subwoofer w/ receiver not working?

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SkaarjMaster

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I decided to start a new thread instead of continuing to add on to that other thread and go too far off topic.
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=975613

I have the Audigy2 on my computer with the analog connections and digital connections connected to an Onkyo TX-SR503 receiver with a Dayton 12" subwoofer. I'm using Klipsch 5.1 non-Ultra satellite speakers. The crossover frequency is still set to the default 100. I have the receiver set to Multichannel and I'm not getting any sound out of the subwoofer. I'm fairly certain the speakers are configured correctly as there's not much to do with the multichannel mode as it is automatic. I have the decoder set to pass-through in AudigyHQ as well. What could I be doing wrong? :confused:
 
If I'm not mistaken, this is a known issue with most every creative card..
If it's in the drivers use 'bass redirection'. The X-Fi I know has +15db redirection which usually corrects the problem.
 
Seems multichannel mode isn't working very well. I just tried some of the Onkyo Original DSP Listening modes and Studio-Mix, Orchestra and All Ch Stereo seems to work best. Seems the Gain setting on the back of the subwoofer (min to max settings) is actually volume and it sounds best just below the half-way point. This is with music being played in Winamp. I still need to try a game and a movie.
 
Are you in 5.1 mode on your reciever? If so.. the subwoofer is on a discreet channel and will only be used when content has LFE signal. Have you tried just sticking it in stereo and seeing if you have output from the sub? I would try a movie.. maybe you can find one with the THX startup.. this will output a LFE signal to your sub.

[edit: heh people replied before I was done.]
 
my advice is to use stereo mode for music, and the multi audio for gaming and movies that use 5.1 stereo always sounds best IN stereo, all that dsp stuff just makes it sound worse imho.
 
Maybe I just need to try the stereo listening mode for music (I see th3 godfather has already suggested this as I'm typing and after re-reading magnetik's post it says something similar) or will this just use two speakers. Studio-Mix sounds the best, but the Dolby PLII symbol is lit so this must mean it's not using the analog signal for this music. Anyone have any suggestions?

So, an mp3 may not have an LFE signal?

I get 2.1 sound with Stereo mode. :(

I will try a movie next. Hopefully, just hitting surround and it will go into auto mode for DTS-Dolby-whatever.
 
Unless anyone has any better ideas, I'm going with "Onkyo Original DSP All Channel Stereo" listening mode for music and games. I believe this is using the analog signal. I'll figure out how to get the Digital Auto setting working with movies later.

EDIT: Here's a link that discusses the DSP modes:
http://www.pcmall.com/pcmall/shop/detail~dpno~382645.asp

What I find strange is this on my receiver the Orchestra, Unplugged, Studio-Mix modes all have the dolby symbol and PLII lit up, but the All Ch Stereo mode does not. Aren't all these supposed to be enhanced analog signals of some kind? :confused:
 
SkaarjMaster said:
I decided to start a new thread instead of continuing to add on to that other thread and go too far off topic.
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=975613

I have the Audigy2 on my computer with the analog connections and digital connections connected to an Onkyo TX-SR503 receiver with a Dayton 12" subwoofer. I'm using Klipsch 5.1 non-Ultra satellite speakers. The crossover frequency is still set to the default 100. I have the receiver set to Multichannel and I'm not getting any sound out of the subwoofer. I'm fairly certain the speakers are configured correctly as there's not much to do with the multichannel mode as it is automatic. I have the decoder set to pass-through in AudigyHQ as well. What could I be doing wrong? :confused:
Click to expand...


I had the same problem with mine. IIRC, you have to go into the THX console and enable bass redirect and match the crossover frequecy to your rec. (I did use analog out)

I think I had to turn off bass redirect if I went dig coax. (I'm not sure there)
 
SkaarjMaster said:
What I find strange is this on my receiver the Orchestra, Unplugged, Studio-Mix modes all have the dolby symbol and PLII lit up, but the All Ch Stereo mode does not. Aren't all these supposed to be enhanced analog signals of some kind? :confused:
Click to expand...

