New Phone - Need Advice / Suggestions

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Melee

Gawd
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Jun 10, 2013
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I haven't purchased a phone in years. I'm finally tired of dealing with this prehistoric P.O.S. so I am going to upgrade while some nice BF/CM deals are going on.

I have Verizon Wireless and the phones I have come across that have peaked my interest are the LG V10, Samsung Galaxy S6 Edge/Edge+, Samsung Note 5, iPhone 6s/6s Plus, and Droid Turbo II. Did I miss any worthy contenders?

First off, which would you guys recommend and why? They are so close in review scores and specs that it is so hard for me to decide, especially with my ignorance toward smartphones. What are the distinguishing factors that would make one a better choice than the rest.

Next, several of these have nice deals since I am eligible for an upgrade so I can get the S6 Edge for $1, Note 5 for $49, LG V10 for $49, S6 Edge+ for $149, and the iPhone 6s/6s Plus for $99 & $199. The Droid Turbo 2 has a CM sale listed for 50% off but I'm not sure what the final price will be. I'd love to avoid signing another 2 year contract but I can't find a decent deal without it. Anything legit deals you guys have come across?

Finally, are there any upcoming smartphones that would be worth waiting another month or two? I'm assuming the next Samsung Galaxy line will be out before long as the current ones have been out for quite some time. The others just released recently so they should be good for a while.

Thanks for the help!


TL/DR - Verizon Customer, Looking for Advice on Best Smartphone, Looking for Best Deals on Smartphone(s), Wondering if Any Smartphones are Releasing soon that are Worth Waiting for.
 
Well, as usual the first question back to you would be "What do you want in a smartphone?" and go from there but sometimes people just can't seem to quantify any respectable answers since they might not be familiar with everything they're capable of nowadays. If you have a few minutes, watch this video (it's just shy of 5 mins long):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nmkab1LUqlg

MKBHD aka Marques Brownlee is one of the most popular device reviewers on YouTube and he makes some rather dead-on comments in this video related to how so many smartphones are so close together in terms of performance (no surprise considering many come out spaced closely to each other based on the same chipsets nowadays) and feature-sets that the only real way to differentiate them nowadays seems to be pointing out what one device doesn't do right or how badly they perform in some manner vs another. I found it a great video to ask someone to watch to get an idea of why reviews these days end up being so similar - there's always that "... but..." thing. :)

For myself personally, of the devices you listed for Verizon at this exact moment if I were to get one it would be the LG V10 for a variety of reasons: I love LG devices and their interface as well as some features like KnockOn (a double tap on the screen wakes it, a double tap on the home screen puts it back to sleep or a double tap on the notification bar in any app) which I can't live without nowadays, and the V10 has the same camera from the G4 at 16 Megapixels along with the still unbeaten f/1.8 aperture for incredible low light performance and other great abilities with the actual camera application where you can adjust most any aspect of the process at all almost like you could with a professional digital camera nowadays.

Another big plus for the V10: it comes with 64GB of storage natively and it's the only option. And yet another: it does 4K video recording at a whopping 64 Megabits bitrate which ensures some pretty damned high quality footage for sure. There are other variables involved in that recording obviously but the bitrate is more than sufficient to capture 4K footage without issues.

I also consider a removable battery and a microSD card slot for storage expansion and absolute must have thing so I don't typically purchase a smartphone without it. Having said that, I will admit that my current daily runner is a Motorola Droid MAXX that I've had for over 2 years now and I keep it because it just works, it really does, and I typically go 2.5 days between charging sessions. I sometimes think my MAXX is possessed or something because I've only met one other MAXX owner that gets more than the advertised "48 hours of battery life" like I do; most people with similar usage barely make it through a day but mine is still going strong on the original battery so I don't mess with it at all. Still running KitKat 4.4.4 and I have no intentions to ever upgrade past that on the MAXX for any reason.

The other devices you mentioned are nice but not my style of hardware, none of them except perhaps the Droid Turbo 2 which now has that nearly (apparently) shatterproof display and after watching multiple videos of people really giving it the workover I've yet to see one actually destroy it - they destroy the actual functionality of the phone itself, sure, but the screen assembly never does shatter. It's worthy of consideration however because it's a solid piece of hardware even in without the shatterproof display assembly.

If you're going for a high end flagship you already mentioned the models that are current on the market today, and I can't speak of what's coming anytime soon. I do tend to favor LG products for most of the reasons mentioned, and I know I babble on about some of the features too much but I swear, once you get accustomed to using KnockOn/KnockOff aka double tap to wake/sleep, if you ever find yourself with a phone that doesn't support that functionality you'll wonder "Why doesn't every smartphone do this?" :D

I'd say check out some of MKBHD's reviews, and also some by Max Lee at:

https://www.youtube.com/user/zedomax

and MobileTechReview:

https://www.youtube.com/user/MobileTechReview

I mention those specifically because they are pretty thorough in most respects, they're not directly tied to major websites like PhoneArena or AndroidAuthority (who of course have their own video reviewers, obviously), and they really seem to love what they're doing. Just my personal opinion as you'll find hundreds of reviewers on YouTube without even trying hard to do so.

