Put the hard drive count up to 50, since thats the largest case drive capacity that you can purchase off shelf. Also, companies such as enermax, takes pride in the fact that their 1kw psu offering can handle 24 drives, which would make your cap of 20 drives a limiting (logical) factor in psu selection.
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Corsair PSU Finder Beta - please give feedback in this thread
- Thread starter Redbeard
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Put the hard drive count up to 50, since thats the largest case drive capacity that you can purchase off shelf. Also, companies such as enermax, takes pride in the fact that their 1kw psu offering can handle 24 drives, which would make your cap of 20 drives a limiting (logical) factor in psu selection.
Grimlaking
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Ok get the sli thing fixed.
I first specced a c2d (E6600) with a single GTS and 3 drives and the max it reccomended was a vx550.
then I specd a c2d q6600 with sli'd 8800gts videos and 3 drives. and the max it reccomended was a vx550. I think I would be pushing the limit with the two 8800gts's in this case wouldn't I?
I suspect that the sli switch may not be calculating based on all draws.
Also include an option for future upgradeability. IE if you have someone buying today with a habit of upgrading once a year or twice a year or once every three months you will be climbing the power supply charts.
So something with a ESTIMATED upgrade path power supply wise may help. That way we can buy the next step up and unless the upgrade is really phenomenal we are sitting pretty.
Maybe even an upgrade credit like with what evga does with video cards?
I first specced a c2d (E6600) with a single GTS and 3 drives and the max it reccomended was a vx550.
then I specd a c2d q6600 with sli'd 8800gts videos and 3 drives. and the max it reccomended was a vx550. I think I would be pushing the limit with the two 8800gts's in this case wouldn't I?
I suspect that the sli switch may not be calculating based on all draws.
Also include an option for future upgradeability. IE if you have someone buying today with a habit of upgrading once a year or twice a year or once every three months you will be climbing the power supply charts.
So something with a ESTIMATED upgrade path power supply wise may help. That way we can buy the next step up and unless the upgrade is really phenomenal we are sitting pretty.
Maybe even an upgrade credit like with what evga does with video cards?
Make the "SLI/Crossfire enabled" text black, see if you like it better than grey (I think I would).
And yeah, darker buttons are needed, I refreshed the page 3 times to try different configs before I noticed the buttons.
To keep things simple, i would jump from 10 HDD to 15 HDD to 20... I don't think 1 HDD makes THAT much of a difference, besides, most people will have less than 10.
Nice tool, I actually checked your site a few days ago wondering if it had a watts calculator or something similar (many of the ones out there are unreliable) but this is even better.
According to it, a highly OC'd Quad Core (non-Ex), 2 8800GT, and 2 HDDs are still powered comfortably by a 520HX, I was thinking of going for the 620HX but I guess really don't need to.
According to it, a highly OC'd Quad Core (non-Ex), 2 8800GT, and 2 HDDs are still powered comfortably by a 520HX, I was thinking of going for the 620HX but I guess really don't need to.
LstBrunnenG
Supreme [H]ardness
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5 HDDs, an overclocked quad-core Core 2 Extreme, and 8800GTXes in SLi and all I'd need is a 620W PSU.
Is it bad that I like this thing because it gives me answers I like to hear?
Is it bad that I like this thing because it gives me answers I like to hear?
Redbeard
Official Corsair Rep.
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Not really, the Q6600 is about 100W, the 8800GTS requires about 120-130W each. Each hard drive is about 15W. Add another 75W as a baseline for motherboard, memory, fans, etc. So with an SLI 8800GTS setup, you'd be at 475W or so under nightmare load.
A 620/650 might be a better choice for headroom and such, but I'd be surprised if you could actually draw 400W+ in a real-world scenario with your system unless you really overclocked it.
Also, for those of you guys with huge numbers of hard drives, I'm sure you realize you are in the vast minority. In the sake of keeping the interface clean, going up to like 50 HDD would just be useless for the majority of folks.
I'm trying to strike a balance between a realistic useful tool for like 95% of people who want to know which PSU to buy and the cool tweakable tool for the 5% of us that are hardcore lunatics.
I'm going to guess that a guy with 50 hard drives is more on the "hardcore lunatic" side of things, and can probably figure out his power needs without resorting to a simple web-based config tool like this. But I'll see what I can do.
Maybe a text input for # of Hds, which is then $HD*15 or whatever is added to the equation? That would keep it clean and still allow for the space crazy people out there
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Redbeard
Official Corsair Rep.
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Not to mention 50 HDD's may be a bit outside teh TX750W's comfort zone
Well, I'm sure it could run 50 HDDs as long as nothing else was hooked up to it, hahaha.
I'd be more worried about the current draw through all the cables. If I knew it was going to run 50 HDDs I'd design the internals of the thing differently so that I could be sure no huge amount of current was going through any one trace or connector, etc.
I just published a minor update, added Opteron processors (only the AM2/939 and Socket F variants, Socket 940 is still mostly server boards) and changed some text around in a few places as well as modified some wattage requirements with more accurate estimates.
