Need help with PB purchase

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Inside_line

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 6, 2004
Messages
144
Hey guys, this will be my first mac, so I have a few questions for the guru's. I am familiar with them since I do work on them (Bioinformatics). I'm looking at the 15".

1) Is the difference between the G4 1.5 and 1.67 significant? Judgine by PC cpus it wouldnt be worth the ~$200 difference in price, but I am not an expert on the G4.

2) Is there anyone with speculation on the pb G5? Will this new cpu completely outpace my G4 and be the standard by which the new apps are written?

3) The Radeon 9700 is available with 128 memory, and had this been a pc I would jump at it. But being a mac... is there really any use for this extra memory? Again, at ~$100 it seems like a luxury. I looked up some popular pc games I play and nothing is available for the mac... I see Doom and WoW, neither of which I want to play on a mac. I play some eq2, and that would be nice, but I just don't see that in the cards anywhere.
 
1.) The processor speed difference probably isnt very noticeable.

2.) Theyll be here when they get here.

3.) According to the apple store the only model that has upgradable vram is the faster superdrive model. Even if you dont game the vram will add longevity to the machine.
 
In answer to question 2:B, the G4 often outperforms a slightly higher clocked G5 in "standard" things. For 3D rendering and such, scientific stuff, imaging, audio, video, etc, the G5 is often much better, but for office type applications, and compiling, the G4 is often quite a bit better, clock for clock. So waiting around for a PowerBook G5 might not really be worth it. If you need that kind of power, chances are you'll need a desktop anyhow.


As for question 3, those extra 64 megabytes of VRAM will increase performance if you have hoodles of windows open. What with Core Image and Core Video in Tiger, chances are your "content creation" applications will take bigger advantage of the video memory, too. Plus it increases longevity and resale value, which is always nice.
 
Thanks so much guys!! It sounds like the G4 isn't so bad, and the extra 64 of vram would probably give the pc a longer shelf life.

I also have a few add'l detail questions..

1) Do the powerbooks throttle their cpu? I'm thinking about popping for the 1.67, but still not so sure. If it's something that secretly "overclocked" and is going to constantly make the machine run hot and deplete the battery... I will stick with the 1.5.

2) With the hard drive or cd drive upgrades, are the updgraded pieces often a higher quality part? For example, they offer the option to upgrade from 80 gig to 100. This is not a big difference... but if the 100 drive is a newer seagate, versus an older toshiba, I would prefer the seagate. Same thing with the cd drives... although I plann on getting the burner anyway, is the "superdrive" really a nicer part which runs quieter / smoother in addition to the features listed?

Thanks again guys, really 'preciate it.
 
I got a G5 and a Titanium Powerbook G4 and the difference is NOTHING when doing normal stuff (Internet, email, etc).

Now, my Powerbook (667) does have 1gb of RAM, but the differences only occur in hevy apps like Photoshop CS, etc.

I dont know what you are planning to do with your computer, but the difference between the two G4 processor speeds are probably not much... unless I got a really kickass 667...

Anyhow, thats my cents - if there is any change coming my way let me know.
 
the CPU will scale when on battery by default (you can change that though) and it will just drop the speed unless you NEED the extra speed....it helps to extend the battery life
 
Grrr.... I can't take it anymore, I want to buy the PB, but I am really hung up on the cpu. If the G4 was closer to 2ghz I'd feel much better about it. But spending 2K+ on a laptop that has a cpu nobody is coding for, in addition to a significantly lower core speed... doesn't sit well.

Does anyone know if the G4 is capable of scaling updwards to 2ghz? I see they've already stretched it from <1ghz to almost 1.7ghz, whats left in it?
 
Just buy it. If you buy smart (i.e. take advantage of applicatble discounts like education etc.) the PB will hardly lose any value. I see 3 year old Ti PBs go for 1000-1300. That's the great thing about Apple products.

If they hit 2.0 with the G4 you'll want dual core or something else - its always that way with computers right :p? It is certainly not fast compared to some of the Centrino laptops, but the OS and design make it great for portable use.
 
Well, I agree with the point that I could sell it... but I'm not looking to buy something and sell it in a year. I don't agree with the dual-core argument. While I don't mind having older technology, I want technology that is at least capable. A 2ghz cpu of any kind can get the job done in my book. While there is faster... nothing is going to seem slow.
 
Just curious, what do you plan on using it for? IMO, the difference between 1.67 and 2.0 isn't that much in a laptop. Typically, it's the other things that get you (slow drives, slow system bus). Again, just curious. :)
 
Inside_line said:
Grrr.... I can't take it anymore, I want to buy the PB, but I am really hung up on the cpu. If the G4 was closer to 2ghz I'd feel much better about it. But spending 2K+ on a laptop that has a cpu nobody is coding for, in addition to a significantly lower core speed... doesn't sit well.

