AMD Phenom II X4 Model 940 @ [H]

This thread needs to be in the ''Thread hall of fame'' on the hardforums for other generations to see and say ''Yup, thats what happends when you stir up with a cult of people''.

wow what a load of BS, this is the worst review i have ever read. whoever wrote this obviously hates AMD and anything they release or get paid too much by Intel, this was the most right sided review i have read, AMD being crap no matter what in their eyes.

you fail H
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All you need to do is click the little X on the right side of your browser! :cool:

I looked at your posting history and laughed. Bravo to you sir.
 
Zero82z said:
Subjective reviews don't mean anything. Numbers do. Unless you can back up your statements with numbers, they also don't really mean anything.
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ugh, would you like me to show you my usual gaming scenarios?

when someone says gaming, it doesn't necessarily mean loading up cs:s or farcry2, there are other games(MMO) which you can load multiple instances of, in my case Lineage 2, where I will load 3-4 clients, and they will use 6-800mb each. is that enough for you? or do you want a screenshot :p?

by your own advice, unless you're playing FC2 you should be on windows xp with 2gb of ram!
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
ugh, would you like me to show you my usual gaming scenarios?

when someone says gaming, it doesn't necessarily mean loading up cs:s or farcry2, there are other games(MMO) which you can load multiple instances of, in my case Lineage 2, where I will load 3-4 clients, and they will use 6-800mb each. is that enough for you? or do you want a screenshot :p?

by your own advice, unless you're playing FC2 you should be on windows xp with 2gb of ram!
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Okay, let's be realistic here. I doubt someone who's looking for 1080p gaming is going to be sitting back on their couch and firing up 3-4 MMO clients on their TV. And if you're really playing 3-4 characters at the same time, then maybe it's time to take a break from the PC for a while ;).
 
iGrooCk said:
wow what a load of BS, this is the worst review i have ever read. whoever wrote this obviously hates AMD and anything they release or get paid too much by Intel, this was the most right sided review i have read, AMD being crap no matter what in their eyes.

you fail H
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AMD video card review from this morning.

NVIDIA’s GeForce GTX 295 simply costs too much in it performance segment. The current price drops on Radeon HD 4870 X2’s make it the best bang for the buck currently. The performance gain just isn’t enough right now to warrant a price that is $100 more than the competition. Even if you scoff at the MIR, we are still talking about a $50 price difference. That is a lot of money to many of us.
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I think you are right, we are out to get them. Supporting AMD flagship video card like. I only have the one installed in my own system as a cover for my next dastardly deed.
 
Zero82z said:
Okay, let's be realistic here. I doubt someone who's looking for 1080p gaming is going to be sitting back on their couch and firing up 3-4 MMO clients on their TV. And if you're really playing 3-4 characters at the same time, then you've got other issues aside from the amount of RAM you're using.
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He has given you real life examples that are accurate, just because you don't use them yourself does not mean that you have a right to personally attack someone who does. He has given a valid point and it should be honored, not belitted with senseless retort...

For example, I play all types of games, FPS, MMO's, etc... I myself have mutli boxed before and I do use a 1080P Sharp Aquos 32inch TV as my TV and PC monitor.

I don't need to use more than 4GBs currently but I do come close to maxing out my RAM usage at times...

Zero82z, for that reason I have agreed with you up until this senseless post...

If your points turn into personal insults than you really need to take a step back and cool down... Before you insult others who aren't directly part of your conversation.
 
alg7_munif said:
Thanks, nice PSU and cooler but I rather add $50 more for the 2GB HD 4850 X2 because I think that at 1080P, 512 MB VRAM per GPU is not enough. I'm aiming for 3.6GHz~3.8GHz OC on the PII 940. For the Q9400 to reach the same clock speed, I need at least 450FSB while I can just play around with the multiplier on the PII. I really hope that an unlocked AM3 PII will be out soon. At least with the AM3 PII, I'll have an upgrade path in the future.