Those signals are an upmix attempt by the receiver's DSP. I don't use them. All channel stereo sounds the cleanest.

Also, if you get the PLII light, it means your a getting the data from the dig coax. I like the analog out from the X-fi better. However, when I had my A2zs, I think I used the dig coax out also.

My best advice is to get a good analog 2.1 signal as your baseline. See what sounds best from there. There was a lot of trial and error for me.

Another thought, the rec has function called, "double bass" or "enhanced bass boost" somewhere in the speaker config. I believe that will split the sub signal from the analog (maybe digital too) front stereo input. Try that.............
 
Thanks, good info! I was told to turn off bass redirect as it can cause problems if not used correctly and it's not right for my situation I think. Also, I can't use double bass in my situation for some reason.

EDIT: Just got home from work and I'll use All Channel Stereo for music and games I think. The only thing that lights up with this is DSP. I changed the crossover frequency to 120 as well. The only thing I'm wondering about is why the subwoofer pops every time I turn it on. I have the subwoofer set to Auto. Maybe I need to set it to Off and just turn it on every time I turn the computer on? :confused:

EDIT AGAIN: Looks like the subwoofer has 3 settings (On/Auto/Off). Auto was giving the popping, so I just set it to off before turning the system on and once it's running I then turn it to Auto. Seems to be work so far, but is still kinda strange. Just looked at my volume control on the computer in Windows and it's at about 90%. Could this have something to do with it because I don't even turn the computer on and the subwoofer still pops with the setting at Auto? I dropped it to 70% anyway, because I remember it shouldn't be that high anyway.

EDIT ONCE AGAIN: I adjusted speaker distance without any problems. But then adjusted speaker levels and I get no test tone for the subwoofer and center channel. What's up with that? :confused:
 
Just a couple things. First, everything has been working fine since a couple days after my last edit to my post and I'm using All Channel Stereo mode with no problems. Second, today it seems the "All Channel Stereo" light doesn't want to stay lit with the DVD light as it has been doing since. Instead, the volume light stays now with the DVD light. I hit the listening mode button and it comes on briefly but then goes back to only the DVD, dsp and volume lights. Anyone know what's up with this? :confused: I don't see anything in the manual about it. I also don't notice any difference in the sound, so everything's still working it's just strange. Thank you.
 
install bare drivers ONLY and the Audio Console... that's it.... non of that THX crap and such... just the drivers and the Audio Console and you should be fine. Seems like I am the only one who does this and the only one without creative problems :cool:
 
Um, the problem has nothing to do with anything in the computer. Anyway, I figured it out. Apparently, my 14-month old son must have hit the "Display" button on the receiver. I just hit it this afternoon and it went back to displaying like it should. Not sure why this isn't in the manual though. :D
 
OK, it's been barely 3.5 years and not sure when it went, but I was playing a video game and no sound was coming from my two right speakers (two left and subwoofer are fine). OK, so I thought either both my right Klipsch satellites are shot at the same time or my receiver is toast. Well, it looks like I either have to get the right speaker connections fixed on my Onkyo TX-SR503 receiver or just get a new receiver. I'm using the analog connections off the Audigy2 5.1/6.1 for the 5.1 surround in games as well as using the digital for movies all plugged into my receiver. I have no idea what the warranty is on this thing, but it's probably not worth sending back. Is there a way to fix these connections or did something inside the receiver just go pop and I'm toast? The warranty I believe was only 2 years. Any ideas?

Maybe this as a possible replacement:
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_580TXS507B/Onkyo-TX-SR507.html?tp=179
 
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With regards to your subwoofer thing:

Two possibilities:

1) Many receivers don't do bass management or the like on multi-channel sources, or it is something you have to turn on manually. They just take the signals and output them as is to various channels. In this case you'll either need to see if you can turn it on for your receiver, or have your soundcard do the bass management.

2) You have your speakers set to "large". For some reason, receivers use weird terminology for bass management and do it in a silly fashion. If speakers go down to a certain point, usually like 60Hz or so, they decide the speaker is "large". What that means is that no bass redirection is done on that channel. Yes, it is rather stupid. So what you do is set all speakers to small, no matter what. That way they all get bass redirection done on them.


