My new computer from AVA Direct

AndonSage · May 31, 2008

I mailed an order and payment today for my new AVA Direct computer

My current computer is a P4 3.0GHz Dell XPS (first gen), and even though I've upgraded it to 2GB RAM and a Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 3850 512MB AGP video card, the new Age of Conan MMORPG is bringing it to it's knees. I was hoping to wait until the new video cards were released, but can't take the low framerates any more, hehe. I'd like to thank Joe Mundy at AVA for working with me on putting together this configuration.

Joe has said they should be able to hit a 3.6GHz overclock in this system, so I'm hoping for that

I was originally going to get the Gigabyte GA-EX38-DS4 motherboard, but Joe said they were only getting about 3.2GHz overclocks with a Q9450 on it, and suggested the eVGA 750i SLI FTW motherboard instead. I checked out three reviews for that motherboard, and all of them were good, and said the board was a great overclocker, so I decided to go with it.

The ThermalRight heatsink and Scythe S-Flex fan are the best cooling combo for air.

I will be replacing the 8800 GTS video card with a next gen card after they come out, but because I game on a 24" monitor at 1920 x 1200, I needed a current card to support that. If I end up going with a new nVidia card, I'll be able to use BFG Tech's Step-Up program.

I realize that I don't currently need 8GB RAM for gaming, but I plan on keeping this computer for five years (and AVA was having a sale on the extra 4GB <g>). When I purchased my Dell in 2003, it came with 1GB, which was a lot at the time. These days, 1GB barely runs the Windows Vista O/S. So the 8GB is for the future. I bet Windows 7 wants even more RAM than Windows Vista.

The Western Digital hard drives are the new, fast, 320GB platter drives. First drive for the O/S, page file and some data files. Second drive for games, graphics, music and video files.

The Samsung DVD burner is quieter than a Lite-On.

I really love the looks of the Antec P182 case, and it's great for cooling and low noise, especially by replacing the Antec fans with Yate-Loon fans.

Because I'll be overclocking with four sticks of RAM, I wanted to make sure I'd have enough power, and since you can't have TOO much power in a computer system, I went with the 1000W Corsair power supply. I know I'll never have to replace the PSU no matter what I add to the computer

I have a Logitech G15 keyboard that I'll move from my Dell to the new computer, and I ordered the Logitech X-540 5.1 speaker system, on sale at amazon.com.

GAMING PC, Core 2 SLI DDR2 Gaming System $2704.19

INTEL, Core 2 Quad Q9450 Quad-Core 2.66GHz, 1333MHz FSB, 12MB (2 x 6MB) L2 Cache, 45nm, 95W, EM64T EIST VT XD, Retail
THERMALRIGHT, Ultra-120 eXtreme CPU Heatsink, Socket 775/AM2, Aluminum
SCYTHE, S-FLEX 120mm 1600 rpm Quiet Fan - Sleeved, for heatsink
ARCTIC COOLING, MX-2 High-Performance Thermal Compound, Non-Electrical Conductive
SERVICE, CPU Overclocking
eVGA, nForce 750i SLI FTW, LGA775, nForce 750i SLI, 1333MHz FSB, DDR2-1066 8GB /4, PCIe x16 SLI, SATA 3.0 Gbit/s RAID 10 /4, HDA, GbLAN, FW /2, ATX, Retail
OCZ, 8GB (4 x 2GB) Reaper HPC Edition PC2-8500 DDR2 1066MHz CL 5-5-5-18 2.1-2.3V SDRAM DIMM, Non-ECC
eVGA, e-GeForce 8800 GTS 670MHz, 512MB DDR3 1940MHz, PCIe x16 SLI, 2x DVI, HDTV/S-Video/Composite Out, Retail
SERVICE, No GPU Overclocking
WESTERN DIGITAL, 320GB WD Caviar® SE16 (WD3200AAKS), SATA 300MB/s, 7200 RPM, 16MB cache
WESTERN DIGITAL, 640GB WD Caviar® SE16 (WD6400AAKS), SATA 3.0 Gbit/s, 7200-RPM, 16MB cache
RAID, No RAID, Independent HDD Drives
MITSUMI, Black Internal 1.44MB 3.5" Floppy Drive
SAMSUNG, Super-WriteMaster SH-S203N Black 20x DVD±R/RW Dual-Layer Burner w/ LightScribe, SATA, w/ Software, OEM
ANTEC, Performance One P182 Black Mid-Tower Case, ATX, No PSU, Steel/Plastic
CASE FAN, NON-LED, Fans Maximum Package, Low Noise
SCYTHE, Kama-Meter Fan Control Panel, 4 Channels, 5.25" Bay, Silver/Black/White
CUSTOM WIRING, Standard Wiring with Round Cables
CORSAIR, CMPSU-1000HX HX Series Power Supply w/ Modularized Cable Management, 1000W, 80 PLUS®, 24-pin ATX12V EPS12V, Multi-GPU Ready
MICROSOFT, Windows Vista Ultimate 64-bit Edition w/ SP1, OEM
SERVICE, OEM System Recovery (both secure HDD partition and bootable CD/DVD)
SERVICE, System Binder
LOGITECH, Office Pro Keyboard, Black, PS/2
LOGITECH, MX518 Gaming-Grade Optical Mouse, USB, PS/2, Black
GAMING PC, Gold Warranty Package (3 Year Limited Parts & Lifetime Labor Warranty, Express/Priority Service)
SERVICE, Standard Shipping (UPS, DHL, or Fedex)