And finally, if you can get into a Verizon store and do a real hands on with the various devices that is highly recommended as well: get something that feels good in the hand and suits you as some of the high end models are notoriously large these days. The V10 is a big one as well but not as big as some 6" models, and it's slightly longer because of the additional screen they added that provides notifications and other functionality without directly having to wake the device overall.
 
Thank you for taking the time to write all of that. I truly appreciate it.

The LG V10 does seem to be a stellar phone in all regards. It's certainly one of the front runners. The main question is.....Do I get it in Black or White and what case do I get for it. :D

The other 2 contenders (unless Apple throws some huge, unexpected sale for the 6s Plus) would be the Samsung Galaxy S6 Edge+ and Note 5. I think those are my top 3 for the moment based on price they can be acquired and the fact that they're all truly amazing phones.
 
Personal preference is black, I can't stand having that white border (even as small as it is) around the screen when I'm watching videos, etc. The V10 has an AMOLED display so when the screen is black it's truly black, but again it's a personal preference.

As for a case, I pretty much always get a case for my devices of any kind, and I have one for my Droid MAXX as well. If I can manage to get a great deal on a V10 in the coming months I will finally be retiring my MAXX (but keeping it for other purposes) and I will most definitely be getting a case. One that I saw recently that I like is this one:

OBLIQ Flex Pro / textured TPU case

It offers pretty much full body protection, maintains a very thin profile so it doesn't add excessive bulk to the V10 which is already a large device anyway, and it has a similar feel to the ballistic-style back which is what the V10 comes with out of the box.

I was a Samsung fan and owned many of their devices over the years, I even still own an original Galaxy S Captivate that I keep around as a PMP (portable media player) just because it's awesome and the Wolfson DAC has outstanding audio quality even today. I went from a Galaxy S (the Captivate), to a Galaxy S4 Active (which I loved and still do, there's just something about those Active models that I find appealing, especially the Galaxy S6 Active), but then I had to step away from them when Samsung made that decision to stop having a removable battery and microSD storage expansion.

Unfortunately the Active series is an AT&T exclusive much like the Droid devices are Verizon exclusives. I don't use Verizon, for the record, I use T-Mobile with my MAXX and it works great - Verizon devices are GSM unlocked from the factory as part of their FCC auction requirements from back in 2013. They're finding new ways to get around that unlocked aspect with SIM locks and APN blocks but people are finding workarounds so that's not an issue anymore either. I say this just for the record because if you're a happy or loyal (or both) Verizon customer it's not relevant I suppose but if they screw you over for some reason at least know a Verizon sold device since 2013 can be used on GSM networks too with a little effort and configuration editing.

When I played around with the S6+ Edge a few days ago it felt good in the hand, and yes it's fairly thin (doesn't matter to me at all), but again it's just not my type of device. The Note would be more like what I'd choose because of the stylus which I do find useful personally. I even grabbed an LG Stylo on craigslist recently just to have one around - I don't use it currently as an active cellular device, just for Wi-Fi purposes since I make all my calls using Googe Hangouts anyway. I don't even give out my actual cellular number, go figure, just my Google Voice one which is tied with Hangouts.

Just offering my own opinions here with the V10 stuff, if it's not to your liking then obviously pass on it but it is a tremendous piece of hardware but you already seem to be aware of that. I was fully into getting a G4 at one point and then out of nowhere came the V10 so, who knows, maybe I'll find a fantastic deal on a G4 now that "the next generation" model is here. I was expecting something next year from LG as the successor to the G4 but they jumped the gun and fired off the V10 so that's my target now (gun puns intended I suppose).

Never been a fan of iPhones, not even their latest and greatest but I will admit the iPhone 6 models are not bad overall - I just don't like getting so locked down and effectively forced into the iTunes usage. Google's Play Market is there for the using but it's not mandatory if I feel like sideloading apps (which is still possible on an iPhone that's jailbroken as I understand things, I don't keep up with what's going on in that side of the smartphone community anymore). The new rumors about the iPhone 7 potentially dropping the standard 1/8"/3.5mm headphone jack in favor of using the Lightning connector everything including a headphone output seems a bit stupid to me but then again Apple does what it wants - always - not what customers actually tell them they'd like to see in new models.

It can be a daunting task to select the best product for yourself - there's no perfect smartphone overall as that MKBHD makes abundantly clear, but you can probably find something that's close to perfect for you and your particular needs and wants. My best suggestion is to literally sit down and do a pros/cons list for your "dream smartphone" - all the stuff you want in such a device, and all the stuff you're not too wild about (missing removable battery, expandable storage, that sort of thing maybe) then just find a device that matches as many of the pros as possible given what's on the market at the time you're looking to make the purchase. Rumors about upcoming devices don't always pan out and it would suck to get a device now (perhaps on contract even though you did say it's something you'd like to avoid if possible) that is bested and superceded by some device only weeks later and you end up regretting the who situation.