Now beat this:
Biostar TA790GX + PII 940 BE $335
8GB G.Skill DDR2 1066 $90
HD 4850 X2 2GB $300
WD 640GB Black $80
Xigmatek HDT-S1283 $37
BFG LS-550 $55 AR

Total $897 AR.

Edit: Btw I think your total should be $882 or maybe you mean that the RAM is $45 for 4GB? I can get double the RAM for only $45 more.
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looks pretty good for a regular gaming build but i wouldn't put some of that gear into a htpc case. keep the hdd but how about this instead:

i7920 $229.99
x58 $209.99
3x2gb1333 $144.99
bluray $109.99
520hx psu $109.99
4850 512 $164.99
lian li ht case $149.99

throw in your hdd for 79.99 and you've got a htpc that can manage and manipulate media at frightening speed plus make a pretty good attempt at mimicking a gaming console for 1199.92 before tax or shipping. not bad.
 
Derfman said:
He has given you real life examples that are accurate, just because you don't use them yourself does not mean that you have a right to personally attack someone who does. He has given a valid point and it should be honored, not belitted with senseless retort...

For example, I play all types of games, FPS, MMO's, etc... I myself have mutli boxed before and I do use a 1080P Sharp Aquos 32inch TV as my TV and PC monitor.

I don't need to use more than 4GBs currently but I do come close to maxing out my RAM usage at times...

Zero82z, for that reason I have agreed with you up until this senseless post...

If your points turn into personal insults than you really need to take a step back and cool down... Before you insult others who aren't directly part of your conversation.
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I didn't mean it as an insult. I've edited my post to better reflect what I meant. But seriously, I'm talking about a system that will be used for standard 1080p gaming here, not a multiple-MMO box.
 
The Phenom II performance speaks for itself. It loses to its old nemesis, the Core 2, which I think some folks will be surprised by. The Phenom II loses to the Core i7, which I think was to be expected. The Phenom II is a loser.
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LOL!!!!!!! Thats fucking harsh.
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
ugh, would you like me to show you my usual gaming scenarios?

when someone says gaming, it doesn't necessarily mean loading up cs:s or farcry2, there are other games(MMO) which you can load multiple instances of, in my case Lineage 2, where I will load 3-4 clients, and they will use 6-800mb each. is that enough for you? or do you want a screenshot :p?

by your own advice, unless you're playing FC2 you should be on windows xp with 2gb of ram!
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When someone says "gaming" I normally don't immediatly think "multi-boxing". Your situation is unique, I bet less than 20% of all gamers even know what "multi-boxing" is. Thats a minority figure right there and not many people will be able to relate to it.

Anyone else get the feeling that AMD has once again "brought a knife to a gunfight". Call what you like, but when you release a chip at this price point its hard not to compare the Phenom 2 to its closley priced i7 competition even though its "supposed" to compete with C2Q.
 
if multi-boxing is what i think it is, it brings back some wow memories....

4 GOD DAMM SHAMANS SPAMMING LB GOD DAMM
 
is there a chance that the ddr3 am3 verson will be faster?This shit is bad,coming from a amd fanboy.
 
mr007 said:
is there a chance that the ddr3 am3 verson will be faster?This shit is bad,coming from a amd fanboy.
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I wouldn't bet on it. Adding more memory bandwidth into the mix probably won't do much.
 
Zero82z said:
Before Tom's took a nosedive? Do you even know when that happened? I'll tell you this: it was well before the Core 2 line was even announced.