I'll update this thread as things progress. I should hear from Joe at AVA once my payment arrives, as to an estimated build and testing time frame.

Terpfen · May 31, 2008

Very nice build, Andon. I'm a little puzzled by a few of your choices, though.

Why have them overclock the CPU, but not the GPU? (Heck, why not save the money they're undoubtedly charging you for the overclock and do it yourself?) I'm not sure why you chose to get a floppy drive, and I'm also curious why you didn't stick a VelociRaptor in there as your gaming drive. Also, are you getting any soundproofing? I would imagine that thing is going to be fairly loud. Lastly, what sound card will you be using?

Congrats. You've got to let us know how Half-Life 2 with the cinematic mod runs on that thing.

heatlesssun · May 31, 2008

Congrats, looks like a nice system. One thing I have noticed in the AVA threads is the desire for longevity. My advice to you is forget about it. Just spend the money and enjoy that 6 months of new computer smell! But this type of system should last you sans gaming for a while.

To answer Terfen's question, since you're planning on upgrading the GPU next month, no point in overclocking.

My questions are how much did they charge for the CPU overclocking? Do they charge by the actual frequency that is obtained or is is a flat fee? And finally, how to they verify the overclock?

Congrats again!

michael.pa2 · May 31, 2008

Normally they charge a flat fee of $99 for overclocking the CPU,but they've been running a special this month where it's free.

Terpfen · May 31, 2008

heatlesssun said:
To answer Terfen's question, since you're planning on upgrading the GPU next month, no point in overclocking.

That would indeed explain it.

Corbin · May 31, 2008

michael.pa2 said:
Normally they charge a flat fee of $99 for overclocking the CPU,but they've been running a special this month where it's free.

99$ whao! good thing you got it free. I would have done it myself and saved 100$.

PinataUT · May 31, 2008

rig looks like a monster! enjoy!

AndonSage · May 31, 2008

Terpfen said:
Why have them overclock the CPU, but not the GPU?

The CPU overclocking was free, and I will be either selling, or using the video card in BFG Tech's Step-Up program in a month or two. I'd want to be able to sell it or send it to BFG Tech and be able to honestly say it was never overclocked.

Terpfen said:
I'm not sure why you chose to get a floppy drive

It's the easiest way to flash the motherboard BIOS, if necessary, and can also be used to boot the computer in case of emergencies. Also, Windows XP required a diskette to set up my home network on multiple computers, although I'm not sure if I'll need it for the same use if Vista works differently. In the end, it's cheap, and doesn't hurt anything.

Terpfen said:
and I'm also curious why you didn't stick a VelociRaptor in there as your gaming drive.

Because the new WD 320GB HDDs are as fast as Raptors, and a VelociRaptor is more expensive.

Terpfen said:
Also, are you getting any soundproofing? I would imagine that thing is going to be fairly loud.

The case itself dampens noise, and the Antec fans are being replaced with low-noise Yate Loons.

Terpfen said:
Lastly, what sound card will you be using?