One thing's for sure: whatever device you choose, make sure it's the one that best suits your needs and wants more than anything else, including the price of purchasing it. That way at least you'll know you're getting your money's worth.

ps
And a screen protector too if you're into such things. I can't stand fingerprints so I pretty much always have a screen protector on my devices, the brand I recommend the most is Moshi but they sell exclusively through AT&T and I'm not 100% positive they'll be making a product for the LG V10 (which AT&T sells too). They make a screen protector called the iVisor AG (anti-glare) and it's a matte finish with anti-fingerprint properties as well. Removable, washable, and incredibly awesome but again they don't make them for every device. They tend to focus on the high end models from Samsung and LG so I expect one any time now for the V10, and of course they support all the iPhones. It's just one brand of screen protector, of course, and a lot of people like the tempered glass style these days but those are seriously glossy and fingerprint magnets, ewww. :)
 
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Melee said:
Thank you for taking the time to write all of that. I truly appreciate it.

The LG V10 does seem to be a stellar phone in all regards. It's certainly one of the front runners. The main question is.....Do I get it in Black or White and what case do I get for it. :D

The other 2 contenders (unless Apple throws some huge, unexpected sale for the 6s Plus) would be the Samsung Galaxy S6 Edge+ and Note 5. I think those are my top 3 for the moment based on price they can be acquired and the fact that they're all truly amazing phones.
Click to expand...

We just picked up 2 V10s yesterday.
And we didn't go to the Verizon store with buying these in mind. I was thinking a Motorola Droid Maxx2. REALLY wanted a Nexus 6; but no go.
As usually we ended up getting what they had all the incentives and rebates; so we get these expensive big-ass phones.
I actually lined up several in front of me; the V10 was fastest, nicest display (not just biggest) and the deciding factor; wife wanted it.

So far so good; does everything nicely.
I was disappointed in the latest Futuremark bench but that is pretty demanding for a portable.

I really didn't WANT new phones; the Amazon Fire phones we have were rock solid and fast. Well, wife drops her and shatters the glass. Found out it cost more to repair than replace. The deal breaker was our carrier (Straight talk) decides to try to screw us by double billing us last month. When we called about this they put us through the wringer and then said they can't do anything about it. We had to go to the bank and contest this to get our credit. The Fire Phones were tied to the AT&T network and the area we are going to move to when our house sells has NO AT&T coverage. Verizon does; so that is how we ended up with V10s. :rolleyes:
 
I've been a wracking my brain all weekend trying to decide. I narrowed it down to the Samsung Note 5 / S6 Edge+, iPhone 6s Plus, and LG V10. I'm still not decided but I want a new phone so I pulled the trigger on an iPhone 6s Plus 64GB since they're on sale at BB. I decided that's the best way to do it since I have 14 days to return it and swap it out if I don't like it. The downside is I may miss out on the deals for the Samsungs and LG V10 they have going on and that would make me sad if I decided not to keep the iPhone. They're all so similar in performance and even appearance for the most part that it's tough to choose. The only nearby cell store I have is a sketchy Verizon "Authorized Retailer" where they don't even have most of the phones out and the ones that are on display aren't even powered on. -_- I am going to head to BB and there's a large Verizon store next door so I'll play around with all the phones before I pick mine up. I can always swap them out while I'm there or go back and do so another day.
 
I purchased the Edge + on Verizon. I had gotten the phone a week prior to the Droid Turbo 2 & V10 release. Since I was within the 14 day window, I went to Verizon to check out the DT2 & V10. I spent an hour at the store comparing both devices to my E+. They were both very nice, with their own set of special features. To me, neither device felt nearly as premium as E+. I've heard bloggers mention a glare or distortion due to its curved display. I have not experienced this. In the end, I decided to keep the Edge +. 6 weeks later, I cannot find anything I dislike about this phone. The new TouchWiz is fast and buttery smooth. The only issue I've had is finding a tempered glass screen protector.
 
How do you guys decide on a phone and convince yourself to keep it after purchase without a second thought? lol I can't for the life of me make up my mind or feel good about the decision. I feel like I would need every phone all at once to swap back and forth doing things to see which I like best. It's too hard to tell just from an in-store demo and the phones nowadays are too darn similar. I'm still feeling such indecisiveness and regret.

I picked up my iPhone 6s Plus 64GB at BB today. It was a tiny store and not well equipped with displays. They had a few Samsung phones out to try and not much else. I picked up my phone and went to a huge Verizon store nearby. They had every single phone out on display and powered on so I messed around with all of them. (They even had the Nexus 6 which doesn't even show up for me on the Verizon website?) I attempted to sign up for the "Samsung Ultimate Test Drive" where you can test one of their phones for 30 days so I could use it alongside the iPhone but I was waitlisted.

After using the iPhone for several hours, I'm still undecided. I also had a hard time deciding on color as nobody had anything other than the Silver on display. I went with it and like it but still not sure on the phone overall. I haven't had a Smartphone in 3 years or so which means any is amazing to me but I'm still on the fence about it at this point.

