do there exist 6800 Ultras with single-slot cooling?

[milling_hordesman]

It's a good question to ask for SLI purposes: are there 6800 Ultras with single-slot cooling solutions? Watercooling might be able to cut it, depending on the block, but I mean stock, air cooling solutions?

 

[Inglix_the_Mad]

BFG has their waterblock 470 toy.

Otherwise go get some copper and machine it. The reason they're dual slot is because they care about the temps their cards run at, unlike another major company

 

[milling_hordesman]

BFG has their waterblock 470 toy.

hmm... it looks like the card itself still has the 2-slot faceplate, though, so you couldn't fit 2 of them side by side, could you? bummer...

 

[Ice Nine]

It's a good question to ask for SLI purposes: are there 6800 Ultras with single-slot cooling solutions? Watercooling might be able to cut it, depending on the block, but I mean stock, air cooling solutions?

The Asus V9999 ultra is a single-slot ultra, I believe.

 

[Syphon Filter]

BFG has their waterblock 470 toy.

Otherwise go get some copper and machine it. The reason they're dual slot is because they care about the temps their cards run at, unlike another major company

I was kinda thinking the same thing...my 9800XT used to idle at like 72*C...my 6800Utra idles at 56*C as a comparison...its insane....

 

[Lint]

It's a good question to ask for SLI purposes: are there 6800 Ultras with single-slot cooling solutions? Watercooling might be able to cut it, depending on the block, but I mean stock, air cooling solutions?

the only one i am aware of is the asus v9999 ultra , now with that said its not realy an issue with agp cards as far as sli purpose goes....agp ones can't do sli anyway and i haven't see a pci-e 6800U yet

 

[Rizen]

The reason they're dual slot is because they care about the temps their cards run at, unlike another major company

Oh no, the cards run hot Seeing as ATI has said they are safe up to over 90C and they wont burn out until the 120C area, who cares? They are under warranty, if it breaks, new free video card for you.

 

[ZenOps]

Yeah, its easy enough to remove and ask for a RMA if it dies due to overheating. Its not like its a laptop chip or anything.

Anything above 90 Celsius though, for any chip is pretty hot in my book. Manufacturing design does not change that much, microchips in general tend to like to be run at less than boiling point temperature. Usually when something is speced to run above boiling point its no longer commercial spec, but military spec (And I really doubt that every GT/Ultra has passed military spec testing) Still, I'm curious as to the physical problems that may crop up later down the road. I was worried with the 9800pro/5900ultra, but there do not seem to be many hardware failures one year later.

 

[CleanSlate]

You dont buy a top of the fucking line card and leave the stock cooling on unless you can't afford losing the warranty, and even then you could take it to a computer shop which wouldn't void the warranty and watch them change it to make sure they do it right. Honestly, that's just horrible.

~Adam

 

[Inglix_the_Mad]

LOL okay, and people wonder why the 6800U's are quiet and do not disrupt your gaming experience. Mine hits 73 centigrade under heavy loading...

Oh wait, maybe ATi was expecting Tejas and that would make their video card look cooler.

Incidentally as someone who formerly worked in the production of circuit boards I can tell you MilSpec is junk. Not quite as bad as consumer spec, but a thousand miles below research / medical spec.

Lastly:Why should I have to RMA a card due to a heat issue, if they just designed a proper HSF combo, life would be sweet. Oh wait, they'd have a two slot solution too then.

Yeah, its easy enough to remove and ask for a RMA if it dies due to overheating. Its not like its a laptop chip or anything.

Anything above 90 Celsius though, for any chip is pretty hot in my book. Manufacturing design does not change that much, microchips in general tend to like to be run at less than boiling point temperature. Usually when something is speced to run above boiling point its no longer commercial spec, but military spec (And I really doubt that every GT/Ultra has passed military spec testing) Still, I'm curious as to the physical problems that may crop up later down the road. I was worried with the 9800pro/5900ultra, but there do not seem to be many hardware failures one year later.

 

[Rizen]

Lastly:Why should I have to RMA a card due to a heat issue, if they just designed a proper HSF combo, life would be sweet. Oh wait, they'd have a two slot solution too then.

Most of the new IHV ATI cards use a VGA Silencer which is dual slot.

