[H]ordebowl Details and Contest Rules

[Kvothe]

The First Annual [H]ordeBowl

Season Schedule:

The [H]FL ([H]orde Folding League) season will be kicking off on November 13th, with a single weeks preseason to be held the prior week. The preseason week will give everyone a week to get their boxes tweaked and ready for the season kick off.

Games will last one week, from Sunday through Saturday, with results being posted sometime the following Sunday. Games will conclude on midnight of the following days:

Nov.
19th
26th

Dec.
3rd
10th
17th
24th
31st

Jan.
7th (Playoffs – Wild Card Weekend, 6 Games + 2 Bye’s)
14th (Playoffs – Divisional Playoffs, 4 Games)
21st (Playoffs – Conference Championships, 2 Games)

Feb.
4th (Playoffs – [H]ordeBowl I)

With next years [H]ordeBowl, we will have a longer season since we got off to a late start this year and didn’t want to interfere with our current gauntlets.

The Playoff system is going to be a direct emulation of the Playoff system used in Pro Football, the 2 best divisional records will receive 1st round bye’s, and the remaining teams shall be seeded according to regular season record, culminating with the final results of the [H]ordeBowl being released on SuperBowl Sunday.

Divisions and Conferences:

The ultimate goal is to have enough interest to facilitate two conferences with 4 divisions per conference. Hopefully we’ll be able to base divisions in respect to your physical location, however some shuffling may be required in order to maintain equality between divisions. Same rule applies for conferences as well. Each team shall have 3 games within their division, 2 additional within conference, and finally 2 remaining games out of the conference. One thing to keep in mind, is that some tweaks may be made closer to season kick off depending on the number of interested participants. Divisional ranking/playoff seeding will then be determined from the win/loss record during the season, with overall record being the first determinant, and any ties being cleared up by divisional record first, then conference, and finally non-conference record should the need arise.

Games:

Games will consist of a series of one week, CPU on CPU gauntlets (dual core and dual CPU do not count as they cannot report as a single CPU). We’ve derived a fantasy football style scoring system in order to get the final scores for your weeks game, this system is as follows:

10 pts. Highest points for the week
14 pts. Highest number of WU's for the week
5 pts. Points per day average (game week only)
5 pts. WU per day average (game week only)
3 pts. Points per WU (game week only)
6 pts. Highest points in one day
10 pts. Highest WU's in one day
1 pt per. Daily highest WU count and Point count (14 pts. Total available.)

For ties in any of the above categories, no points shall be awarded, and the highest point total shall be declared the winner.

Signups:

Signups are going to be held for the three weeks prior to the preseason, October 16th through November 5th. Conferences, Divisions, and schedules shall be produced during the preseason week.

To minimize the risk of cheating we’ve decided to go with a different method of providing usernames. Each user shall enter in the signup thread, and should then be expecting a PM containing a username that has been long abandoned. Due to questions regarding the possibility of tainted results, we feel this is the most indiscreet possible method of maintaining integrity in our results.

For those concerned that the stats could be spoofed, an audit shall be allowed of the results for any who feel that we’re not maintaining the stats correctly. Any concerns with this policy should be addressed to p[H]ant0m and I’ll be more than willing to help clear up any issues. Also, for any interested entrants, I shall provide the excel spreadsheet we’re using to calculate the results if participants would like to verify their stats on their own.

Rules and Disclaimers:

1. At any time, should a users active CPU count go above 1, they shall be disqualified and any further games on the schedule shall instantly be forfeited until the 7 day CPU count drops back to 1.
2. Should any evidence of early ends be seen, it will constitute a single day forfeiture and stats for that day shall not count into the end of game stats.
3. This contest is in no way associated with [H]ard|OCP, so do not contact any [H]ard|OCP staff with questions/comments/etc.
4. This contest is being brought to you by p[H]ant0m, K*, and Viper87227. Special thanks to AtomicMoose for his help getting this off the ground.

Prize:

The winner if the [H]ordeBowl will be taking home a brand new boxen. The final specifications are unknown, but expect them to be something along these lines:

AMD Sempron 2200+
Asus Socket A Motherboard
2x256MB PC2100
Integrated VGA, Sound, NIC
Sony DVD±RW Drive
Maxtor 40GB Hard Drive
CoolerMaster 350W PSU
Unknown Case


Good luck to all, and remember, Signups will begin October 16th!

 

[chileman]

Sounds complicated on your end. Let me know if you need help.