I loved the Samsung Note 5, at least the way it looked and felt in my hand while messing around with it. It didn't look as long and cumbersome as the others and the screen was gorgeous. The Samsung S6 Edge+ was also really nice but I'm not sure how I feel about the "Edge" screen. It felt awkward in my hand and I don't know if I like everything rounding off on the ends like that. At the same time, I don't know how much I would use the "S Pen" on the Note 5 so it's kind of a wash. It's a really hard decision to choose between those two since they're almost identical. It's literally "Pen vs Edge".

The LG V10 was the huge surprise for me. It's the largest of them all but didn't appear to be, somehow. It felt great in my hand, was buttery smooth, and a beautiful phone. I really like the "second screen" at the top, as well, and could see it being quite useful. I wish the back was made out of something different but at 64GB base memory, removable battery & SD card, and a $49 price tag, it's extremely tempting.

The Droid Turbo 2 was okay. Battery life isn't much of an issue for me as I'm rarely ever away from home for more than a day and almost always able to charge at some point. The durability is fine but I don't drop things that often and I always put on a case so not huge selling points for me.

HELP ME! lol
 
You apparently liked the V10 and you can get different backs for it depending on your moods I suppose. ;) Leather, ballistic rubber/nylon/silicone/etc, your choice, and of course different colors and textures as well. Can't say that about anything else out there on the market right now except the Motorola Moto X series where you can order one (but can't buy it in a store) totally customized in most every respect, even down to the wallpaper from the factory.

Everything you just said about the V10 leads me to think it's the right phone for you (not that I had anything to do with it, of course :D) so, at this point considering the one little issue you have - the backing plate - and the fact that it can be swapped out for a whole host of other possibilities, that would still be the phone I'd lean you towards (if I had anything to do with it, that is :p).

iPhones are nice, I admit that, the newest ones with the "Force Touch" is nice as well but in reality for the most part it's just basically hold-and-decide more than anything else. And of course it requires a mostly proprietary tool (iTunes) to make full use of it - yes there are some third party tools that give access to the device but, in the long run you're still "stuck" with iTunes for the most part. Non-standard power and data cables aka Lightning can be an issue depending on the situation - you might need to charge up sometime and forget to have brought at least the Lightning cable with you and you find yourself in a place with nothing but typical microUSB hardware all over the place.

As an example of this I was at a local hospital just the other day with my wife (she had a touch of bronchitis) and they have a new "charging station" in the lobby for visitors which I thought was pretty cool so I plugged in my MAXX just for a few minutes to see how well it would charge (the station was providing 1.2A to my MAXX as measured by GSAM Battery Monitor). Of the 10 different available connectors it offered, not one of them was a Lightning connector for iPhones - they were all microUSB, but they did have 4 USB ports along each side of the charging station and 3 of those were being used by visitors that had iPhones and those were all Lightning cable devices, not older typical 30-pin model devices like the iPhone 4S and prior. So at least the charging station provided an option for them as long as they remembered to carry the Lightning cable with 'em.

Anyway, enough rambling from me: you already know which phone I'd get, and apparently you lean towards the V10 in some degrees. It's about as loaded as a phone can ever get given the current state of technology. The removable battery (which would mitigate the need to charge quiet a bit even if you did get just one spare and keep it charged up and carried with you) is a huge plus even today, and the microSD slot for more storage (even with 64GB internally which leaves about 57GB available to the end user) is just another bonus if you need to make use of it.

And, in case you didn't know it, the V10 (and the Galaxy devices) work as IR remotes too so you can use them to control your TV/HDTV/Stereo/DVD/Blu-ray/whatever and they do a really great job of it too. Won't see an iPhone do that anytime soon, if ever. Apple would rather sell you a remote for $39.95 that costs them like $2 to manufacture and suck up even more bloated profits, and there are a lot of third party products nowadays that use the headphone jack or even Wi-Fi to remotely control an IR remote control (yes, seriously, as stupid as it sounds that's how it works - you control a device using Wi-Fi that is then itself an IR remote control, ugh) to get such functionality but, LG and Samsung have been doing it for a few years now and I find that pretty awesome.

I'm sure you'll get the device you realize suits you best across all the needs and wants you have and it'll work great for you as expected.

Happy holidays. ;)

ps
If you want to grab a second V10 for me, I won't say no. :D :D JUST KIDDING
 
I've got a v10 too- it's great although the fingerprint scanner doesn't work with a case on- it seems as though you need to make contact with the metal bumpers for the sensor to work which of course a case covers up.
 
LG is aware of the issue with the metal ring around the power button/sensor assembly and they're working on an update that should resolve it and take the ring out of the reader equation, so to speak. And yes, some cases (but not all of them) are affecting it.

The solution that most people have discovered is to make sure there's no case on the V10, then de-register all the current fingerprint data from your user profile, all of it. Reboot the phone, put your case on it and then go through the enrollment or registration process for fingerprints again with the case on and it should work without issues from that point on. At least that's the solution I've seen reported time and time again until the update from LG makes an appearance, probably in the next few weeks if not sooner.
 
