Attaching Bookshelves to Z-5500 Subwoofer

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Mansize_tissue

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I'm thinking of replacing the two front satellites of my Z-5500 set with a pair of bookshelf speakers; is this possible?
 
Danothemano said:
Yep.
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Would you mind elaborating please?

I have little knowledge of audio equipment, and I mainly use these Z-5500s for gaming. However, occasionally when I want to listen to music on something other than my headphones, I want to use the Z-5500s but they completely fail at it. Do I need to look for 8ohm (I think that's what the Z-5500 satellite speakers are rated at) bookshelves which can handle a little over 62 watts so they aren't blown by the amplifier?
 
To be on the safe side you could go with speakers that have the same ohm rating, especially since you're not sure what the amp's tolerances are.

I wouldn't worry about matching watts too much though. It's not uncommon to to see speakers paired with amps that are twice as powerful, just don't max out the volume and you'll be ok.
 
it works fine if you dont listen super loud. i used some cheap pioneer speakers on my z680 till i decided to blow the logitec amp up a little.

this is right after i blew the amp up, which was followed by by the cheap onkyo.
Rears.jpg


in the end not a great difference in sound but a difference none the less. the top end is loads better but teh cross over is set hi (well over 100zh) so it still sounds a bit thin.
 
Thank you for your help, guys. I have a really old pair of Sony bookshelves in the loft, and I'm pretty sure they're utter crap. However, I was thinking I could just connect them up to see what it's like before I drop some cash on the new ones. Here's a photograph of the rear of the speaker:


Do you think it's worth a shot?

SJetski71, if I get a pair of speakers rated at say 80 watts, there wouldn't be any chance in anything blowing would there? I mean, the amplifier won't be able to handle this much anyway so it won't overload them, I don't think.

Tangent inc., why exactly did the amplifier blow up? I'm a little concerned because I think I'd rather have the amplifier, like, working and stuff. Yeah, I was also thinking about how the crossover frequency would affect any kind of improvement gained from this. It's a bit annoying, but still worth a try.

Thanks again, I really appreciate your help.
 
Tangent inc. said:
it works fine if you dont listen super loud. i used some cheap pioneer speakers on my z680 till i decided to blow the logitec amp up a little.

this is right after i blew the amp up, which was followed by by the cheap onkyo.
Rears.jpg


in the end not a great difference in sound but a difference none the less. the top end is loads better but teh cross over is set hi (well over 100zh) so it still sounds a bit thin.
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I also replaced my 2 front sats with Polk R15, and the diff is pretty big for me. But I'm looking for a good cheap center channel to replace the log one... which one do you have?
 
kaluminati said:
I also replaced my 2 front sats with Polk R15, and the diff is pretty big for me. But I'm looking for a good cheap center channel to replace the log one... which one do you have?
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Did you replace the satellites on a set of Z-5500s with these?
 
I've done this before with the Z-560's and some Athena bookshelves. It's a decent upgrade, and you always have the option to move onto a receiver and subwoofer later on (which is what I did).
 
While changing the PC sats to real bookshelf speakers will indeed improve the sound, you must understand that you are still tying the bookshelf speakers to the limited range of the PC sub, which obviously will be driving the speakers. In effect, whatever range you had with your old speakers, you'll just be pushing that through better speakers, which means, not much. And then, at that, you may mess up the sound imaging; think unbalanced sound due to different speakers. If you are going to change the fronts, you might as well change the rears as well as the center (i.e. all of them).

If you really want to get better sound, ditch the PC based system and get a real receiver, sub, and speakers. I realize budget may not allow for it, but if good sound is what you're after, you're better served this way. Plus, it's not exorbitantly expensive as it was before; ~$500.00 can get you a nice system.
 
My brother has done this (Klipsch 4.1 system, replaced the sats with Klipsch bookshelves)... and a LOT of people do this on the Klipsch forums.