 

[Duster]

WaHoo.

Sounds like fun.

But I have a ? what if say someone enters a 1ghz PIII and I enter a 3.2 GHZ P4 now surly I will win on a case like this. How are you going to make it so everyone has the same odds?

 

[OSUguy98]

Sweet!!! Glad to know you guys found a way around the "new" username issue!


Keep on Folding!! For the [H]orde!!

 

[Kvothe]

But I have a ? what if say someone enters a 1ghz PIII and I enter a 3.2 GHZ P4 now surly I will win on a case like this. How are you going to make it so everyone has the same odds?

There's no way to keep it even. The entire point is the people enter a fast boxen, be it a borg or something else. We've tried to keep it an relatively close equation between points and total WU's. Unfortunately If a slow boxen is all you have, there's not alot that can be done, which is a symptom of any gauntlet we run. Now I'm not averse to someone seeing if they can solicit someone else to run a faster boxen in their name.

 

[Duster]

There's no way to keep it even. The entire point is the people enter a fast boxen, be it a borg or something else. We've tried to keep it an relatively close equation between points and total WU's. Unfortunately If a slow boxen is all you have, there's not alot that can be done, which is a symptom of any gauntlet we run. Now I'm not averse to someone seeing if they can solicit someone else to run a faster boxen in their name.

guess i should start pimping some of my high GHZ boxen

so folding names are going to be kept secret? That was so no one can start folding for someone else to DQ them.

 

[Duster]

Can I run two Teams?

 

[RPhArrow]

Cool !! Now I get to figure out how to turn one of my farm tractors into a dragster

 

[Kvothe]

so folding names are going to be kept secret? That was so no one can start folding for someone else to DQ them.

Yeah, there was enough concern that points could be spoofed and people could be DQ'd that keeping the usernames secret, and in the hands of the those of us running it, was very important. Not to mention it solves alot of problems in regards to new usernames showing up and etc. As long as it's for 33, most people won't care. And it increases team health.

 

[Kvothe]

Can I run two Teams?

For this year, it's single entry only. After we see what kind of undertaking this ends up being, that's on my list of things to look into next year.

 

[MN Scout]

The early unit ending penalty seems a little harsh to me. Can't some of the wus early unit end themselves because of certain calculations that can be reached?

Also could you clarify these:
5 pts. Points per day average (game week only)
5 pts. WU per day average (game week only)
3 pts. Points per WU (game week only)

5 pts based on what, the highest pts per day across the teams or just 5 pts if they turn in anything. Etc.

Could you also give a full low down on, "The Playoff system is going to be a direct emulation of the Playoff system used in Pro Football, the 2 best divisional records will receive 1st round bye’s, and the remaining teams shall be seeded according to regular season record, culminating with the final results of the [H]ordeBowl being released on SuperBowl Sunday." I don't know anything about the Playoff system that is used in Pro Football. Also I don't know what "bye's" are, so if you can make sure to explain that also. And I don't know how any of that other stuff works.

I just want to know what I'm getting into, and how this all works.

-Mn Scout

 

[Kvothe]

5 pts. Points per day average (game week only)
5 pts. WU per day average (game week only)
3 pts. Points per WU (game week only)

K, these three categories are based on game week averages, what we'll will be doing is taking your weekly total in points and in WU's and determining your PPD average for that week span, along with the WU average and Points per WU all during that single week. The higest average for those categories wins the designated number of points.

As the season progress you'll be compiling a record, from this record, standings will be generated and the best 8 teams will get into our playoff tournament. During the first weekend of the tournament the teams with the best record from either side of the bracket will be given an automatic pass to the 2nd round. I'll see what I can do about setting up an image that better illustrates how this works.

 

[Duster]

Do we have pre season games? Need to set my team through there paces to see what roster changes need to be made before the season starts.

Do you get home field advantage?

 

[AtomicMoose]

5 pts. Points per day average (game week only)
5 pts. WU per day average (game week only)
3 pts. Points per WU (game week only)

K, these three categories are based on game week averages, what we'll will be doing is taking your weekly total in points and in WU's and determining your PPD average for that week span, along with the WU average and Points per WU all during that single week. The higest average for those categories wins the designated number of points.

As the season progress you'll be compiling a record, from this record, standings will be generated and the best 8 teams will get into our playoff tournament. During the first weekend of the tournament the teams with the best record from either side of the bracket will be given an automatic pass to the 2nd round. I'll see what I can do about setting up an image that better illustrates how this works.

