Galaxy GeForce GTX 560 Ti GC Video Card Review @ [H]

On the other hand, AMD's config options for Eyefinity blow NV's (non-existent) options for Surround... Then again, NV's bezel compensation can potentially work w/different displays, AMD's definitely doesn't. You can pick endless sore spots on either side if you sit down and really analyze it.
 
mattchapman said:
After reading Kyle's review a few days ago I was really turned off the 560 GTX. However, after reading many other reviews and weighing up the pros/cons I'm considering the MSI Twin Frozr GTX 560 at $260.
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If you are at 1920x1200 resolution or lower, go for it bro. That card will suit your needs just fine.

There is nothing wrong with 560 Ti, it just is not the best value when you look at the data, but that hardly makes it a bad card, just not an award winner.
 
Moonzi said:
I wasn't aware of that, thanks Kyle appreciate the information. So now it's basically a case of the 5770's not xfiring well?

Actually nm, don't want to derail the thread. I'm just constantly going back and forth in my head over the GTX 560 and 6950 2GB card at 1920X1200.
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actually they do very well, almost matching a 5870. so likely something else was wrong.

back on topic what do people think the price needs to drop to to be more competitive? for me it would have to be around a 6870 price.
 
Valset said:
actually they do very well, almost matching a 5870. so likely something else was wrong.

back on topic what do people think the price needs to drop to to be more competitive? for me it would have to be around a 6870 price.
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If they were the same price as the 6870's they wouldn't be competitive, they'd just be dominating the 6870... And 2GB variants at $50 more would make for amazing Surround cards. None of that's gonna happen tho, chances are they're just gonna drop to $230 or whatever after all the NV loyalists have bought theirs at $250-260. The biggest problem for the GTX 560 isn't the 6870's low price, the GTX 560 IS faster in many games/scenarios, the biggest problem is the 6950's low price after MIR (as little as $260).
 
The GTX 560 is more of a match for the HD 6870 than for the HD 6950, but since it is slightly faster than the HD 6870 by a very slim margin, it should be priced slightly higher than the HD 6870. Its current price isn't competitive enough.
 
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evolucion8 said:
The GTX 560 is more of a match for the HD 6870 than for the HD 6950, but since it is slightly faster than the HD 6870 by a very slim margin, it should be priced slightly higher than the HD 6870. Its current price is competitive enough.
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Unfortunately it is not priced correctly. Using today's Newegg prices with MIR

The 560 is currently selling at a 20% premium to the 6870.

The 6950 (2gb version) only sells at a 4% premium to a 560!

Please tell me how it is even close to being competitively priced. And don't throw in all the OC speculation we don't have enough random samples to say it will always be hitting 20% + levels.
 
alienate said:
Unfortunately it is not priced correctly. Using today's Newegg prices with MIR

The 560 is currently selling at a 20% premium to the 6870.

The 6950 (2gb version) only sells at a 4% premium to a 560!

Please tell me how it is even close to being competitively priced. And don't throw in all the OC speculation we don't have enough random samples to say it will always be hitting 20% + levels.
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It wasn't competitively priced, it was a typo :p which I fixed ten minutes ago.
 
evolucion8 said:
The GTX 560 is more of a match for the HD 6870 than for the HD 6950, but since it is slightly faster than the HD 6870 by a very slim margin, it should be priced slightly higher than the HD 6870. Its current price isn't competitive enough.
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From what I've read the GTX 560 blows 6870 out of the water and is very close to the 6950but it loses out at anything higher than 1920x1200. Without the MIR's on AMD it's competitive....but with the MIR's I agree it's probably $30 over priced.
Then again, what the hell is $30 to most people? A round of beers?!
 
mattchapman said:
Then again, what the hell is $30 to most people? A round of beers?!
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This is true.