The Klipsch amp and the Logitech amp are just about the same. You should be able to swap the sats and the bookshelf speakers with no problem. You may have to play with the balance though, I'm sure it's not hard using the 5500's control pod.

This is a first step to moving up to a receiver based system.

I would wholeheartedly suggest that you do this for now, and save money and get yourself a receiver based system at a later date. The sats on the 5500 are not exactly its strong point. The 5500's strongpoint is its versatility... but by adding better fronts mains to it, you'll definitely improve your music experience in stereo and by carefully balancing the overall volume for all 5 speakers, you can improve your movie watching/gaming experience as well.

As long as your speakers are not a tough load (say 4ohm impedance), you should be ok.
 
Pinipig523 said:
This is a first step to moving up to a receiver based system.

I would wholeheartedly suggest that you do this for now, and save money and get yourself a receiver based system at a later date. The sats on the 5500 are not exactly its strong point. The 5500's strongpoint is its versatility... but by adding better fronts mains to it, you'll definitely improve your music experience in stereo and by carefully balancing the overall volume for all 5 speakers, you can improve your movie watching/gaming experience as well.

As long as your speakers are not a tough load (say 4ohm impedance), you should be ok.
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This is a good point. It's a good way to start stepping up to real audio - hi fi audio. Once you do, you'll never, ever look back.
 
Mansize_tissue said:
SJetski71, if I get a pair of speakers rated at say 80 watts, there wouldn't be any chance in anything blowing would there? I mean, the amplifier won't be able to handle this much anyway so it won't overload them, I don't think.
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Though wattage ratings should always be taken with a grain of salt, a set of 80watt speakers should be perfectly fine. Distortion will probably keep you from maxing the volume anyway.
 
Ok, thank you for all of your help guys. I really appreciate it.

I would've got a receiver + bookshelf speakers to begin with, but I prioritise gaming over music and I really don't have enough room to have bookshelf speakers as rears. On my desk I can only really fit a small pair of bookshelf speakers, so I'll have to leave the centre and rears at satellites for now, but I'm just curious I guess.

What sort of damage could I cause by attaching those old, Sony speakers? Is anything likely to blow up and should I only keep it at low volumes?

If this works out well and I decide to get some better bookshelves, do they need to be 8 ohms? Also, am I best to get some rated for higher wattages or lower wattages? I just have little knowledge in this area, and I really don't want to risk hurting anything.
 
Computer speakers like the Logitechs and Klipschs are 6 ohm. Most bookshelfs for *real* audio systems are usually 8 ohm. Translation: volume level won't be quite as high, which would be not be a problem in your case. Like one of the earlier posts, distortion would win out over volume at the higher levels.

Decent A/V and audio receivers will drive 4 ohm speakers. I doubt the z-5500's would. Less resistance = higher amps, which would not be good "cheaper" amps.

In the end, your bookshelfs should be just fine.
 
JC634 said:
Computer speakers like the Logitechs and Klipschs are 6 ohm. Most bookshelfs for *real* audio systems are usually 8 ohm. Translation: volume level won't be quite as high, which would be not be a problem in your case. Like one of the earlier posts, distortion would win out over volume at the higher levels.

Decent A/V and audio receivers will drive 4 ohm speakers. I doubt the z-5500's would. Less resistance = higher amps, which would not be good "cheaper" amps.

In the end, your bookshelfs should be just fine.
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Ah, thank you. I'll try connected them later today, but I haven't got very high hopes because they'll probably still lack midrange. I'll report back later with my findings.
 
I have a little bit of a problem. I just got the old speakers down from the loft and realised there's a 2-pin plug on the end of the wire instead of normal, bare speaker wire. Now, I'd get a photograph up on here so you could see but the only camera I have handy is the one on my mobile phone and the memory card doesn't seem to like my card reader any more so I'll just have to explain. Basically, there are 2 pins: one of them is 9mm long, round and comes to a point at the end; the other is 10mm long, 4mm wide (it's a rectangular shape) and, therefore, has a flat end. Any idea which corresponds to the black and red wires on normal speaker cable? Oh and, by the way, the wires split and join the speaker at to different points (one is colour-coded blue, the other is red).