With regards to your receiver:

Probably no way to fix it. If you are good with a multimeter and a solder gun, maybe. Could be just a solder joint, maybe just a cap or two, who knows? However there isn't a simple "Do this and it'll be fixed," thing, you'd have to diagnose the problem.

You probably just need to get new hardware. If you like your receiver and don't want to get a new one, you might be able to just get a power amp. If the amp is what's blown, not the whole channel, then you can just use the line level outputs to connect to a new amp. However, not sure how worth it that is at the price point you are looking at.

In terms of receiver brands, you also might want to consider Denon. They seem to offer rather good features and quality for the money. I was looking at Denon and Onkyo, and settled on Denon.

In either case, you might want to order from 6ave.com. They are an official dealer for both, but seem to usually be able to beat Crutchfield's prices. Crutchfield has a very "the price is the price" attitude and it is usually near MSRP. 6th Ave advertises high prices on the website, but if you call them and request a lower price, they'll usually give you one. They knocked about 25% off of the website price for the Denon I ordered, which brought it in line with most budget, non-authorized places.
 
Thanks man! It seems like my subwoofer is fine, for some reason it was turned off and I have no idea why; I set it back to auto? (middle setting) and it's fine now. I'll definitely consider what you said and large and small though; I'm pretty sure I set it like I was supposed 3.5 years ago though.

Yep, I'll probably need a new receiver. Is there a power amp inside the receiver specifically for the right side speakers? If not, then I think I'm thinking this might not be my problem. The sound from the other 3 speakers still sounds great (and also from the subwoofer for that matter). I'll look around and also look at Denon. Ever look at PartsExpress for receivers?
 
Yes, there is an amp for every channel. Even when amps are stereo or multi-channel in over all design, each channel has its own separate amplification circuitry. As such it is possible for just a single channel to die. It also could be something earlier in the stage on the channel, the preamp stage might be dead in which case the channel is gone entirely. The only way to tell would be to hook the pre-out for that channel to something else and see if you are getting signal. If so, then just the amp is dead and you could buy a power amp if you wanted (in practice you'd likely get a stereo amp and hook both your left and right up to it). If there's no signal then the whole channel is dead and there's nothing you can do.

Nope, never ordered from PartsExpress. They carry only a few brands, none of which I own. I have a Yamaha receiver for my TV setup, and I have a Denon on order for my computer. The Yamaha I got from J&R, as I rather like them for audio stuff. The Denon they didn't have (they carry Denon receivers, but not the one I wanted) so I went with 6th Ave.

I am generally careful to order only from authorized dealers. All the audio companies claim you get no warranty service if you buy from an unauthorized dealer. I dunno how serious they are about that, but I'm not interested in finding out. I'll spend a bit more and get one I know is covered.
 
If your subwoofer has high level inputs, connect it directly to your front speaker amp outputs and turn off bass redirection in the driver.
Make sure your amp is set up for 5.0, not 5.1.
Windows only has 5.1 setting but when bass redirection is turned off, it sends sub bass and LFE to the other speakers. Not using the LFE channel makes it 5.0

Sub bass (and LFE) will now be fed to the other speakers if they are set to large (full frequency) on the PC and on the amps setup, so set the front pair to large and the others to small.
The high level feed to the sub from the front speakers will now contain all sound, therefore all bass, not just LFE bass.
So you need to set the subwoofers filters to only respond to lower bass, say up to 100Hz.

My subs are set up this way and it sounds TONS better than using the LFE channel only for the sub.
This is because there is a lot more sub bass than is present on the LFE channel and the sub can also respond to low bass (above sub bass) that is normally expected to come from the front speakers, thus bolstering all bass (configure the subwoofer to suit your bass taste).
The amplifier imparts its own character and timing to the sound which is passed on to the sub as well as the main speakers.
Your sub will now always be used, even when playing stereo, not just when there are Low Frequency Effects on the LFE channel.
 