Are you sure you aren't thinking of the Droid Turbo 2 in regards to changing the material on the back of the phone? I believe the V10 only comes in one style of back. You can get a cover for it, of course, though.

The sales ended on the Samsung Note/Edge and iPhones which is a bummer if I decide to swap this out. The Samsung phones went back up at least $200 from $49-$149 to $249-$349. I think the iPhones were all $100 off so my 64GB was $299 and now I'd have to pay an extra $100 just to swap out colors. lol I can still snag the V10 but I'm torn between the Note & V10 as both seemed excellent. Honestly, I don't dislike the iPhone. It seems pretty great, overall. I don't know how to explain it. I like it but I don't love it and it just doesn't have that "it" factor that makes me need to have it.

Buying a phone never used to be this hard. :(

I hope your wife is feeling better, by the way. I'm sorry to hear she was ill. Thanks for all your help.
 
marshac said:
I've got a v10 too- it's great although the fingerprint scanner doesn't work with a case on- it seems as though you need to make contact with the metal bumpers for the sensor to work which of course a case covers up.
Click to expand...

I have not tried using the finger print scanner so I looked and I do not see a metal ring around the button. I'm guessing the issue has been fixed on the latest phones.

On benefit of this "big ass phone" is the screen is big enough to replace our ancient GPS for trips. I've ordered a window claw for this. I'm also going to try recording 1080p video while driving. Should be fun. I guess I will toss the old TomTom GPS in the ash can. Map updates are $50 and it is about worthless now a days.
 
Melee said:
Are you sure you aren't thinking of the Droid Turbo 2 in regards to changing the material on the back of the phone? I believe the V10 only comes in one style of back. You can get a cover for it, of course, though.
Click to expand...

Yes, but that's why I mentioned the Moto X model because those can be customized (by ordering online) in any manner you want whereas the V10 does come in one basic stock configuration however you're free to customize it after that with whatever back you want and they do offer quite a few options direct from LG (trying to find that page at LG's website again and not having much luck, and obviously you can find back covers at Amazon or eBay or someplace as they're out there).

And what do you know, the bonus pack deal is back - they just fired it up again on November 30th - except this time it's just a 64GB microSD card - even so it's FREE along with the spare battery and the discrete charger case for it:

https://lgv10promo.com/V10-64/home.mfs

It originally was from November 1st through November 15th and I thought they were done with it but apparently they just fired up round 2 so, unless you can get such bonus items with the Galaxy Note, I would grab a V10 fast and get registered for this promo before it disappears.

As for the metal ring I'm speaking of, it's possible new V10s are being produced and shipped out with some improved fingerprint reader that doesn't have such a metal ring around the power button assembly but this pic shows it:

V10_Metal_Ring.png


Anyway, with the bonus pack - even if it's just a 64GB microSD card - and considering the other phones went back up in price, well, again you already know my position on the matter of which one to choose. :p

And thank you for the kind words about the wife, will pass them along.

Now go get the damned V10, dammit. :D
 
Does the same company/brand that makes the Case and Screen Protector you recommended make them for all Smartphones? I'm hesitant to order extra stuff until I decide if I'm keeping this phone or not but the screen is a fingerprint magnet and the phone feels fragile so it's scary not having any protection on it.

The fingerprint scanner on the iPhone is superb, I will give them that. I registered both thumbs and index fingers with ease and every single time, the phone opens instantly without ever a hiccup or a miss.

The V10 sale for $49 goes through Saturday. I will probably give the iPhone until Thursday or Friday to really test it and see if I want it. As it stands, I'm feeling like I will be returning it and snagging the LG unless I somehow fall in love with the iPhone between now and then. The 64GB Note I wanted is back up to to $400 which is a bummer as I did like it a lot, as well. Money isn't a huge issue or deciding factor but the LG seems to be a stellar phone and it is damn hard to justify the Samsung for $350 extra when the V10 is as good or possibly better and only costs $49.

We shall see in the following days. My first day or so has just been getting reacquainted with Smartphones in general as I haven't owned one in years. Now I have the hang of it again so I can really test the phone instead of just being amazed at the difference from the years old Samsung Flip Phone that I had. lol

Thanks. <3
 
Sounds to me like you already know which device is better on several levels but, it's your money and time so obviously use what you have available to figure out whether the iPhone is the one - pretty sure the Samsung stuff is out of the running now because of that pricing, but for me I just have zero use for an iPhone. Sure, I wouldn't mind having one but they're just boring to me - they all look the same, they all have the same interface, customization on most any level is exceedingly difficult unless you jailbreak them which is a can of worms most iPhone owners just won't get into and I understand that.

There are just too many things about Android devices that I prefer over any other platform I suppose, and yes I'm very involved with custom ROMs for well over a decade now so I do tend to favor buying devices that offer such capability - being a flagship device you can be sure that the V10 is on its way with custom ROMs. I don't think root has been achieved just yet but soon enough - a recovery has been created and there's at least one debloated ROMs aka a lot of factory installed stuff has been gutted out of it to make it leaner overall.

