Windows 8.1 Update Tries To Win Back Desktop Diehards

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Honestly, I don't think anything Microsoft does at this point will make Windows 8 haters happy but it is still nice to see the company implementing changes based on customer feedback.

A word of warning: If you’re a Metro hater, this update will do almost nothing to make you feel all warm and fuzzy. The Windows 7-style Start menu is not coming back. This update sticks with the fundamental design principles of the Windows 8 interface, and nothing in it comes close to restoring the Windows 7 desktop interface. It is still the Windows 8.x interface, evolved, with that evolution clearly driven by powerful negative feedback.
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the abortion that is metro will hopefully not be a main feature of windows 9
 
the lack of right click menus in metro was one of the biggest reasons its a useability nightmare, but adding that in still doesnt make me want to use it
 
Well, I have been perfectly happy with Windows 8/ 8.1 and update 1 all along. The only real missing item out of the box has been proper training materials. Metro is no abortion just because you do not like it. The standard start menu is gone, get over it.

However, like heatlesssun has said before, I would not be surprised to see a non full screen start screen/ start menu like interface in Windows 9. Windows 7 is now boring to me but it still works and does so for what a person wants it to do. (I also have 7 in a virtual box machine just in case I need it.) Being able to use additional features without loosing the ability to do what I have always done is a plus in my book and why Windows 8 is good to me.
 
"Microsoft is trying to ease the pain for Windows users who are befuddled by the Windows 8 interface on conventional PCs." Yep, befuddled is just about right in regards to some users.
 
Honestly, Windows 7 Ultimate has been treating me so good, I've had no incentive to "upgrade."

HAVING SAID THAT...

I recently built a bad ass box for the living room and the only OS I had lying around was a copy of Windows 8 (from the initial $40 sale). I installed it on the living room computer and I have to say...I really, really like it for an entertainment system OS.

There. I said it. :)
 
Microsoft still being arrogant I see. So no $ from me. I don't care much about the start menu being gone at this point (because I don't use Windows 8), but there is absolutely NO EXCUSE to not give users the option to toggle it.
 
Honestly, once I got everything on the Start screen setup right (took forever though...), and assigned one of the side buttons on my mouse to the Start button, I actually haven't used the aftermarket Start8 start menu since... It's actually faster and takes less time now to open what I'm gunning for.
 
Steve said:
I recently built a bad ass box for the living room and the only OS I had lying around was a copy of Windows 8 (from the initial $40 sale). I installed it on the living room computer and I have to say...I really, really like it for an entertainment system OS.

There. I said it. :)
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Apostasy! Heretic! ;)
 
I've used Win 8 since RTM and have found it to work great for both my convertable laptops and desktop (3x monitor). How much time do you REALLY spend using the start menu? If its over a few minutes per day, you could probably optimize what you are doing by pinning to the taskbar or something else.

I see the start menu maybe once a week? I use WIN+S / WIN+Q to launch programs I haven't pinned / use regularly. Win+# will launch that application from your taskbar.

There are so many "small" hidden improvements to the core OS that makes it smoother I'd hate to go back to 7.
 
I'm not a "die-hard" Windows 8 hater. Windows 8 has a lot of good things going for it.
I'm not even a Metro hater. On a tablet, Metro is a fairly natural interface for most use cases.

It's just that Metro has exactly NO place in a desktop environment. And Microsoft's continued insistence that we kludge along with a dressed up tablet interface is asinine.
 
I just delete ALL the Modern/Metro apps on my Windows 8/8.1 machines and that's all I have to do. Then I'm happy and it sits in Desktop all day long.

Folks come up with all these convoluted methods but my way takes all of 60 seconds on a new build.

Simple.

Since Windows 7, I don't really use the Start Menu, just Taskbar and some Shortcuts on the desktop.
 
The thing I really HATE about the metro screen is that you end up with a huge number of extra icons with programs that install stand alone utilities, such as what Visual Studio does. You get over 20 icons on the metro screen.

Gimme my folders back and a logical/easy way to organize them, like in Windows 7.

I never, ever use the metro screen. It is worthless for any type of actual productive work on a non-touchscreen computer.

