5.1 Gaming from HTPC

B

Bun-Bun

Gawd
Joined
Sep 11, 2003
Messages
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I used to accomplish 5.1 gaming by running a bunch of cables and adapters from the separate channel outputs on the sound card to the multi channel input on my receiver.

Due to issues with noise plus the mass rats nest it created I have done away with those cables and have a single TOSLINK going from the onboard audio to my receiver.

No more 5.1. I have tried connecting an HDMI cable to the receiver (to try 5.1 PCM) but I can't get a nice 1:1 pixel mapping signal from the HTPC to the TV this way (TV sees 1080i instead of a computer signal so its scaled wonky and colors are all wrong and it just looks like garbage). Only way to get a nice signal is direct to the TV. Can I split the output from my HTPC so that my receiver can do audio and TV still gets the direct signal?

I also have been looking at sound cards that can do Dolby/DTS encoding but everyone I find now is discontinued.


Equipment is as follows:

Custom HTPC
2600K @ 4.5GHz
Maximus IV gene-z/gen3
Asus DirectCU II GTX 670
240GB Samsung 840 Evo

Yamaha RX-V661
Emotiva UPA-2
Paradigm Monitor 11 towers (fronts)
Paradigm Center 3
Paradigm Atoms (rears)
Paradigm SE10 (sub)
 
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Got the splitter. Does the same thing as when the computer is connected to the receiver. TV goes to 1080i and picture goes to crap (colors are wrong and it is oversharpened).

And to top it off instead of seeing the receiver for audio it sees the TV (yet the receiver plays the audio) so wont detect 5.1/7.1 PCM and I only get 2 channel.

But I have two HDMI out's on my computer... wonder if I connect the receiver to the other HDMI...
 
So I finally got PCM 5.1 to work. First way I had was TV connected to GTX670 and another HDMI cable from the onboard intel graphics to the receiver. This only works if I disconnect the TV from the receiver. For some reason the computer will see the TV instead of receiver (in the windows sound control panel). When I test audio over that connection the receiver plays the audio but because its detecting the TV it will only do 2 channel PCM. Disconnecting the TV lets the computer see the receiver and configure 5.1 PCM correctly.

This, however, stopped working for some reason. So now I have the TV connected to a DVI port on the GTX670 and the HDMI port goes to the receiver. This works but requires having a second monitored enabled taking up VRAM (receiver read audio on HDMI in the absence of a video signal).

So now I have to have all my HDMI devices connected direct to the TV (which isn't the end o the world) but I have 5.1 PCM.


Time to start looking at new receivers I think.I think new receivers will possibly let me connect the computer to them and then to the TV and still have the proper signal get through. Or at least let me configure the audio portion properly so that I can leave the TV connected and still have the computer see the receiver instead of the TV for audio.
 
Sorry you're having so much trouble, a new receiver really is the best option, not sure how old your model is but thats BS that its not working (another reason to hate HDMI, as if we needed more).

FWIW, I have the Yamaha RX-A700 and can plug a Nvidia card into it via HDMI without any issues, audio and video works great with minimal lag, good enough for FPS gaming.
 
Yes I hate HDMI and wish a new standard would be brought out for audio for this very reason. I like running separate components and don't feel the need for an audio receiver to do video switching. Yet with HDMI this is a requirement.

I don't quite understand it. I know on my TV I have to name the source in order for it to disable the internal video processing for use with a computer. But for whatever reason when it comes through the receiver, or I have the receiver hooked up as well with the splitter, a part of the communication is lost and the TV turns on its internal video processor. EDIT: After some reading I wonder if its an HDCP issue...

So need a receiver that will properly passthrough the video and properly process the audio.

My receiver is a Yamaha RX-V661 that was a previous year model when I bought it in 2007. The new model brought video processing capability that, at the time, I didn't care about.

I like that you can do 5.1 PCM over HDMI in one cable. I hated having all those cables for 5.1. Now we need an update to TOSLINK to handle PCM 5.1/7.1 and ditch HDMI. Or a new standard for everything that actually works.
 
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These days a decent HDMI receiver is the key component of making the HTPC gaming experience work well. They don't have to be insanely expensive, though. Some of the Sony mid-range models are less than $200 brand new and if you get last's year's model they can sometimes even be had for less than $150.

I've been doing the PC > Receiver > TV setup for going on 5 years and it has honestly become pretty seamless now. No dealing with EAX settings, DD Live, or any of that nonsense. Both ATI and Nvidia have good driver support and games, movies, and apps will auto-select everything based on how you have it set up in the Windows control panel.