Go with the playoff tree....easy to read.

 

[Kvothe]

Do we have pre season games? Need to set my team through there paces to see what roster changes need to be made before the season starts.

Do you get home field advantage?

There will be a 1 week preseason, mostly that's just for there to be a small gap between the old and new contests. The preseason week is mostly so you can get your name plugged in and get ready for the season, no games or schedules are going to set for that week so its a shakedown week. Again, thanks to the late start, there will be a more substaintial addition for next year.

 

[Kvothe]

Go with the playoff tree....easy to read.

Actually I found a really good site that explains the seeding and how it works, mind you there could be some deviation from what they say as interest level could cause some changes.

http://home.earthlink.net/~ob1gui/nflrules.htm

 

[Zxcs]

Tempted to oc my fx55 to 3.2 and enter, but I'm feeling too lazy atm. Maybe when I've seen what other people are entering

 

[Kvothe]

Tempted to oc my fx55 to 3.2 and enter, but I'm feeling too lazy atm. Maybe when I've seen what other people are entering

Heh, well unless everyone makes it public knowledge what they're running, then it very well could be a surprise what you're going against. You might just want to get that boxen up to speed anyhow.

 

[Zxcs]

Heh, well unless everyone makes it public knowledge what they're running, then it very well could be a surprise what you're going against. You might just want to get that boxen up to speed anyhow.

Cleaning up the room from my previous bench atm and its deffinatly not fun . I don't really like mess thats why I only usually bench for a day or two. I may get it going, but right now I just wanna relax and be lazy.

 

[Duster]

Well since I have only one boxen.... I have no clue which one to enter

The Xeon... The P4 the A64

or maybe the good ol PIII Cely

 

[Viper87227]

Well since I have only one boxen.... I have no clue which one to enter

The Xeon... The P4 the A64

or maybe the good ol PIII Cely

I'd have to suggest the A64

 

[Duster]

A64 3200+ against a P4 3.4

I would think the P4 would win...
But have no real numbers

 

[marty9876]

1. bullshit form the mod thread.

2. too many rules.

3 What if someone needs to do a reinstall of the folding client? OS crashes or what not. New client, new Stanford ID, +1 CPU count. Might get a little over board here, but make everyone export their user ID out of the reg and back it up...ok little over board. No clue how this works in nix.

4. How to handle WU dumping? Only real way is to get an insider at the offical forums (ChelseaOilman is a mod there, on team 33) to every now and again check the users. However this is asking a lot of him, plus the records he can look at are somewhat limited. Another option is to have everyone provide the queue.dat file and run qd against it maybe...?? Example: On P4's a 241 pointer timker and a 450 QMD take just about the same time. WU per day would be a wash, PPD would be > than here.

5. What you go and suck a little o' moose dong per 1 ?

 

[Kvothe]

1. Silly mary, just wouldn't be the same without your warm welcome.
2. Well since this is something new, we're starting with an already pre-defined format. Part of the deal with this being first year is that we may find that some of the rules are useless, and others need to be added. It's going to take time, but until someone can come up with something other than a straight out gauntlet, this is what we have to work with.
3. Just contact me, I'll provide a new username to fold under for the remainder of the week and the stats will be cumulative.
4. Best we can do is watch for patterns that are outside the norm, we're well aware of what WU's run how fast on certain processors. If there is any question of tainted results the user concerned will be contacted and we will then contact the guys at Stanford. The results of the contest shall be held in appeal until we've gotten word back on the status of the units turned in.
5. I wouldn't have it any other way.

 

[GwilyaGwees]

If someone sneakernetted wu's around a home lan (let's say), wouldn't that be cheating? What I am thinking about is to d/l a wu from Stanford on machine A, let machine A crunch it for a bit, then transfer the wu data over to machine B, let machine A d/l another w/u, and repeat with machine C. Then when machine B w/u is almost finished, transfer it back to machine A, let machine A complete the last frame, u/l to Stanford, and repeat all over again. I think this is viable. So will your integrity hold up????

Just wondering ..........
GwilyaGwees

 

[Duster]

was think the same sort of thing

but didn't want to say anything and give others ideas

 

[Kvothe]

Yep that would be cheating, but again, all we can really do to combat it is by continually monitoring stats for anything that looks out of place. Right the highest concieveable points a single box and can pull in one day is at 900 points, and thats if you drop a QMD right after midnight and another right before the end of that day. That's the level I'm look at at least. Probably tops you're talking is 3 WU's in a given day, and that's if they are smaller Ambers. Most of the fraud prevention on this is going to be based on the knowledge we have of the benchmarks for various cores etc. So its going to be subjective, but I do think the instances where the numbers don't quite match up will be eveident.