Metro reminds me of those people that store absolutely everything on their desktop without folders. Ever seen a screen with 100+ documents and shortcuts on a desktop? Yeah, there is a great idea to try to force on everybody.

That being said, Windows 8 with a start menu add-on and boot to desktop is better than 7 for the most part.

I just simply despise Metro.
 
cyclone3d said:
The thing I really HATE about the metro screen is that you end up with a huge number of extra icons with programs that install stand alone utilities, such as what Visual Studio does. You get over 20 icons on the metro screen.
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How many of those do you actually USE on a day-to-day basis, though? One? Maybe 2 or 3? Just pin *those* to the metro screen, and leave the rest on the expanded menu. If you end up needing them, the charm search will pop them up with a keystroke or two (in generally less gestures/typing than navigating a multi-level menu).

And, heck, if you really DO need to have all 20 of them on the metro panel at once, just shrink them to the new 1/8 tile size so they bunch up out of the way, and have a couple larger tiles for the more 'important' apps in the dev environment.

Once you get used to it, it really is VERY fast to use!
 
Who's using the start menu? Why? It's useless. Pin the damn things to the taskbar you noobs.
 
I shouldn't have to scroll left/right to find what i'm looking for in a clusterfuck of unorganized god knows what. Or use the search function every time. It'a a mess.
 
I still think one of the problems of Win 8 is how much of a hassle it is to actually customize your start menu or "All Apps" menu. With every program creating a new set of folders and a bunch of useless shortcuts like readme files and uninstallers - it becomes cavernous in a hurry.
It's unwieldy by default, but once I started trimming mine up and keeping all of my shortcuts into 5 near folders on a single screen...well, it's just like Windows 7.
They should offer more tools to trim the fat or at least stop programs from installing 15 separate shortcuts and a new folder every time anything new is installed.
 
dgz said:
Who's using the start menu? Why? It's useless. Pin the damn things to the taskbar you noobs.
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I'd rather just the previous operating system where pinning stuff just makes things a tiny bit more convenient, but is no way required to make it useable.
 
HydroBudz said:
I shouldn't have to scroll left/right to find what i'm looking for in a clusterfuck of unorganized god knows what. Or use the search function every time. It'a a mess.
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What exactly are you referring to here? The Start Screen is a collection of manually organized elements, shortcuts and notifications. It's really no less organized than the Start Menu but the Start Menu has a very limited shortcut facility.
 
Domingo said:
I still think one of the problems of Win 8 is how much of a hassle it is to actually customize your start menu or "All Apps" menu. With every program creating a new set of folders and a bunch of useless shortcuts like readme files and uninstallers - it becomes cavernous in a hurry.
It's unwieldy by default, but once I started trimming mine up and keeping all of my shortcuts into 5 near folders on a single screen...well, it's just like Windows 7.
They should offer more tools to trim the fat or at least stop programs from installing 15 separate shortcuts and a new folder every time anything new is installed.
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My "All Apps" menu at my home development box is at minimum 4 monitors wide and I have no where near as many applications installed at home versus my development box at work.
 
3 Posts before MoG/Heatless came in here spewing the same old tired ass argument we have heard 5000 times, pretty sure that is a new record.

That said, why is this news? Why is this trash article even given the light of day? We knew everything stated in it months ago. There wasn't a shred of even remotely new information. Honestly 8.1 does nothing and just shows that MS hasn't listened and is Still trying to shove this shit down our throats. It is a half assed compromise, nothing more. I don't care about booting to desktop and a "start button" if all that button does is launch metro. Metro is the single biggest problem that all the "haters" have. Dancing around showing it until I need to do anything doesn't fix that.

Apparently MS needs the argument distilled down to terms even a moron can understand.

"I Do Not Want a Full Screen of Tiles."

I "RARELY use the start menu, and the few times I do, it is just to find a program that I happened to forget the name due to not using it in ages. So I don't need something that takes up my entire damn desktop to find that. A list I can quickly scroll for works far better. Every other time, I'll have it in my quick launch or fire off a fast instant search.

