Illegal Downloading No Different from Stealing a Handbag

The law here in the Netherlands says that downloading music and videos is perfectly legal as long it's just a copy for yourself (fair use). I guess I could start robbing handbags from old ladies now as well and be just as in the clear.

Thank you, RIAA :)
 
In all honesty, if any 3 strikes shit like this gets passed, I'm going to make every effort to illegally distribute as much music as possible. I'm such a rebel.
 
Emanuel, the brother of US presidential adviser Rahm, said the industry was talking to the US government in a bid to introduce a "three strikes and you're out" law to govern illegal downloading. "We are in the midst of talking to the president and some attorney generals and [we are] trying to implement a three strikes and you're out rule," he added.
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Dumbass needs to learn more about the Goverment he's trying to influence, it's Attorneys General
 
Ualdayan said:
Of course the music industry only believes this when it benefits them. The other day EMI lawyers tried to convince a court that Pink Floyd's contract requirement to only sell whole albums only applied to physical CDs and not digital. EMI lawyer's - get this - in simple terms said digital is different form physical and shouldn't be considered the same under the law.

Of course, when talking punishment or morals THEN they want everybody to believe they are one and the same. 'You wouldn't steal a CD would you? Then why would you download it?" out of one side, and "Digital is fundamentally different from physical, and people shouldn't consider them the same. Therefore this contract for limits on how we can sell their album is purely related to the physical form, not the digital one." out of the other side.
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I think this needs to be quoted again. The stupidity of the RIAA continues to amaze me! :(
 
Mindy Kaling had a good bit about it in her standup....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcOdNc_seyM

something like...."Would I steal a car....yes...I would steal a car. If all I had to do was touch the car and 30 seconds later it was mine...and the original owner go to keep their car."

That was from memory...so please don't complain if it wasn't 100%...or even 75%.
 
Why is this 3 strikes law push in USA a surprise to anyone given how many RIAA connected lawyers were put into nice gov jobs by Obama?

Obama Taps 5th RIAA Lawyer to Justice Dept.
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http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/04/obama-taps-fift/
That was the number a year ago, I haven't checked to see if there's been more since then.

Here's the thing, when Obama asks opinions of people over at justice about this potential law, what kinda advice do you think the RIAA "reps" are going to give him?
 
txaggies07 said:
Mindy Kaling had a good bit about it in her standup....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcOdNc_seyM

something like...."Would I steal a car....yes...I would steal a car. If all I had to do was touch the car and 30 seconds later it was mine...and the original owner go to keep their car."

That was from memory...so please don't complain if it wasn't 100%...or even 75%.
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Nice, very funny. Thanks for the link. :D
 
Copyrights as a whole need to be rethought. Having decades of protection is crazy in this day and age. Think of abandonware games from the 80s. Some of them are from companies that have long since died off, and nobody knows who really owns the rights. Yet downloading those is technically illegal.

A cartoon about a mouse made 82 years ago, by a guy who's been dead 44 years now, still has another 13 years of protection before it gets another extension. It's insane.

Copyrights should be drastically scaled back. After 5-10 years, it should become public domain. If it's no longer being actively sold, it should become public domain.
 
balthan said:
Copyrights as a whole need to be rethought. Having decades of protection is crazy in this day and age. Think of abandonware games from the 80s. Some of them are from companies that have long since died off, and nobody knows who really owns the rights. Yet downloading those is technically illegal.

A cartoon about a mouse made 82 years ago, by a guy who's been dead 44 years now, still has another 13 years of protection before it gets another extension. It's insane.

Copyrights should be drastically scaled back. After 5-10 years, it should become public domain. If it's no longer being actively sold, it should become public domain.
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B...but, then all those good companies like Disney won't be making bilions in royalities! /sarcasm

To all those who believe in absolute free markets, I provide you the challenge of copyright: a companies interest in copyright is keeping it as long as possible to make money. Societies interest is to keep the knowledge free and flowing. Those two goals are completely at odds, at which point it's the job of the government to step up and protect the interests of Society over the fat cats. Unfortunatly, when the government is bought and paid-for, they tend to protect the fat cats instead of society.
 
the difference is... illegal downloading does not ALWAYS take something away from the artist. Take someone's bag. They are out a bag. there is only 1 bag to be had amongst 2 people. If I take music they can still sell the music to someone else.
The other factor is... how often do people illegally download things that they would have bought otherwise? If someone isnt going to pay 10$ for some band they've never heard of, they'll never buy the merch or go to concerts. If they hear it, they may potentially pay for the CD and go to shows. its like a risk free trial.. Granted some people never wind up paying back.. But a lot of those people are too cheap and never would have bought the stuff they stole anyway.
Money isnt being LOST by illegal downloading, its just that people have things they wouldnt have otherwise.... But not at the cost of depriving someone else of it (like for stealing physical objects)
 
We've read that people who download the most, BUY the most. This is their customer base they're attacking.

