Carmack: no Rage (or id Tech5 engine) port for Linux. Interesting reasons inside...

pxc

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Some guy wrote to Carmack and asked about a Linux version of Rage. Carmack responded:

> Dear Mr Carmack, I am just wondering if the graphics renderer for
> Rage is still
> built using OpenGL 3.* as a target? Will id still port to Linux if
> user numbers are
> small or not as big as say Mac OS or Windows?
>
> Gratzi,
> naikon89

The PC and Mac versions are still OpenGL 2.x.

We are not currently scheduling native linux ports. It isn't out of the
question, but I don't think we will be able to justify the work. If
there are hundreds of thousands of linux users playing Quake Live when
we are done with Rage, that would certainly influence our decision...

John Carmack

> Ok, it must be alot more difficult to port
> than older id software games :(

Yes, it is. The codebase is much, much larger, and the graphics
technology pushes a lot of paths that are not usually optimized. It
probably wouldn't be all that bad to get it running on the nvidia binary
drivers, but the chance of it working correctly and acceptably anywhere
else would be small.
If you are restricted to it only working on the
closed source drivers, you might as well boot into windows and get the
fully tested and tuned experience...

John Carmack

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1244727

OK, maybe not that interesting or surprising. ;) It's still a big ouch to AMD.
 
That's unfortunate due to the fact that id was one (or the only) that usually had their games available for linux. However, they're not an "independent" studio anymore. And if they don't have the resources to focus on that portion of a project, then it will only be done, if something justifies it.
 
TBH, it doesn't really matter. How many times did people actually play from linux? I can't personally recall playing from linux at any time, mainly because it's a hassle to dual boot to play another game.
 
I play whatever I can from within Linux. WoW runs better through Linux than it does through Windows for me. I normally only boot into Windows when there's a new MMO beta to play with.

Windows 7 seems to take forever to boot if it hasn't been started for a week or so which makes me want to start it up even less.


Id not supporting Rage in Linux is not really surprising. There still aren't enough gamers on Linux to make it worthwhile for them. I'd expect it to run on Linux eventually, either through an unofficial binary or WINE.
 
Hes been swayed by money now. He lost the passion already. Thinking like that really shows that he won't be making linux games for along time.
 
I'll take ID over Epic any day. After buying that piece of shit you call UT3, I'm never buying another Epic game.
 
Some guy wrote to Carmack and asked about a Linux version of Rage. Carmack responded:





http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1244727

OK, maybe not that interesting or surprising. ;) It's still a big ouch to AMD.

Its not as if the Linux community doesn't already know that AMD's proprietary drivers suck or anything. I don't really see the big deal in this as a user of Debian Linux, since I haven't played an ID game I have liked in the last 10 years. Doom 3 was a joke(not scary or fun), quake 4 wasn't made by ID.

This might have to do with the acquisition by ZeniMax Media. Can't really say I care or not if they stop releasing games for Linux, its not like any recent games have been fun.
 
Hes been swayed by money now. He lost the passion already. Thinking like that really shows that he won't be making linux games for along time.
Well that is a little unfair, he does after all run a business the whole point of which is to make money. He did Linux ports of his other games, which AFAIK he lost money on too, and unfortunately iD hasn't been able to score any large developers lately who'll use their engine either. He has to look at the money side of things if he is to stay in business, particularly right now that we're in the worst recession in decades.
 
That's probably true, but it's still sad if they won't support linux. I also prefer id games over Epic, but don't mean Epic is bad.
 
Really? I liked UT3. Epic has been releasing much better games than id in recent years

I'll take ID over Epic any day. After buying that piece of shit you call UT3, I'm never buying another Epic game.
Posted via [H] Mobile Device
 
Really? I liked UT3. Epic has been releasing much better games than id in recent years


Posted via [H] Mobile Device

Problem is now the XBox 360 is pretty much the only place where you will find a game by Epic anymore. I'll pass.
 
The codebase is much, much larger, and the graphics
technology pushes a lot of paths that are not usually optimized.

So it basically comes down to "Linux drivers suck and are a PITA to program for."

Not surprising really, since this is the first less that you learn when trying out Linux. :p
 
So it basically comes down to "Linux drivers suck and are a PITA to program for."
I've mentioned it before, but ATI's binary linux drivers stick out for awfulness. ATI's Windows drivers aren't exactly perfect, but I find I have very few, if any, problems doing regular things like playing games or with media playback (on PC monitors at least). ATI drivers under OS X are first rate. There is little reason why ATI's linux drivers should lag so badly after so many years, other than maybe as a choice.
----

FWIW, I liked both Doom3 and UT3. I'm not anti- any gaming company, although I tend to avoid titles with unacceptable DRM (which is really few). Any game I'm not interested in isn't because I set the standard for what's good or bad (cough), but just that it's not a type of game i would be interested in.
 
epic only has gears & ut3, & it's only gears2 that's only on xbox

Right. Cliffy B (raging hemorrhoid buttwipe) and Tim Sweeney have been quite vocal about being console only from now on out because they think that everyone that knows how to throw together a gaming machine knows how to use BitTorrent and pirate games and that consoles are where the money is. Fuck them.
 
UT3 might be on Linux, they have someone porting it over so it might happen eventually.

It's very possible, and there's been talk of it, but nothing's materialized yet.

And, yes, ATi's binary drivers are shit, because they neglected them for years, then instead of fixing them, released the shit they had as OSS for the community to work on. I mean, the community has made leaps, but there's only so much you can do with shit to make it be less like shit.

nVidia is better, but they too leave a lot out of their Linux drivers. Both companies need to get their shit together. You're providing me hardware, I expect it to work regardless of which OS I choose to run.
 
