For those who have lapped their cpu's, click here!

It just donned on me , It's quite possible I've (we've) given credit where none is due , and overlooked the obvious proof.

Ok......here's the deal . Thermodynamics 101 .

I'm going to point to the wiki , but the same data is available on any 'encyclopedic data source' you want.

Heat transfer basics

I quote

"To quantify the ease with which a particular medium conducts, engineers employ the thermal conductivity, also known as the conductivity constant or conduction coefficient, k. In thermal conductivity k is defined as "the quantity of heat, Q, transmitted in time (t) through a thickness (L), in a direction normal to a surface of area (A), due to a temperature difference (ΔT) [...]." Thermal conductivity is a material property that is primarily dependent on the medium's phase, temperature, density, and molecular bonding."

See the bit about 'surface area' ?

Flatter = more surface area , hence greater conduction.
Period.

Dispute that.

:D
 
BrainEater said:
No shit.I've got a proc here waiting to be lapped.

C'mon over pfunkman , I'll lap the damn thing and you can hold the fucking thermometer.

Sheesh.

I'm blown away that someones actually trying to defend this guy ( hal ,over on that blog) , let alone an [H] member.This is part of university courses......many of them.It's very basic thermodynamics.
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If you would end your fucking tanrturm long enough to read this shit you would see i agree with you guys. Im not asking you to prove it to me im saying use that proof on the blogger since all i read in the comments was stupid remarks and people disagreeing without siting any proof...
 
pfunkman said:
If you would end your fucking tanrturm long enough to read this shit you would see i agree with you guys. Im not asking you to prove it to me im saying use that proof on the blogger since all i read in the comments was stupid remarks and people disagreeing without siting any proof...
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Because like I said in my previous poet..he deleted all the proof......POOF! gone.....there was no way he was gong to admit he was wrong, so he just deletes anything that proves him wrong....
 
ok cool.

I apologize for getting worked up...I actually did , and I admit it , but it sure looked like you were agreeing with him to me....I could be wrong , but I'm not the only one who interpreted it that way.

As far as I'm concerned , 'hal's blog' , is some sort of 'negative marketing research' or some BS.I did'nt post outright insults , I really tried to provide data ,and it was dismissed outright.

Yea I'm guilty of troll baiting, but that shit pisses me off.

:D
 
Crosshairs said:
Because like I said in my previous poet..he deleted all the proof......POOF! gone.....there was no way he was gong to admit he was wrong, so he just deletes anything that proves him wrong....
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Waste of time messing with it then his minds set in stone. Must have missed your earlier post.

BrainEater said:
ok cool.

I apologize for getting worked up...I actually did , and I admit it , but it sure looked like you were agreeing with him to me....I could be wrong , but I'm not the only one who interpreted it that way.

As far as I'm concerned , 'hal's blog' , is some sort of 'negative marketing research' or some BS.I did'nt post outright insults , I really tried to provide data ,and it was dismissed outright.

Yea I'm guilty of troll baiting, but that shit pisses me off.

:D
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Im with you guys all i was saying was instead of the nonsense shit talking i was reading folks should bust out the data he cant refute. Apparently that was done and he just deletes it so its a moot point now.

I have learned long ago that alot of tech bloggers are just dumbasses that have barely a grasp on what thier talking about. I tend to ignore the whole blogosphere because its filled with pompous arrogant fools that think thier world is so inportant it needs to be published daily.
 
pfunkman said:
Again that shits all over the net, its just talk not a shred of proof. I could tell you that i used dog shit as a thermal compound and dropped 5 degrees and it would be as scientific as the thread you linked.

If nobody has any hard evidence (No saying you lapped your CPU and dropped temp is not hard evidence) then i would quit spamming the dudes site with bullshit...
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Please elaborate on what you would consider "more scientific." If it's one thing you take away from the thread I linked to, it's that not all IHS are created the same. Most are concave like his to a different degree, some are convex, damn near none are as flat as can be attained via hand lapping. Now using simple logic, a concave IHS is not going to mate with the heatsink directly along the hottest part of the surface during operation.

The point is that there is no risk of damage, it depends on who you ask whether it's worth the effort, and even though Intel spent "billions" in designing the IHS, it still comes out worse than most heatsink surfaces.
 
You guys are all nerds, seriously.

I still think this guy comes up with arguments just to have them, and try to piss people off.

BTW my personal belief is that lappings effects are best seen on overclocked CPUs. Let me know what you think.
 