Im still waiting to see the [H] do a solid comparison of this card overclocked. If the tables turn with a solid OC i may end up getting it.
 
mattchapman said:
From what I've read the GTX 560 blows 6870 out of the water and is very close to the 6950but it loses out at anything higher than 1920x1200. Without the MIR's on AMD it's competitive....but with the MIR's I agree it's probably $30 over priced.
Then again, what the hell is $30 to most people? A round of beers?!
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What games does it blow out out of the water - Dirt 2? Just going over Anandtech's apples to apples at 1900x1200 the 6870 is within 5% of nearly every modern game. Please do tell.
 
alienate said:
What games does it blow out out of the water - Dirt 2? Just going over Anandtech's apples to apples at 1900x1200 the 6870 is within 5% of nearly every modern game. Please do tell.
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Sorry perhaps my comment was a little exaggerated. Here's an example though (and admittedly this is the Twin Frozr II)

From PureOverclock:
In terms of performance, we saw the MSI GTX 560 Ti Twin Frozr II OC easily beat the Radeon 6870 in just about every facet
 
Yeah the GTX560 does not blow the 6870 out of the water. It's marginally faster, arguably negligibly so.
 
mattchapman said:
Here's an example though (and admittedly this is the Twin Frozr II)
From PureOverclock:
In terms of performance, we saw the MSI GTX 560 Ti Twin Frozr II OC easily beat the Radeon 6870 in just about every facet
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The Twin Frozr is fairly high OC, so the performance gain is substantial, yet it sell at about the regular price of reference 560.

The Twin Frozr seems like a considerably better buy than the reference cards.
 
Olle P said:
The Twin Frozr is fairly high OC, so the performance gain is substantial, yet it sell at about the regular price of reference 560.

The Twin Frozr seems like a considerably better buy than the reference cards.
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Yeah I'm deciding between the Twin Frozr or the Gigabyte SOC. Seems the Gigabyte squeezes another 5% in performance but at a price of another 100W at load (and $15 extra).
 
With overclocks come extra heat. A GTX560Ti with a moderate overclock will use as much power as an HD6970, easily. [220W versus the GTX560's typical 195W].
The power increase of the TwinFrozr is around 20W, up from 195 to 215.
Power consumption of the Gigabyte SOC is around 250-260W, so the same as a GTX470/570 at stock.
 
Its quite interesting to watch as industry oversaturates the market with yet another product.
260 280 285 295 460 465 470 480 560 570 580 plus all the variations
and even worse on AMD front with card names and prices jumbled up in one big orgy of somewhat
similar yet a little different beasts, all battling for your cash, to play that ONE or TWO good PC games that come out once in a blue moon.
 
Well that's a very pessimistic view. Just because you don't enjoy the wealth of PC titles released in the last year doesn't mean everybody else doesn't :p

Also you forgot the GTX275, haha.
I don't really see why AMD's nomenclature is worse, at least it makes some sense. Two GTX460s that are different speeds, plus a GTX460SE that's slower still, what is that about?
 
I agree that NVIDIA's naming is significantly more confusing and definitely more misleading
 
Has anybody seen the Gigabyte 560 SOC card on sale anywhere in the US yet? I can't seem to find it, and I really wanna grab a pair of 'em for my new system.
 
CPTStewart said:
Has anybody seen the Gigabyte 560 SOC card on sale anywhere in the US yet? I can't seem to find it, and I really wanna grab a pair of 'em for my new system.
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Tiger Direct. $275

I had my eye on this but I think I'll go for a slightly less OC'd version to save power and increase longevity. Perhaps MSI Twin Frozr II.
 
alienate said:
What games does it blow out out of the water - Dirt 2? Just going over Anandtech's apples to apples at 1900x1200 the 6870 is within 5% of nearly every modern game. Please do tell.
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Mathematics dosn't seem to be your strength. I calculated all the results in the test you mentioned for the resolutions 1900 and 1680 whereever AA was enabled. Additionally i took always the best result for the 6950 (1 or 2GB depending on test).