The best thing I've read about the issue from the artist's perspective is from the author Cory Doctorow. Essentially, he believes, the greatest danger for an artist is obscurity not piracy. The people who go online and download music or books are the people who LIKE music or books. They are your customers. While a download may, but not necessarily, mean a lost sale, it almost always means a future sale. Maybe not from the downloader himself, but from someone the downloader introduces the artist's works to.
 
Call me an old timer if you will, but before downloading we used to tape from the radio, swap tapes of our albums, or get in a group and each person bought a cd a week and everyone got a copy. They didn't care about that too much up here in Canada, and when the companies came calling to the feds, they received $0.05 on each blank, or w/e it is now.
The fact their lawyers stated in court that digital and physical are different, and thus should be treated differently, should be quoted in all cases moving forward. It is the mass distributers causing the problems, yet they prefer to chase the end user, it's far easier for them now. But when it was the hard copies they only pursued the larger players, the ones that profited from it.
What's next ? When you go to a party you have to mail Sony a cheque for each one of their licensed songs you heard at the party ?
 
You gotta love how they are going after people who perform copyright infringement like they are uber criminals, when the people who totally screwed our economy got handouts and thank yous! When the crime for "stealing" songs and movies is in some cases worse then killing a person..you know something is wrong with your laws.
 
[UPS] Sorce;1035445300 said:
Good thing he's already been elected, then. :p
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Not for his 2nd term. He gone after this. But let not turn this into political bullshit, we all know the riaa and mpaa is sleeping with the great one :D
 
Let's be honest, the biggest difference between stealing a CD and illegally downloading music is one is convenient, the other is dangerous.
 
illgiveumorality said:
Let's be honest, the biggest difference between stealing a CD and illegally downloading music is one is convenient, the other is dangerous.
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No, the biggest difference between stealing a cd and downloading a song is property. If you steal a CD, the store is missing 1 CD. If you download a song, nothing is gone.
 
Fail said:
I don't care if it's illegal or not

what's illegal is them making all that shitty music, and all those stupid movies and conning people into buying them
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You can't con willing idiots... They purposely stand in line to either have the latest/greatest gadget or to watch some shit movie and be considered cool in their limited peer group because they stood in line for 12 hours...

Basically, like Ron White says, "you can't fix stupid". The only codicil I'd add to that is 'you can avoid stupid, but you can't avoid the lowest common denominator'
 
illgiveumorality said:
I'm sorry, but, what?
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What he's saying is that if you steal a CD from a store, that CD is no longer in a store. If you download a song, the song is still on the hard disk where you downloaded it from.

One is removing a good from where it was, the other is not.

In your original statement you could have said, "morally the same." You were being figurative, and he took you literally.
 
I like the use of " <they've stolen our liberty> " in the same definition.
 
The US hopes to get a 3 strikes type law?

So has the actual fines and prison terms not stemmed piracy yet they think a new law will? Geezus
 
deff said:
Also, Obama will lose another vote if he seriously entertains this idea.
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I used to think he was a smart guy, but all of these issues coming up healthcare, foreign policies... and now this? Why are they even entertaining the idea? I really wonder now. Isn't healthcare fucked up enough now or that is potentially? Do we need some silliness with IP law now?
 
Decibel said:
What he's saying is that if you steal a CD from a store, that CD is no longer in a store. If you download a song, the song is still on the hard disk where you downloaded it from.

One is removing a good from where it was, the other is not.

In your original statement you could have said, "morally the same." You were being figurative, and he took you literally.
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I want an album, and I want it for free. If I don't download it, my other option is to take it from a store.
If I download it, who isn't making money? The artist, the label if it applies, and the store I would have bought it from.
If I take it from a store, who isn't making money? The artist, the label if it applies, and the store I would have bought it from.
 
illgiveumorality said:
I want an album, and I want it for free. If I don't download it, my other option is to take it from a store.
If I download it, who isn't making money? The artist, the label if it applies, and the store I would have bought it from.
If I take it from a store, who isn't making money? The artist, the label if it applies, and the store I would have bought it from.
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What about getting a copied cd/dvd from a friend? who isn't making money? The artist, the label if it applies, and the store you would have bought it from?

What if you rent a CD or DVD or even goto the Libary and borrow a CD then copy said CD? who loses money? is it the artist, the label if it applies, and the store the library would have bought it from?

You can't count a sale that would have NEVER taken place to begin with.
 
So I can steal two lady's handbags and that's fine, but if I steal a third one then I will go to jail.
Sweet !!!!

Hopefully this new law will apply to all merchandise.
I'm going to Best Buy and nab myself some televisions. Yeeeehawwww !!
 
demingo said:
No, the biggest difference between stealing a cd and downloading a song is property. If you steal a CD, the store is missing 1 CD. If you download a song, nothing is gone.
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Took the words right out of my mouth.
 
this is retarded. Copyright infringement is nothing like stealing a handbag.

If I made my own version of a song and burnt it on to my own CD it would be an infringement on the original copyright, and is NOT EVEN close to stealing the original CD out of a store.