And also, you can't please everyone. Here you are bitching about single-slot cards running hot and how you wish they were dual slot but this very thread is looking for a single slot solution

 

[milling_hordesman]

You dont buy a top of the fucking line card and leave the stock cooling on unless you can't afford losing the warranty, and even then you could take it to a computer shop which wouldn't void the warranty and watch them change it to make sure they do it right. Honestly, that's just horrible.

~Adam

I do buy a "top of the fucking line" video card and leave on the stock cooling, so obviously that can't be correct. It just logically can't be. In fact, the only reason why you do buy a "top of the fucking line" video card is so that you don't have to void the warranty (mod/overclock) to get the max out of it.

Also, I didn't know you could get a shop to do it without voiding the warranty. Is that for real?

Now, I like the sound of that ASUS V9999 Ultra (though the numbering scheme is just funky). I'm probably not going to have to worry about hot air building up between the video cards because of my case setup, so 2 of those in SLI in a couple of years sounds like a quality idea.

 

[Inglix_the_Mad]

No you cannot please everyone. The problem is that ATi people go "single slot! single slot!" when their card should be dual slot

However both companies can improve here. The problem is we consumers would pay more (hey I'd live). The simplest would be to use better materials in video card HSF combos. Most cards use mid-grade aluminium HSF's, this could be replaced by better quality (thermally conducive) metals that would allow smaller designs. Next: just as AMD taught Intel that you can have speed without having a clock turned up so high you generate 150w of heat (the dead Tejas), both of these companies should learn this.

nVidia is very borderline for me here. 56 idle, 73 load centigrade? My 3200 A64 doesn't hit the idle temperature most of the time. Finally, if your going to clock the memory at a high speed, do not forget to cool it too!

So technically I wish all cards were single slot, but I know why they should not be. Are you willing to pay the price (figure US$50-US$100) for materials and workmanship. Most video card companies do not believe so.

Most of the new IHV ATI cards use a VGA Silencer which is dual slot.

And also, you can't please everyone. Here you are bitching about single-slot cards running hot and how you wish they were dual slot but this very thread is looking for a single slot solution

 

[Dillusion]

take the GT reference design and fabricate one of all copper and make a hole big enough for a 60/72mm fan. now THATS a mod!

 

[ZenOps]

Military spec isn't junk... At least not in Canada.

It has to pass a few more test than commercial grade stuff. Here you are allowed to do spot testing on commercial products, whereas milspec everything has to be tested.

 

[tranCendenZ]

The ASUS 6800U is single slot and not yet widely available yet.

That being said, offerings now dont really matter since SLI is pci-e only.

 

[dderidex]

Now, I like the sound of that ASUS V9999 Ultra (though the numbering scheme is just funky). I'm probably not going to have to worry about hot air building up between the video cards because of my case setup, so 2 of those in SLI in a couple of years sounds like a quality idea

Are you even paying attention?

No, you are obviously not, as it has been said several times in the thread.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AGP SLI!!! Never has been, never will be. Defeats the entire point of AGP.

Sorry, it's PCI-E only, and there are no PCI-E 6800s out right now, of *any* slot cooling.

 

[Inglix_the_Mad]

Is any of it made in the U.S. or anywhere other than Canada. There are (international) specifications as far as how off center a part may be, what is too much or too little solder, how much burn-in it goes through, particulate contamination levels, et al. Now of course this varies somewhat by application, but then the part is bumped from MilSpec to Research. Most anti-lock brakes are nearly Research, which I consider a good thing. However certain weapon drive control systems rank just above what you'd ship in someone's TV out of China.

We tested everything one way or another, however the level of testing changes. Low end consumer goes through a simple in-circuit test, research through several simulated burn-ins / in-circuit tests. Various test machines would be used, for example the Genrad 2270, HP3070 Series III(? on exact model number), various ESS and functional testers, some designed for a specific board (others use "fixtures" to test multiple board types), not to mention XRay machines. Processes for production could vary from a Pick'n'Place / HeatFlo SMT setup to a human placed Wave solder PTH setup, to a person simply soldering on the certain SMT, PTH, trace wires by hand or inserting chips into carriers. Oh and maybe the use of PLC programmmers if they have custom programmed chips that are programmable onsite.

Commercial/Consumer is so sloppy you could get a cow through the specs.
MilSpec is someone around the area of a slightly smaller cow.
Research / Hospital grade is so tight it isn't funny.

