It's that time: time to switch from CRT to LCD

J

jyi786

Supreme [H]ardness
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I want to get the best LCD out there, within my budget of about $800.00. I'd like a screen that is good for it all (gaming, DVDs, Photochop, web browsing) without any ghosting, backlight bleeding, or dead pixels. Oh, not to mention, quiet. :rolleyes: My Viewsonic CRT sounds like a supersonic screecher, is too hard on my eyes, and distorts the picture so much no matter how much I play with the geometry controls. It's frustrating.

I've sorta narrowed down to Viewsonic VP201S. Do you have any other suggestions?
 
The apple 20". Im making the same move as you, but im heading to the local mac store to pick one of these up. You also get 10% off with your student card, or if you go to a preferred university, so it will run me $900 out the door. The color and build quality are simply outstanding, and widescreen is the way of the future. :p
 
One thing I've never heard of the Apple display was anyone mentioning anything about ghosting. Does it ghost at all or what?
 
If you can live with the chance you'll have to exchange, I'd say go with the Dell 2005FP over the Apple. Definately 1 of those 2 screens, as they both use the same LG S-IPS panel (the Viewsonic is not as good for all of your applications). Reason I say Dell is because it is much more feature-rich than the Apple, not to mention how much of a pain in the ass it can be to make any sort of adjustment to it, as there is no PC software for it. It's also quite a bit cheaper with those constant coupons in the US (you can have it for around $500), and the widescreen on either gives you a nice amount of workspace :)

The Dell is far more suited for a PC-setup, and cheaper. Just, as you see in this forum, if you don't get a good one first try, you will have to exchange it. Which isn't as much of a hassle as it may sound. Dell's support is usually pretty good, at least in my experience.
 
I was also looking at a Samsung 213T. Does that thing ghost?
 
Moreso than the Apple/Dell, yes. It's got a 25ms response time and it is a PVA panel... they aren't as good as S-IPS in terms of response time. If you're going to play games, PVA panels (i.e. most samsungs) aren't suitable for you.
 
ajm786 said:
I'd like a screen that is good for it all (gaming, DVDs, Photochop, web browsing) without any ghosting, backlight bleeding, or dead pixels.
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Hate to tell you this, but at the moment there is no such a thing.
 
I just recently converted from 22" NEC monitors to a 2001FP and I couldn't be any happier. Not only is my back better, but there's less heat coming out of this thing too. It doesn't ghost and it's got no dead pixels (and I got it used!). I don't know what the big deal is with backlight bleeding, but it doesn't bother me at all.
 
BossNoodleKaboodle said:
Not an LCD one anyway ;)
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I know that there will be no LCD that will be perfect in everything. But I am willing to sacrifice a little to gain what I feel will be a major upgrade. Let me list a few reasons why I want to switch from CRT to LCD.

My CRT does this:

1. Strains my eyes to hell
2. Distorts the picture, no matter how much I play with the geometry settings
3. Sounds like a bat (emits a high pitched squeal, enough for me to get a real headache)
4. Acts as a room heater (not good in summer)
5. Needs time to heat up, like a car, in order to get the whole picture on the screen
6. EXTREMELY HARD TO CLEAN :mad:

Name me a CRT that does not have all these highly annoying properties, and I'll be all for it. Oh, also no annoying AG wires (aperture grille). Everyone says it's almost unnoticeable, but to me, it's too noticeable, especially when I'm Photochopping.
 
ajm786 said:
I know that there will be no LCD that will be perfect in everything. But I am willing to sacrifice a little to gain what I feel will be a major upgrade. Let me list a few reasons why I want to switch from CRT to LCD.

My CRT does this:

1. Strains my eyes to hell
2. Distorts the picture, no matter how much I play with the geometry settings
3. Sounds like a bat (emits a high pitched squeal, enough for me to get a real headache)
4. Acts as a room heater (not good in summer)
5. Needs time to heat up, like a car, in order to get the whole picture on the screen
6. EXTREMELY HARD TO CLEAN :mad:

Name me a CRT that does not have all these highly annoying properties, and I'll be all for it. Oh, also no annoying AG wires (aperture grille). Everyone says it's almost unnoticeable, but to me, it's too noticeable, especially when I'm Photochopping.
Click to expand...

All of those reasons are invalid because a good quality CRT won't have any of those problems. I just got a brand new Diamondtron 93sb and its fantastic. It doesn't have any of the pitfalls you just mentioned. The only disadvantage to this monitor is that its heavy, but its not meant to be portable anyway, so its not that big of a deal. AG wires aren't actually that big of a deal to me because they're thinner than the pixels are tall, and they get thinner as the monitor gets older. If you do serious photoshop work you might want to invest in the $8,300 IBM T221 LCD if you must have LCD. Take a look at the newer CRT's before you rule them out for serious graphics work.
 
ajm786 said:
My CRT does this:

1. Strains my eyes to hell
2. Distorts the picture, no matter how much I play with the geometry settings
3. Sounds like a bat (emits a high pitched squeal, enough for me to get a real headache)
4. Acts as a room heater (not good in summer)
5. Needs time to heat up, like a car, in order to get the whole picture on the screen
6. EXTREMELY HARD TO CLEAN :mad:

Name me a CRT that does not have all these highly annoying properties, and I'll be all for it. Oh, also no annoying AG wires (aperture grille). Everyone says it's almost unnoticeable, but to me, it's too noticeable, especially when I'm Photochopping.
Click to expand...

