Audio dropout with SB Z and optical audio

[jamesman32]

I currently have a home audio setup that runs as follows. I have a Sound Blaster Z running optical audio to an Onkyo receiver. I have a pair of 7870s in crossfire, one of which is using HDMI through the Onkyo receiver into my monitor. My issue is the following; every few moments, my audio cuts in and out. It happens a few times every song in iTunes, once in a while in Pandora, every so often on Youtube, etc, and it even causes my in-game sound to get really distorted. The computer responds, but the sound just drops momentarily.

Here's what I've done so far to try to troubleshoot.

- Reinstalled Windows (Didn't help)
- Updated BIOS (Didn't help)
- Updated audio drivers to newest version (Didn't help)
- Tried beta audio drivers (Didn't help)
- Disabled all audio playback other than optical (Didn't help)
- Updated GPU drivers (Didn't help)
- Uninstalled HDMI audio drivers for GPU (Didn't help)
- Tried beta GPU drivers (Didn't help)
- Tried connected HDMI straight to monitor with no receiver pass (Didn't help)
- Connected headphones directly to sound card and disconnected optical (Works, no drop out!)***
- Connected headphones to receiver, connected receiver to soundcard with optical (Didn't help)
- Set PCIe slot to manually default to Gen3 in BIOS (Didn't help)

I've researched this issue a bit more, and I've found that MANY people have had weird HDMI audio dropout issues with the HD7000 series (very similar to mine), but I'm not using HDMI audio through my GPUs, I'm using optical from my Sound Blaster Z. There is a known registry fix for this bug, which I've tried, and it does not help my issue either. The only "fix" I have found is disconnected optical completely and plugging my headphones into the 3.5mm output on the sound card, meaning my receiver and speakers are useless.

For reference, the SB Z and Onkyo receiver worked fine together in my previous rig. The only "new" components in my system are the 1150 MB and CPU, and the two 7870s. Previously I was on 1155 with a single GTX670.

Any ideas?

 

[B00nie]

So when you use the sound without having it decoded in the Onkyo receiver, stuff works. Ring any bell?

 

[jamesman32]

So when you use the sound without having it decoded in the Onkyo receiver, stuff works. Ring any bell?

So you think it could be the receiver? I tried going to the SBZ control panel and disabling Dolby and DTS and running without an encoder, and then selecting "Play stereo mix to digital output" and I haven't had any drop outs so far.

 

[Nenu]

Try another optical cable.
The one you are using may be damaged, causing less light to get to the receiving end, or light is bounced around a little damaging the signal or interfering with incoming signals.

See if the problem changes in any way when you wiggle the cable.
Although this may not show if the cable isnt the problem, it may show that it is.
Its worth try another cable even if this makes no difference.

You can also try an SPDIF coax cable, your amp and soundcard should both support this.

 

[jamesman32]

Try another optical cable.
The one you are using may be damaged, causing less light to get to the receiving end, or light is bounced around a little damaging the signal or interfering with incoming signals.

See if the problem changes in any way when you wiggle the cable.
Although this may not show if the cable isnt the problem, it may show that it is.
Its worth try another cable even if this makes no difference.

You can also try an SPDIF coax cable, your amp and soundcard should both support this.

Wiggling the cable at the connectors doesn't cause any drops. The issue feels really random. I can't physically do anything to the cable to cause it. I'll grab another cable off Amazon if I can't figure something else out.

I did however realize the the one other change I made in my setup was moving my receiver from my desktop to a cabinet. I moved it back to the desktop after noticing how hot the receiver was getting when all the hot air rising from it was being trapped above it. This hasn't fixed the issue either.

 

[Nenu]

Stick a PC fan running at 5V or 7V on top of the amp if you can find a small power supply, like for an external hard drive.
Make it draw air out of the top.
This will save your amp from wearing out quickly.

Try a coax cable from the soundcard, theres no need to use optical for digital out.

 

[B00nie]

So you think it could be the receiver? I tried going to the SBZ control panel and disabling Dolby and DTS and running without an encoder, and then selecting "Play stereo mix to digital output" and I haven't had any drop outs so far.

If removing the dolby settings in your receiver fixed the problem then the issue is possibly related to your receiver and has nothing to do with the computer itself. Try another receiver. When troubleshooting you must always eliminate each possible factor one by one.

 

[nob0dey]

Try another optical cable.
The one you are using may be damaged, causing less light to get to the receiving end, or light is bounced around a little damaging the signal or interfering with incoming signals.

See if the problem changes in any way when you wiggle the cable.
Although this may not show if the cable isnt the problem, it may show that it is.
Its worth try another cable even if this makes no difference.

You can also try an SPDIF coax cable, your amp and soundcard should both support this.

I have a ZxR. I don't see anywhere on the card or on the manual that says it has a SPDIF coax. The whole z line does not support it.

OP try swapping out the optical cable. I've been through that same issue with my receiver and luckily it worked again.

 

[nob0dey]

Just found a beta driver for the Z and Zx dated June 13th.

Take note of the following:

THIS IS AN UNSUPPORTED BETA DRIVER. There is no technical support for this driver.
We recommend that only experienced users install this driver. Do not install this driver on a system used to perform critical tasks.
Users who are looking for stable drivers should wait for the final release. When this happens, user should install the latest Sound Blaster Z-Series driver available.
This download supports and is applicable for the following models:

Sound Blaster Z (SB1500, SB1502)
Sound Blaster Zx (SB1506)
Added Enhancement / Features:

Multiple fixes that improve the driver's overall stability and performance
Added support for ASIO playback and recording

http://support.creative.com/downloads/download.aspx?nDownloadId=12806

 

[Nenu]

I have a ZxR. I don't see anywhere on the card or on the manual that says it has a SPDIF coax. The whole z line does not support it.

