


Seems like a good integrator, Recommended is well deserved and points for their techie hanging out at the [H]!

Seems like a solid enuf computer. Some of the trash you guys review is pretty sad, this company seems like they offer a fairly good value and can back it up with some techs that actually know a thing or two about computers. Its mildly refreshing in itself!

daftie said:

Hi Trung!


Your mom plays BF2 and Oblivion??


Seems like a good integrator, Recommended is well deserved and points for their techie hanging out at the [H]!

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I think you misunderstand the article. My mom doesnt play BF2 or Oblivion, but I do wish she play some kind of games. Maybe then, she wouldnt complain when I start buying computer parts.

Josh_Norem said:

In my opinion most videocards benefit from aftermarket coolers like that Zalman unit. They usually drop temps by about 10C, and are very quiet. I've always used aftermarket coolers on my videocards. They're more for noise reduction than cooling, though they do drop temps significantly.

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One thing that gets me. The video card that shipped with the system had a zalman heatsink on it but your "rma" was a new card. Did they install an aftermarket cooler on it and ship it to you or did it come with a stock heatsink? If it came with a stock heatsink I would think that would be a knock against them.

Other then that a good review and what seems to be a pretty good setup. Kinda weird though how they covered up some of the rear ports yet didn't cover up the audio ports they were not going to use.

Regarding the "confusing" PowerDVD-envelope for the Gigabyte drivers disc:
At least since the 6800-series Gigabyte includes PowerDVD on their drivers disc, so the envelope comes with a serial number for it.
That´s hardly something new, but it is something I would expect to be known by HardOcp-stuff.

Otherwise I think the machine is well suited for someone who has the money to buy a decent pc but not the time or the knowledge to put it all together. A disc image of the freshly installed machine would´ve been nice though. And why not just leave the free versions of the benchmarking utilities on the hd? This way, the customer could verify if the machine is really as powerful as stated in the binder (otherwise, some dumb nitpickers could start lamenting on how the pc was supposed to achieve 10 more points in 3dm2k99).

Purchasing, Packaging, and Presentation - 5/10

Seems a bit harsh. Their website is not that bad.

jackknife said:

Regarding the "confusing" PowerDVD-envelope for the Gigabyte drivers disc:
At least since the 6800-series Gigabyte includes PowerDVD on their drivers disc, so the envelope comes with a serial number for it.
That´s hardly something new, but it is something I would expect to be known by HardOcp-stuff.

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What was confusing ("interesting" was the word we chose, I believe) is that the video card driver disc was put in a Cyberlink sleeve. This means they were flip-flopping the media around - it wasn't confusing because we knew exactly what happened, but it smacked of laziness and a lack of attention to detail.

Goaty said:

Purchasing, Packaging, and Presentation - 5/10

Seems a bit harsh. Their website is not that bad.

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That score did not only pertain to their site. Although it's one of the more convoluted, a big part of the penalty here was that they did not package the materials correctly and they spilled out all inside the box.

DragoonTD said:

I think you misunderstand the article. My mom doesnt play BF2 or Oblivion, but I do wish she play some kind of games. Maybe then, she wouldnt complain when I start buying computer parts.

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You got me all wrong Trung (s'ok)

I quoted the article, and meant the author's mom plays those games, as a joke.

Get your mom into yahoo! games and tell her she needs WC in her next upgrade to play the next version of whatever she's addicted to

Nice way to use the multi quote button there, Mr. Editor.

As far as the zalman heatsink, that is stock for the gigabyte 7900GT. Little things like the packaging not being inside should be taken care of. Btw, I'm not speaking on behalf of the company or anything. Just speaking from what I know. The company has made some changes to packaging before we even knew the system was getting reviewed. As far as I know, that gigabyte disc came with the powerdvd serial # because the cd has powerdvd as one of their software. But I could be wrong.

DragoonTD said:

Hmm...got out of work and finish eating dinner. Got a chance to read the whole article; good read. I appreciate your kind remarks regarding the technical support issues.

"Trung?!
Is she the Digital Storm technical-support Orc? jk"

My oh my...that gave me a good laugh. I'm not sure if that is a typo or not, but last I check...I'm a guy. My life for the hoard?

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LOL. Sup, T. Thanks for taking the joke, I was afraid someone might take it personal. I thought I read 'she' in the article. Ah well. Zug Zug!
And thanks for the feedback, it's always nice to see someone from the company stopping by...
Especially a pretty decent tech, which are few and far between these days.