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Nenu, I'll keep all that in mind if I have to get a new receiver. Hopefully, all this stuff is in the manual and is easily set (or in WinXP somewhere). I have no idea if my present receiver is set this way though and at this point will not matter until or if my 5.1 comes back.

Sycraft, "hook the pre-out for that channel to something else". I assume this is whatever is coming from the sound card on my computer. What should or can I hook this to in order to check?
 
No, it is on the receiver. Many receivers have a "pre-out" block. Basically there is an RCA connection for each channel, which allows you to feed it to an external amplifier. However, it looks like yours doesn't, it only has one for the subwoofer. That means that it doesn't really matter what is broken on the right channel, it is effectively useless to you now.

So you are back to getting a new receiver.
 
SkaarjMaster said:
Nenu, I'll keep all that in mind if I have to get a new receiver. Hopefully, all this stuff is in the manual and is easily set (or in WinXP somewhere). I have no idea if my present receiver is set this way though and at this point will not matter until or if my 5.1 comes back....
Click to expand...

Is there any reason you need a new receiver?
The method I described is dependent upon the subwoofer having high level inputs, thats all.
It will work with any receiver.
It doesnt take power from your main amp, the high level inputs on subs are designed to use high level just for the signal.
Subs use their own amplifier to power the speaker.

Also the method will only be described in the subwoofers handbook, not the amps.
 
Ummm, I would guess that he is using it as an amplifier because he has component speakers and sub. Not all subwoofers function as speaker amps. That's common for computer all-in-one setups, but not for real home theatre gear. The Dayton sub he has is such an item. It has an internal amp for itself, but no output for speakers.

As such, he needs an amp to deal with the speakers. For budget setups, a receiver is usually the way to go. Rather hard to get a 5-7 channel dedicated amp for less than a cheap receiver since dedicated amps tend to be "high end" components.

Also receivers can offer additional features. A simple one would be a nice volume knob, related to that would be a real preamplification stage (which some soundcards have, some don't). A more advanced one would be speaker setup and room correction. The Onkyo he's looking at has Audyssey 2EQ on it, which has two functions:

1) It calibrates your speaker setup. The main thing it handles that is a pain for most people to do manually is delays and levels. It measures how far away all your speakers are and sets the correct delays so the sound arrives at the same time. It also measures volume output, and adjusts the channel gain to make them all the same level. Gives a more cohesive sound field.

2) Corrects for frequency problems with your speakers/room. 2EQ doesn't have all that high resolution of a filter, but it can deal with some problems. So using it gives you a more flat, neutral sound.

For that matter, the advanced features of a receiver are the main reason for some people to own them. It is why I have a receiver on order. I've already got power amps running my speakers. However, I really want a system with MultEQ XT (a more advanced product like 2EQ). My choices are pretty much a $2500 dedicated MultiEQ equalizer, or a $1000 receiver. I elected to go the receiver route, since it is cheaper and also lets me ditch the amps I don't want (I'm keeping my front amp, getting rid of the other two probably).

Receivers are basically where you go when you want to move beyond computer surround systems. Computer speakers only go so high up the quality (and price) scale. Past that, you've got to go to something else. In most cases, that is a receiver as your control and amp, and then a set of speakers.
 
OK, I think I've narrowed it down to two receivers, but I may just have to get the Onkyo TX-SR507. It seems the Yamaha RX-V465 has 105w per channel and may be too much for my 60w Klipsch satellite speakers. Here are the links for each:

Onkyo TX-SR507:
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_580TXS507B/Onkyo-TX-SR507.html?tp=179

Yamaha RX-V465:
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_022RXV465/Yamaha-RX-V465.html?tp=179

(I don't know where I'm getting them yet, but those are convenient links; also can't get the Denon or Sony units because they're too tall....Denon also has two different height specs which is confusing)

Also, I can figure out everything except for the analog input connections from my sound card. Right now, I have 3 stereo minijacks coming from the sound card and each is split into two RCAs on the other end for L-R signals and each is conveniently plugged into the front/surround (back)/center-sub multi-channel inputs on the back of the TX-SR503, but looking at the pictures of the back of the Yamaha and Onkyo 507 units I can't seem to figure out the equivalent connection points. Any ideas? Thank you.
 
