AMD Sempron - Thoughts & Rumors

FrgMstr

FrgMstr

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AMD Sempron:
SUNNYVALE, CALIF. -June 7, 2004- AMD (NYSE: AMD) today announced that it will introduce a new brand of PC processors to be named AMD Sempron. The AMD Sempron processor family is expected to redefine everyday computing for today's value-conscious buyers of desktop and notebook PCs.

AMD Sempron processors are being developed to meet the evolving day-to-day needs of home and business PC users. Basic computing is no longer just about email, Web browsing or word processing. Today it's also about downloading and playing music, or sending pictures to family and friends. This full-featured product line is designed to deliver best-in-class performance for the growing segment of PC users who want more from their PCs.

Hmmm. 754-pin low L2 cache parts that are 32-bit only? Read the full PR here.
 
Looks like this is the way to phase out the xp line. The athlon xps are begining to look more and more like budget cpus as time passes: xbit labs budget roundup
Might as well move development towards 754/9xx to compete more effectively with the memory bandwidth monster of the p4 and let the good old dog die in respect. I dont know if AMD planned the recent explosion of the mobile athlons, with their low voltages and unlocked multis, but it stirred up the overclocking community. If you ask me, this is a good way to end the socket among the enthusiasts, with a new toy to play with, and thenf finally let it to rest
 
I'm really wondering where AMD is going with this. They are telling everyone they need 64bit computing for tomorrow, and they are planning on selling 32bit only procs from the hammer line. It seems rather doubtful that the 64bit portion of the processor isn't working, since AMD said it added minimal extra transistors from the Athlon 64 and Opteron launch. Interesting to see anyways.
 
sandmanx said:
I'm really wondering where AMD is going with this. They are telling everyone they need 64bit computing for tomorrow, and they are planning on selling 32bit only procs from the hammer line. It seems rather doubtful that the 64bit portion of the processor isn't working, since AMD said it added minimal extra transistors from the Athlon 64 and Opteron launch. Interesting to see anyways.
Click to expand...

This is exactly what this is. I think it is interesting that they will likely not have 64-bit capabilities though (as they noted Athlon64s will keep 64-bit). I had guessed that AMD would do "top to bottom" 64-bit, but I am guessing that their clock scaling slowing down is forcing them to make other market dividing feature segmentations.
 
Hmm, freaky, heard rumors on this chip but nothing concrete till now.

Any ideas on specs?
 
So I take it this is basically just an Athlon64 without the 64bit processing abilities......nice! If they sell them cheap enough this could become a huge hit. I know I'd think about buying one over an Athlon64 if its 32-bit performance was just as fast.
 
neuroquake said:
So I take it this is basically just an Athlon64 without the 64bit processing abilities......nice! If they sell them cheap enough this could become a huge hit. I know I'd think about buying one over an Athlon64 if its 32-bit performance was just as fast.
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I would GUESS that we will see a reduced L2 cache, further reducing die size and cost in a 754-pin package. And frankly I dont think 64-bit computing will have ANY impact in the low end marke till possibly 2007 if then.
 
sandmanx said:
I'm really wondering where AMD is going with this. They are telling everyone they need 64bit computing for tomorrow, and they are planning on selling 32bit only procs from the hammer line.
Click to expand...

What I think people are forgetting, is that even if you dont have 64bit capabilites, that doesnt mean you cant do everything a person with a higher end cpu can do. Software comapnies are still gonna release two versions of their programs, one 64 and one 32bit. It'll be years before companies start releasing only 64bit software. Maybe the launch of longhorn would be 64bit only, but thats years away.
 
So are these going to be on the Paris cores from the AMD roadmap? the 32-bit budget athlon 64..?
 
At the very least it will extened the life cycle of Socket 754, which im sure the motherboard manufacturers will love. Having to blow all that $ on R&D for 754 and not having it go to waste 1.5 yrs after its release.

Best guess on whats on chip.