I will be using onboard sound. If I don't like it, I'll consider an Auzentech or Asus Xonar, but not Creative.

Terpfen said:
Congrats. You've got to let us know how Half-Life 2 with the cinematic mod runs on that thing.

Thanks

Sorry, but I don't play FPS games. However, I can let you know how well Age of Conan and Vanguard run on it

AndonSage · May 31, 2008

heatlesssun said:
My questions are how much did they charge for the CPU overclocking? Do they charge by the actual frequency that is obtained or is is a flat fee? And finally, how to they verify the overclock?

As was mentioned by other posters, the normal fee is $99, but free during the month of May. They don't guarantee an actual number on the overclock speed, because that's almost impossible to do, since chips can be different. However, I was told they were getting 3.6GHz with the eVGA 750i SLI FTW motherboard and the Q9450 CPU pretty regularly, so even if mine doesn't get that high, it should still be pretty good.

I would imagine CPU-Z is enough to verify the overclock? I don't know, I didn't ask.

heatlesssun · May 31, 2008

AndonSage said:
I would imagine CPU-Z is enough to verify the overclock? I don't know, I didn't ask.

By verify I meant what kind of stability testing do they run. The standard test is a Prime 95 Blend test of at least 12 hours. From a system builder, they should run it for at least 24 hours.

You want to check into this because am unstable overclock can be a real pain. Try also to get some comfort level with changing the clock yourself as you just never know when you might experience an overclocking problem and need to back it down.

You'll probably be fine, looks like the Q9450 hits 3.6 with no problem, you just want to be safe.

Terpfen · May 31, 2008

AndonSage said:
It's the easiest way to flash the motherboard BIOS, if necessary, and can also be used to boot the computer in case of emergencies. Also, Windows XP required a diskette to set up my home network on multiple computers, although I'm not sure if I'll need it for the same use if Vista works differently. In the end, it's cheap, and doesn't hurt anything.

I just see it as unnecessary. You can use a USB thumb drive to flash the BIOS just as effectively as a floppy.

Because the new WD 320GB HDDs are as fast as Raptors, and a VelociRaptor is more expensive.

Well, you're paying nearly $3000 dollars, so I would think you could fit a VelociRaptor in there as your OS and gaming drive. (Is it still considered desirable to put a paging file on a separate hard drive on the same cable stripe?)

The case itself dampens noise, and the Antec fans are being replaced with low-noise Yate Loons.

Right, but it can still get loud. Maybe I'm paranoid, but some soundproof padding affixed to the interior sides of the case would be worth the extra cost, IMO.

I will be using onboard sound. If I don't like it, I'll consider an Auzentech or Asus Xonar, but not Creative.

I think you'll wind up getting a sound card. Get something with a great DAC. The M-Audio Revolution used to be a very good choice, but I think their driver situation has deteriorated. With a decent sound system, you'll be able to tell the difference.

Thanks Sorry, but I don't play FPS games. However, I can let you know how well Age of Conan and Vanguard run on it

I ask because I really want to build a Vista 64-bit system to run that cinematic mod. I'm a sucker for high-resolution anything.

spenny2112 · May 31, 2008

Personally I would have gone with 4GB DDR3 because DDR2 will be extinct in the next five years, and having 4 GB of DDR3 gives you the ability to upgrade to the 8GB whereas with DDR2 you cannot upgrade to DDR3 without buying a new mobo

engiNURD · May 31, 2008

I don't think that nForce board has a COM port header, but you can check the manual to be sure. If not, you can pickup an inexpensive RS232 Serial I/O card instead, to run that bar code scanner of yours.

oh, or the USB->Serial adapter mentioned in your other thread.

spenny2112 said:
Personally I would have gone with 4GB DDR3 because DDR2 will be extinct in the next five years, and having 4 GB of DDR3 gives you the ability to upgrade to the 8GB whereas with DDR2 you cannot upgrade to DDR3 without buying a new mobo

DDR2 will be useless in 5yrs, so there should be no worries in that regard. The price premium for DDR3 is way too high right now to make it a sensible decision, future compatibility or not. When DDR3 has better performance than DDR2 and is much more affordable, it will be time for a new motherboard anyhow.

heatlesssun · May 31, 2008

Terpfen said:
I ask because I really want to build a Vista 64-bit system to run that cinematic mod. I'm a sucker for high-resolution anything.