Anyway, it's true that in some circumstances, cache does make a big difference. However, for most tasks, it doesn't have that much of an impact, and the performance per clock advantage that the Q9400 has over the Phenom II would certainly more than make up for any drop in performance due to a cache deficiency.
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I think Tom's was rolling down a hill for quite a while but I don't think they completely fell off a cliff until a year to year and a half ago (whenever they were sold). They still had good content at times and that article was one of them.
 
sause said:
This review compares a $1000 and $1400 cpu against one that costs $275. You've wasted your time and ours, not to mention your "resources" to conduct this examination and report the findings.
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Nice job reading the explanation for why those CPUs were used. The fact is, it wouldn't have made a difference if the Phenom II was compared to a Q9550 and i7 920 both overclocked to 3.2GHz. The 965EE and QX9770 were simply used because they were already clocked at 3.2GHz. The idea was to perform a clock for clock comparison, which you would know if you had bothered to actually read the article.
 
it's not simply about multiboxing and gaming, it's about system performance as well, thanks to vista, 64bit is now more mainstream, and superfetch makes 8gb seem more enticing then ever

we don't even know his normal system usage, when I first got 8GB i thought it was useless, but now I'd rather have 8gb and 3.2ghz, then 4gb and 3.6

by the way zero, the Q9400 is 6m cache vs 12m on the Q9650/9770
I would probably go with the Q6600 over the 9400 given the choice
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
it's not simply about multiboxing and gaming, it's about system performance as well, thanks to vista, 64bit is now more mainstream, and superfetch makes 8gb seem more enticing then ever

we don't even know his normal system usage, when I first got 8GB i thought it was useless, but now I'd rather have 8gb and 3.2ghz, then 4gb and 3.6
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We're not discussing a general-purpose machine though. This is about a pure gaming box.
 
rennyf77 said:
looks pretty good for a regular gaming build but i wouldn't put some of that gear into a htpc case. keep the hdd but how about this instead:

i7920 $229.99
x58 $209.99
3x2gb1333 $144.99
bluray $109.99
520hx psu $109.99
4850 512 $164.99
lian li ht case $149.99

throw in your hdd for 79.99 and you've got a htpc that can manage and manipulate media at frightening speed plus make a pretty good attempt at mimicking a gaming console for 1199.92 before tax or shipping. not bad.
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That is not a HTPC but a multimedia editing rig. ;) If I want a HTPC, I think that 780G with Athlon X2 4850e would be enough.

For a a gaming rig, I'm sure that @1080P, the PII rig in my post would be much better than the i7 rig in your post.

Btw guys, please stop the RAM debate, for me DDR2 is dirt cheap right now so another 4GB won't hurt. Even if it is true that it won't help, I can also drop the RAM to 4GB in the PII spec so it will be a moot point anyway.
 
alg7_munif said:
That is not a HTPC but a multimedia editing rig. ;) If I want a HTPC, I think that 780G with Athlon X2 4850e would be enough.

For a a gaming rig, I'm sure that @1080P, the PII rig in my post would be much better than the i7 rig in your post.
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better by a few frames maybe, but much better? i doubt it. were talking about 1920x1080 not 1600 or below.
 
alg7_munif said:
What I mean is, buy an AM2+ mobo with DDR2 RAM but use an AM3 PII because the CPU will work inside an AM2+ mobo and also AM3 mobo. Later when DDR3 and AM3 mobos are cheap, just buy the mobo and RAM without a new CPU. You can still upgrade the CPU later with a faster AM3 CPU.
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That sounds like an endless cycle of upgrading to me. I did something similar with an athlon xp to a 939 so I could keep ddr1 & an agp card.. complete waste of money.

Work out how much money you are willing to spend for this budget system & add in the cost of your upgrades & you will see its not worth it.
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
ugh, would you like me to show you my usual gaming scenarios?

when someone says gaming, it doesn't necessarily mean loading up cs:s or farcry2, there are other games(MMO) which you can load multiple instances of, in my case Lineage 2, where I will load 3-4 clients, and they will use 6-800mb each. is that enough for you? or do you want a screenshot :p?

by your own advice, unless you're playing FC2 you should be on windows xp with 2gb of ram!
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When it comes to pure performance, no one gives a damn about how many instances of a single game you want to run. And in your original argument you were asking to beat the 1080p gaming performance, NOT how many instances of a game you could run.
 