Incidentally if you want to have fun, solder fine pitch SMT chips by hand, without lifting the pads, bridging pins, or leaving solder balls behind. Oh and I mean really fine pitch, you know the kind you have to do all your work through a magnifying lens just to see the pins proper. Oh and don't cheat a use a mini Heat-Flo (which blows hot *air* on the affected area and then uses a plunger to pick up the old part to be replaced by a new one that is then placed by it.)

Military spec isn't junk... At least not in Canada.

It has to pass a few more test than commercial grade stuff. Here you are allowed to do spot testing on commercial products, whereas milspec everything has to be tested.

 

[fallguy]

No you cannot please everyone. The problem is that ATi people go "single slot! single slot!" when their card should be dual slot

And why should they be dual slot? My X800 Pro ran 20c cooler under load, than my 6800 GT does. It runs fine with a single slot cooler, they dont need a dual slot.

 

[Rizen]

nVidia is very borderline for me here. 56 idle, 73 load centigrade? My 3200 A64 doesn't hit the idle temperature most of the time. Finally, if your going to clock the memory at a high speed, do not forget to cool it too!

Several board members have reported load temps of 80C+, some close to 90C. I'd say yours runs exceptionally cool, actually

But why would we pay 50-100 for decent cooling? You can get the top of the line Socket A cooler for 50 bucks (SP-97) and that is light years ahead of what would be needed for a GPU.

 

[kleptophobiac]

... it would need to dissipate as much heat as a CPU, but take up far less space than the CPU HSF. That's tough business.

As for soldering fine pitch chips, it is pretty easy. You blob solder over all the pins, and go back and use braid to remove the remainder between pins. You can do 4-5 pins at a time with the braid. You solder everything down, and go around the perimeter with the braid to clean it up. Voila!

 

[Inglix_the_Mad]

Exactly why you would need good machining and high quality (thermally conducive) materials. That's where the extra milling time would probably come in too

Incidentally your way of soldering FP would have failed every time. You would never leave the proper amount of solder evenly across all pins thus failing the standards check. The only way to pass the standards verification by hand was:

1) Remove old chip with variable temp iron and solder wick, and burning the old chip at that point to break the SMT glue (heat applied to center).

2) Change to fine tip and reapply solder the the pads (where the pins sit)

3) After all that's nice and cool, glue down the new chip, with a tiny bit of flux on each pin, I had a model paintbrush for it.

4) Using the fine tip and medium heat, tap each leg down and watch for solder peaking (indicating too much solder).

... it would need to dissipate as much heat as a CPU, but take up far less space than the CPU HSF. That's tough business.

As for soldering fine pitch chips, it is pretty easy. You blob solder over all the pins, and go back and use braid to remove the remainder between pins. You can do 4-5 pins at a time with the braid. You solder everything down, and go around the perimeter with the braid to clean it up. Voila!

 

[Nomad]

I believe that MSI is offering a single slot solution as well.

 

[-JR-]

I've installed an ASUS V9999GE which is essentially the same dog as a V9999 Ultra. It's a single slot AGP card as well, meaning it doesn't occupie the neighbouring PCI slot as well. Great overclocking and features, !BUT! I've had major overheating problems with this card and ASUS I see is still holding up their reputation for the worst support in the business. After four weeks of badgering them for support I got an email asking me to check for and remove dust from my brand new VGA card.

The card runs 62C under no load, just sitting at the Windows desktop. But launch Doom3 at just 1024X768 and it will over heat within 15min. It will reach 85c on the GPU and 80c on the RAM and has declocked to 250Mhz just to hold that temp.

I do have an IDE RAID card installed in the PCI slot next to the AGP card.

However I have a watercooled dual Xeon system with 3 case fans running just to try and get the temp down on the vid card, with little help.

Not sure if anyone else reading this has a ASUS V9999 series card but the fan speed seems very slow on mine even at 100% throttle. It only turns at 3500RPM MAX and my old GF3Ti card ran at 5500RPM. If anyone else out there has one of these, I'd like to know what you find.

I've ordered some super duper long IDE cables so that I can move my RAID card down a slot. We'll see how much of an impact this has. Other then that I've only been able to find one water cooling solution that will fit on my AGP card and still have a usable PCI slot next door. Seen here is anyone likes... http://snt-systems.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=137
Might have to order one of those if ASUS keeps screwing me. You'd think after spending close to $1000 Canadian ($5.25 American that you'd be able to get some better support.

My rant is over now....


-JR-
Reeeeealy faster PC that's all wet.