 

[marty9876]

If someone sneakernetted wu's around a home lan (let's say), wouldn't that be cheating? What I am thinking about is to d/l a wu from Stanford on machine A, let machine A crunch it for a bit, then transfer the wu data over to machine B, let machine A d/l another w/u, and repeat with machine C. Then when machine B w/u is almost finished, transfer it back to machine A, let machine A complete the last frame, u/l to Stanford, and repeat all over again. I think this is viable. So will your integrity hold up????

Just wondering ..........
GwilyaGwees

right click save as

Na, I think these guys actually, maybe, sort-of, have a good idea here once I figure out what it is.

 

[Viper87227]

right click save as

Na, I think these guys actually, maybe, sort-of, have a good idea here once I figure out what it is.

Of course we have a good idea. Your ignorance is the only issue...

 

[Kvothe]

Just a reminder, signups for the [H]ordeBowl start next Sunday!

 

[upriverpaddler]

I read nothing about an entry fee. If its going to happen, then why not participate. Why wait and see? Too lazy? How much easier can it be? Recieve one PM and retype one name!! Just do it!! And, cheaters get their own in the end.

 

[Kvothe]

And, cheaters get their own in the end.

Hmm... what he said, and we'll said the moose with a reach through!

 

[Viper87227]

bump for one week till liftoff!

 

[RugenNixie]

I better hurry up and fix my computer. I just had to drop all of my 29% overclock (stable for about 3 years) due to some freaky problems with my motherboard. My computer is a few years old, so I'll need that overclock if I'm going to get any wins.

 

[MN Scout]

Yeah I really need to get my A64 back up to speed. Weird things started happening. 1 week!

 

[RPhArrow]

Ahh,, well,,,, a new contest.... So who is going to manipulate this one... figure out the way to fxck it up ?? Count me gone...

 

[Viper87227]

Ahh,, well,,,, a new contest.... So who is going to manipulate this one... figure out the way to fxck it up ?? Count me gone...

I hope your being sarcastic...

 

[RPhArrow]

I hope your being sarcastic...

Not really... It's a classic example of why you see Kyle, Steve, OCP in general disavowing any connection with subforum contests & races... I still think Mage rules however...

 

[Viper87227]

Not really... It's a classic example of why you see Kyle, Steve, OCP in general disavowing any connection with subforum contests & races... I still think Mage rules however...

When it has come to contests in teh DC forum in the past, be it mine or the ones done by p[h]antom and kodiac, have you ever seen any manipulation or fuck ups on them? By saying "who is going to manipulate this one" it sounds like your saying its been a problem in the past and it will be a problem again. I don't see where there have been problems in the past, perhaps you can point them out to me, and with this contest, p[h]antom took great care in making sure there could be no cheating. From what I have pondered, there is no way anyone could really cheat. It would be more effort than its worth, thats for damn sure.

 

[RPhArrow]

When it has come to contests in teh DC forum in the past, be it mine or the ones done by p[h]antom and kodiac, have you ever seen any manipulation or fuck ups on them? By saying "who is going to manipulate this one" it sounds like your saying its been a problem in the past and it will be a problem again. I don't see where there have been problems in the past, perhaps you can point them out to me, and with this contest, p[h]antom took great care in making sure there could be no cheating. From what I have pondered, there is no way anyone could really cheat. It would be more effort than its worth, thats for damn sure.

1. What the HELL do you think has happened in the last [H]orde contest started by k* and p[H]antom? It got manipulated to the point that there was NO contest ... I did not point fingers except that I know it was not unhappy_mage.. I'm not the one who mentioned p[H]antom or kodiac... you tell ME who screwed that race...and who didn't stop it...

2. Is there a way to cheat in the upcoming race ? Hell, I didn't think anyone would cheat in the last race !! I have given up & pitched my best boxen to unhappy_mage myself..

3. See.. it's not the folks who want to participate or compete fairly that are the problem.... It's the people who think they can manipulate the process and not suffer consequences that are the problem....

4. Do I really care ?..... Only for new guys walking in here that think it's a level playing field... It's not.... it's totally controlled by insiders with inside communications (oh... can I find that IRC channel ??)

5. Should I fold anyway ? ... You bet... .