Manny Calavera
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Very cool tool ! Keep up the great work.
Heh, no offense, Redbeard, but Corsair has no hope of getting my bigger business. Once I break 1KW, it's quad Opterons and Etasis hot-swaps only.
Unless Corsair is going to start building hot-swappable power supplies. (Hint: I do like those 15000RPM 40mm screamers. They let you know the box is alive!)
Arcygenical
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What are the "overestimation" margins in this tool? The power usage of a HD varies substantially between make and model, fans can use anywhere from 3 to 15 watts, aging components can draw more power, as can hotter ones.
Is a worst case scenario used for each component, or an "optimal" one?
The reason I ask, is that my system (01 in sig) was recommended to use the 450w PSU. Now, I've calculated the draw from the wall power draw at 410w. The PSU is around 79% efficient (under-estimation), so the actual power draw is in the 325w area... This was with my USB accessories unplugged, my second ethernet port disabled, and only a "mild" full load case (FAH).
This is about 71% of the full capacity of the 450w PSU. I've never used one of these 450's before, but I would assume that a 24/7 71%-75% load wouldn't be the best situation possible.
Is a worst case scenario used for each component, or an "optimal" one?
The reason I ask, is that my system (01 in sig) was recommended to use the 450w PSU. Now, I've calculated the draw from the wall power draw at 410w. The PSU is around 79% efficient (under-estimation), so the actual power draw is in the 325w area... This was with my USB accessories unplugged, my second ethernet port disabled, and only a "mild" full load case (FAH).
This is about 71% of the full capacity of the 450w PSU. I've never used one of these 450's before, but I would assume that a 24/7 71%-75% load wouldn't be the best situation possible.
Redbeard
Official Corsair Rep.
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We use "typical" components. For example, most fans are .5A at 12V, so 6W or so. I assumed 5 fans in the typical case, for 30W just for fans. That's actually high, most of the time, considering that a lot of people have their fans plugged into their motherboard (which controls fan speed based on temp) or a fanbus.
For your system 70% of the full capacity is fine most of the time. Ideally you'd want to be between 30-70% for optimum efficiency. You have to remember that it's rated at 50C, so if the inside of your case is down to 30-40C like most people's cases, the PSU can output significantly more power and last much longer at those lower real-world temps.
I'm curious as to what your components are, though. 410W from the wall is pretty significant. And even 80% efficiency would be you at what, 328W?
The VX450 is pretty under-rated, from a spec standpoint. I think it'd be fine. If you wanted peace of mind, the VX550 or the HX520 might be a better choice. This, of course, depends on how often your system is running at full load.
Arcygenical
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Hmm. That's good to know you use the "average" values. 6w is a great exaggeration of actual power usage per fan, so that's quite reasonable IMO. The PSU chamber is isolated from case air, since i'm using a rATX style case... And the case temperature is identical to outside ambient anyways, due to my fan setup.
My system is constantly at a full CPU load. It has never not been! The 410w figure was taken while running 2 instances of orthos, RTHDRIBL and copying files around on my Raptor... So, not the average usage scenario that's for sure! Remember though, this is using an 18w water pump, 8w of CCFL's, 19w of fans, 3 hard drives, and around 10w of USB accessories. The CPU would be pulling around 141w (70% of the maximum TDP for my OC), a heavily overclocked GTS... Among other things
I wasn't aware your PSU's were rated at 50c. I figured they'd be rated at 25c like most other manufacturers. I've used a lot o HX520s for customer builds... but because of this, my next personal PSU will be a Corsair...
I see Arcygenical hasn't heard of me!
[H] Rule #2358235: If AreEss doesn't say it's complete crap, it must be canned awesome distilled into pure win.
Seriously. Corsair is good stuff. I dumped PCP&C - who now rates at 40C as "industrial," for Corsair. And I have spent untold sums on PCP&C over the years - especially for customer builds. Now, that's not to say Corsair can fill all my needs - but my >750W builds are all Etasis. And usually jumping from single unit ~750W to N+1 redundant at 1650W+ with 1% regulation.
The 450vx works like a charm. Awesome PSU. Seems a shame to stuff it into my old Elan Vital T10 case.
There is very little doubt that my next PSU will be a Corsair.
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That is for their Seasonic built Silencers like the 750 quad (Seasonic x900) not their Win-tact offerings.
jonnyGURU
Technical Marketing Manager at Corsair Memory
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Right. And a lot of times the jump from 40°C to 50°C doesn't mean there's a de-rate, but just a shorter MTBF.
Not what I was told, Paul. In fact, that is the exact opposite of what I was told. They derated the Silencer 230 SFX/uATX from 50C to 40C, which is/was a Win-Tact built unit. It was also flatly stated to me that "industrial is 40C" and further, that it made "no difference." Sorry, but this is the same company that bragged about the 1KW doing 1100W @ <=40C. And most times, the 40C-50C jump does derate significantly. It's 10C, not 10F. That's a huge difference in temperature.
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That is fine, I have both types of units here and the Seasonic built Silencer is rated at 40c while the Win-tact built Turbo-Cool's are rated at 50c.