EDIT: My memory card and card reader made up, so here are some photographs:





Hmm, I could connect the red speaker cable, that's currently being used to connect my front satellites to the subwoofer, directly to the back of the speaker instead by unscrewing the the existing cable. Would I connect the red wire to the red bit on the speaker, and then the black wire to the blue bit?
 
Ok, so I got it all hooked up in the end, but I cant decide whether it sounds better or not. One thing I've noticed, though, is that I notice a lot more sounds in my music, such as symbols. However, the mid-bass isn't really much better, they take up more room and I'm too afraid I'm going to damage something if I turn it up too loud. I'm not really too concerned about breaking the speakers, it's just the amplifier/subwoofer unit which concerns me. Am I likely to damage the amplifier by having the volume too loud, and would getting higher/lower watt/impedence speakers make damaging the amplifier (or even the speakers) more likely?
 
kaluminati,
mine are pioneer shf21lr and the matching center which i ordered on sale from circutcity. i definitely suggest getting bookshelves and have no doubt you will like the improvment, just keep in mind it is not worlds different. for me i was happy with the money spent.
P4290125.jpg


Mansize_tissue,
One thing I've noticed, though, is that I notice a lot more sounds in my music, such as symbols. However, the mid-bass isn't really much better
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this is what i meant with "the top end is loads better but the cross over is set hi (well over 100zh) so it still sounds a bit thin" the amp is crossed over at 120kz 'ish and all the sound under that point will route to the sub. there is no way around this but for me the 680's where for gaming only so i did not mind. voices in movies will sound "chesty" because the sub will put far more power in the high bass freq. then naturally produced by our body. with a bookshelf containing a tweeter you are only gaining higher extension and maybe a bit of clarity but the mid performance will remain the same.

as Pinipig523 commented... this is a great start for upgrades. and he is one of the inspiring factors in my money well spent.

i hold this forum in sole responsibility for the thousands i have spent in the past year on home theater and PC audio gear. for me it all started with "well now that i have spearkers, a receiver as about the same price as replacing my z680" then i ended up woth a sub, receiver for a second system (HTPC) and a few K in speakers for that system. now i am looking into a bigger sub, have just bought a new tv due on tues. and will order the X-sub for my first rig in about a month.



in the end i guess all i have to say is "DAMN you guys... im broke" good luck Mansize_tissue have fun in your decision.
 
Thank you. I'll hook these bookshelves up semi-permanently soon--that is, until I get some proper ones. Can any of you guys recommend any? I don't want to spend too much (no more than £60) because the little improvement doesn't really justify spending any more. Also, are there any here that would be appropriate. Also, how can I prevent any damage to the amplifier? Do I want to get speakers rated for higher or lower than 62 watts (I think that's what the satellites are rated for)?

Nice setup by the way, Tangent inc.
 
Would anything bad happen if I connect these speakers to the Z-5500 amplifier?





They're 2 ohms less than the smaller Sony bookshelves I have connected right now. I just wanted to see if these sounded any different.

Oh, and I'm still looking to buy some nicer looking bookshelves. Any suggestions? I definitely don't want to spend more than £50, but £40 is my limit ideally.
 
I had the control pod receiver go out on my Z-5500 set.

Logitech sent me a whole new system, and I'd like to utilize the sats and sub for another PC.

Anyone know where to find a {"center, front, rear" 1/8" tri-set to db15 cable} ?

I'm thinking I should be able to bypass the control pod altogether? Should be able to just go from the tri-prong 1/8" plugged to computer and pipe that to the db15 pins. I'd prefer not to make a custom cable. How would volume control work? Assume I could just control it from the PC since the amp is in the sub.