trick_m0nkey said:
When it comes to pure performance, no one gives a damn about how many instances of a single game you want to run. And in your original argument you were asking to beat the 1080p gaming performance, NOT how many instances of a game you could run.
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If the person does play an mmo and likes to run more then 1 client, then his game will be directly effected by having 8gb vs 4gb, somehow I doubt that his performance will be noticable between 100 and 150fps too :p

how is that not related to gaming? how about how fast the games launch thanks to superfetch?
 
iGrooCk said:
wow what a load of BS, this is the worst review i have ever read. whoever wrote this obviously hates AMD and anything they release or get paid too much by Intel, this was the most right sided review i have read, AMD being crap no matter what in their eyes. you fail H
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Damn dude, don't hold back. But at least we have a different opinion. I don't agree with you but I respect the fact you decided to post a minority view. In all seriousness though, is there any one or two reasons WHY this review was so bad?

Casper312 said:
This thread needs to be in the ''Thread hall of fame'' on the hardforums for other generations to see and say ''Yup, thats what happends when you stir up with a cult of people''.



All you need to do is click the little X on the right side of your browser! :cool:

I looked at your posting history and laughed. Bravo to you sir.
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Well honestly, he could have worded it better but after seeing some of Kyle's responses (unneeded or not) I can see why he let loose. But hey so he didn't think it was good. I hope he read it thoroughly, because i bet he is making the same mistake most are who dont like this review. You think they are doing benchmarks at stock speeds. That's the point of [H]'s article.



Now that I have been reading all of these different configurations, I might end up buying a low end i7 like a 920 just for the future proofing. I was looking at a Q6600 or an E8500 but I might just go i7. My current pc is in my sig, what do you guys think?
 
XamediX said:
Now that I have been reading all of these different configurations, I might end up buying a low end i7 like a 920 just for the future proofing. I was looking at a Q6600 or an E8500 but I might just go i7. My current pc is in my sig, what do you guys think?
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I think that whichever way you go, it will be a massive upgrade.
 
jfreund said:
Kept me entertained at work all day :)
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Same!

Some interesting debates going on. I like seeing different viewpoints discussed civilly. Makes you think a little bit harder about which way you're going to take it. So in the end you make a fully informed decision. :)
 
XamediX said:
Now that I have been reading all of these different configurations, I might end up buying a low end i7 like a 920 just for the future proofing. I was looking at a Q6600 or an E8500 but I might just go i7. My current pc is in my sig, what do you guys think?
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If your budget is high enough to go i7 and you don't mind spending the extra on the X58/DDR3, it's not a bad deal.

If you're only gaming on a single GPU, Q9550 or similar (especially after Intel prices cuts happen this month) is probably good enough and will allow more investment into the GPU.
 
While a 'clock-for-clock' comparison is all well and good, it is in a vacuum. I get to write off all the computer hardware I buy and even then $275 is steep for a CPU, much less $1000. While the CPU maybe a "loser", you have to be on crack to pay for one of those i7's. How many enthusiasts really buy CPU's costing that much? To me it is akin to badge-whoring car owners. To own a Porsche and drive it like a Honda is a waste of resources. If I pay 3x the cost for a CPU, it had BETTER outperform the cheaper one.

While the theory is nice, the practice isn't useful. The comparison doesn't do me any good. Nobody other than an extremely small section of the populace would look at the results and then go spend $2k+ on a machine when they can get more than enough performance for less than half. I would say in this economy, the value proposition matters far more than the absolute highest performance available.

