best bang for the buck souncard

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RayDaddy

[H]ard|Gawd
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Feb 22, 2007
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I Have an intel DX79SR board and am using onboard sound and I want something noticeably better but on a budget.

looking for the best bang for the buck soundcard.

music and gaming are my focus

I can go pci or pci express 1x for slots


thanks
 
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Better speakers will be more of a difference than a better sound card, unless you're getting noise/interference from other components.
 
Yeah, if you want better clarity and depth you'll need better speakers then. I used to use some Logitech Z560 THX 4.1 that look similar to yours and they're were okish (and I'm biased as I got them for free), they got the job done but there's way better speakers out there. You're unlikely to notice a difference with new sound card/DAC (not counting some specialized post processing which is usually crap anyway). Spend you money where it counts, the speakers.
 
Yup. The creative Z has the best surround emulation out there. For gaming, it is the best currently.
 
spaceman said:
Yup. The creative Z has the best surround emulation out there. For gaming, it is the best currently.
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Agreed. If you're using on-board audio then Razer Surround (free or pay version) does a nice job with any set of headphones.
 
Use onboard unless you're getting poor SNR (hum, hiss, etc.). Surround emulation is completely unnecessary. Even if you like the idea of surround emulation, it's still better to put the money into better speakers instead, in my opinion. If you already have good speakers, THEN look into surround handling if you do want it. I don't mess around with surround in games much as of late, but I've owned and experienced many home theater systems, and when watching recent movies that have relatively good surround tracks, I'd rather have 2 good speakers than 3+ bad ones. (Though having 5+ GOOD speakers is certainly not a bad thing!)
 
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Matthew Kane said:
Quad ESL 54 or 65's should do the job.
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Heh :)

Although I agree that a better speaker will make the biggest difference (assuming no other immediate issues as hinted above)
Then upgrade the amp or sound card next.

Pechendko said:
ALC889 is the best bang for your buck

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/high-end-pc-audio,3733-19.html

Modern onboard audio is at the point where you won't hear any difference with a technically better dac. Unless you are some deluded audiophile with placebo.
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Or someone who has good enough kit to tell the difference :p
Fair enough if its not your thing, but it doesnt mean others should miss out.
 
Nenu said:
Or someone who has good enough kit to tell the difference :p
Fair enough if its not your thing, but it doesnt mean others should miss out.
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I have hd650's and o2/odac. Is this good enough?

Tried from my asus maximus4 onboard audio as well as straight from odac. And there's no perceptible difference when the volume levels matched closely. Even the volume was plenty enough for 650's, when driven from realtek.

Event if there's some tonal difference it's so minuscule it's not worth bothering with, you'd better off spending that money on better phones.
 
Pechendko said:
I have hd650's and o2/odac. Is this good enough?
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Dont know, havent tried them.

Tried from my asus maximus4 onboard audio as well as straight from odac. And there's no perceptible difference when the volume levels matched closely. Even the volume was plenty enough for 650's, when driven from realtek.

Event if there's some tonal difference it's so minuscule it's not worth bothering with, you'd better off spending that money on better phones.
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There is little difference between my Auzentech Prelude, Emotiva UMC-1 and the Onkyo 875 DACs, quite similar sound.
All of them sound better than my onboard sound by quite a margin, more detail, better bass extension, warmer sound, greater stereo effects

But my 2 most recent DACs put everything to shame, they are the Minimax Tube DAC plus and Oppo 105.
These have more detail in spades, its not even close. Stereo effects are another league entirely.
Both of these use the same DAC chip but are connected in different ways internally. This makes them sound different to each other.
(Minimax is brighter/more detailed and has lowest bass extension, the Oppo emphasises some bass frequencies more so bass can feel stronger and pulls a little bit more of a stereo effect on occasion. I prefer the Minimax on my current setup, it makes me want to listen to music more, but it is only stereo. The Oppo is a great surround DAC and very good stereo.)

The DAC can have a great impact, as can the design of the circuit for the DAC chip used (and other components).
The DAC should be chosen to suit the equipment you have and perhaps your own taste.
If you have a bright amp/speakers and you choose a bright DAC, you may hate it.
But if your system lacks brightness, that DAC might help bring it to life.


Its not always easy or cheap to make the best decision.
It wasnt until I built new speakers that I could tell much difference between DACs, but even then, the earlier DACs were similar.
A good set of headphones (well driven, you may need a headphone amp) should be ample to tell the difference between DACs.
But as you pointed out, some differences are small and not worth paying money for.

