High refresh rate or respond time..

[Jayda10]

I know these are two different things.. But whats more important for a gaming monitor.
I cant decide..which one should i pick..

Monitor 1: 2 ms 60 hz (Samsung t220) vs Monitor 2: 5 ms 120 hz (Samsung 2233RZ)

1) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001273

2) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001311&Tpk=samsung 2233RZ


Is 120 hz worth the 3 ms longer in response time and will I even have any use of it in online gaming ? Or will just the mouse be smoother?
Heard you have to hit at least above 70 fps in order for 120 hz to be effective.

Any advices.

Thank you.

 

[Askanison2]

Both being a TN panel, it is likely both have 2ms GTG and 5ms (pixel response). So it is not actually 3ms longer but a difference in quoting the rate.

 

[kinetic]

120hz isnt there yet.. get the samsung XL2370.. from bestbuy.com .. unless newegg has it available.. LED backlit is the bomb.. no light leakage and you can hardly tell about ghosting if you turn on visual sync.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

I've got an Asus 22" w/ 2 ms (GTG) and there is no ghosting whatsoever. Colors aren't as great as my old CRT (Dell Ultrascan), but they're not bad.

 

[nomu]

I know these are two different things.. But whats more important for a gaming monitor.
I cant decide..which one should i pick..

Monitor 1: 2 ms 60 hz (Samsung t220) vs Monitor 2: 5 ms 120 hz (Samsung 2233RZ)

1) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001273

2) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001311&Tpk=samsung 2233RZ


Is 120 hz worth the 3 ms longer in response time and will I even have any use of it in online gaming ? Or will just the mouse be smoother?
Heard you have to hit at least above 70 fps in order for 120 hz to be effective.

Any advices.

Thank you.

The 2233rz is faster than the t220. g2g is not a very good measure when you're comparing such different panels.

 

[evilsofa]

Response time is one of those unreliable stats that the monitor marketing companies have fudged past the point of being useful. But in this case, comparing response time is irrelevant, because for gaming purposes, 120Hz monitors are in a completely different class over any 60Hz monitor. The only reason not to consider the 120Hz monitors is if you want a bigger monitor.

And particularly for online gaming, the Samsung 2233rz >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Samsung T220.

 

[Jayda10]

Im really considering the 2233 rz but now im suddenly unsure if HDCP works over the dual-link cable ? As I watch HD movies on monitor sometimes, does that mean the movies wont me in HD quality any longer ?

That what i gatherd from another thread on here :

Originally Posted by 10e View Post
It's because it's not required. It will work in either mode, but the 120hz technology doesn't work in single-link and HDCP doesn't work in 120hz dual-link. I wonder where that leaves 120hz "judder free" BluRay? In the hands of pirates methinks.

http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1387713&page=2

 

[evilsofa]

Im really considering the 2233 rz but now im suddenly unsure if HDCP works over the dual-link cable ?

"When we played movies at 120Hz refresh rate--be they DVD or Blu-ray--we did not notice a difference from playing them in 60Hz. For the 2233RZ and the VX2265wm, there is no advantage to playing movies at 120Hz when connected to a computer. We did not test either with a stand-alone DVD or Blu-ray player."

http://fullres.blogspot.com/2009/04/samsung-syncmaster-2233rz.html

I think if it were not HDCP-compliant at 120Hz, the writers of that article would have howled bloody murder.

 

[10e]

"When we played movies at 120Hz refresh rate--be they DVD or Blu-ray--we did not notice a difference from playing them in 60Hz. For the 2233RZ and the VX2265wm, there is no advantage to playing movies at 120Hz when connected to a computer. We did not test either with a stand-alone DVD or Blu-ray player."

http://fullres.blogspot.com/2009/04/samsung-syncmaster-2233rz.html

I think if it were not HDCP-compliant at 120Hz, the writers of that article would have howled bloody murder.

