Whoisthisreally
[H]ard|Gawd
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2009
- Messages
- 1,143
An excellent demonstration. Though, would it still be as applicable to panels with lesser viewing angles?
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I don't have the instruments to measure screen temperature. But here's a better visual representation of panel (dis)uniformity from a 12 bit raw file taken at base ISO using a macro lens (low light fall-off) and editing the file by applying about 50 pixels gaussian blur to get rid of blockiness artifacts from moire, desaturating, then applying a levels curve to greatly exaggerate contrast. There's about 20 posterised "levels" there, so someone good at maths could be able to work out approximate relative luminance values from darkest to lightest based on integer rounding of 12 bit data. It's a more accurate "plot" than TFTCentral's method which I used to make a fairly similar chart in my earlier post - quite expected as only 35 points were measured consecutively rather than millions measured simultaneously. If you used a consistent exposure parameter, applied standard curves and post processing, then you could have a better and faster method for screen uniformity measurement. My measurements with a colorimeter - showing +/- 5% luminance over most of the panel, with -5-10% variation at the bottom, probably closer to about +/- 8% when I look at recorded values. Now that I look hard at a white screen, yes I can see it. (darn the usual bleater/trasher posts that always pop up with "problems" when a bargain arises) I won't complain about it though, because I'm certain that my (originally very expensive) Diamondtron CRT was worse for uniformity, most of the panels measured by TFTCentral are worse - and IMHO, the 2209wa is a true bargain if the specs meet your needs.
What I can tell you with good certainly, is that the bright areas on the image below are areas where the surface of the screen feels warmer, not just the back panel of the monitor. I guess that it is the PSU - but I'm not pulling it apart to check this out. Perhaps makers should put the PSU in the base stand to avoid this effect.
Interesting...i can see the 2 black vertical bars like the screen has been split into thirds that was very prominent on my screen. I can tell you the temp in my room is about 26c at most times,this shows me the uniformity issues are reproduced between screens - that picture looks like you polarised the clear one I managed to take of mine. That's some thorough test, well done.
Think you'll find you said a little more than "All I said was that you over-reacted" You didn't proceed to state that a 2000 dollar monitor has worse issues than mine, the reason being to undermine my statement as this monitor is cheaper than your 2000 dollar example, therefore people should put up or shut up?!?!?...do me a favour... this is a forum where I thought people could openly discuss the thread topic without being attacked by people like you with their arrogant statements.
So perhaps the diffuser for the 6 x CCFLs isn't 100%. Or that the temperature from the CCFL lights somehow has an impact on screen luminance, or that the lamps themselves aren't 100%.
But from my photo, that "split" effect on my screen is very, very small. I think I can see (naked eye) that the brightness declines at the edges, but no stripes or any such effect. Neither did (or would) TFTCentral's 35 point measurement be likely to spot it. The bottom RH corner in my screen is darker than the top RH corner, but I can't see the difference. (OTOH, if the difference was sharply defined, then I expect that it would be visible)
The effect that I got wasn't polarising, but using levels adjustment to narrow down dynamic range only to what was recorded. The stripes are created as the RGB levels must be integers - it's a common problem with gradients in photography - particularly if you try to darken blue skies in jpeg images, and it's (IMO) the most significant problem with TN panels, as even if posterisation isn't there in the 8bit file, you might see it on a 6 bit panel, so totally unsuitable for photo post-processing using very normal "tone mapping" techniques, even if you can calibrate it, and think pictures look nice on it.
As far as making any quantitative assessment of the relative luminance value of bands, consider that the original file was 12 bit (x3-RGB), but edited in 16 bit colourspace. It just makes my head hurt to think about how the software rendered it...
People with poor quality LCDs frequently post complaints about banding in unmodified images ex-camera, blaming the camera of course. When they finally post a sample image, and it looks fine on any CRT or decent LCD, they still don't want to accept the truth.
You can overcome most of the problem with ex-camera jpegs in post processing by using Photoshop and working with the image in 16 bit colourspace, saving any intermediate steps in 16 bit format (tiff/psd).
I don't have the instruments to measure screen temperature. But here's a better visual representation of panel (dis)uniformity from a 12 bit raw file taken at base ISO using a macro lens (low light fall-off) and editing the file by applying about 50 pixels gaussian blur to get rid of blockiness artifacts from moire, desaturating, then applying a levels curve to greatly exaggerate contrast. There's about 20 posterised "levels" there, so someone good at maths could be able to work out approximate relative luminance values from darkest to lightest based on integer rounding of 12 bit data. It's a more accurate "plot" than TFTCentral's method which I used to make a fairly similar chart in my earlier post - quite expected as only 35 points were measured consecutively rather than millions measured simultaneously. If you used a consistent exposure parameter, applied standard curves and post processing, then you could have a better and faster method for screen uniformity measurement. My measurements with a colorimeter - showing +/- 5% luminance over most of the panel, with -5-10% variation at the bottom, probably closer to about +/- 8% when I look at recorded values. Now that I look hard at a white screen, yes I can see it. (darn the usual bleater/trasher posts that always pop up with "problems" when a bargain arises) I won't complain about it though, because I'm certain that my (originally very expensive) Diamondtron CRT was worse for uniformity, most of the panels measured by TFTCentral are worse - and IMHO, the 2209wa is a true bargain if the specs meet your needs.