What do I want on my desktop? Nothing..except a picture. I don't want a ton of shitty clutter on top of said picture..Just the picture. Want to know how many shortcuts are on my desktop right now? Not a damn 1, so why the fuck would I want a giant ass overlay of tiles?
 
Many actually use desktops to get real work done on boxes NOT connected to the net which have no entertainment related apps on them. They also use REAL TIME apps which means no needless background crap for low latency and max use of CPU cycles. The idea of functional tools to accomplish that is what those users demand. For these users the eye candy and fluff just makes the box perform worse and more likely to have problems. When MS then also strips efficient working tools/methods or makes it difficult to do a function with their new version, these users obviously will be very upset with the stupidity of polarizing their significant market share. These users will not accept backwards steps of LESS overall real time performance and/or user time savings. Tools like the start menu, folders, multiple windows use with those windows being sized/formated/placement where you left them, and right click commands to name a few examples just get real work done better/faster. Windows 8 is a clusterf*ck for these users and they have voted with their wallets despite whatever PR spin is out there trying to save face for MS. Its wait and see if Windows 9 helps or hurts, otherwise Windows 7 with a few add-ons will service this large group of desktop users best for the next few years.
 
Dekoth-E- said:
3 Posts before MoG/Heatless came in here spewing the same old tired ass argument we have heard 5000 times, pretty sure that is a new record.
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Actually a good deal of my posts about Windows 8 are about pointing out the bazillion just flat out technically incorrect things that are said about it.

Dekoth-E- said:
"I Do Not Want a Full Screen of Tiles."
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For all of the supposedly tired arguments you say I and others make, I've never argued the point that some people don't like the full screen elements and have stated from the beginning that something like a mini-Start Screen that wasn't full screen should be there and it doesn't have to be the classic Start Menu and I don't think that it should be the classic Start Menu.

The point I've made about the Start Screen is that it is nowhere near the impediment to using Windows with a keyboard and mouse that many make it out to be. Sure one may not like it or be confused by it at least initially since it's new, but if it were as functionally defective with keyboards and mice as some make it out to be, then NO ONE would be able to effectively use it with a keyboard and mouse.

Dekoth-E- said:
I "RARELY use the start menu, and the few times I do, it is just to find a program that I happened to forget the name due to not using it in ages. So I don't need something that takes up my entire damn desktop to find that. A list I can quickly scroll for works far better. Every other time, I'll have it in my quick launch or fire off a fast instant search.
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Windows Key+S.

Dekoth-E- said:
What do I want on my desktop? Nothing..except a picture. I don't want a ton of shitty clutter on top of said picture..Just the picture. Want to know how many shortcuts are on my desktop right now? Not a damn 1, so why the fuck would I want a giant ass overlay of tiles?
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Nothing on my Windows 8 devices' desktops besides an image.
 
Bassmankr said:
Tools like the start menu, folders, multiple windows use with those windows being sized/formated/placement where you left them, and right click commands to name a few examples just get real work done better/faster.
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Other than the Start Menu, which I don't see as a productivity tool, it's an app launcher as there's tons of ways to do that in Windows, Windows 8 has all of these things you listed.
 
ManofGod said:
Well, I have been perfectly happy with Windows 8/ 8.1 and update 1 all along. The only real missing item out of the box has been proper training materials. Metro is no abortion just because you do not like it. The standard start menu is gone, get over it.
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"Get over it."

Wow so easy to say.

Imagine 1000 employees yelling at you because they can't get their job done because the Windows interface has changed so drastically. All those mouse and keyboard actions memorized over the course of the job, to perform their job, suddenly are useless. What a complete waste. Now they'll have to be re-trained. I might as well start my company from scratch again.

We already went through a version of this when we upgraded Office from 2003 to 2010. The uproar, when no could do their job because the menus were gone replaced by the stupid ass ribbon, was deafening. Definitely not going to go through that again by upgrading to Windows 8. We're doing our upgrades to Windows 7.
 
amddragonpc said:
All those mouse and keyboard actions memorized over the course of the job, to perform their job, suddenly are useless.
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This just isn't true. The keyboard commands to control the Windows UI between 7 and 8 are extremely similar. 8 actually have substantially more keyboard commands than 7, which is something most probably don't realize.
 