Redbeard
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Yes, from what I have seen it's not whether it is Win-tact or Seasonic, it's whether it's Silencer or Turbo-Cool.
Silencer seems 40C
Turbo-Cool seems 50C
I don't know for a fact, but that appears to be the spec. I imagine there could be Win-tact units under the Silencer series as well that would be rated at 40C.
Paul_Johnson said:
If you fire up your wayback machine, you will find the Silencer 230's and 360's were rated at 50C. They were Seasonic units as well. My whole problem really is how they did it, and how they responded to my inquiries regarding the 750's at release. I'm still sitting on my stash of various Silencers prior to the 750's, and they're all rated at 50C. They're also effectively identical to the currently offered Silencers. In other words, they derated temperature only. And believe me, the Silencers will put out rated at 50C, all day long.
It's not a quality issue nearly as much as an attitude issue. They've taken the stance - prematurely, frankly - that they are the Cadillac of all power supplies, and can sell on brand alone. And to some extent, that's true. But the fact is that their quality has slipped significantly, and with their push into consumer, they've developed what I consider a real attitude problem. Bear in mind, I really have spent a lot with them over the years - remember the TurboCool 600? I still have two in my attic. Sadly, I sold my chrome PCP&C case - that still is the penultimate in "bling." Basically, they made a branding decision which they didn't need to, because they felt like it.
But anyways, getting back on track here.
*puppy eyes* How about it, Redbeard? Hot-swappable redundant units make me happy. They also have stupid margins. (Just ask Etasis.) Really stupid margins for you and me. And frankly, I could use something at around 1300-1400W that doesn't have to go into a rack, and isn't "1400W!!! (@ 10C)"
Redbeard
Official Corsair Rep.
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I'd love to design a true dual-redundant PSU that had a hot-swappable design that allowed that kind of power, but I think our sales would basically be you and...well, just you.
Hey, who knows though, we're always looking for our next project. Cooling, PSUs, Memory, who knows. Memory is a tough business, prices fluctuate so much that if you have $5 million in inventory one day, within a week it can be $4 million. Losing a million bucks in a week is tough to deal with. PSUs, the price doesn't vary that much, same with other things like cooling, mice, keyboards, cases, pretty much anything BUT memory, the price is more stable.
Memory, whether it's flash or regular, is volatile. Tough to keep consistent money flowing in, especially in a year like this when the prices fell through the floor. I mean, just a year ago it was about $200 for a low end 2 x 1GB set of modules, today it's $100 for a 2 x 2GB set. Twice as much memory for half the price is awesome for you guys as consumers, but it's tough for us as a memory company.
That being said, our company isn't in the business of doing "me too" products. Anything we release has a purpose, it has to perform better, be a better deal, offer features other people don't.
So maybe a hot swappable consumer-level PSU would be popular...heh. We'd have to design the whole case around it, though. And the guys at Silent PC Review would never talk to us again.
jonnyGURU
Technical Marketing Manager at Corsair Memory
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*sniff* *sniff* That brought a tear to my eye.. *sniff* (send more Dominator RAM)
Redbeard
Official Corsair Rep.
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If you are being sarcastic you get no RAM.
If you are not being sarcastic I'll trade you RAM for video cards.
jonnyGURU
Technical Marketing Manager at Corsair Memory
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Hmm......
I'll get back with you.
I'll get back with you.
Darth Bobo
[H]ard|Gawd
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Nice little tool there
Besides the "very discrete buttons" issue, which is already in the process of being fixed, I have one little request:
Put in a "quiet system" option, just a box you can tick or so. A lot of people, me included, are concerned with keeping their systems as quiet as possible, for me that meant choosing the HX620 (love it btw, I never hear it ) eventhough it's vastely overkill for my system which should never use up more than 330W or so effectively, most of the time less. The reason I made this choice instead of the HX520 at the time was that I want to keep the load between 40 and 60 % so that I get max. efficiency which leads to less heat and therefore less noise as you already know.
Ofcause I don't know what load limit your calculator bases its recommendations on, I would just like there to be and option which effectively rebases the recommendation to 60% max load or so to take into account those wanting a quiet system. Anyway I hope I make sence.
Besides the "very discrete buttons" issue, which is already in the process of being fixed, I have one little request:
Put in a "quiet system" option, just a box you can tick or so. A lot of people, me included, are concerned with keeping their systems as quiet as possible, for me that meant choosing the HX620 (love it btw, I never hear it
) eventhough it's vastely overkill for my system which should never use up more than 330W or so effectively, most of the time less. The reason I made this choice instead of the HX520 at the time was that I want to keep the load between 40 and 60 % so that I get max. efficiency which leads to less heat and therefore less noise as you already know.Ofcause I don't know what load limit your calculator bases its recommendations on, I would just like there to be and option which effectively rebases the recommendation to 60% max load or so to take into account those wanting a quiet system. Anyway I hope I make sence.
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Gut a couple because something tells me you may be surprised.
If you drop us a new thread for it though.