That said, I won't be buying a PII for a couple months until the prices settle down. But I will buy one, even if it is a loser. I personally found the language used certainly implied the writer had a bit of bias, regardless of whether it exists in reality or not. Anyway, it is less than awesome performance from AMD right off the bat with the PII. But the value equation still is strong, plain and simple.
 
schwank said:
While a 'clock-for-clock' comparison is all well and good, it is in a vacuum. I get to write off all the computer hardware I buy and even then $275 is steep for a CPU, much less $1000. While the CPU maybe a "loser", you have to be on crack to pay for one of those i7's. How many enthusiasts really buy CPU's costing that much? To me it is akin to badge-whoring car owners. To own a Porsche and drive it like a Honda is a waste of resources. If I pay 3x the cost for a CPU, it had BETTER outperform the cheaper one.
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Would you be happier if Kyle used an Intel chip that was 20% cheaper? Because you know the PII would still have lost anyway....

The cost of the processors is basically irrelevant when you take into account how easy it is to overclock Intel chips. Kyle could have picked any one of a dozen Intel quads that are cheaper than the PII and the PII would lose every time.

The whole line of Intel Extreme Edition processors seems silly to me. How many enthusiasts really buy CPUs costing that much? Enough for Intel to continue to market them.
 
schwank said:
While a 'clock-for-clock' comparison is all well and good, it is in a vacuum. I get to write off all the computer hardware I buy and even then $275 is steep for a CPU, much less $1000. While the CPU maybe a "loser", you have to be on crack to pay for one of those i7's.
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I paid $227 for most of my Core i7 920 CPUs. All of them run along great at 3.8GHz on most of our boards.

I don't ever recall telling our readers to buy a one grand CPU.
 
panfist said:
Would you be happier if Kyle used an Intel chip that was 20% cheaper? Because you know the PII would still have lost anyway....

The cost of the processors is basically irrelevant when you take into account how easy it is to overclock Intel chips. Kyle could have picked any one of a dozen Intel quads that are cheaper than the PII and the PII would lose every time.
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THANK YOU. I'm getting tired of repeating myself.
 
panfist said:
Would you be happier if Kyle used an Intel chip that was 20% cheaper? Because you know the PII would still have lost anyway....

The cost of the processors is basically irrelevant when you take into account how easy it is to overclock Intel chips. Kyle could have picked any one of a dozen Intel quads that are cheaper than the PII and the PII would lose every time.

The whole line of Intel Extreme Edition processors seems silly to me. How many enthusiasts really buy CPUs costing that much? Enough for Intel to continue to market them.
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We use the EE for testing because they are easier to OC without impact any of the other internal CPU clocks.
 
AMD should just give up and leave the cpu market for good, they are so far behind their chips, chipsets and everything else are USELESS TRASH, garbage, not worth the silicon they are printed on........

the ATI sides the only one doing "ok" and even there they are cheaping out by not following nvidia's lead with "one chip to rule them all" insted trying to force people into multi gpu configs.....what a crock.......
 
schwank said:
While the theory is nice, the practice isn't useful. The comparison doesn't do me any good. Nobody other than an extremely small section of the populace would look at the results and then go spend $2k+ on a machine when they can get more than enough performance for less than half. I would say in this economy, the value proposition matters far more than the absolute highest performance available.
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Did you not read the many other postings of systems around the $800-$900 mark that people posted up? You must be a guerrilla/viral marketer. Because I cannot believe you ignored ALL those system setups people posted in their arguments previous to your post. Were you too lazy to read the rest of the thread before airing your opinion? Is it me or are some of these people NOT reading shit but the last page of posts and just spouting knee jerk reactions to what they read?

SheepCake said:
AMD should just give up and leave the cpu market for good, they are so far behind their chips, chipsets and everything else are USELESS TRASH, garbage, not worth the silicon they are printed on.......
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For all the people that say Kyle was biased against AMD, Kyle aint got shit on this sheep here...



In other news, my question is since i'm doing a new system, would the price increase justify an i& setup for future proofing? I plan to take my sound card, GPU, PS, from the system in my sig to put in the new build. So all I need is CPU, MOBO, and Ram.
 
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