What really drove me nuts on 8.1 is they removed the ability to forget networks. At my company we add users to a test network to make sure programs will work in and out of the office and now we have to go through the command prompt to remove any wireless connections.
 
amddragonpc said:
"Get over it."

Wow so easy to say.

Imagine 1000 employees yelling at you because they can't get their job done because the Windows interface has changed so drastically. All those mouse and keyboard actions memorized over the course of the job, to perform their job, suddenly are useless. What a complete waste. Now they'll have to be re-trained. I might as well start my company from scratch again.

We already went through a version of this when we upgraded Office from 2003 to 2010. The uproar, when no could do their job because the menus were gone replaced by the stupid ass ribbon, was deafening. Definitely not going to go through that again by upgrading to Windows 8. We're doing our upgrades to Windows 7.
Click to expand...

Don't even bother. They want to crap on the old interface while telling everybody they are not allowed to bitch about Metro and to "get over it". Hech, even MS is doing an about face on some of this stuff. Its to the point where fan boys are just thread crapping now until everybody just gives up.
 
Forget about Metro.
I sporadically stared at a laptop running 8 for 3 hours yesterday while it was thinking about updating to 8.1.

Starts downloading, sits. Starts again. Sits. Starts again. Sits. It was like watching a child that forgot to take his/her ADD medication.

Sales rep is going to get their laptop back the same way it came - with 8, not 8.1. Thought I'd 'do them a favor' by applying the updates, and the POS couldn't make it's mind up. Even thought maybe, just maybe, it was flaky on the wireless so I plugged it in...still nothing. Still couldn't make it's mind up.

So forget Metro. I could care less about Metro at this point. There's too many other things I've seen 8 do (or not do) that are not issues with 7, Vista, or even XP or 2000.

Wake me up when 9 comes out and then maybe I'll display a hint of interest. Until then, 8, 8.1, and 8.11 can go back into their packaging and the fridge because it's still not 'done'.
 
pcjunkie said:
Don't even bother. They want to crap on the old interface while telling everybody they are not allowed to bitch about Metro and to "get over it".
Click to expand...

There's nothing wrong with legitimate complaints and there are things to legitimately to complain about. But a lot of stuff is made up, like the notion that all the keyboard commands in 7 & 8 are different when they are 90% plus the same with most of the exceptions being ones that exist in 8 that didn't in 7.

pcjunkie said:
Hech, even MS is doing an about face on some of this stuff. Its to the point where fan boys are just thread crapping now until everybody just gives up.
Click to expand...

Some say that but even a lot of Windows 8 proponents like myself have said that the UI would probably become more keyboard and mouse friendly and configurable over time. There's really nothing up to this point that is an about face, just more options and defaults being more desktop aware and familiar.
 
Steve said:
Honestly, Windows 7 Ultimate has been treating me so good, I've had no incentive to "upgrade."

HAVING SAID THAT...

I recently built a bad ass box for the living room and the only OS I had lying around was a copy of Windows 8 (from the initial $40 sale). I installed it on the living room computer and I have to say...I really, really like it for an entertainment system OS.

There. I said it. :)
Click to expand...

This.
 
Dekoth-E- said:
3 Posts before MoG/Heatless came in here spewing the same old tired ass argument we have heard 5000 times, pretty sure that is a new record.

That said, why is this news? Why is this trash article even given the light of day? We knew everything stated in it months ago. There wasn't a shred of even remotely new information. Honestly 8.1 does nothing and just shows that MS hasn't listened and is Still trying to shove this shit down our throats. It is a half assed compromise, nothing more. I don't care about booting to desktop and a "start button" if all that button does is launch metro. Metro is the single biggest problem that all the "haters" have. Dancing around showing it until I need to do anything doesn't fix that.

Apparently MS needs the argument distilled down to terms even a moron can understand.

"I Do Not Want a Full Screen of Tiles."

I "RARELY use the start menu, and the few times I do, it is just to find a program that I happened to forget the name due to not using it in ages. So I don't need something that takes up my entire damn desktop to find that. A list I can quickly scroll for works far better. Every other time, I'll have it in my quick launch or fire off a fast instant search.