Saw you talking about this mod so I just installed it tried it out on my sig rig with SLI disabled max out at 1920x1200 and it ran just fine. Looks like its just some improved textures so if the regular HL2 runs well I don't see why this shouldn't. A single 8800 GTS and Core 2 CPU should be fine.

Terpfen · May 31, 2008

heatlesssun said:
Saw you talking about this mod so I just installed it tried it out on my sig rig with SLI disabled max out at 1920x1200 and it ran just fine. Looks like its just some improved textures so if the regular HL2 runs well I don't see why this shouldn't. A single 8800 GTS and Core 2 CPU should be fine.

Did you install everything, including the new models? The devs warn that it sucks up memory to the point where they recommend using a 64-bit OS just to have enough addressable memory.

Also, I'm not really on a Core 2. Think "Pentium 4 2.8Ghz."

heatlesssun · Jun 1, 2008

I orginally installed Version 4, I just installed Version 8 with SLI on. It's running fine but it has some long load times, and to be honest, I'm not all that thrilled with the models. They were definitely going for a super hot Aylex, and she ain't bad.

Don't really know how this would run an a P4 2.8, probably not that great but playable. I'll give it some play time however just to see how it looks.

AndonSage · Jun 1, 2008

heatlesssun said:
By verify I meant what kind of stability testing do they run. The standard test is a Prime 95 Blend test of at least 12 hours. From a system builder, they should run it for at least 24 hours.

Ah, gotcha. I am sure they will do thorough and extensive testing, not the least of which is because they have to support it, and if I had to be on the phone with their tech support all the time, they would lose money in the end.

heatlesssun said:
Try also to get some comfort level with changing the clock yourself as you just never know when you might experience an overclocking problem and need to back it down.

I will find out what changes were made in the BIOS for whichever overclock speed they get. Fortunately, the warranty covers their overclocking, so if anything were to go wrong, I would be using their tech support to troubleshoot.

heatlesssun said:
You'll probably be fine, looks like the Q9450 hits 3.6 with no problem, you just want to be safe.

Yeah, I understand what you are saying. Although I didn't ask Joe directly, I got the feeling from talking to him that they've done a lot of Q9450 overclocks on the eVGA 750i SLI FTW motherboard. There is also a thread in another section here on the [H] forums where people are posting what kind of overclock speed they are getting with their Q9450, and 3.6GHz seems to be common.

I will be updating this thread as my build progresses, and will have a final evaluation after the computer arrives. So I will have more information to share, in the future.

AndonSage · Jun 1, 2008

Terpfen said:
I think you'll wind up getting a sound card. Get something with a great DAC. The M-Audio Revolution used to be a very good choice, but I think their driver situation has deteriorated. With a decent sound system, you'll be able to tell the difference.

If I decide that I need a sound card, then I will be posting here in the appropriate section for recommendations, and actual user experience with sound cards, so that I make sure I get a good sound card. I'm not sure what a DAC is, but I'll make a note for that. Thanks

Re: other comments: I wanted the floppy drive, end of story

Total budget was $3000 (price is currently $2953.84 with tax+shipping), a VelociRaptor is expensive and I'm happy with the new WD Caviars, so I never thought of getting a VelociRaptor. I'll look into it. I will let you know if the system is too loud. From everything I can tell, my config should actually be very quiet.

AndonSage · Jun 1, 2008

spenny2112 said:
Personally I would have gone with 4GB DDR3 because DDR2 will be extinct in the next five years, and having 4 GB of DDR3 gives you the ability to upgrade to the 8GB whereas with DDR2 you cannot upgrade to DDR3 without buying a new mobo

Nehalem is coming out at the end of this year. All current motherboards will then become obsolete, since Nehalem is a different architecture that does not use the FSB. DDR2 is fine for the system I configured, the memory I chose is very good, and I don't need to upgrade to 8GB because I'm starting with 8GB. In five years, when I replace this computer, DDR3 might even have been replaced by DDR5.

AndonSage · Jun 1, 2008

enginurd said:
I don't think that nForce board has a COM port header, but you can check the manual to be sure. If not, you can pickup an inexpensive RS232 Serial I/O card instead, to run that bar code scanner of yours. oh, or the USB->Serial adapter mentioned in your other thread.