Lower L2 cache.

No execute.

SSE 3 possibly?
 
I think 754 is going to be the land of the enthusiast for a while, at least the one that is cost conscious.

I have an ABIT KV8Pro (VIA K8T800Pro) running a A64 3000+ at 2.45GHz (10*245) right now. Looks to be a hell of an OC combo for around $250....half the cost of a 754-pin 3700+ CPU.

Yes, an article is on the way.
 
Only bad part I could even harp on that with would be the lack of dual channel memory bus. Then again it's performace gain isn't that big of a deal anyway.

Looks like the leap to socket 939 is going to be long and drawn out thats for sure. AMD may be cutting that move off at the knees with the Sempron release. :rolleyes:
 
Sniper_Merc said:
Only bad part I could even harp on that with would be the lack of dual channel memory bus. Then again it's performace gain isn't that big of a deal anyway.

Looks like the leap to socket 939 is going to be long and drawn out thats for sure. AMD may be cutting that move off at the knees with the Sempron release. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Actually I think this is exactly what AMD needs for it to become more successful as a company and stay competitive in the market. Let's fact it, it is hard to keep producing great CPUs that lead the industry and sell them for bargain basement prices when fighting a giant like Intel.
 
oh c'mon how do you even know if its a 32Bit processor? maybe its a 64 bit processor with ultra low cache/FSB..

will wait for the specs...
 
Is AMD going to continue to release Athlon 64's on the 754 socket?

It seems turning 754 to 32bit only would help push their high end, if you want 64bit you have to buy the real thing, with possibly the best 32bit performance being on 754. We have to see benches to know for sure.

On the other hand, selling 32 and 64bit on the same socket may help slow migrators, start with a cheap 32bit chip and upgrade to 64bit later if it benefits you. The other side of this argument is the 64bit chips have no problem with the 32bit OS, so why go this path?
Wouldn't it be ironic if all after all the anticipation for Socket 939 if Socket 754 becomes the true enthusiast platform.
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Even if AMD isn't remarking weak 64bit chips as 32bit, I doubt they'll allow this to happen. The 32bit chips will probably be the lower yeild 64bit chips.

Then comes the thought, how are they disabling the 64bit capability if it is still on die? Cutting circuts internally or something we can unlock?
 
256K of cache is a bit tight IMO. I was kind of hoping the only change would be 32-bit computing.
 
qdemn7 said:
Wouldn't it be ironic if all after all the anticipation for Socket 939 if Socket 754 becomes the true enthusiast platform. :confused:
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Is it still ironic if it's intentional? AMD has priced socket 939 for people with more money than brains, so the only intelligent choice for the next 6-12 months probably is socket 754. No dual channel support? That makes like 5% difference, and costs %50 more. Not worth it, IMO.

I think my next system is going to be a 754 system, probably a MSI K8N Neo Platinum and whatever is the best 754 chip around $150 at the time.
 
The 32 bit chips will not be disabled 64 bit chips from what I understand

They are not getting many chips onto a die at the moment and this is where these 32 bit processor come into play. You can fit a lot more (especially with the reduced L2). Yields are higher so they can sell more.
 
Logan321 said:
Is it still ironic if it's intentional? AMD has priced socket 939 for people with more money than brains, so the only intelligent choice for the next 6-12 months probably is socket 754. No dual channel support? That makes like 5% difference, and costs %50 more. Not worth it, IMO.

I think my next system is going to be a 754 system, probably a MSI K8N Neo Platinum and whatever is the best 754 chip around $150 at the time.
Click to expand...
Not necesarily. Remmeber this isn't a hobby for everyone. I do video editing on the side of my computer biz, if I can get two vids done in the time it takes to do one with my current system for about a $1000 investment for a CPU and mainboard... hell, spend a little more and keep the old vid system along side, 3 in the time it takes to do one...
 