Mine.
1. Nope. Though admittedly looking at just about any CRT with a sharp picture at 85Hz+ and not at an insane res doesn't bother me. (2048x1536 on a 21, 1600x1200 on a 19, etc.)
2. Nope. This Hitachi's got good geometry. It *looks* like the bottom edge isn't straight, but I checked it with a ruler. The bezel's curved & the image is straight. A good 'ol optical illusion makes the image look curved alond the bottom edge of the screen.
3. Either it's really old, you hurt it, or it was a POS to begin with.
4. Actually, it's more like a lightbulb. The highest I've seen is 160W on a 24" Sony. They do heat up the room though, particularly if you have a bunch of them. I just park a box fan in the doorway.
5. Maybe a couple seconds.
6. I use a wet sock on occasion.

As for the AG lines, you're kinda hosed on CRTs. You'd have to get a used shadow mask screen as AFAIK high quality, flat shadow mask monitors aren't really made anymore. If I remember right Eizo was the best for those. Hitachi (I've got a Hitachi CM823F shadow mask monitor) was pretty good too, and should cost you a lot less. Hitachi's out of the monitor business entirely, and Eizo just does LCDs now.
 
I thought I put my CRT in my sig. It's a Viewsonic P90f. I didn't think it was a POS when I got it first.

1. This CRT strains the heck out of my eyes. No question about that.
2. In Photochop, if I have a photo in the middle of the screen, it's ever so slightly squished vertically. Once I pick up that photo and drag it to either the left or right of the screen, it gets wider and wider. You can see it being "stretched".
3. It's not an old model, nor did I ever hurt it. It must have been a POS to begin with.
4. I tested this monitor on a PIII laptop to make sure my computer is not the device making my room hot. Sure enough, this monitor will raise the temp in my room about 7-10C. Enough to be felt.
5. Seriously. This is ridiculous. I have to wait about 30 min. for the picture to get fully onscreen.
6. Might be the ARAG treatment, but it's still hard as hell to clean.

zandor, what CRT do you have?
 
ajm786 said:
I thought I put my CRT in my sig. It's a Viewsonic P90f. I didn't think it was a POS when I got it first.

1. This CRT strains the heck out of my eyes. No question about that.
2. In Photochop, if I have a photo in the middle of the screen, it's ever so slightly squished vertically. Once I pick up that photo and drag it to either the left or right of the screen, it gets wider and wider. You can see it being "stretched".
3. It's not an old model, nor did I ever hurt it. It must have been a POS to begin with.
4. I tested this monitor on a PIII laptop to make sure my computer is not the device making my room hot. Sure enough, this monitor will raise the temp in my room about 7-10C. Enough to be felt.
5. Seriously. This is ridiculous. I have to wait about 30 min. for the picture to get fully onscreen.
6. Might be the ARAG treatment, but it's still hard as hell to clean.

zandor, what CRT do you have?
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Sounds like you got a bad one to begin with. I have had a few Sony's now that have given me no problems (other than their bulk) and perhaps the lack of super precision in the text, but that is because I have seen what LCDs can do and I don't think you can get as good of quality text on a CRT as an LCD, but that is just my opinion.
 
I have a Hitachi CM823F (21" (20), flat, shadow mask), a Hitachi CM715 (19" (18), not flat, shadow mask), and a Sun/Sony GDM-20E20 (20" (18), '90s style wannabe flat, Trinitron)

None of them do any of these nasty things except for making the room warm, and my heat problem is probably a lot worse than yours. Along with the 3 CRTs I've got a 2 dual processor rigs and a total of 17 HDs going at all times. All but 2 of the drives are 10k or 15k rpm. Most are cheap refurbs. (I've had damned good luck w/ refurb SCSI/FC-ALs...1 of 14 has died, and that was from a $200 10 pack of 18's I got about 1.5 years ago) It's not bad as long as I keep the box fan in the doorway though.
 
ajm786 said:
Oh, also no annoying AG wires (aperture grille). Everyone says it's almost unnoticeable, but to me, it's too noticeable, especially when I'm Photochopping.
Click to expand...

I can't stand the damn AG wires. Any time there is a light backround, my eyes are instantly attracted to those 2 stupid lines running across the screen. I had a $1000+ sony 19" CRT for 3 years and that whole time I never got use to having the AG wires. I can't remember the model. Whenever I was writing an email or paper, I would find myself just constantly looking at the lines. Don't listen to the anti-LCD crowd. Look at all the LCDs out there and find the screen that would work out best for you. I would suggest an S-IPS screen for you. They seem to have the best everything exept for brightness. I use dual Dell 2001FP and I love them. Neither have a single dead or stuck pixel and I don't notice any ghosting what so ever.
 
ajm786 said:
I thought I put my CRT in my sig. It's a Viewsonic P90f. I didn't think it was a POS when I got it first.