What do I want on my desktop? Nothing..except a picture. I don't want a ton of shitty clutter on top of said picture..Just the picture. Want to know how many shortcuts are on my desktop right now? Not a damn 1, so why the fuck would I want a giant ass overlay of tiles?
Click to expand...

Wow, it took you 24 threads before you came in spewing you same old tired ass triad. Nice self control there. :rolleyes:
 
amddragonpc said:
"Get over it."

Wow so easy to say.

Imagine 1000 employees yelling at you because they can't get their job done because the Windows interface has changed so drastically. All those mouse and keyboard actions memorized over the course of the job, to perform their job, suddenly are useless. What a complete waste. Now they'll have to be re-trained. I might as well start my company from scratch again.

We already went through a version of this when we upgraded Office from 2003 to 2010. The uproar, when no could do their job because the menus were gone replaced by the stupid ass ribbon, was deafening. Definitely not going to go through that again by upgrading to Windows 8. We're doing our upgrades to Windows 7.
Click to expand...

Great job only quoting half of what I said. Of course, this is what I fully said:

"Well, I have been perfectly happy with Windows 8/ 8.1 and update 1 all along. The only real missing item out of the box has been proper training materials. Metro is no abortion just because you do not like it. The standard start menu is gone, get over it.

However, like heatlesssun has said before, I would not be surprised to see a non full screen start screen/ start menu like interface in Windows 9. Windows 7 is now boring to me but it still works and does so for what a person wants it to do. (I also have 7 in a virtual box machine just in case I need it.) Being able to use additional features without loosing the ability to do what I have always done is a plus in my book and why Windows 8 is good to me."

Next time, perhaps a whole point would be better served unless you where trying to misconstrue what I said.
 
zero2dash said:
Forget about Metro.
I sporadically stared at a laptop running 8 for 3 hours yesterday while it was thinking about updating to 8.1.

Starts downloading, sits. Starts again. Sits. Starts again. Sits. It was like watching a child that forgot to take his/her ADD medication.

Sales rep is going to get their laptop back the same way it came - with 8, not 8.1. Thought I'd 'do them a favor' by applying the updates, and the POS couldn't make it's mind up. Even thought maybe, just maybe, it was flaky on the wireless so I plugged it in...still nothing. Still couldn't make it's mind up.

So forget Metro. I could care less about Metro at this point. There's too many other things I've seen 8 do (or not do) that are not issues with 7, Vista, or even XP or 2000.

Wake me up when 9 comes out and then maybe I'll display a hint of interest. Until then, 8, 8.1, and 8.11 can go back into their packaging and the fridge because it's still not 'done'.
Click to expand...

Funny. Windows 8 is the only operating system I've had bork itself and TWICE, since Windows ME/2000 (can't remember which). The first time I got thrown into some infinite boot loop because start up repair decided to launch without my permission (it doesn't even give you the option if you want to go into it or not) and it somehow messed itself up. The second time I had a Windows Update somehow go bad, and the same thing - infinite boot loop but this time it kept getting stuck at the "applying updates" after booting. It fail, then reboot and try again. The solution to that was to shutdown the PC after installing the Windows update, and not restart. Since then, I've disabled everything I could on Win 8 for those mining rigs.
 
piker28 said:
What really drove me nuts on 8.1 is they removed the ability to forget networks. At my company we add users to a test network to make sure programs will work in and out of the office and now we have to go through the command prompt to remove any wireless connections.
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Yeah, that one was definitely strange, I will give you that.
 
Microsoft doesn't care about the OS space, the future is in the cloud and services.

HAHAHAHAHA. Microsoft saving Apple Computers from extinction.
 
pcjunkie said:
Don't even bother. They want to crap on the old interface while telling everybody they are not allowed to bitch about Metro and to "get over it". Hech, even MS is doing an about face on some of this stuff. Its to the point where fan boys are just thread crapping now until everybody just gives up.
Click to expand...

*Golf glaps* Nice, really nice. Also out of context but hey, context is not important anyways, right?
 
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