Resolution Game HD6870(fps) GTX560TI(+/- %) HD6950(+/- %)
1920x1200 Crysis Warhead 41,20 5,83 17,96
1680x1050 Crysis Warhead 47,1 12,31 23,78
1920x1200 BattleForge 53,10 22,41 9,79
1680x1050 BattleForge 60,30 25,21 9,29
1920x1200 Metro2033 29,30 5,80 22,87
1920x1200 HAWX 101,00 17,82 6,93
1680x1050 HAWX 111,00 26,13 7,21
1920x1200 CivilizationV 34,90 42,98 -0,29
1920x1200 Battlefield Bad CompanII 55,90 10,38 11,63
1920x1200 Stalker Call of Pripyat 40,20 9,70 29,60
1680x1050 Stalker Call of Pripyat 49,10 11,20 28,51
1920x1200 DIRT 2 66,10 24,96 7,41
1680x1050 DIRT 2 72,40 31,49 8,56
1920x1200 Mass Effect 2 64,90 14,02 20,96
1680x1050 Mass Effect 2 78,70 18,68 20,20
1920x1200 Wolfenstein 89,50 -0,11 14,97
1680x1050 Wolfenstein 101,50 -8,77 9,56

The same picture you get here:
http://www.computerbase.de/artikel/...-sli/23/#abschnitt_performancerating_mit_aaaf

Overall 17% better than the HD6870 at 1680x1050 with 4xAA and 16AF and equal to the HD6950. At 1920x1200 with the same AA and AF settings overall 14% better than the HD6870. The HD6950 is 5% better than the 560TI at this setting.

That combined with the better image quality, better AA flexibility, better tesselation performance + PhysX, Cuda and developer support in general makes it simply the better choice compared to the 6870. Finally regarding noise level under load its a class of it's own and i think this is a very important point - far more important than 2h a day load power consumption.
 
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ViDA said:
Its quite interesting to watch as industry oversaturates the market with yet another product.
260 280 285 295 460 465 470 480 560 570 580 plus all the variations
and even worse on AMD front with card names and prices jumbled up in one big orgy of somewhat
similar yet a little different beasts, all battling for your cash, to play that ONE or TWO good PC games that come out once in a blue moon.
Click to expand...

Don't forget the GTX 275 and the GTX 260 that they wouldn't rename which people had to make names for. Like GTX 260+ or GTX 260 Core 216, when they could have just named it GTX 265. LOL nVIDIA was confusing as hell back then. Whatever doesn't really matter.

EDIT: Oh yeah and the 8800GTS 512, 9800GTX, 9800GTX+, GTS 250, and the 8800GTS G80 which had absolutely nothing to do with all of the previously mentioned G92 cards :).
 
Richthofen said:
Mathematics dosn't seem to be your strength. I calculated all the results in the test you mentioned for the resolutions 1900 and 1680 whereever AA was enabled. Additionally i took always the best result for the 6950 (1 or 2GB depending on test).

Resolution Game HD6870(fps) GTX560TI(+/- %) HD6950(+/- %)
1920x1200 Crysis Warhead 41,20 5,83 17,96
1680x1050 Crysis Warhead 47,1 12,31 23,78
1920x1200 BattleForge 53,10 22,41 9,79
1680x1050 BattleForge 60,30 25,21 9,29
1920x1200 Metro2033 29,30 5,80 22,87
1920x1200 HAWX 101,00 17,82 6,93
1680x1050 HAWX 111,00 26,13 7,21
1920x1200 CivilizationV 34,90 42,98 -0,29
1920x1200 Battlefield Bad CompanII 55,90 10,38 11,63
1920x1200 Stalker Call of Pripyat 40,20 9,70 29,60
1680x1050 Stalker Call of Pripyat 49,10 11,20 28,51
1920x1200 DIRT 2 66,10 24,96 7,41
1680x1050 DIRT 2 72,40 31,49 8,56
1920x1200 Mass Effect 2 64,90 14,02 20,96
1680x1050 Mass Effect 2 78,70 18,68 20,20
1920x1200 Wolfenstein 89,50 -0,11 14,97
1680x1050 Wolfenstein 101,50 -8,77 9,56