The more crap you put in the way of the signal, the more detail you lose.
ie overly long cables, poor quality cables, poor quality connections, unneeded pre-amps, low quality EQs, low quality amp etc...
You dont need to spend a lot on cables, just dont buy crap ones.
When you get a very revealing setup (and you care for more of that), higher quality cables that cost a bit more can be useful. But no point in spending much until you are sure.

Choose wisely.

edit
forgot to say:
With my older DACs I didnt care much for high definition music (24bit 96KHz to 192KHz).
I could tell the difference but it was small.
When I got the last 2 DACs that changed, its very easy to tell the difference now and is much appreciated, more detail, things I couldnt hear before.
Of course the speakers, amp and least other things in the signal path help decide how much you get from your DAC.
 
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Nenu said:
Or someone who has good enough kit to tell the difference :p
Fair enough if its not your thing, but it doesnt mean others should miss out.
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Keep telling yourself whatever you need to justify your wasted purchases. I'll take either my DIY Adire/Vifa/HiVi or my Onix Reference 1 speakers with onboard over ANY of your fancy gear (though I actually run most of my audio through the TI USB DAC built into my Allen&Heath ZED-10 mixer). I especially love all the wasted money on buying that many DACs - even if you really think they are better, it is not cost effective to keep buying them, and you are significantly exaggerating the differences (anytime anyone tells you 2 DACs sound more than very slightly different, they are using hyperbole). Keep driving that economy though.

Don't get me wrong - I'm sure your setup sounds good - but I'm 100% confident that nobody needs to spend a ton of money on DACs like you did to get sound as good or better than yours.
 
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Jesus, I dont need to tell myself anything, that was my experience I posted.

I didnt once say he should spend what I have, there are soooooo many DACs etc, I cannot possibly know what is best value for the op.
My Hifi upgrade process was quite slow until I realised I could finally get what I wanted.
The only regret purchase was the Emotiva UMC-1. I got that because it came with a free money off voucher (that was worth more than I paid) for an upcoming DAC. But then I ended up getting the Minimax DAC so gave the Emo DAC to a friend who is more than happy with it.

I loved the sound from the Minimax' Sabre32 9018 DAC chip so much that I had to get a multichannel version of it, this is why I bought the Oppo 105. I dont regret it one bit, it does everything I wanted it to.
My brother liked it so much he bought one as well !
The Onkyo 875 was my first higher quality amp system, it served its purpose well and my Dad now has it. I bought some Emotiva amps to replace it which would not have been worth upgrading for my old DACs, but did open up even more detail on the two Sabre32 DAC machines.

All I can do is pass on what I know.
I wanted him to know that you can get parts that make a difference, but I do concede that not everyone cares enough for it to matter, and fair enough. Perceived value is what it is.
I am very happy with my system, I'm glad you are with yours.
 
Nenu said:
Jesus, I dont need to tell myself anything, that was my experience I posted.
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Ah, but don't go and tell us our other gear is not up to par if we don't agree with you about DACs and you won't get rebuked. Golden ears tend to make this assumption that you either hear some huge difference from whatever expensive tube-based DAC or your speakers or ears are faulty. Neither is the case (at least for some of us).
 
I upgraded from logitech z3 to Microlabs Fc360 Speaker and it made a massive difference. I could understand what people were saying which was a huge improvements. I will never buy logitech speakers again.
 
dandragonrage said:
Ah, but don't go and tell us our other gear is not up to par if we don't agree with you about DACs and you won't get rebuked. Golden ears tend to make this assumption that you either hear some huge difference from whatever expensive tube-based DAC or your speakers or ears are faulty. Neither is the case (at least for some of us).
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He gave 'audiophiles' a dig so I gave him one back :p

There are some loonies and rip off gear.
But there are also people who genuinely appreciate well chosen parts.

I wasnt really knocking his gear, I qualified that in my next post and put a lot of effort into it in case it would help him.
So thanks.

ps
I turned the Tube section of my DAC off and disconnected its power supply because it made a noticeable difference to the solid state DAC section!
(I found this out when I unplugged the tube one day)
I no longer use the Tube section, it is entirely disabled.
I didnt buy it because it has a tube, I got it because of very good reviews and user feedback.
 
My Xonar DGX cost me $20 bucks new. As far as bang and buck are related I guess it depends on how much buck you have....
 
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