6800xt Vs X1600pro (agp)

BMWlover

Limp Gawd
Joined
May 13, 2006
Messages
424
I was wondering what card you guys would use for a AGP system. A 512 MB Sapphire Radeon X1600Pro or a 256 MB XFX Geforce 6800XT. I like the looks of the XFX, and I like Nvidia, but the ATI may be better, even though it's memory interface is 128MB not 256MB like the Nvidia. Thanks for your help, and other suggestions under 200 are welcome. Thanks again.

Edit: I am sorry for the double post. Did not mean to.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16814102680
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814150157

14-102-680-02.JPG

14-150-157-02.JPG
 
The x1600 Pro is a fairly pathetic card, slower than a 6600 GT.

That said, at 8 pipes and 350 MHz core, the 6800 XT is also slower than the 6600 GT.

My suggestion: go with the 6600 GT. It costs the same.

Don't be fooled by the fact that the x1600 Pro has 512MB ram, and the 6800 XT has 256MB, and the 6600 GT has only 128MB - you'll never see the benefits of more than 128MB with these lower-end cards anyway.

If you have to buy one of the above though, pick up the 6800 XT and overclock the hell out of it. It can handle it.
 
I agree. The only benefit of the X1600 Pro is SM3. Nothing more. It's about on par with a 9800 Pro otherwise. If they made the X1600XT in AGP then it would be worth it as it's considerably faster than a X1600 Pro. I would look to a used 6800GT or NU, or X800GTO.
 
All the cards he mentioned have SM3.0 so there really is no benefit other than newer technology.
 
SM3 isn't a pro in the x1600 favor here becuase both of the cards you've chosen support SM3. That being said the 6800XT is better than the x1600 Pro.
 
That's easy...

Get an x850 Pro or XT

All of the other cards are too slow to use SM3
 
Leon2ky said:
You can flash 6800XT's to 6800GT's can't you?

My thought too, though i'd first try unlocking the disabled quads in rivatuner first.
 
How does the X800GTO compare to a 6800 with 16 pipes unlocked?
 
The X1600 PRO isn't that terrible of a card, but the XT is much better. Also, this Sapphire card is infamous for being extremely shitty. A X800 or 6800 could beat the crap out of it anyday.
 
Leon2ky said:
You can flash 6800XT's to 6800GT's can't you?
No...

The 6800XT's have 8 pipes...
the 6800GT's have 16 pipes..

And you aren't unlocking two quads ;).

The 6800NU unlocks to 16/6 alot of the time though.
 
I just got my XFX 6800XTreme today (AGP).. its 256MB DDR3 normally clocked at 350/1000. It performed pretty decent.. alot better than I expected. My XFX 5950 Ultra had died because I damaged it cleaning the dust out of it.. lol. I think I bent the card taking off the stupid fan shroud that was wedged on.

Anyhow, I used the coolbits thing and it can overclock and stay VERY stable at 450/1250. That is what I'm running at right now. No fractals, no blips, etc. It runs just like normal and stays around 55C to 60C under max load. I noticed I picked up a few extra frames per second in the games I play. (HL2, Doom3, Q4, COD2) Then, I decided to see if I could unlock any of the extra pipes/features with the RivaTuner utility. Well.. I really never used the utility before, but I believe I unlocked more pipes. I defietly noticed a 20fps INCREASE in Q4 @ 1280x1024 high setting. I get around 60fps steady now. Before, the RivaTuner said my card was 8pp/4vp. Then I went into the unlocked pro capabilities part, and enabled the disabled parts in the bit field processor manager. Now it says 12pp/5vp. I guess that means I went from 8 pipelines to 12 piplines? I definetly noticed a huge increase in frames per second though in all my games.

Oh, and a pic of it installed in my system, its pretty sexy...
IMG_0084.jpg
 
I would take your 12x5 256 MB @ 1200mhz 6800XT over my old 16x5 6800 128mb @ 800mhz any day of the week. It was a nice card, but the slow 128mb was really holding it back. I could only get 400 on the core with mine so you have a nice overlcock there.
 
I just took some screenshot for you guys to show my settings.

Overclocked via Coolbits:
overclocked.jpg


Unlocked via RivaTuner:
unlocked.jpg
 
To the original poster: The 6800XT will most likely school a X1600PRO. I sincerely doubt even my 128mb 6600GT running at 580/1150 could compare to a 256mb, 256-bit 6800XT. There's also the chance that it will unlock, and I've heard of some people unlocking them to full 16/6 cards.

Wiretap: can you unlock the extra vertex shader at all? That would put you at 12/6. Most of the vertex shaders on all the 6800 series variants can be unlocked without any problems. Oh, and sexy looking pc there!
 
Is it dangerous inlocking pipeline and vertex shaders? Riva Tuner says my 6800XT can unmask up to 16,8. Is it likely that they will work? Can I kill the card?
 