If you're interested, check out the LG V10 subforum over at XDA Developers:

http://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v10?styleid=15

The very first subforum at the top, LG V10 Real Life Review, is where other XDA members are offering up their comments about owning the V10 and on various aspects of the device, and of course there are the other subforums about general questions, accessories (lots of case and back cover discussion), and so on.

It's not absolutely necessary to do custom ROMs on such a high powered top o' the line device but at least the potential exists even if it's not something you'd ever actually do. That's a big part of why I prefer Android, and when that OS is coupled with a nice device like a V10 or anything else really then more things become possible whereas with an iPhone it's like, ok, what can I do, not that, not that, damn, that would have been cool, not that either, geezus why did I buy this locked down piece of sh-- oh well. ;)

Anyway, have fun putting the iPhone through whatever testing wringers you can come up with.
 
You may take a look on HTC E9 and Sony Xperia Z5. But I think iPhone 6S plus would be the best option for you. I am currently using iPhone 6S plus and I am in love with it.
 
You're welcome, and if the bloatware/crapware are bugging you or getting in the way, you can always go into Settings - Apps and disable whatever you simply don't intend to use. That will disable them completely so they don't appear on the home or apps screens at all - they'll still be on the device itself but simply not functional and not visible. If a root ever appears for the Verizon V10 then you'd be able to install something like Titanium Backup (the pay version, well worth it IMO) and that would allow completely uninstalling said bloatware/crapware but at the moment no root seems to exist.

So, Melee, what ended up being the final disposition - did you keep the iPhone or...? :D
 
Tiberian said:
You're welcome, and if the bloatware/crapware are bugging you or getting in the way, you can always go into Settings - Apps and disable whatever you simply don't intend to use. That will disable them completely so they don't appear on the home or apps screens at all - they'll still be on the device itself but simply not functional and not visible. If a root ever appears for the Verizon V10 then you'd be able to install something like Titanium Backup (the pay version, well worth it IMO) and that would allow completely uninstalling said bloatware/crapware but at the moment no root seems to exist.

So, Melee, what ended up being the final disposition - did you keep the iPhone or...? :D
Click to expand...

Yeah, my first course of action was to disable a lot of it but some of it you cannot disable in this manner.
 
Like Tiberian I was using a Droid Maxx for a few months. Amazing battery life but the phone is really starting to show its age now and the processor is becoming noticeably slow. I tried a Galaxy S6, Nexus 6, Moto X Pure Edition, and Nexus 5x all this year and ended up with the iPhone 6S. The quality of apps and fluidity of the OS is what wins me over year after year with the iPhone. Despite being very limited, iOS does a fantastic job of remaining stable and reliable. I just couldn't take TouchWiz and all the little UI quirks and little bits of lag and frame drops, the Nexus 6 was just too damn big, the Moto X Pure was also a little big too, the battery life was a bit too short, and I'm really missing a fingerprint scanner now, and the 5x while was solid overall, just felt a little too cheap and too large for a 5.2" phone.

Kind of knew this would happen to me, but I'm loving my 6S. Let us know if you stick with the iPhone or decide to go with that V10, and if anyone is interested, my Maxx is for sale in FS/FT for $130 shipped. :)
 
Tiberian said:
So, Melee, what ended up being the final disposition - did you keep the iPhone or...? :D
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I returned the iPhone a few days ago but mainly because it appeared to be defective. It worked fine at first but then my notifications stopped coming in and the phone would not ring or beep for calls and messages. The speaker worked fine if I played music but not for anything else, including games. I spoke with people at Verizon and Apple and couldn't find a solution so that was the final, deciding factor. I may end up going back to iPhone in the end, at least until the new Samsung devices come out in February or March, but I'm not sure yet.