Great review as always. A few observations:

I don’t see anything wrong with more options for the customer. I don’t know why HardOcp feels so strongly that even the budget integrators should offer a certain level of wiring neatness. Some people don’t care if the wiring is neat or not – they save $18. If you do care, pay the $18. It seems the best of both worlds. I never understand advocating for less choice because one of the options is not a choice you personally would make.

Like Goaty I also thought the 5/10 score was harsh. Having configured systems at all of HardOcp’s favorites I didn’t see a big difference. Leaving the accessories box open while not great resulted in no damage to the system. And unlike many reviewed machines the DS had no component failures that were possibly connected to shipping.

The biggest DS omission for me is the Disk Image.

@toystwo.
About the wiring, I made the same arguments about one of the previous systems (the Ajump, thread found here: http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1132678 ), and there was a pretty good discussion as to why[H] finds wiring important. It was insightful, definitely check it out.

Modred189 said:

@toystwo.
About the wiring, I made the same arguments about one of the previous systems (the Ajump, thread found here: http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1132678 ), and there was a pretty good discussion as to why[H] finds wiring important. It was insightful, definitely check it out.

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I had previously read the Ajump comments. Those are all good points for why clean wiring is desirable. It doesn't change the fact that everyone may not desire it or want to pay for it (some people do not perform upgrades, have case windows, are OK with moving wiring out of the way to save $18, etc., etc.,). The point is personal choice. Having a choice is not a bad thing and it makes no sense to me to portray it as such.

HardOcp clearly places a high value on clean wiring -- why not check the $18 dollar option when ordering as other consumers will do who also value clean wiring?

toystwo said:

HardOcp clearly places a high value on clean wiring -- why not check the $18 dollar option when ordering as other consumers will do who also value clean wiring?

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We explained that the reason we did not check the $18 option is that we wanted to see what kind of work they would do on a windowed system. If it was an enclosed system and it had messy wiring, we wouldn't have cared TOO much. However, since it had a window, AND case lighting, and they pictured this system on their site as appearing a certain way - we wanted to see what we would get.

As we've stated, wire routing is one of the places we can look to see what kind of pride an integrator puts into their machines. Yes, some customers may not care that their system is clean, but if you order a machine not knowing that it has a sharp integration and finally get to look at it, you're generally going to be blown away. And that's what we believe the goal of a boutique integrator should be - to impress and please their customers from the get-go - regardless of whether we consider them to be a budget integrator or not.

Considering placing an order with these guys. The value looks very good, every consumer review i've seen over the last 3 months has been great and the fact that it's automatically 2 years parts and labor with lifetime support has me seriously looking to buy a similar system to the one reviewed this weekend.

We would like to express appreciation to the great team at HardOCP. Digital Storm is thrilled to be a piece of HardOCP’s authentic reviews.

---

HardOCP had thrown us off our chairs with the addressed issues in their whole user experience with Digital Storm. The reason being is that we actually implanted a whole new management system before HardOCP posted the review. It definitely felt great to know that we had already taken care of many of the issues HardOCP addressed.

1) Exterior of the shipping box was damaged: The new shipping boxes we are using have much more sturdy and thicker walls to greatly reduce the amount of holes or scrapes from courier transit.

2) Open accessories box: Our new shipping boxes do not have as much open room at the top. This will prevent the accessories box and binder to dislodge during transit from our facility to the end user. We also modified the locking mechanism for the flaps on the accessories box to prevent the box from opening so easily.

3) Quality Cabling: We agree that neat and organized cabling goes a long way towards improved air flow, easier upgrades, and the general quality of the craftsmanship. Our “Round Cable” upgrade for $18 adds the feature of replacing the flat bulky IDE ribbon cables with smaller round cables. Neat and organized cabling comes with every purchase, regardless if the order contains a round cable upgrade. We always try our best to ensure our wiring jobs are neat as possible; however, the CoolMax series of power supplies made it very difficult for us to achieve this goal. The CoolMax power supplies have very short power cable lengths. Due to this problem, it prevents us to properly route the cables throughout the chassis. As a side note, we have discontinued selling the CoolMax and have replaced it with a ThermalTake 550W.

4) Restore Disk: We moved to an image based restore solution. This allows the end user to restore his/her computer back to the original factory configuration with the latest drivers and software pre-installed.

5) Top Audio Ports: We are aware of this issue and are looking for someone to purchase a bulk of adapters to allow us to easily connect the Creative audio out connector on the sound card to the more common AC’97/HD Audio connector used in our builds. The Creative XtremeGamer allows us to directly connect the chassis connector onto the sound card without the use of a customized adapter. With the ease of impentation of this new feature, the Creative XtremeGamer is listed as “Recommended” on our website. This card is now also the default sound card for our Twister ULTRA series.