The same picture you get here:
http://www.computerbase.de/artikel/...-sli/23/#abschnitt_performancerating_mit_aaaf

Overall 17% better than the HD6870 at 1680x1050 with 4xAA and 16AF and equal to the HD6950. At 1920x1200 with the same AA and AF settings overall 14% better than the HD6870. The HD6950 is 5% better than the 560TI at this setting.

That combined with the better image quality, better AA flexibility, better tesselation performance + PhysX, Cuda and developer support in general makes it simply the better choice compared to the 6870. Finally regarding noise level under load its a class of it's own and i think this is a very important point - far more important than 2h a day load power consumption.
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Interesting. Despite all the banter on 6950 vs 560 I think it basically boils down to personal preference/allegiance to AMD or nVidia. I myself have always bought and been heppy with nVidia so for that reason (as well as having a shorter card) I'll get the 560.
 
Is it just me, or does it look like a down-clocked 570 might provide 560 performance with lower power usage?
 
The GTX570 uses far more power than the 560Ti, up to 250W in some games, whereas the 560Ti typically runs around 190W.
 
Mmm, "up to" for one card, and "typically" for the other ... using [H] review numbers for each card and a PSU 0.85% eff, then the 560 is 195W, and the 570 is 209W (BF:BC2).

A 7.4% jump in typical gaming power for 15-30% faster performance ... can only mean that downclocking a 570 is going to further beat the pants off of a 560 in perf/watt. (For an extra $100, naturally.)
 
Seem overpriced to me...The GTX 460 I picked up for less than a C-Note a couple of weeks ago takes on all comers in 1080P. I don't see why people would need to spend more for these cards that they really don't need.

I guess in the end, it's wants vs. needs.

I do know one thing, Barnum & Bailey(er...George Hull) was on to something...

Best,

Liquid Cool
 
Richthofen said:
Mathematics dosn't seem to be your strength. I calculated all the results in the test you mentioned for the resolutions 1900 and 1680 whereever AA was enabled. Additionally i took always the best result for the 6950 (1 or 2GB depending on test).
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First off you discredited yourself by including 1680, we are at [H] and not playing on 22 inch monitors, but it makes your argument look good eh? Second, the 14% lead at 1920 is heavily skewed by two games: civ 5, which is not a FPS so somewhat irrelevant, and Dirt 2, a Nvidia optimized game which no one plays. Take those two games out and the difference is around 5%.

If you play those two games heavily you might want to consider the 560. Otherwise, no, it commands a hefty 20% price to the 6870. The IQ quality is totally unfounded in extreme cases or it would have been brought up in the review. I can't see why you would recommend the 560 it heavily contradicts this sites review and most others.

P.S. If you're going to quote such data in the future use a table and post a screenshot.
 
alienate said:
First off you discredited yourself by including 1680, we are at [H] and not playing on 22 inch monitors, but it makes your argument look good eh?
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How can you say we are not plaxing on 22 inch monitors? Maybe not you but still a lot of others incluing myself. If you like to play shooters you better don't have a too big screen because otherwise you get owned by others because the human eye is limited when it comes to observing the screen. I am 99% sure that if we would do a market research a significant amound of gamers still play at 1680x1050 and some even at lower resolutions. Btw the Steam statistics show the 1680x1050 resolution to be still the most popular one. And a huge amount of gamers still use lower resolutions. Perfect environment for the GTX560TI.