I had one heck of a time at Best Buy returning it for an exchange. I spent literally 6-7 hours because they didn't process the return properly so it didn't reset my upgrade eligibility with Verizon. I ended up having to travel back and forth between BB stores for the majority of an entire day before I could get it worked out and actually get the LG V10. My first impressions aren't great so far but I am keeping an open mind and I'm going to give it a least a week as I did with the iPhone. The iPhone just felt a lot snappier and more responsive. The V10 should be superior in terms of hardware but I guess the software is to blame. The main complaint I have so far is the reliability and functionality of the fingerprint scanner in comparison to the iPhone's. I know that seems as if I'm nitpicking but it makes a world of difference. The placement of the scanner on the V10 is far more awkward than I had assumed it would be and forces you to pick up the phone to unlock it with the scanner. It also takes at least 2-3 attempts most of the time to unlock the phone in this way and is noticeably slower than the iPhone which always took 1 attempt and was instant. This is showcased most in apps which utilize the scanner for identity and permission. I was using at least 5+ apps that did this on a regular basis so it is a bit disappointing. I haven't completed proper testing but the battery life also seems much shorter in the V10. I messed around with apps, games, videos, music, etc. on the iPhone all day and still had at least 20%+ battery life when I plugged it in to charge before bed. With the V10, I tried the same yesterday and could actually see the battery draining rapidly. I didn't make it through half a day before I received a 20% battery life warning and had to plug it in to charge. The display on the V10 is (at least to me) noticeably superior to the iPhone. It is a bit larger and 2560x1440 resolution vs the 1920x1080 on the iPhone. In terms of audio, the earbuds were nice to have with the iPhone whereas the V10 doesn't include headphones but it's not a deal breaker for me as I've never been a huge fan of the earbuds. They hurt my ears physically if I wear them long at all and are impossible for me to keep in if I try to use them while running or working out. The speaker on the iPhone is certainly superior, though. It gets much louder and sounds fuller while the V10's is more thin and tinny sounding. On the other hand, the V10 has a built in "Hi-Fi" DAC which does sound great with headphones plugged in. (It only works with headphones and makes no difference with the speaker.) In regards to build quality, both seem great but the iPhone definitely felt more expensive. I believe this is mostly due to the back of the V10 which I am not a fan of. The V10 is an attractive phone (aside from the material on the back, which I mentioned already) and I love the "second screen" up top which displays notifications, time, date, and battery life even when the main screen is locked and turned off. Additionally, it allows you easy access to your most frequently used apps & contacts which is certainly nice. It also has a fantastic camera which takes beautiful pictures if you just point and click but it allows a ton of settings and customization if you appreciate having that much control. I've never messed with digital cameras much so I am more of a point and click connoisseur.

I apologize for the lengthy post. I just wanted to share my insights so far in hopes that it will help some of you guys as I've had one heck of a time finding reliable, helpful information. Purchasing a phone has been much more difficult than I assumed it would be. I hope that the LG V10 grows on me. It was $250+ cheaper than the iPhone and I've never been an Apple loyalist (only Apple product I own is an old iPod Nano) so I believe I'm as objective as I can possibly be. If I decide not to keep the V10, I will likely try either a Samsung Note 5 / S6 Edge+ so that I can decide for sure if it was iOS I preferred over Android or if I just didn't care for the V10. That would give me better closure to the matter and help me feel like I'm making a more educated decision than if I just concluded I didn't like Android phones because of one.


Xan433 said:
I ended up with the iPhone 6S. The quality of apps and fluidity of the OS is what wins me over year after year with the iPhone. Despite being very limited, iOS does a fantastic job of remaining stable and reliable. I just couldn't take TouchWiz and all the little UI quirks and little bits of lag and frame drops.

Kind of knew this would happen to me, but I'm loving my 6S. Let us know if you stick with the iPhone or decide to go with that V10.
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Did you happen to try the 6s Plus or only the 6s? I'm having such a tough time deciding to go with the "Phablet" sized phones or the smaller versions. I love having the larger screen for videos, apps, games, reading, and certainly for typing as it is far easier. However, when it comes to just using it as a phone, one handed use, or carrying in your pocket, they do become quite awkward and cumbersome at times. Both are great with their own pros and cons. I'm just not sure which way to go. lol

Your description is quite similar to the way I have felt so far. Between owning the iPhone & V10, messing around with my brother's Samsung, and the demoing I have done in stores of all the different models, iOS just felt significantly better overall. I can zoom through the interface, everything loads instantly, and it is all so snappy and responsive.

As I said, I am going to give the V10 a week and even if I don't like it, I will most likely snag a different Android phone before going back to iPhone just for peace of mind in knowing I tested everything sufficiently. I feel that will make my decisions for these types of purchases far easier in the future if I know exactly what I like and what I'm looking for.


Thanks so much for everyone's help (especially you Tiberian) and I hope I can help at least someone with my feedback as I try things out in hopes of making a final, satisfying decision for my own device.
 
Just looked at this thread a few hours ago and wondered if you'd be reporting in and, voila, there you are. ;) No worries about the length of the post - in today's world the whole tl;dr mentality infuriates me to no end so, type away man, type away.

Sorry to see you're not as satisfied as I figured you might be with the V10, and I'll be the first to admit that yes iPhones and iOS are smoother overall in regular operation because they're designed to be that way with the OS code and the hardware working together. Android still is a mish-mash of various hardware platforms of entirely too many configurations with an OS that tries it's best to give great performance even though the entire design from the gitgo of using virtual machines and Java foundations has always been the Achilles hell for that platform sadly.

Even when throwing incredibly powerful CPUs and GPUs out there for Android to make use of, it still suffers from the foundations it was built on years ago. Android really needs to be completely scrapped of the Java underpinnings along with the VM aspects and they need to start completely fresh but that won't happen at this point or anytime in the future either - ART (the Android Run-Time that replaced the old Dalvik run-time) improved things pretty well but even so it's still the same old thing in the long run).

Just for the record: I've seen iPhones - even the latest and greatest ones - lag from time to time so, they're not all that either. Most people can't, don't, or won't notice it but it's there and it does happen: you can find YouTube videos of such instances so it's pretty well documented. But when people get so acclimated to a particular device and how it works for them they sometimes don't notice the tiny issues when they happen which is fine, it's not a big deal overall.