I was hoping they would leave 64 bit in to create a large 64 bit user base. But in reality Intel needs to release their AMD64 compatible chips for this to happen.
 
It seems they are basically reviving the duron.

AMD needs to make more money and people will go for what's cheaper. People buy celerons right?

thought with all the time they spent making x86-64 possible it seems like a waste to take it off of the chip.

I'd really wait for specs to pass judgement though.
Even thought the mainstream really doesn't know the difference.
 
I think it's great that they are coming out with a new lowend cpu, though I'm not sure if it's required, since their athlon xp owns same priced celerons by a wide margin. Personally, I could careless 64 bit or not, as long as it's faster than the athlon xp, and offered around the same price, I'd buy one.
 
notoriousformula said:
oh c'mon how do you even know if its a 32Bit processor? maybe its a 64 bit processor with ultra low cache/FSB..

will wait for the specs...
Click to expand...

Never said I knew. Just making an educated guess. If I am wrong on anything, it will probably be lowering the cache as that would be expensive to roll out another core for the "cheapie" CPU.
 
qdemn7 said:
Wouldn't it be ironic if all after all the anticipation for Socket 939 if Socket 754 becomes the true enthusiast platform. :confused:
Click to expand...

I am not so sure that is exactly what is going to happen this year.... :eek:
 
Well obviously if they're releasing a prococessor for it, 754 isnt dead. From here it looks like its going to be mainstream/entry level, while 939 will be high mainstream/high end.

The market requires AMD to have something cheap. If only to compete with the *cough* celeron. I could see both sockets surviving. Simply to cater to each end of the market. Even if its going the way of the Dodo it wont be for awhile yet.

One great thing about socket A was that it was a rather mature, stable, and long lasting platform.
 
Socket 754 is going no where....they are still ramping up. Here are AMD projection numbers through the end of the year. They look at bit inflated to me, but what do I know.

Q3: FX - 12K; 754-pin - 970K; 939-pin - 250K
Q4: FX - 14K; 754-pin - 900K; 939-pin - 530K
 
I am going to the AMD tech tour in Toronto tonight. I will find out whatever I can there and post here.

I'll try to find out several different things:
1. Is this the chip code-named Paris? (Almost definetly a yes, but it never hurts to make sure)
2. Is this a K8 or k7 based chip? (Probably K8, but again, might as well ask)
3. Will it have AMD64 extensions?
4. Will it have less cache than Newcastle?
5. WIll it have NX?
6. About how much will these cost? (Ballpark figure)
7. What's up with the name?
 
Its a decent move to get rid of socket A and try to bring A64 mobos(754 pin) to the masses. Which they could always upgrade the CPU in it later to 64 bits when its needed or useful. However, I think AMD needs to get everything on ONE SOCKET for their consumer market, and maybe another one for server market.

socket 940 - opteron and early FX's (server market)
socket 939 - new FX's and A64 - dual channel (EVERYTHING should be this)
socket 754 - single channel A64
socket 754 - single channel Sempron 32-bit
socket A - (false dual channel) 32-bit Athlon XP

Its just too many options and not good for motherboard manufacturers or AMD.
They could obviously lower costs if everything was 939-pin... and just enable/disable the option in the chip.

ex:
939 pin dual-channel A64 or FX (high end to mid)
939 pin single-channel A64 (CPU has dual channel disabled) (mid-end)
939 pin dual-channel Sempron (low end) (NEW - my suggestion)
939 pin single-channel Sempron (budget)

And have all 4 of those CPU's work on ONE motherboard, ONE SOCKET!!!