PliotronX said:
Please elaborate on what you would consider "more scientific." If it's one thing you take away from the thread I linked to, it's that not all IHS are created the same. Most are concave like his to a different degree, some are convex, damn near none are as flat as can be attained via hand lapping. Now using simple logic, a concave IHS is not going to mate with the heatsink directly along the hottest part of the surface during operation.

The point is that there is no risk of damage, it depends on who you ask whether it's worth the effort, and even though Intel spent "billions" in designing the IHS, it still comes out worse than most heatsink surfaces.
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Again, please read all my posts, i am not disputing anything here. I was suggesting that sort of stuff be posted on the guys blog but apparently he just deletes comments like that.

Now i will disagree one thing. Saying theres no risk of damage is downright stupid, there is an obvious risk and everyone here knows it. Small risk maybe but it is a risk nonetheless.
 
pfunkman said:
Again, please read all my posts, i am not disputing anything here. I was suggesting that sort of stuff be posted on the guys blog but apparently he just deletes comments like that.

Now i will disagree one thing. Saying theres no risk of damage is downright stupid, there is an obvious risk and everyone here knows it. Small risk maybe but it is a risk nonetheless.
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I concur (love that word) with you. I understand you didn't realize he was deleting the posts, and that people were calling him a retard as a result.

However, I think what they are implying is that "no risk" equates to very little. Unless you get a belt sander or still plug the processor in while it's still wet, etc. not many things can go wrong. Gently sanding it for hours takes a long time. Anyone thinking they're screwing up will give up, given the huge time commitment and monetary cost *I think* (hope) they would stop.

300 grit sand paper would take a while to screw up (I think, correct me if I'm wrong)

It's a risk installing the processor or RAM so you don't shock it and ruin it as well... Yada yada. (You can't yada yada sex btw).

Again, I must mention that this is probably some grad student writing a paper by invoking stupid and argumentive tacticts, or somebody who just needs his attention. God knows a lot of us with the internet still live in our mom's basement.
 
I may purchase a new processor in the next few weeks.. I already have an Ultima-90 lapped to a mirror finish. If there's substantial interest, I can try the new processor stock then lapped using the same thermal paste, etc.I honestly doubt there is a measurable difference, but I could give it a shot.
 
pfunkman said:
Again, please read all my posts, i am not disputing anything here. I was suggesting that sort of stuff be posted on the guys blog but apparently he just deletes comments like that.

Now i will disagree one thing. Saying theres no risk of damage is downright stupid, there is an obvious risk and everyone here knows it. Small risk maybe but it is a risk nonetheless.
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I understand, but you did not specify what kind of results you are looking for. Your posts in general have actually been disputing readily available data. The only way to satisfy your mind is to hold your own experiments (correction- the author of the article should do it, and do it right). I think what you are suggesting is an irrefutable source rather than "just some guy on the internet" but then, that's who we're talking about here aren't we? And this someone would not accept any data showing improvement even if it were directly from [insert deity of choice here].

tmclaugh has it right, but I would ask what this obvious risk is. There are no pins to bend, the IHS is sealed so that no contaminants will invade the internal area. There is a small gap in the sealant but the IHS is in direct contact with the PCB (ever try to stick a razor under there?).

The whole debate aside, it looks like someone from another forum screwed the pooch and sent a death threat to the author so he is getting more publicity by attempting to have the other forum shut down. I am certain we can agree the guy is just looking for page hits :p
 
I've lapped my previous old overclocked Northwood 2.6 @ 4.7 (not the one in my sig). The surface I lapped was very rough afterwoods...temperature gains at the end was only up to 7'C. Lapped some more till I I noticed the layer of the IHS was going thinner the surface gradually became very rough and I had a hard time in the end trying to make proper contact between the copper pipe and the IHS. Plenty of ZeroTherm paste did the work...and gave last final temperature decrease of up to 11'C. But it did kill the motherboard at the end....Heck I still have it today. :p

Now thesedays, I am trying to lap another P4 to acheive the "mirror look" finish. Though I've heard that average temp decrease for this method is just about 4-6'C cooler as sanding down the IHS with finer grit sand paper can't compete with the temps of my previous carefully roughly lapped Northwood P4!
 
kencheeto said:
If there's substantial interest, I can try the new processor stock then lapped using the same thermal paste, etc.I honestly doubt there is a measurable difference, but I could give it a shot.
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That would depend on whether the new processor has a flat surface or not.
 
PM me when we start going /I/ on this guy. I'm up for it.
 
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