OP try swapping out the optical cable. I've been through that same issue with my receiver and luckily it worked again.

Ah, didnt realise, thanks for checking.
I'm surprised though, my X-Fi and Prelude both do coax from the same port as the optical out.

 

[B00nie]

Optical cables are prone to cracking if they get bent. One of the downfalls of the tech.

 

[counterpoint]

Can the receiver's firmware be updated via network or USB? May not be possible if its an older model. What model is it btw?

 

[jamesman32]

I have a ZxR. I don't see anywhere on the card or on the manual that says it has a SPDIF coax. The whole z line does not support it.

OP try swapping out the optical cable. I've been through that same issue with my receiver and luckily it worked again.

I'll try that today and see if it helps. Thanks

Just found a beta driver for the Z and Zx dated June 13th.

Thanks for the link. That's the driver I'm currently running already. Unfortunately it hasn't helped over the April release.

Can the receiver's firmware be updated via network or USB? May not be possible if its an older model. What model is it btw?

I checked Onkyo's website (The model is the HT-S3400) and it says there are no firmware updates available

http://legacy.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=HT-S3400&class=Systems&p=d

 

[jamesman32]

Small update on this issue, for anyone interested or following.

I took all my hardware out of my case and set up a bench. Initially, when the problem started, I had my expansion cards set up as follows, going from top to bottom.

1. 7870 (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
2. Empty (PCIe X1)
3. Sound Blaster Z (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
4. 7870 (PCIe X16 2.0 @ X4)

When I removed my setup from my case, I removed the bottom 7870 (in slot 4) and moved the SBZ from slot 3 to slot 4. I kept the first 7870 in slot 1, and the new configuration looked like this.

1. 7870 (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X16)
2. Empty
3. Empty
4. Sound Blaster Z (PCIe X16 2.0 @ X4)

In this configuration, the problem with optical audio dropout went away completely. So, I think I've found that my receiver, my optical cable, my speakers, and my sound card all work, as I thought they did. Is there any possible way that the dropout is a motherboard issue or a crossfire compatibility issue?

 

[Nenu]

Yeah good troubleshooting.
But very confusing as I would expect the same problem to occur (as described) with your headphones connected directly to the Z.
Are you 100% sure it doesnt happen with analogue out from the Z as well?

Can you try another amp with optical in?
You may have a poor optical implementation on the Onkyo that is very sensitive to timing issues.

 

[jamesman32]

Yeah good troubleshooting.
But very confusing as I would expect the same problem to occur (as described) with your headphones connected directly to the Z.
Are you 100% sure it doesnt happen with analogue out from the Z as well?

Can you try another amp with optical in?
You may have a poor optical implementation on the Onkyo that is very sensitive to timing issues.

Positive it doesn't happen with analog out. Tried both my Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 and my Audio Technica headphones. Also, I cannot try another amp without borrowing one from a friend or relative. I just don't have another one hanging around at the moment.

On another note, I tried yet another configuration, and the dropout has returned, which leads me further to believe it might be a PCIe issue?.

Bearing in mind that this was the original configuration
1. 7870 (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
2. Empty (PCIe X1)
3. Sound Blaster Z (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
4. 7870 (PCIe X16 2.0 @ X4)

And I just tried this
1. 7870 (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
2. Empty (PCIe X1)
3. Sound Blaster Z (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
4. Empty

Removing the second 7870 but keeping all other slots the same makes the dropout come back, albeit a lot less frequently.

 

[Nenu]

Assuming the second config also has the problem, it looks like you cant put the soundcard in the SLI paired x8 PCI-E slots.
Its possible that the SLI slots are giving the same latency / availability as a pair, which is suitable for the gfx cards but not for the soundcard.

Find a way not to use the x8 slots for the soundcard while a gfx card is in one of them.
See what happens if you use one gfx card in a none x8 slot while the soundcard is in a x8 slot, just to see what happens.

 

[jamesman32]

Assuming the second config also has the problem, it looks like you cant put the soundcard in the SLI paired x8 PCI-E slots.
Its possible that the SLI slots are giving the same latency / availability as a pair, which is suitable for the gfx cards but not for the soundcard.

Find a way not to use the x8 slots for the soundcard while a gfx card is in one of them.
See what happens if you use one gfx card in a none x8 slot while the soundcard is in a x8 slot, just to see what happens.

I tried the following configuration per your recommendation (No GPU in the SLI slots (1 or 3)).

1. Empty (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
2. Empty (PCIe X1)
3. Sound Blaster Z (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
4. 7870 (PCIe X16 2.0 @ X4)

In this configuration, there is STILL some dropout.

I then tried the following

1. Empty (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
2. SBZ (PCIe X1)
3. 7870 (PCIe X16 3.0 @ X8)
4. Empty (PCIe X16 2.0 @ X4)

This setup yielded no dropout, as expected, because the SBZ was not in an X16 lane where it could interfere with the GPUs.

I decided to go ahead and order another motherboard. I went with an MSI Z87M-G43, which has the following configuration

1. PCIe X16 3.0
2. PCIe X1
3. PCIe X1
4. PCIe X16 2.0

I think this configuration should work better? The SBZ will sit in slot 3 with GPUs in 1 and 4, and they shouldn't interfere.