Samsung should fix/update their manual.

http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/200901/20090106142742765/BN59-00834A-Eng.pdf

I searched that manual for HDCP and found this on page 12 (13 of 54) when I posted it. Maybe they didn't check what mode they were in when they tested it, or is Samsung confused again?

Connect the DVI Cable to the DVI IN port on
the back of your monitor.
Note
DVI with HDCP : HDCP operates only in Single
Link mode (60 Hz).
(It is not supported in Dual Link

Even then, it's still the best pure gaming monitor out there by the sounds of it.

 

[evilsofa]

I searched that manual for HDCP and found this on page 12 (13 of 54) when I posted it. Maybe they didn't check what mode they were in when they tested it, or is Samsung confused again?

Another odd piece of evidence: the Tigerdirect 2233rz page states: "Dual Link also provides HDCP support, which is required for Blu-Ray playback." But that statement is part of their description of DVI Dual-Link, not of the 2233rz itself.

After more searching, I found this yahoo answer from 2 years ago:

Right now, HDCP is not being used or enforced for Blu-Ray or HD-DVD. The studios have agreed to wait until 2010-2012 before enforcing it. When they do, you will still be able to watch a movie on Blu-Ray or HD-DVD, but it won't be in HD. It'll essentially look like a normal DVD. I do not know if this would affect current discs, or only be on discs manufactured after that point.

So, maybe HDCP is in fact not working on the 2233rz in 120Hz mode, but it just doesn't matter yet because they aren't enforcing it. I'm not even sure this will ever matter, because Blu-Ray would never play at more than 60Hz anyway - Blu-Ray is limited to 24Hz when playing 1080p, and what I've read implies it's limited to 60Hz at lower resolutions.

So I would just say the OP shouldn't worry about that and enjoy a great gaming monitor.

 

[Jayda10]

So, maybe HDCP is in fact not working on the 2233rz in 120Hz mode, but it just doesn't matter yet because they aren't enforcing it. I'm not even sure this will ever matter, because Blu-Ray would never play at more than 60Hz anyway - Blu-Ray is limited to 24Hz when playing 1080p, and what I've read implies it's limited to 60Hz at lower resolutions.

So I would just say the OP shouldn't worry about that and enjoy a great gaming monitor.

In case it hd doesnt work on the dual link, isnt it just as simple changing to a single-ink cable, and monitor would right ? Of course 120hz is not working then but thats ok.

Im just hesitating a bit as i want the best bang-for-the-buck and still a good monitor. It would definitively be strange if you cant watch hd on a $ 300 screen.

Bleeding is another issue on several of samsungs monitors and this one is supposed to have that on the sides , guess you cant have it all in this industry.

 

[nomu]

In case it hd doesnt work on the dual link, isnt it just as simple changing to a single-ink cable, and monitor would right ? Of course 120hz is not working then but thats ok.

Im just hesitating a bit as i want the best bang-for-the-buck and still a good monitor. It would definitively be strange if you cant watch hd on a $ 300 screen.

Bleeding is another issue on several of samsungs monitors and this one is supposed to have that on the sides , guess you cant have it all in this industry.

You wouldn't need to change cables. The monitor will accept a single link connection over a DL cable, and of course your video card will automatically send 1680x1050@60Hz as a SL signal. Just switch modes in Windows if there's a problem.

Better yet, rip stuff with AnyDVD or DumpHD.

 

[krameriffic]

Response time is one of those unreliable stats that the monitor marketing companies have fudged past the point of being useful. But in this case, comparing response time is irrelevant, because for gaming purposes, 120Hz monitors are in a completely different class over any 60Hz monitor. The only reason not to consider the 120Hz monitors is if you want a bigger monitor.

And particularly for online gaming, the Samsung 2233rz >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Samsung T220.

For gaming purposes this is absolutely true. The only other monitor to consider for 120Hz (AFAIK) is the Viewsonic VX2265wm. They have their shortcomings to be sure, but the fluidity of motion on these monitors makes every other 60Hz LCD look like a toy out of a crackerjack box.