Neither of the receivers you have selected as candidates feature analogue multi-channel in. It is a feature often not found on entry level receivers. I would suggest looking at an HTR-6150 which you can get from Amazon, among other places. It has the multi-channel input you need.
 
That Yamaha seems way too tall for where I'm putting it:
http://www.amazon.com/Yamaha-HTR-6150BL-7-1-Channel-Theater-Receiver/dp/B0013ZCHOI

But this Onkyo TX-SR506 seems perfect:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-jfIyCF0n6cm/p_580TXS506B/Onkyo-TX-SR506-Black.html
(I'll have to get it at Amazon though)

Why do they keep discontinuing the ones with multi-channel inputs?:(

EDIT: I just ordered the 506 from Amazon!!! I figure if this one dies and I have the same setup, between the two of them I'll fiddle with the inside parts to get one working unit.;)
 
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magnetik said:
Are you in 5.1 mode on your reciever? If so.. the subwoofer is on a discreet channel and will only be used when content has LFE signal. Have you tried just sticking it in stereo and seeing if you have output from the sub? I would try a movie.. maybe you can find one with the THX startup.. this will output a LFE signal to your sub.

[edit: heh people replied before I was done.]
Click to expand...

Thank you so much for that post!

The 'no bass on non 5.1 streams' has been bugging me for a while and I was just going to make a thread but saw this one instead.
I had my subwoofer set to LFE only so it would only work on streams with LFE signal (DD and DTS). I just set it to LFE+Main and it works perfectly!
 
Also, wondering if there is any way to have the speaker wire just plug into the back of the 506 instead of wrapping around and screwing down the connection? (banana clip? not sure?) I'm also going to finally hook up the 14-gauge wire I bought last year to replace the Klipsch 16-gauge default speaker wire; I figure since I'm messing with stuff anyway this would be a good time. The 14-gauge wire has a red wire and black wire all wrapped in a white sleeve.
 
SkaarjMaster said:
Why do they keep discontinuing the ones with multi-channel inputs?:(
Click to expand...

Costs money. On low end units, they want to drop the cost as much as possible and still keep the features people want. A multi-channel input costs a good bit since you need all the connectors, but also an ADC for it and so on. Since these days not so many people use one, it is generally left off lower end units. High end units have it because cost is not such an issue and there's a rule that "more inputs = bettar than" with a high end receiver. They pack in tons, even ones that nobody is likely to use (you aren't using 7 composite video inputs if you spent $1000 on a receiver).

Also, wondering if there is any way to have the speaker wire just plug into the back of the 506 instead of wrapping around and screwing down the connection?
Click to expand...

Sure, they are called banana plugs. You hook them on to the wire, and then plug them in to the receiver. Monoprice has a bunch of choices for fairly cheap. Personally I like the locking banana plugs that Bluejeans sells. I find them much easier to put on the wire, and I like the fact that they lock solid in my gear. However, they are twice the price.

Either way, that's what you are after. They just plug right in to the binding posts. You CAN buy wire with them already on, but I don't recommend it. Costs a good deal more usually, and you have to specify the length before hand. They aren't hard to put on the wire, so I think it is much better to cut the cable to teh length you need, then terminate it yourself.
 
Banana plugs! That's it! Thanks man, I'll try and get some locking ones. I've had this 14-gauge speaker wire all wrapped up in a spool for almost a year now, so I think it's about time. It's definitely harder to find time to do things these days with a 4.5-year old son around.:)
 
OK, so I got the banana plugs yesterday and last night I switched the channels and got 3.1 sound so that there is no sound in the back two channels instead of the right two and it is the correct channels. So, I have the old receiver setup until I get the new one.

The new one arrived today and the bastards sent a 507 instead of the 506, WTF!!!!????