Does anyone know if the G4 is capable of scaling updwards to 2ghz? I see they've already stretched it from <1ghz to almost 1.7ghz, whats left in it?
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ok..you have lost me here...WTF do you mean "a cpu that nobody is coding for"?!? it is a G4 processor..there is no special coding that needs to be done other than what is already being done...also since it looks like you are from the PC world...Mhz/Ghz don't really mean that much any more...yeah a G3 700 will be a lot slower than a G4 1.42 but the difference between a 1.67 and 2 (if it hits that) isn't going to be that noticable in every day apps

also if you have patience you never know what will be announced (if anything) at the next WWDC since that is usually when something is released and not to sound rude or anything but based on your post there...you sound like the type of person that would bitch whine and moan that you just got this and something newer and faster came out a month after you got yours and that is just wrong and you should have either been told or get a free upgrade
 
gigglebyte said:
ok..you have lost me here...WTF do you mean "a cpu that nobody is coding for"?!? it is a G4 processor..there is no special coding that needs to be done other than what is already being done...also since it looks like you are from the PC world...Mhz/Ghz don't really mean that much any more...yeah a G3 700 will be a lot slower than a G4 1.42 but the difference between a 1.67 and 2 (if it hits that) isn't going to be that noticable in every day apps

also if you have patience you never know what will be announced (if anything) at the next WWDC since that is usually when something is released and not to sound rude or anything but based on your post there...you sound like the type of person that would bitch whine and moan that you just got this and something newer and faster came out a month after you got yours and that is just wrong and you should have either been told or get a free upgrade
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I'm use science applications. I run 100+ sequences of DNA in a multiple alignment progam such as sequencher, or clustal from a command line. Also use phylogenetics packages such as phylip to make trees for determining evolutionary relationships and classifications. I am also selling my PC laptop to switch to the powerbook, so I will be buying virtualPC with the computer. VirtualPC says it has optimized code for the G5. Since you asked, different processors have different instruction sets, i.e. plus, minus would be two different instructions. Typically, programmers write programs (code) using the most efficient intructions, and those are usually the ones in the newer processors. It's like a new bag of tricks. This is the reason emulation programs don't work well as well as a natural environment. They are asked to carry out instructions that the platform they are running on don't have... and so instead of a hardware calculation, it is a software calculation; and happens much slower. But thanks for your response.... I'll just add you to my ignore list now so I don't have the aggravation of having to read any more of your "helpful" posts.
 
Inside_line said:
I'm use science applications. I run 100+ sequences of DNA in a multiple alignment progam such as sequencher, or clustal from a command line. Also use phylogenetics packages such as phylip to make trees for determining evolutionary relationships and classifications. I am also selling my PC laptop to switch to the powerbook, so I will be buying virtualPC with the computer. VirtualPC says it has optimized code for the G5. Since you asked, different processors have different instruction sets, i.e. plus, minus would be two different instructions. Typically, programmers write programs (code) using the most efficient intructions, and those are usually the ones in the newer processors. It's like a new bag of tricks. This is the reason emulation programs don't work well as well as a natural environment. They are asked to carry out instructions that the platform they are running on don't have... and so instead of a hardware calculation, it is a software calculation; and happens much slower. But thanks for your response.... I'll just add you to my ignore list now so I don't have the aggravation of having to read any more of your "helpful" posts.
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The reason VirtualPC has "optimized code for the G5" is that up until version 7, it wouldn't even run on the G5! The G4 has been out since 2000. Optimizing for the G4 is sort of the default nowadays.

Both the G4 and the G5 (and the G3, and the G2 and G1...) are PowerPC. The instructions for plus and minus and everything else is exactly the same. They have full binary compatibility (except for VirtualPC, I guess). Yes, they're quite different architectures, and optimizing for either can give good results, but for the most part, general PPC-optimizations will improve performance on both processors.

Why are you so damned rude? You're asking us for help. You should be glad we don't just tell you to fuck off.
 
I am going to have to figure out this ignore function ;) and yeah...I may have been a little blunt there but I did say I didn't mean to be rude..I was just going off the tone of your post and you are wrong about not coding for G4s anymore as BMR stated VPC HAD to be rewritten to work on the G5...oh and VPC7 doesn't work much better than 6 did (loaded it up on my ibook last week and it still blows chunks) maybe it will work better on a G5 but since you are getting a powerbook have fun
 
Black Morty Rackham said:
The reason VirtualPC has "optimized code for the G5" is that up until version 7, it wouldn't even run on the G5! The G4 has been out since 2000. Optimizing for the G4 is sort of the default nowadays.

Both the G4 and the G5 (and the G3, and the G2 and G1...) are PowerPC. The instructions for plus and minus and everything else is exactly the same. They have full binary compatibility (except for VirtualPC, I guess). Yes, they're quite different architectures, and optimizing for either can give good results, but for the most part, general PPC-optimizations will improve performance on both processors.

Why are you so damned rude? You're asking us for help. You should be glad we don't just tell you to fuck off.
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Thanks for your post, that was exactly what I was looking for... same instruction sets!
 
Inside_line said:
Thanks for your post, that was exactly what I was looking for... same instruction sets!
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I don't mean to be rude, but it would've taken about half a second on Apple.com or Google to find out that Apple have been using PowerPC since 1994, and don't have plans to change, if whether or not they used the same instruction set was all you wanted to know.

You're welcome, though, I suppose.
 
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