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And, yes, ATi's binary drivers are shit, because they neglected them for years, then instead of fixing them, released the shit they had as OSS for the community to work on. I mean, the community has made leaps, but there's only so much you can do with shit to make it be less like shit.
I've been running a 4850 on Ubuntu for 8 months, and have not had a single issue with the ATI drivers. The open source drivers, on the other hand, were barely functional at the best of times.
 
For those who play Windows games in Linux with WINE, do you get surround 5.1 sound?
 
For those who play Windows games in Linux with WINE, do you get surround 5.1 sound?

It should work fine, assuming it's also working fine in the Linux install. Granted, I've never used it myself so I don't know for sure.
 
I dont see what the big hub-bub is all about. Its a simple return on investment. If it does not make business sense to do it (ie the -project number of sales on Linux would not cover the time it takes to optimize for most of the popular hardware) then its not a smart business decision to do so. :(
 
How long did it take for games to show up on Mac's a few years ago? and I'm sure there's alot more Mac gamers then Linux gamers.
 
How long did it take for games to show up on Mac's a few years ago? and I'm sure there's alot more Mac gamers then Linux gamers.

No, games required 2 Mouse buttons, then macs finally decided to join the rest of the world and stop their retarded "simple" innovation.
 
TBH, it doesn't really matter. How many times did people actually play from linux? I can't personally recall playing from linux at any time, mainly because it's a hassle to dual boot to play another game.

Agreed. I played Doom 3 in Linux just to say that I played Doom 3 in Linux.

I switched back to Windows after that. Linux performance was slower, and at the time I couldn't afford to lose any frames per second.
 
epic only has gears & ut3, & it's only gears2 that's only on xbox

ut3 pc has gotten a lot of free content from epic, plus they push http://www.makesomethingunreal.com

of course.. none of that is linux (or does ut3 have a capability?)

You're deceiving yourself if you think Epic will expend any energy whatsoever on PC development ever again. They released an incomplete, bug-ridden game with a joke of a UI (and also terribad netcode out of the 90s) and no one played/plays it. Surprise! Then they released a couple mediocre maps and gametypes. After a year.

We've pretty much got Valve (and awesome indy firms like Taleworlds) left.
 
It's the reason i've switched to MMO's, it is just so much less hassle with all the waiting for bugs to be fixed by retarded developers. Oh well Long live NCSoft!
 
It's the reason i've switched to MMO's, it is just so much less hassle with all the waiting for bugs to be fixed by retarded developers.

That run on sentence completely contradicts itself. lol

Switched to MMOs so you wouldn't have to worry about developers having to fix bugs. hahahaha
 
That run on sentence completely contradicts itself. lol

Switched to MMOs so you wouldn't have to worry about developers having to fix bugs. hahahaha

Well I meant it in a different context, not such that x class is overpowered and takes classes yz to kill x. I meant more that, I can't bring myself to play a 20 hour long RPG which can have bugs that keep crashing the game or w/e at random points, and the developer will take 30 days to issue a patch. For an MMO, if there is a bug that does that, it will be issued via hot fix in under 2-3 days, lest they want the customer to take their cash elsewhere.
 
That run on sentence completely contradicts itself. lol

Switched to MMOs so you wouldn't have to worry about developers having to fix bugs. hahahaha

MMOs are rarely buggy. Say all you want about stuff like WoW and EVE having lots of grinding, or having unbalanced classes, but they are far from buggy. Except for the authentication server issues of late, WoW is possibly one of the most polished games I've even played on any platform.
 
MMOs are rarely buggy. Say all you want about stuff like WoW and EVE having lots of grinding, or having unbalanced classes, but they are far from buggy. Except for the authentication server issues of late, WoW is possibly one of the most polished games I've even played on any platform.

And how long have they both been out? Of course, they are polished now. LOL @ "MMOs are rarely buggy."

Anyone who played WoW at launch (or any other MMO for that matter) can tell you that they had their fair share of problems (crashes, logins, gameplay glitches, etc.). It could be argued that MMOs have more bugs at launch than non MMOs. That strictly based on a staff hired for doing updates from subscriptions.
 
[Epic] released an incomplete, bug-ridden game with a joke of a UI (and also terribad netcode out of the 90s) and no one played/plays it. Surprise! Then they released a couple mediocre maps and gametypes. After a year.
What's kind of interesting is that Epic made an investment in the PC version of UT3 at all after it was released. I think the Titan Pack is indicative that Epic still has an interest in keeping PC gamers, they just (strangely) have no idea how to do it.

Granted, the thread-locking hysteria at their forums after it was released suggests otherwise, so it's tough say exactly what Epic wants.
 
What's kind of interesting is that Epic made an investment in the PC version of UT3 at all after it was released. I think the Titan Pack is indicative that Epic still has an interest in keeping PC gamers, they just (strangely) have no idea how to do it.

Granted, the thread-locking hysteria at their forums after it was released suggests otherwise, so it's tough say exactly what Epic wants.

Not really. Epic have since announced that there are no current plans for any more UT releases. At all. The franchise has been put on hold. So, what franchise will keep them on the PC, do you think? None. They are a console dev now, and Chief Douchebag Officer B has actually said as much. They'll just never officially say it.

Unfortunately, that extra content for UT3 was just a half-hearted, last ditch attempt at appeasement of the PC gods. When that didn't work, they just blamed piracy as all the other devs do.
 
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