If I manufactured my own slap chop that would be copyright infringement, which is nothing like me stealing a slop chop out of a store.

If I download a copy of a song from the internet it is copyright infringement.....which is obviously nothing like stealing a handbag.

But ignorance is the easiest canvas to paint on.
 
NLJP said:
Took the words right out of my mouth.
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mine also... this whole thing is getting out of hand... I almost now want to DL stuff just to spite the assholes at the RIAA..

BTW - whoever posted that comic bit about stealing the car.. TY. that shit was funny. :)
 
So here is how I see pirating


Sneaking into the movies.

You steak into a movie who is it hurting? No one.
Would the show the movie anyways to the other paying customers heck even if no one is in the theater? Probably.
Would those empty seats go to waste? Yes.
If you bought popcorn would the theater make money where they would not have made any if you had stayed home? Yes.
Are you removing a physical item of any kind? No.

Is it right? No most people would say it is not. The people that sneak in are cheating the system. If everyone did that who would pay for new movies or theater upgrades etc? No one would so the companies (that only do this for money DUH) say this movie making thing is worthless lets make cars instead. All of a sudden no more new movies or theaters.

You like games? You want new games to come out next year? Guess what you are not helping by stealing them. Sure the game industry rakes in billions and the % of people stealing games is far to small to impact if the industry will continue. But those of us who pay for our games and movies essentially make it possible for thieves to leech off the system.

Games are a luxury item. Your not stealing food, water, clothing, shelter. Your stealing something that other people "DO WITHOUT" if they cant afford it, cant buy it in their country, etc. I know game execs are likely scumbags but there are a lot of people that work in the industry that are just regular people, worse they are enthusiasts like us. Rewarding their effort by stealing a game is not right. If a game sucks don't buy it, or steal it or anything do without. Some people recently seem to think they are entitled to a copy of entertainment because the internet changed things. If you want to live in a place where a person creates luxury items not for any profit but to be given to all the people I think there are a few of those countries still around.

Its my opinion but you are wrong.
 
No ones getting hurt here in downloading anything. Someone originally bought the material in the first place and started sharing it. Might aswell say all sharing is bad. Lending your friends a movie you bought should be criminal also. Same thing. In the eye of the RIAA and MPAA only the person that buys the movie or cd is able to listen to it. Its illegal if you expose material to another person that hasn't bought the material yet. If you show a movie when all your relatives come over its considered illegal public viewing. These organizations are all criminal in the way they do business. If it was up to them they'd charge us per the second of viewing/listening copyrighted material. The artists don't get one dime as it is. Why should anyone care if anyone downloads anyways. No ones going to go run down to bestbuy and buy it anyways if they haven't already. People are too lazy to do that these days and everything sucks now. Nothing good has came out in along time to be worth paying 35 dollars for a bluray that has over 15 minuets in previews you can't skip. These companies are frauds in reality. I wasn't going to buy anything anyways. I buy games that are good. Anything thats good i buy. I don't buy stuff i think is trash though. They shouldn't go after the consumers. Its obvious they are hiring crappy artists. Nothing good comes out anymore. You never hear anything catchy anymore. I wish this phase would pass us quick. I think people were a lot smarter back then. We had a lot more going on. Too many people now are too lazy to do anything that we haven't had anything good for years. Talent has dried up. People are listening to music that pre dates 1990 for a reason. To me the reason we aren't getting anything good these days is because of the computer. Too much computer generated enhanced voices. People use to use robotics for movies now its cgi. Robotics was much more realistic looking though. End product back then was much better. Much more effort was put in before and stuff was better. The internet is one of the best innovations in along time but to me theres going to be some real slobs in future ;). RIAA and MPAA will be obsolete in the future. They're dieing off slowly but surely.
 
Have you ever noticed it's always liberals making this argument? First Hillary Rosen, now this Emmanuel turd.

Vote Republican.
 
if you really wanna support the artists

download their music and then buy tickets to their concerts, buy their t shirts too

there, i said it
 
Conker said:
I don't buy stuff i think is trash though.
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I agree no one should buy an inferior product you are encouraging them to make more crap.

... But when you don't buy trash are you doing without it at all? OR are you downloading it off the internet because you still want to see / hear the trash and just don't want to pay for it. That is what defines the stealing vs savvy consumer.

I see this argument made all the time and I apologize you may not ever torrent anything. But the distinction that you would never buy this crap does not excuse you to steal a copy of it online.

Lots of people also say well its just like sharing a CD with a friend is that wrong? HUH? No and frankly if you don't see any moral difference between the two I cant explain it to you. The ironic and sad thing is most people "really" know its wrong but in a public forum pirates will argue till they are blue in the face that they shouldn't have to pay for the same things everyone else does. As far as buying something if its good... ya some people do but I would guess a lot of pirates ones they know how to get it they get it for free most the time and find some way to justify it to themselves. Oh I heard it didn't have replay ability, I just wanted to hear the song all the way through, I am waiting for the directors cut to actually buy it....
 
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