1. This CRT strains the heck out of my eyes. No question about that.
2. In Photochop, if I have a photo in the middle of the screen, it's ever so slightly squished vertically. Once I pick up that photo and drag it to either the left or right of the screen, it gets wider and wider. You can see it being "stretched".
3. It's not an old model, nor did I ever hurt it. It must have been a POS to begin with.
4. I tested this monitor on a PIII laptop to make sure my computer is not the device making my room hot. Sure enough, this monitor will raise the temp in my room about 7-10C. Enough to be felt.
5. Seriously. This is ridiculous. I have to wait about 30 min. for the picture to get fully onscreen.
6. Might be the ARAG treatment, but it's still hard as hell to clean.

zandor, what CRT do you have?
Click to expand...

1) Is a valid point although it is far less of an issue on good CRTs
2) This is a problem I've noticed on Viewsonics it has to do with the linearity setting, for some retarded reason the default calibration isn't so good, yes you can calibrate it yourself but it's something you wouldn't have to worry about on an LCD
3) All CRTs emit some high pitched noises, I can hear them in a silent room but they are not enough to bother me, then again, I've heard that people are very different in their perception of high frequencies like this so it could be a valid issue for ajm786
4) True
5) This is true of Trinitron tubes. It's one of those issues that many may not care about but it is something that every Sony I have ever owned suffers from. The tube takes about 30min to completely warm up (this is something that Sony itself acknowledges) during this time the image on screen will drift a few mm to its final "fully warm" position.
6) It is the anti-reflective coating, it's hard to get totally spotless in any light clean but there are ways to mitigate this issue. LCDs be easier to get clean, but they are also more sensitive to what you use to clean them. So if you don't use very soft cloth or tissues to clean the screen you may end up putting permanent scratches and streaks in the surface of the screen.

I'd look at the Apple 20" Cinema Display or the Dell 2005FPW. The Dell is cheaper and is an excellent display (I own one) but you may be bothered by some of the potential backlighting issues.
 
i blow circuits with my CRT since, in tandem with my badass audio system, it uses way too much nuclear power. And just the feeling that im sitting close to a electromagnetic Cathode ray tube 6 hours a day makes me tweak out. I also go to my friends house at least twice a week with my entire computer minus my badass speakers, but with my 72 lb monitor (NEC FE991SB 19"er). It would be nice to drop that down to 10-15 lbs. How can you go wrong with the viewsonic 19" 12ms LCD?

Oh yeah, i also have a major EMI problem which will soon be eliminated through the use of a LCD screen.

Good times,
 
Seraphim974 said:
And just the feeling that im sitting close to a electromagnetic Cathode ray tube 6 hours a day makes me tweak out.
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Don't worry about that. CRTs can't produce high enery radiation (not enough power), low energy gets blocked by this metal grid (shadow mask or aperture grill), and the midrage stuff can't penetrate an inch or so of leaded glass. That's why monitors have so much lead in them. They put it in the glass so you don't get fried. TCO standards (which basically every monitor these days meets) limit monitor emissions to well below background radiation. You'll be fine.
Don't worry about the lead either. It's no more dangerous than having a piece of decorative lead crystal in your house. If you ground it into a powder and sprinkled it on your food or inhaled the powder that would be bad. But as long as you don't eat or inhale it you're fine. Oh, and do not eat iPod shuffle either.

As for the lugging and the power... you can never have too much power, and that's what liftgates and pallette jacks are for.
 
Your CRT gets interference from something and you're worried about the radiation from the CRT?

What kind of circuit do you have these "badass" speakers running on? Why would it blow breakers?

Weight savings you cant argue with.

LOL @ liftgates and power jacks :D
 
At 1600x1200, the text is very small, so I have to raise the DPI to 125. What should I set it to if I get something like a 22 inch monitor? Keep it the same?
 
this is what i am powering and i also have a subwoofer in my closet that is slightly larger than the CRT monitor pictured here. All this is run in a semi-farm house with limited power.
DSC00999.JPG


Oh and i do actually have my porn star friend lift my monitor when i go to his house on weekends. He just always seems to end up lifting it. he takes care of his body
 
ajm786 said:
At 1600x1200, the text is very small, so I have to raise the DPI to 125. What should I set it to if I get something like a 22 inch monitor? Keep it the same?
Click to expand...
100. A screen with a 20" viewable area is 16" x 12", so 100 dpi for 1600x1200.
 
Do you guys know of any place that has a good return policy on monitors?
 
Seraphim974 said:
this is what i am powering and i also have a subwoofer in my closet that is slightly larger than the CRT monitor pictured here. All this is run in a semi-farm house with limited power.
DSC00999.JPG


Oh and i do actually have my porn star friend lift my monitor when i go to his house on weekends. He just always seems to end up lifting it. he takes care of his body
Click to expand...

You're not getting surround sound if the speakers are all on your desk LOL.
 
What I'm going to do is try the Viewsonic VP201s. If that doesn't work out, I'll go for one of those monster AG CRTs on Newegg.

Does anyone know if Office Depot will pricematch Newegg? Office Depot is advertising the VP201s for a little over $1100.00. :rolleyes:
 
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