This would undoubtedly help AMD get more sales as people could get a low-end CPU now (with 939-pin mobo) and upgrade to a better CPU later (more $ for AMD). Where now I think people are holding off since 754-pin is not the future board of choice. AMD should take advantage of Intel being stagnant and get some serious sales. They are too targeted on high end 939, with out a GOOD low/mid-end choice.
 
chrisf6969 brings up some valid points about too many socket designs for AMD. You have 4 different design boards that oems would have to use right now to sell a full range of AMD computers, compared to 2 different board designs (very soon to be 3) for Intel. Also, Intel will quickly start phasing out socket 478 once the new socket design is fully deployed, whereas it looks like all 4 AMD boards will be marketed for another year, from what I've read. This Sempron (yuck, what a stupid name) might fill in for the budget boards and displace socket A, but we'll see what it benches like when actual processors are in hands of people like Kyle. Who knows, if it's that light on L2 cache, it might hurt performance enough to where Barton performs as well or better than Sempron at the same clock speeds.
 
Well it seems pretty apparent that Sanders is gone and Ruiz is at the helm now. The company is definately trying to take a different approach to the market than the AMD of the past. Obviously they been doing some research and talking to the market place and have discovered that 64 bit computing isn't going to be that common for quite some time despite their best hopes. Even though Microsoft will have a Windows Op system for them at some point, without plenty of apps available as well, it simply cannot be a strong sellling point to the average desktop user. Suprise , Suprise, that when that user goes to buy a new PC they are not going to give a big fluff about paying 400 + dollars for the CPU alone that the salesman tells them "Well you can run 64 bit software on it". Yeah sure AMD wants to stop Fabing the AthlonXP line but they really don't offer much in the "low end" market once the XP is basically gone. As the Wendy's analogy goes, if you don't have the single on the menu, you may just end up not selling very many doubles of triples either. I'm really starting to watch AMD with a raised eyebrow now. One of these days someone inside that company may wake up and realize their biggest problems over the last few years hasn't been in the R&D, design, or product areas. It's AMD's marketing dept. that needs a good flush.
 
JNavy89GT said:
I don't
most new A64's will run 2.5-2.6ghz on good air
CG stepping that is.
Click to expand...
I agree, even my older CO stepping does 2.5 stable @ 1.74v and will bench at 2.6. Of course I am watercooled to do 2.6ghz, but I did 2.4 @ 1.6v 24/7 before I migrated to watercooling. Some of the newer 3400+'s do 2.6 easy with a good motherboard.
 
Remeber the the Athalon....then Thunderbird....then Palamino....then Thoroughbred.... then ThoroughbredB.... then Barton?

Call me when the A64's get to the Barton part, thanks.
 
uwackme said:
Remeber the the Athalon....then Thunderbird....then Palamino....then Thoroughbred.... then ThoroughbredB.... then Barton?

Call me when the A64's get to the Barton part, thanks.
Click to expand...

When they're out of date and there's a new chip generation out? Sure thing! Seems a bit silly to skip a generation completely and consider jumping on it when it's approaching the end of its life, but hey, that's just me. ;)
 
Paris has been on AMD roadmaps for quite some time...32-bit Socket 754 chip 130nm and probably 256K L2. Replacement of the Duron/Athlon XP line. Hope AMD doesn't charge more than $100.

/off topic
Hey uwackme :)
 
CIWS said:
One of these days someone inside that company may wake up and realize their biggest problems over the last few years hasn't been in the R&D, design, or product areas. It's AMD's marketing dept. that needs a good flush.
Click to expand...

I'd have to agree 100%
 
CIWS said:
<snip>..... It's AMD's marketing dept. that needs a good flush.
Click to expand...

Hehe...good one CIWS, but everybody knows that AMD doesn't have a Marketing Dept.
I'm sure they've just hung a "Marketing" sign on the janitor's closet. ;)

I'm really liking the idea of a cheaper socket 754 part.
With the pricing of the 64-bit CPU's being so high AMD wasn't going to be getting much relic $$$ for some time.
 
CIWS said:
It's AMD's marketing dept. that needs a good flush.
Click to expand...

Ain't that the truth. Whoever came up with the name Sempron needs to be shot. My dyslexic self read it as Spermon.

Hey, that actually might work.

Spermon your box?
 
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