Second, the 14% lead at 1920 is heavily skewed by two games: civ 5, which is not a FPS so somewhat irrelevant, and Dirt 2, a Nvidia optimized game which no one plays. Take those two games out and the difference is around 5%.
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I don't take any games out as you are not the one deciding which games are relevant and which not. And even if Nvidia would sponsor all games it doesn't matter to the customer. The customer expects the best result when buying Nvidia hardware. Nvidia's job is to do everything that is possible to enable that.
Looking at the numbers the only game (from the [H] review) where the HD6870 is somewhat faster at 1680 and equal at 1920 is Wolfenstein and that's it.
IQ is worse as proven by various websites, noise level is a lot worse, and well the rest has already been said. The HD6870 simply is a fail. Look at the steam statistics. People still prefer the GTX460 and i think it's safe to say that they would also prefer the GTX560.

If you play those two games heavily you might want to consider the 560. Otherwise, no, it commands a hefty 20% price to the 6870. The IQ quality is totally unfounded in extreme cases or it would have been brought up in the review. I can't see why you would recommend the 560 it heavily contradicts this sites review and most others.
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Again the IQ thing has been proven. Their are plenty of other threads discussing that - so no need to get any deeper into that here. Regarding price - in Germany its 20 Euro. That's a joke when you are about to invest in a 200 Euro product and in that case it's around 10 percent. I think a lot will be willing to pay that even if the products were equal just because you get the better Nvidia support, more OC headroom and the far better cooling solution in terms of noise. And regarding your last point you seem to ignore that a lot of other sites in fact recommend the 560.

P.S. If you're going to quote such data in the future use a table and post a screenshot.
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I tried. Unfortunately this forum did not support the HTML tags.
 
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Richthofen said:
How can you say we are not plaxing on 22 inch monitors? Maybe not you but still a lot of others incluing myself. If you like to play shooters you better don't have a too big screen because otherwise you get owned by others because the human eye is limited when it comes to observing the screen. I am 99% sure that if we would do a market research a significant amound of gamers still play at 1680x1050 and some even at lower resolutions. Btw the Steam statistics show the 1680x1050 resolution to be still the most popular one. And a huge amount of gamers still use lower resolutions. Perfect environment for the GTX560TI.



I don't take any games out as you are not the one deciding which games are relevant and which not. And even if Nvidia would sponsor all games it doesn't matter to the customer. The customer expects the best result when buying Nvidia hardware. Nvidia's job is to do everything that is possible to enable that.
Looking at the numbers the only game (from the [H] review) where the HD6870 is somewhat faster at 1680 and equal at 1920 is Wolfenstein and that's it.
IQ is worse as proven by various websites, noise level is a lot worse, and well the rest has already been said. The HD6870 simply is a fail. Look at the steam statistics. People still prefer the GTX460 and i think it's safe to say that they would also prefer the GTX560.


Again the IQ thing has been proven. Their are plenty of other threads discussing that - so no need to get any deeper into that here. Regarding price - in Germany its 20 Euro. That's a joke when you are about to invest in a 200 Euro product and in that case it's around 10 percent. I think a lot will be willing to pay that even if the products were equal just because you get the better Nvidia support, more OC headroom and the far better cooling solution in terms of noise. And regarding your last point you seem to ignore that a lot of other sites in fact recommend the 560.



I tried. Unfortunately this forum did not support the HTML tags.
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You don't seem to be getting it. The 1680 benchmarks are moot since both these cards run anything out there well over 50 fps at 1680. There hasn't been a [H] review in years testing this resolution because of that reason. You should be in the market for a budget $100 dollar card if this is your resolution with no intent to upgrade....

About the IQ, let me get this straight, you're telling me don't be subjective by not including games no one plays? Yet bring up the tired image quality issue which is completely subjective. Some say it looks worse, some say it looks different, some say it looks better, most say there is no discernible difference whatsoever when playing. That is called hypocrisy!

From Anandtech review:

we can’t find any clear game examples of where the 6870’s texture filtering is deficient compared to NVIDIA’s – they seem to be equals once again

From Hexus:

we couldn't see any particular degradation in image quality when using the default Catalyst settings


Also no mention from Hard about it, thats good enough for me.