6) Latest Drivers: With the new management system we have implanted, we are now able to offer the latest: Chipset, Display, Audio, BIOS, and Physics drivers for our systems.

We are always looking for input and constructive comments from individuals to better improve the company in effectively providing an excellent customer experience. We thank you all for your inputs and anxiously wait for HardOCP to review our systems again in the future.

P.S.
For readers that are looking for more “class” in our products, we are launching our “Signature Series” very soon. This will be offered as an upgrade package and will include custom painting of the chassis and water-jet cutting of our logo on the front door.

Warm Regards,
Digital Storm Staff

@Digital_Storm: Great to see you guys taking HardOCP's criticisms head on and improving your product. I will be interested to read [H]'s next review of you guys

love it! another caring integrator! props

Dark Prodigy said:

Well, if pricepoint and bargains are all of what you look for in a PC then fine. I never said it was overpriced. I DID say boring and utterly vanilla becuase I think its true. If someone wants a prebuilt system with off-the-shelf parts with minimum premium, then that's ok for THEM. Just not ok for ME.

When I browsed around the Digital Storm website, design and integration of their systems are built in a way that any of us can pick up parts from newegg and build ourselves..and most of us do. If I am buying a pre-built system, I need something from the integrator that sets them apart from the rest. Meaning what can your system offer me besides a warranty and the hassle of not building it myself. What makes your brand of boutique PC stand out....

IMO boutique PC's should be stylish, finely tuned, stable and branded with the integrators identity..and Digital Storm is NOT all those things...

Click to expand...

i'd be curious to know, in your opinion, what is all those things?

spincut said:

i'd be curious to know, in your opinion, what is all those things?

Click to expand...

Glad you asked...


and my 2nd choice..
a close second...

Dark Prodigy said:

Glad you asked...


and my 2nd choice..
a close second...

Click to expand...

Well, don't forget, we are launching our Signature Series soon. Just to give everyone a sneak peak, here is a Twister ULTRA painted in a Ferrari Red with black anodized highlights.





P.S.
Our signature series will also have a custom cut logo on the front panel door.

Hi all,

New here, but wanted to thank you guys for the review of Digital Storm. Was looking at their site and a few other custom pc builders, did a google for a review and nicely surprised found your review of them. So I ordered myself a nice upgrade as I'm sick of building my own.
Ordered on Sunday, and quickly received two emails. One automated response, then one from a sales department saying my order was sent over so a tech could review it before they start work on it. Now for four days its sat with the status "Order has been processed. Computer configuration is currently being reviewed prior to assembly." .
Seems like a long time just for some tech to glance over the parts I requested and pass it along to be built. But hey I am pretty impatient, and the wait is between one and two weeks before shipping.
Will update here on my experience with DS here, if anyone is interested.

Just a Fool

PS Nice Red case, will be neat to see how the finished system looks.

ivanthefool

Please keep us updated. I will probably be ordering from them very soon.

ivanthefool said:

Hi all,

New here, but wanted to thank you guys for the review of Digital Storm. Was looking at their site and a few other custom pc builders, did a google for a review and nicely surprised found your review of them. So I ordered myself a nice upgrade as I'm sick of building my own.
Ordered on Sunday, and quickly received two emails. One automated response, then one from a sales department saying my order was sent over so a tech could review it before they start work on it. Now for four days its sat with the status "Order has been processed. Computer configuration is currently being reviewed prior to assembly." .
Seems like a long time just for some tech to glance over the parts I requested and pass it along to be built. But hey I am pretty impatient, and the wait is between one and two weeks before shipping.
Will update here on my experience with DS here, if anyone is interested.

Just a Fool

PS Nice Red case, will be neat to see how the finished system looks.

Click to expand...

Thanks for your comment on the red case. We have been backed up by orders from the holiday season, however, we are striving to do our very best to process orders as soon as possible. If it's been in that phase for a few days now, it's just on queue for the parts to be assigned from inventory and finally assembly. Our build times are 5-10 business days, so basically once we start to pull your order from inventory, the system will be shipped 5-10 business days from that date. We hope that clears everything out. There is no way we are going to rush systems, we rather ensure each and every system is nothing but the best before shipment. Your order should begin the build phase very soon though. We should be all caught up by today.

Thanks for the quick response DS. Does clear things up quite a bit.

Brassidus : I will post up pics of my new computer and toss in my 2 cents of a review once it arrives.

Just a Fool