Yeah, I didn't see a COM port header listed in the specs, but I'll check again when it gets here. I may just not worry about, since this current computer will only be moved over a few feet, and I can continue to run the scanner and software on this computer. But as you've said, I have a few choices, so it's not a problem. Thanks for the card recommendation.

AndonSage · Jun 2, 2008

Terpfen said:
I would think you could fit a VelociRaptor in there as your OS and gaming drive.

I've done some research, and the noise from a VelociRaptor appears to be the same as the Raptors. My computer network is in my great room, where I have my TV / Entertainment Center, and I prefer to have a quieter drive. The new WD 320GB platter drives are almost as fast as the old Raptors were. So I will be staying with the drives I already chose.

Terpfen said:
I think you'll wind up getting a sound card.

I did some research on sound cards, in case you are correct. It comes down to either the Asus Xonar DX or the Auzentech X-Fi Prelude 7.1 (I refuse to buy a Creative Labs card). The Asus uses software emulation for EAX (they reverse engineered EAX), while the Auzentech has the actual X-Fi chip. The Asus is better for the Dolby stuff, and it's half the price. I guess I need to find out how many games use EAX vs. Dolby these days.

LibertySyclone · Jun 2, 2008

EAX is few and far between, save some dough and get the ASUS IMO.

AndonSage · Jun 2, 2008

LibertySyclone said:
EAX is few and far between, save some dough and get the ASUS IMO.

I'm going to test out the onboard sound first, though

Anyway, I saw an article today regarding the Computex convention, and Asus is coming out with new Xonar sound cards (Xonar HDAV and Xonar D1) in the June-July time frame. If I do decide to buy a sound card, I'll wait for reviews on their new sound cards before I buy.

AndonSage · Jun 3, 2008

Last update for a while, probably. The AVA Direct web site shows my order is PROCESSING ("Your order is in the production cycle.")

AVA Direct doesn't break down what is happening to your computer, like build, testing, etc. So unless something goes wrong, I'll hopefully see the Status change to SHIPPED ("Your order has been shipped out of our warehouse. Tracking number is available.") in about two to two and a half weeks.

CTT3 · Jun 4, 2008

AndonSage said:
Last update for a while, probably. The AVA Direct web site shows my order is PROCESSING ("Your order is in the production cycle.") AVA Direct doesn't break down what is happening to your computer, like build, testing, etc. So unless something goes wrong, I'll hopefully see the Status change to SHIPPED ("Your order has been shipped out of our warehouse. Tracking number is available.") in about two to two and a half weeks.

Have you requested that AVA send you pictures of your rig during the production process? I did when I placed my order and doing so gave me an idea of how far along they were with my rig at any given time.

Not promisin they will send you pics on a daily basis, but at least it's better than seeing the word "processing" for the next two weeks.

engiNURD · Jun 4, 2008

CTT3 said:
Have you requested that AVA send you pictures of your rig during the production process? I did when I placed my order and doing so gave me an idea of how far along they were with my rig at any given time.

Not promisin they will send you pics on a daily basis, but at least it's better than seeing the word "processing" for the next two weeks.

lol.. thats cool. though, it might make me want to cancel my order and build it myself, lol.

AndonSage · Jun 5, 2008

CTT3 said:
Have you requested that AVA send you pictures of your rig during the production process?

Actually, I received a PM on AVA's forum on Monday from Matt Slagle (he's R&D for AVA), that said he had seen my order, and was going to put my computer in their Showcase sub-forum. So I didn't even have to ask

I'd like to mention one very nice thing that Misha at AVA Direct did for me... I found out yesterday, from finally reading BFG's Terms & Conditions, that cards sold with complete systems did not qualify for their Trade-Up Program. So I asked if AVA could switch my BFG video card to an eVGA video card, since AVA is a partner in the eVGA Step-Up Program, and eVGA video cards sold with AVA systems qualify. Misha was very nice and quickly changed my order, and e-mailed me a confirmation

AndonSage · Jun 10, 2008

Just an update for June 10, 2008: I received a picture of a partial build of my system today

It shows the motherboard in the case, with the PSU, heatsink and fans installed. I should get some more pictures tomorrow (I hope), and will post them when I do. Hopefully they'll finish the build tomorrow, and then take a couple days to get a stable overclock and do a burn-in and testing.