I refused the package and took it back to the UPS store after talking to the customer service dept at TigerDirect (through Amazon.com). I was a little uneasy about ordering from TigerDirect and I guess I should have went with my instincts on this one. Apparently, Amazon had the correct info in the e-mails back to me, but TigerDirect listed it as a 507; it wouldn't have made any difference though as I would not have been able to do anything until today anyway. I then reordered a 506 from someplace else. We'll see how this one goes.:(
 
I swear TigerDirect delights in screwing people over.

Hopefully your new receiver works out well for you.
 
This has suddenly turned rather bizarre. I got a call from my neighbor across the street this Saturday (8-22-09) and they said they have a package for me and have had it around 4-5 days and I asked them what it said on the outside of the box and where it was from, etc. and they said,"TX-SR507, TigerDirect, UPS". Apparently, UPS tried to deliver it again instead of taking it back to TigerDirect. Is this the new f-ing thing now or what?:mad:

Anyway, I've been calling my neighbor back the past couple of days with no response.......may be walking over there after work tomorrow. They said they would try and take it back to UPS on that Saturday, so we'll see if they did or not. OK, so you remember I ordered the other one, well the other place sent me an e-mail saying they'd get back to me on my order soon. WTF? Did they go on vacation or something? If I don't hear from them soon and/or they screw me like TigerNeglect, then there could be trouble. This new company is SafeandSoundHQ.

Also, my wife went over to the neighbors house yesterday with no response; she'll try again today and I'll try again tonight. I called twice this weekend to confirm that they either took it back or not with no response. WTF?! So now I have money out their for two receivers with not one in my possession that I can use............fun times.:not:
 
The neighbor finally responded and said they took it to UPS store today. Maybe UPS will get the message this time. I was ready to charge the neighbor for the package and I would have done it to...........basically, give me the package or the $$$. It's ridiculous that they kept it for so long and also ridiculous that they didn't call me back. I have no idea WTF their problem was, but it's a good thing my wife talked to them instead of me. I also called me credit card company and told them "I'm not paying that part of my bill", etc.

As far as the other place, why should I have to pay for a phone call as well as the price of the item? If I don't get a favorable response soon, I'm going to finally register for reseller ratings and trash them as well as TigerDirect.:mad:
 
Good reviews at reseller ratings and bad reviews at beat this......go figure?

OK, I'll give them one more day (check my e-mails at home tonight) and then I'll try their toll-free number tomorrow and ask WTF!?:eek:
 
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OK, so they never charged my card and they don't have the 506B in stock (but they have the 507B and nothing else that will work for me). He did say the 506B was discontinued about 6 months ago and, most likely, I would end up getting the 507 if I ordered the 506 with people not realizing the connections are different and thinking they are doing me a favor with the upgrade when they actually are not. I asked the guy why he's advertising the 506b then and he said they're changing that soon..............um, but not soon enough for me apparently.:(

I tried all the other Onkyo receivers and they are either too tall or the connections won't work (same with the Denon receivers). I may look at the Yamahas again, but I think it's the same deal with them. Newegg doesn't seem to have anything that would work for me either. I tried Compusa.com and they have the 506B advertised, but after calling they said it was a drop shipment from the manufacturer and I would get the 507 again (WTF is with that, change the f-ing ad people.....I told them this). I don't want to change my sound card because I have same in two computers and I sometimes switch to the other computer.

It's looking like ebay or get a new computer desk (not happening) or new subwoofer (not happening).
 
Nothing wrong with ebay, you'll save money on something you wouldn't otherwise be changing out if it weren't for the dead one. Practically all receivers from a year or more ago have discrete 5/6/7.1 inputs, so you'll have a lot to choose from.
 
...also, I'd like to get a fan (one that doesn't make a lot of noise) to blow across the top of the new receiver under the desk, so maybe this one lasts a little longer if heat was the problem before. Do you think a 120mm computer fan mounted in the correct position powered by some sort of power plug would do the trick?
 
Instead, fit a fan on top of the amp to draw hot air out of the top.
I used an old external hard drive bay, cut holes in the top bottom and mounted 2x80mm silent fans in it.
The bay provides the power and it works fantastic.
 
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