HDMI isn't exactly the greatest thing in the world, but it's not going anywhere. Certainly not back to Toslink. If anything, the one format that could have an impact is DisplayPort. DP *can* handle audio, but almost nothing supports it since there seems to be little or no standard to it.
 
Does your TV have a PC mode where it disables the internal video processing? (for proper picture and less input lag)

Does having your computer -> receiver -> TV respect that and work properly?

I've had a computer on the TV setup for a long time (think I started in 2006). But I have always taken the computer straight to the TV and used TOSLINK to the receiver (or 5.1 analog to the receiver).
 
Mine has a "gaming mode" and it looks/works just like a PC monitor. Lag only comes into play when you turn on interlacing/smoothmotion...which I never do. Even 1-5 frame moves in fighting games work fine.

Never had any problems with anything not working okay. The receiver just works as a video pass-thru while decoding the audio. I know some video cards have random EDID issues with the HD audio codecs, but I've never had any issues with video.

The one goofy thing that you can occasionally encounter (monitor people have it, too) is framerate stutter because of an odd refresh rate. Even though TV's and monitors claim a 60hz refresh rate, most are really something closer to 59.9hz or 60.5hz. When certain games send over a true 60-61hz signal, movement can end up looking choppy. Fixing it is as simple as using a framerate limiter. MSI Afterburner and RadeonPro are the most common ones and both work fine.
 
Ok so starts the A/V receiver hunt.

any recommendations? My audio setup is pretty high end so I would want at least equivilent and preferably better quality DAC's as what is in my RX-V661. Currently have Xbox360, Wii, PS3, and my computer connecting to it. Ability to adjust video/audio processing per input (audio and video seperately) for pass-through or process. I'm partial to yamaha and have disliked the Onkyo's I have used.

But I'm also broke.
 
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I've had good luck with Sony receivers working pretty seamlessly. You can definitely program the audio and video for each input, although some of the video options can be sparse on certain models. They'll at least have the option to set the default resolution and whether you want any upscaling.
I've also had bad experiences with Onkyo, so I wouldn't recommend them either.
A lot of A/V guys swear by Denon although they can be pricey. Yamaha and Pioneer are other brands people tend to have good experiences with.
Personally, I'd just hunt for anything that claims to be HDMI 1.4 compliant and/or features 3D. Even if you don't use it, that's just a sign that it supports the latest standard. That standard is a couple years old, so you can probably get older models for cheap that still support it.
 
For some more in-depth research than what we can suggest, I'd head yourself over to AVSForums and check out what other people are suggesting in your price range, they also have threads / comments on input lag if you're gaming over this setup.

I'd be looking at a previous model years receiver on year end / holiday sale, that has enough power to drive your components and has no input lag - they all come with so many bells and whistles these days and nearly all of them will do HDMI from a PC way better than what you have now.
 
I will head over to AVSforums, thanks.

Power isn't a huge concern. I have an Emotiva UPA-2 driving my fronts.
 
The stupid AVR market makes no sense!

Cheaper AVR's don't have pre outs anymore. So you have to spend more money for an AVR with a bigger better amp in order to get pre outs and than make the internal amp useless!

gah!
 
Well I sorta got it working.

http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1038495309&postcount=438

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1091403/edid-override-thread

Following information from both of those links I was able to get my computer to produce 5.1 PCM to my receiver while the receiver is connected to the TV; I extracted the EDID override for my receiver and installed that to the device with the ID matching my receiver. It still shows up as Samsung tv in sound control panel but it lets me assign 5.1 as its speaker configuration. However I still can not get 1080p 4:4:4 to through the receiver to the TV.

During the process I discovered that sometimes the computer would get confused and just assign a generic non pnp EDID to the HDMI output and then it would work, video anyway. As long as it was in this mode no audio would come out. So this is a EDID/HDMI handshake issue. After going through all this I am not convinced a new receiver would fix my problem.

However I am happy now that at least I can use the receiver to still switch to the other port (my xbox360) and still have it connected to the TV while getting proper 5.1 PCM from the computer.

EDIT:

NVM this still is not a solution. With the receiver connected to the TV I can't shut off the TV. If I do the computer and receiver go into a endless loop of switching. Can't establish a connection. So no sound and the receiver keeps clicking. I like to shut off the TV and just listen to music sometimes.
 
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