It is highly doubtful. Unlock each part piece by piece and stress test it. If the quad (4 pipelines) is faulty, it is already broken. It won't damage already good pipelines. The vertex shader should be good, as I haven't heard almost any reports of it not unlocking without issues.

I would try 12/6 then if all is well, 16/6. One may be good, the other may be bad. Hopefully you will get at least 1 unlock. One more quad puts you near 6800GS levels, if you get both you've got one killer card. Always worth a try.
 
MetalX said:
How does the X800GTO compare to a 6800 with 16 pipes unlocked?

Don't get an X800GTO, get an X800Pro. They're faster than a 6800GT, almost as fast as 6800 Ultra. The only thing missing is SM3.0 support, which isn't really a big deal in your price range. The only difference between the Pro and the GTO is that the GTO has slightly faster memory (490ddr vs 450ddr) and a slower chip clock speed (400 vs 475), However, the pro's memory should overclock to make up the difference, while its a crapshoot getting the core of the gto up to pro speeds.

Of course, if you have the scratch you could just go a step further and get an X850XT, which is a far better deal than either considering you can get one for around $200 and it's got 4 more pipelines and higher clock/mem speeds.
 
nigerian_businessman said:
Don't get an X800GTO, get an X800Pro. They're faster than a 6800GT, almost as fast as 6800 Ultra, and you can get one for $150 right now at newegg. The only thing missing is SM3.0 support, which isn't really a big deal in your price range.

Just get a X800GTO 2 they're nearly guaranteed to OC to at least X850XT speeds. Mine does past X850XTPE speeds.
 
dont get the blue color tho.. get the red bleu is new core sucks at OCing trust me mine barely OC'es 1 ounce but the red ones OC to like 850Xt
 
nigerian_businessman said:
Don't get an X800GTO, get an X800Pro. They're faster than a 6800GT, almost as fast as 6800 Ultra, and you can get one for $150 right now at newegg. The only thing missing is SM3.0 support, which isn't really a big deal in your price range.
um, no. The x800 Pro was match for hte 6800U only at launch, when the 6800's drivers sucked ass. a few weeks/months later and the 6800 (even the GT) can handily hand the x800 Pro its ass.

I would gladly put my 6800GT @ 430/1.18 against an OCed x850XT PE anytime.
 
lithium726 said:
um, no. The x800 Pro was match for hte 6800U only at launch, when the 6800's drivers sucked ass. a few weeks/months later and the 6800 (even the GT) can handily hand the x800 Pro its ass until you turn on AA and AF, or take price into consideration.

There you go, fixed.

BTW, got a link to back up those statements?
 
The 6800GT can be had on ebay for $150.

Sure, you have an X800Pro? Suite of benchmarks? Ill put mine back to stock just fer you, I dont feel like browsing hte net for old benchmarks :p

even with AA and AF the 6800 will outclass the x800pro.

edit: here ya go. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2113&p=4

and that was at lauch. ATI's arch was still supported in old, mature drivers - the NV ones were brand new.
 
lithium726 said:
The 6800GT can be had on ebay for $150.

Sure, you have an X800Pro? Suite of benchmarks? Ill put mine back to stock just fer you, I dont feel like browsing hte net for old benchmarks :p

even with AA and AF the 6800 will outclass the x800pro.

Yes, I have an x800 pro. I also have a 3700+ Claw with 1mb of cache that will dance circles around your processor. It wouldn't be a balanced comparison simply because of that, and besides, I don't need to particicpate because I don't mind searching for the reviews.

Heres one of those reviews. Here's another. And just for good measure, heres yet another one. Oh, and on that last one you might want to read the whole review, or at least the farcry part, where they give you a bit of information about nvidia's optimizations and the effects on image quality.

Sorry, but I tend to prefer facts to subjective opinions. I suspect the guy who wants to upgrade his video does too.
 
All of those benchmarks are from launch. Like i said, drivers.

I really dont care if your processor will "own" mine, it will be a small difference at 1280, which is the highest I can run. I am still willing to benchmark my card against yours, even with my "weaker" CPU.

I gave a review too, at launch. the X800 and GT traded blows, with the Pro never *significantly* outrunning the GT. The GT significantly outran the Pro several times.

Benchmarks from July, 2004 do not adequatly portray the preformance of either of these cards now.
 
lithium726 said:
even with AA and AF the 6800 will outclass the x800pro.

edit: here ya go. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2113&p=4

and that was at lauch. ATI's arch was still supported in old, mature drivers - the NV ones were brand new.

Ok, thats one review vs 3, and it still doesn't show the 6800GT soundly beating the x800pro, especially in situations with AA and AF. Once again, it's really only in OpenGL games or situations without AA and AF where the 6800 series of cards really have an advantage.
 
Again, lets run some games against eachother.

We can do it at 1280x1024, highest detail settings. CPU limitation gone.
 
lithium726 said:
Again, lets run some games against eachother.

We can do it at 1280x1024, highest detail settings. CPU limitation gone.