That or I'm guessing I could use a cheap 5.1 a/v or surround receiver, by inputting PC to that and outputting to the sub.....again the db15 connection messes that up.

Any help?
 
Any advice with respect to the question in my previous post? I want to try out these speakers to see if there's any improvement. However, I don't know if their lower impedance and higher wattage will cause any damage to anything.
 
Mansize_tissue said:
Any advice with respect to the question in my previous post? I want to try out these speakers to see if there's any improvement. However, I don't know if their lower impedance and higher wattage will cause any damage to anything.
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5500's sats are 6 ohm. Higher wattage (if I understand correctly) simply referances how much power the speakers can handle. 60 watts should be fine. OR... If the speakers begin to sound distorted, turn the volume down.
 
JC634 said:
5500's sats are 6 ohm. Higher wattage (if I understand correctly) simply referances how much power the speakers can handle. 60 watts should be fine. OR... If the speakers begin to sound distorted, turn the volume down.
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Ok, thank you. So, say I connected some 4 ohm speakers or 10 ohm speakers; what... difference would this make?
 
Tangent inc. said:
they would not play as loud for a given volume at the same sensitivity.
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Thank you. So the lower the impedance they more difficult they are to drive, correct? It's weird that, with headphones, it's the other way round. Should I take any precautions with these 6 ohm speakers; I mean, is anything more likely to break with these than with the 8 ohm ones?
 
You can proceed without worry. The only minor precautions you *may* need to take will be to lower the volume if it sounds horrible and distorted (your ears will know it when they hear it).

Plug em in, and crank it up slowly to test. You won't have to blast the volume 100% since it'll sound bad anyway. But maybe try as high as 60-70%, then let your ears be the judge.
 
oops sorry i did not transate my thought to words well. the ohm rating is just a guide for the all around resistance. this changes with frequency and if the industry would supply a curve instead of a number then amps can be better matched.

to your question... the the higher the ohm rating the harder to drive stands true. when you drop resistance your amp works less for a given output but you can stress the power supply side of the amp and cause shut offs or damage. this may not be entirely true but to me it is like.... if you are going to push something and you have a good idea of the weight you expect it to be that weight. ass you lean in you suddenly feel the object slide away and fall on you face. you have "THIS" amount of push but the object only needed "THAT" much to drive and you have caused and unstable state (falling). if the am runs out of head room because you dropped the resistance to low then you run into clipping and over heating just as you would loosing your footing when expecting an object to resist your push

every time you double the resistance your at least half the potential amount of power you speaker will receive.

ok done with that. you should have nothing to worry about when you plug bookshelves into your setup. i do have first have experience in blowing up the Z680 wiring it with sub that i had layin around though. i over drew the amp at a lower resistance then it could handle and it burned up. 4ohm 12" infinity tower and 8ohm logi bash amp.
 
Thank you, I really appreciate your help, guys. I'll try connecting them up later. If there's much improvement over the small Sony bookshelves I have connected up right now, I guess I'll end up spending a little more on a more descent pair of bookshelves.
 
Well, the larger Sony speakers work fine. Of course, they don't sound anywhere near their full potential, but they're better than the normal satellites. Look:

 
No No No, 4ohm speakers have less resistance just like headphones, but this also means they will pull more current from the amplifier, which may not be able to handle it.

Basicaly if you put 2 8 ohm speakers in parallel you will achieve a 4 ohm load, which may or may not cook the amp (pulling twice the current from the same channel on the amp).
 
Justintoxicated said:
No No No, 4ohm speakers have less resistance just like headphones, but this also means they will pull more current from the amplifier, which may not be able to handle it.

Basicaly if you put 2 8 ohm speakers in parallel you will achieve a 4 ohm load, which may or may not cook the amp (pulling twice the current from the same channel on the amp).
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Ah right, cheers. So 6 ohm speakers should be ok, right?
 
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