I have read your past posts and think its fair to warn other members of your financial interest in Nvidia or against AMD. You are looking out for yourself, not the best interest of this forum. Nearly half your posts on this board are stock related or flat out bashing AMD :(
 
560 beats 6870.
I hear different stories on 560 vs 6950 so I recommend users simply go with their brand loyalty!
 
XFX's custom-cooled 6870 is pretty darn quiet (quieter than any other AMD card or the GTX 560 even) and it's like $10 more than the stock one... So if you're willing to put some effort into your buying decision you can eliminate that as one of the differentiating factors between these cards.

Anyway, anyone have any good review links of the GTX 560 in SLI at Surround resolutions? I'm trying to decide between 2x 6870's, 2x GTX 560s, and 2x 6950's... Unfortunately I can't find any decent 5760x1200 reviews for the 6800 series or the GTX 560's, best I've found is this by HardwareHeaven but there's only like 3 games tested in a Surround/Eyefinity config.
 
Impulse said:
XFX's custom-cooled 6870 is pretty darn quiet (quieter than any other AMD card or the GTX 560 even) and it's like $10 more than the stock one... So if you're willing to put some effort into your buying decision you can eliminate that as one of the differentiating factors between these cards.

Anyway, anyone have any good review links of the GTX 560 in SLI at Surround resolutions? I'm trying to decide between 2x 6870's, 2x GTX 560s, and 2x 6950's... Unfortunately I can't find any decent 5760x1200 reviews for the 6800 series or the GTX 560's, best I've found is this by HardwareHeaven but there's only like 3 games tested in a Surround/Eyefinity config.
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Nevermind raw processing speed, you want the 2gb minimum memory per card at 5760x1200 unless you don't mind toning down some settings, that simple. With 1gb AA cannot be maxed (usually 2x max), and textures sometimes saturates the memory which is probably why there aren't many reviews about them.

Pre-2gb cards you didn't much of a choice, now you do! :)


Y.
 
I don't think people will be benching 560 SLI at 5760x1200 because of the lack of memory. Where memory isn't an issue you should see results 10-15% away from SLI 570s. Where it is (and it will often be with only a gig per card at that res) then you'll find games unplayable.
 
Yeah, I realize the memory will be a bigger bottleneck than any performance difference between those three GPUs... And I don't mind sacrificing most or all AA at 5760x1200 if it means I can save $120 or so, I would however like to keep most other settings (besides AA) near max though. I know this is gonna vary wildly to game from game, which is why I wish someone would run a decent review with at 'least half a dozen games.

I mean, I know Eyefinity/Surround is a niche thing, and most people jumping into it won't have a problem investing an extra $100 when they're already spending at 'least $400+ on displays and $400+ on GPUs... I'm just not sure whether I'll really enjoy gaming on three displays, which is why I wanted to limit my GPU investment, plus they're GPUs, they'll probably last me a year at best before I get the itch to upgrade 'em.

I don't have a problem spending the money per se, I mean, I'm spending $800 on two extra 24" HP ZR24w IPS screens... But I'll get at 'least 5-6 years use out of those, and I'll be getting plenty of use out of them even outside of gaming. It's a bang-for-my buck kinda thing I guess. I suppose the 2GB cards have a chance to last me much longer tho.

OTOH I've seen games like BF:BC2 will play fine with 2X AA (or even 4X I think) at 5760x1200 on 2x 6870's... So if it's only two or three games like STALKER and Crysis that are gonna choke on these cards, I really wouldn't mind.
 
Well you don't have to sacrifice anything if you buy 6950s instead of 560s, as they come with 2GB to start with. The difference between 2GB 6950s and 1GB GTX560Tis is $60 ($20 after rebates come in).
If you're willing to buy Palit, you can buy two 2GB GTX560Tis, but that's $15 more than the HD6950s, even before the rebates arrive, and the 560 is a slower card than the 6950, especially once you have a pair of them.
 
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