Why bother? Theres plenty of benchmarks available to show both card's abilities. I don't need to spend even more of my time getting into a pissing contest with you. I'm not that attached to either card, I've clearly stated that in some situations the 6800GT is better. I think that the ATI x800pro is a better deal, overall. Had you talked to me when they first came out, I'd have told you get the 6800GT, just because it was cheaper and the difference isn't that big of a deal, but now that you can pick up both cards for around the same price, the only reason to get the 6800GT is for SM3.0 support, and how many SM3.0 games are out right now? Not too many.

Honestly, its a dumb argument anyway. This all started because I said get the x800pro over the x800gto, because it's a better card -- which it is. Just because I stated that it's faster than the 6800GT, you get your panties in a twist. Then you continually counter with 'lets run some benchmarks' even though you could easily overclock the card to get the results you want, with no oversight, and despite the fact that we have completely different systems that don't even come close to comparing to each other. Why? Because you think driver optimizations have changed everything? Nevermind that you don't have any analysis to confirm that except your own.

Look, its not like I called your mother a whore or anything. I don't need to spend 3 hrs backing up a statement thats confirmed already by other independant sources. If you feel that strongly about it, why don't you go get your hands on an x800pro and run the benchmarks yourself.
 
Jesus man, I wasnt trying to start a pissing match, I was actually looking forward to seeing how the two compared now that two years had passed in current games. I thought it would be interesting and fun, no need to get all worked up about it. Benchmarks taken two years ago ago mean a whole lotta nothing, hense the idea. But whatever, Im not going to buy an X800 Pro because its a waste of money for me to do so.

I always maintained that your claims were true at launch, and that is all you have proven. They were true at launch. You gave a bunch of benchmarks that were taken at that time, and yes, the drivers have gotten loads better. Thats the only reason I BOUGHT the 6800 all those years ago, because it actually starting showing promise after a few driver revisions, the x800Pro was a much better card when they were both released.

I was expecting to have some fun. Instead I get a guy who thinks my "panties are in a twist" and claims I am reacting the same way as if you had called my mother a whore. Whatever man.
 
6800xt is slower than x800gto. If you can find x800pro for the same price, get that, but go for the GTO if you can't.


Here's a comparison

6800XT:
Memory Bandwidth 22.4 GB/sec
Shader Operations 2600 Operations/sec
Pixel Fill Rate: 2600 MPixels/sec
Texture Fill Rate 2600 MTexels/sec
Vertex Operations 325 MVertices/sec

X800GTO
Memory Bandwidth 31.36 GB/sec
Shader Operations 4800 Operations/sec
Pixel Fill Rate: 4800 MPixels/sec
Texture Fill Rate 4800 MTexels/sec
Vertex Operations 600 MVertices/sec

And just for good measure..

X800PRO
Memory Bandwidth 28.8 GB/sec
Shader Operations 5700 Operations/sec
Pixel Fill Rate: 5700 MPixels/sec
Texture Fill Rate 5700 MTexels/sec
Vertex Operations 712.5 MVertices/sec


X1600Pro
Memory Bandwidth 12.48 GB/sec
Shader Operations 6000 Operations/sec
Pixel Fill Rate: 2000 MPixels/sec
Texture Fill Rate 2000 MTexels/sec
Vertex Operations 625 MVertices/sec
 
I'm not taking any sides here, but, that comparison uses a PCI-express version of the 6800XT. There are a lot of different version of the 6800XT.

The one in the article has:

1) 128mb DDR memory
2) Inability to unlock anything (NV41 not NV40)
3) Lower memory clock speeds (DDR1 instead of GDDR3)

Direct comparison versus the XFX 6800XT AGP on newegg:

128mb vs. 256mb
NV41 vs. NV40
700Mhz DDR1 vs. 1000Mhz GDDR3

In short, that comparison does not really accurately represent a direct comparison. Once again, I take no sides, it's just that there are a million different 6800XT models with different clocks, memory types and cores and it gets real confusing.
 
ep1taph said:
I'm not taking any sides here, but, that comparison uses a PCI-express version of the 6800XT. There are a lot of different version of the 6800XT.

The one in the article has:

1) 128mb DDR memory
2) Inability to unlock anything (NV41 not NV40)
3) Lower memory clock speeds (DDR1 instead of GDDR3)

Direct comparison versus the XFX 6800XT AGP on newegg:

128mb vs. 256mb
NV41 vs. NV40
700Mhz DDR1 vs. 1000Mhz GDDR3

In short, that comparison does not really accurately represent a direct comparison. Once again, I take no sides, it's just that there are a million different 6800XT models with different clocks, memory types and cores and it gets real confusing.

Thanks for pointing that out. I knew they were different as far as being PCI-E vs AGP, but was unaware of the different core and clock speeds. I'd guess that the x800gto vs 6800XT are comparable with the nod going to the GTO with AA/AF turned on.
 
As seems to be the case with red vs green so often, eh?

That 6800XT just looks damn sweet, check that other guys thread where he unlocked it to a GS, he has some sweet pictures of it.
 
Back
Top