Terpfen · Jun 10, 2008

Looking forward to those pictures. Their forums have some nice shots of past customer systems.

AndonSage · Jun 11, 2008

Matt from AVA Direct sent me some pictures

Beginning the build:

Nice wiring, front:

Nice wiring, back:

SouLXIV · Jun 11, 2008

wow nice wiring job

Terpfen · Jun 11, 2008

Very impressive. That's great work so far. After graduation and getting a job that pays more than $10/hour, I'll have to order a system from them. Hope they're still around in 2010...

engiNURD · Jun 11, 2008

Hm... I wonder how they keep that TRUE120 from wiggling too much during shipment? If they pad around it, could you take a pic for me when it comes in? unless you can find an existing pic.

AndonSage · Jun 11, 2008

enginurd said:
Hm... I wonder how they keep that TRUE120 from wiggling too much during shipment? If they pad around it, could you take a pic for me when it comes in? unless you can find an existing pic.

I've already talked to AVA about "inside the case" packing, exactly for that reason. And yes, I will be taking pictures when it arrives, just like [H] Consumer used to do with their reviews

I just got in my new Canon PowerShot A720 IS camera, which I had to get because my roommate broke my old Sony CyberShot DSC-P72. I wanted to have a camera to take pictures with when my computer arrives.

Everett1 · Jun 11, 2008

Why the 1000 PSU?

AndonSage · Jun 12, 2008

Everett1 said:
Why the 1000 PSU?

As stated in the first post:

Because I'll be overclocking with four sticks of RAM, I wanted to make sure I'd have enough power, and since you can't have TOO much power in a computer system, I went with the 1000W Corsair power supply. I know I'll never have to replace the PSU no matter what I add to the computer

And who knows? Maybe I'll SLI two nVidia cards in the future. I normally keep a computer for five years before replacing it, except for upgrading the video cards. Or maybe I'll need it when they come out with an x4 video card

AndonSage · Jun 12, 2008

enginurd said:
Hm... I wonder how they keep that TRUE120 from wiggling too much during shipment? If they pad around it, could you take a pic for me when it comes in? unless you can find an existing pic.

Matt sent me a pic of how they ship rigs like that.

Inside the case packaging:

Everett1 · Jun 12, 2008

AndonSage said:
As stated in the first post:

And who knows? Maybe I'll SLI two nVidia cards in the future. I normally keep a computer for five years before replacing it, except for upgrading the video cards. Or maybe I'll need it when they come out with an x4 video card

Oh right

Sorry to have asked. Smart idea to get a larger capacity PSU now then to upgrade in the future.

And sorry to not say anything good in my first reply of the wiring job, since it does look nice.

PinataUT · Jun 14, 2008

Hawt.

I was very impressed with how well my computer was packed with cut foam internally. My box took a big hit during shipping - enough to punch through the outer box *and* the inner box. No damage to finish and it looked like the box snagged on a corner of a wooden crate or something while UPS was handling it. Everything worked fine.

AndonSage · Jun 14, 2008

Update:

I talked with Joe at AVA Direct yesterday afternoon and got an update on my computer. It seems they are having problems overclocking with 4 sticks of RAM, which I knew might be a problem. Especially since guys like Danny Bui and silent-circuit told me it would be, hehe.

I got an e-mail from Matt that said the following:

Bad news, apparently using 8GB of memory and overclocking is leading to instability problems. I have read up on the issue, and the problem is that the northbridge with 4 DIMMs is already stressed enough. Throw in the fact that you now oc it, and the northbridge cannot handle anymore.

Two really expensive and fast builds using extreme processors and 1600 mhz ddr3 had to be downgraded to 4gb just to stay stable.

We are trying our hardest to play with the memory timings and settings to get it stable. But it takes time to test and configure this. So please be patient, I know youre anxious and excited for your system.

Anyway, they are going to continue trying on Monday, but if they can't hit 3.2GHz, I told them to drop it down to 4GB (2 x 2GB) so they can overclock it to 3.6GHz (which is what Joe had told me they could do with the eVGA 750i SLI FTW motherboard and the Q9450).

Joe is going to call me on Monday to let me know how things worked out. I really appreciate how hard they are working on this issue, without charging me more

My new computer from AVA Direct

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