What I can tell you with good certainly, is that the bright areas on the image below are areas where the surface of the screen feels warmer, not just the back panel of the monitor. I guess that it is the PSU - but I'm not pulling it apart to check this out. Perhaps makers should put the PSU in the base stand to avoid this effect.
I've had 2 of these monitors for a day now and I'm considering returning. It may be the white glow, the sparkly anti-glare or the greeny/red tinge around text, but 30 minutes of coding gives me eye-strain and a headache. I can stare at crts and TN screens for hours. I'm running at 0 brightness and 40 contrast (lowering bit by bit, but not helping tbh).
Alright guys, I'm just going to buy this since it's so cheap in the first place. Is the deal still going for 200$ at dell?
Thank you so much for this information. This actually confirms why I have noticed some darkening in one of the corners (not really apparent unless looked for) on my monitors. It makes sense now.
Overall, I for one still really like these monitors especially for the price I paid for them. The overall picture quality is great and on top of that the ergonomics of this monitor is a nice added feature.
I would still highly recommend this monitor to anybody who was thinking about buying one.
I have my hopes on OLED in 4 or 5 years. But hello burn in... Maybe FED?
This is what I'm most worried about, I love the clear colors of a glossy, it's like when you look at solid color it's completely clear and crisp, but with the last matte I had it looked like abunch of crystals or staticy stuff was on it, I wish they could offer a glossy or matte screen for monitors when you buy, I mean it isn't that hard to switch them up, just take out the matte and put a glossy instead ( I think lmao no idea what im talking about )There are only few minor attributes where w2207 comes on top. Due to its glossy screen w2207 has sharper/crisper text. The anti-glare finish on 2209WA introduces a slight fuzziness, most pronounced with smaller fonts. It also creates a slight shimmering effect when viewing patches of light color, such as new document page. But this is typical of anti-glare coats in general and 2209WA is no exception. These caught my eye only because I had the w2207 side by side, and I've easily adjusted to it.
Overall I'm happy with the purchase. I got a superior movie watching monitor, more accurate colors, and better viewing angles with very slight trade-offs. Even at the listed price 2209WA is a great deal. At $212 shipped, if you can still get it at this price, it's practically a steal.
BTW, I might get a 24' glossy down the road but I'm never getting another TN panel again. "I've seen the light."
Wow...34 pages! Guys this has to be a good product. Just came across this thread and tried to catch up on this as much as possible but no way to get it done in time to ensure I'm still able to take advantage of this deal.
So please help me out while I am catching up.
Would someone intended to do photo editing, graphic design and video capture and editing but with limited fund be appreciative of this Dell2209WA?
Yes, you will appreciate it for the function you stated.Wow...34 pages! Guys this has to be a good product. Just came across this thread and tried to catch up on this as much as possible but no way to get it done in time to ensure I'm still able to take advantage of this deal.
So please help me out while I am catching up.
Would someone intended to do photo editing, graphic design and video capture and editing but with limited fund be appreciative of this Dell2209WA?
lol, in a word. Yes!
In a few more, IMHO there aren't any other options to even consider for an IPS panel at $200ish!
Yes, you will appreciate it for the function you stated.
I found a terrific way to quickly check for dead/stuck pixels and backlight bleed. In the OSD under Other Settings, enable LCD Conditioning. The monitor will start displaying full screens of various colors. It's exactly like the break-in images some people use on brand-new plasma TV's to get the phosphors to stabilize before calibration. The OSD menu says LCD Conditioning is to get rid of image retention, but I've sure never had a problem with image retention on an LCD monitor.
There is even better way to do this: 1) Unplug video cord. 2) Press both brightness and menu OSD buttons for 2 sec. The monitor will go into self-test mode. You can now cycle through different color screens by pressing the brightness button. Of course, this is all explained in the troubleshooting section of the manual, but you got to be a real nerd to read the manual, right?
There is even better way to do this: 1) Unplug video cord. 2) Press both brightness and menu OSD buttons for 2 sec. The monitor will go into self-test mode. You can now cycle through different color screens by pressing the brightness button. Of course, this is all explained in the troubleshooting section of the manual, but you got to be a real nerd to read the manual, right?
Guys, thanks. This is exciting.
Will you please be more specific in the ways that I can and will appreciate this 2209WA, aside from the price factor.
Thanks in advance.
FYI,
Digitalversus.com has their "stats" on it.
Input lag is listed as 20ms max, and 9ms average.
Here's the link:
http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.php?ty=6&ma1=23&mo1=465&p1=4590&ma2=88&mo2=470&p2=4605&ph=12
Cool! Peel the rest off and you'll have a glossy! (Kidding, kidding...half-kidding. )All I have to say is, does Dell have ANY Quality Control whatsoever? Here's a picture of my new screen, the film is literally separating from the screen:
I can see the left most two squares very easily, and the third one with some effort.
The fourth/rightmost is impossible to see.
Thanks for the assessment. This sounds like the best monitor for the price for me anytime in the forseeable future - I went ahead and ordered today, $212+tax. Here's hoping it's a good one.I can pick out a difference in the fourth square, but I can't point out definitive borders like I could on the previous three. I couldn't tell you that the shape of the affected area was a square.