The fingerprint scanner in the V10 is LG's first ever so I can understand why there are issues, they are planning on a firmware update that should address most of them sometime soon, maybe it'll help with your situation, maybe not (it may be released well after you return it, if you decide to do so). I have no use for such things personally and even if I had a V10 I wouldn't use that feature myself but yes I can see the appeal for many folks.

Hope things work out with the V10 for you but if not, at least you had some time with it and I hope you do find something that suits all your needs and wants, even if it is an iPhone. :D

Happy holidays to you and yours.
 
Did you happen to try the 6s Plus or only the 6s? I'm having such a tough time deciding to go with the "Phablet" sized phones or the smaller versions. I love having the larger screen for videos, apps, games, reading, and certainly for typing as it is far easier. However, when it comes to just using it as a phone, one handed use, or carrying in your pocket, they do become quite awkward and cumbersome at times. Both are great with their own pros and cons. I'm just not sure which way to go. lol

Your description is quite similar to the way I have felt so far. Between owning the iPhone & V10, messing around with my brother's Samsung, and the demoing I have done in stores of all the different models, iOS just felt significantly better overall. I can zoom through the interface, everything loads instantly, and it is all so snappy and responsive.

As I said, I am going to give the V10 a week and even if I don't like it, I will most likely snag a different Android phone before going back to iPhone just for peace of mind in knowing I tested everything sufficiently. I feel that will make my decisions for these types of purchases far easier in the future if I know exactly what I like and what I'm looking for.


Thanks so much for everyone's help (especially you Tiberian) and I hope I can help at least someone with my feedback as I try things out in hopes of making a final, satisfying decision for my own device.
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I've tried both and done exchanges myself a few times. I always end up going with the regular size.

The Plus is a amazing phone, and very fun to use, but once you're out and about, day to day, the size starts to become cumbersome for me. Battery life is amazing but for my usage the regular 6 has gotten me through the day. Between the 6 and 6S, and even the 5S, I've never once ran out of juice but the end of the day.

I also don't use the camera a lot, so OIS isn't needed for me. I've summed it up for people that decide between the 6S and 6S Plus:

If you just want a Phone and have a tablet or iPad, get the 6S... You can still consume media, but it's obviously going to be a huge advantage on the Plus. If you want a compact "phone" for calls and text, this is a good option.

If you're seeking an all in one device, media consumption, or in need of very long battery life or the best camera experience, get the Plus.

I guess that's how I see it.
 
If you're not interested in fiddling with your phone and only want to call, sms, play some games and surf the web then get the iPhone.
If you want a lot more customization get one of the better Android phones. V10 is a great phone, probably the best, but I remember using my old Note 3 and it was nothing short of amazing.
I went from Note 3 to Lumia 1520 and truly missed that pen. When it comes to Android my vote goes to Note 5/Edge+, depending if you want the pen or fancy screen.
I'm about to buy Lumia 950 XL. You might want to check it out. It's something in between iOS and Android, but with a lot prettier, snappier and modern OS than both, although with far less apps. But I'd make that compromise.
 
Nebell said:
If you're not interested in fiddling with your phone and only want to call, sms, play some games and surf the web then get the iPhone.
If you want a lot more customization get one of the better Android phones. V10 is a great phone, probably the best, but I remember using my old Note 3 and it was nothing short of amazing.
I went from Note 3 to Lumia 1520 and truly missed that pen. When it comes to Android my vote goes to Note 5/Edge+, depending if you want the pen or fancy screen.
I'm about to buy Lumia 950 XL. You might want to check it out. It's something in between iOS and Android, but with a lot prettier, snappier and modern OS than both, although with far less apps. But I'd make that compromise.
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If you don't mind, can you go a bit more in-depth on your comparison? The main thing I always see people valuing about Android over iOS is Customization. However, I've been through every screen and option on my V10 and I don't really see that many options. Sure, you can change the background, font, and maybe some colors but I haven't found anything that game changing in terms of customizing. I think it is a bit unfair to say iPhone is for people who don't want to do anything but basic phone functions as I haven't found anything I could do with the V10 that I couldn't with the iPhone and vice versa. Customizing would be the only exception but I'm not sure what more could be changed that would make a difference.

As for other phone options, I probably would have tried a Samsung device but the V10 was only $49 and all of the Samsung Note 5s and Edge+s were $299+, even more expensive than the iPhone which were $100 off at Best Buy where I got mine. I don't believe Verizon offers the Lumia 950 XL. The only other top choices aside from the ones mentioned already appear to be the Droid 2 Turbo and Nexus 6 (not 6P which I was interested to check out). I am hoping the Samsung Galaxy S7 and Note 6 lines will release in the next few months as they are supposed to as that would probably be my choice. I also hope the Nexus 6P is offered on Verizon soon as it looks quite nice as well.
 
Melee said:
If you don't mind, can you go a bit more in-depth on your comparison? The main thing I always see people valuing about Android over iOS is Customization. However, I've been through every screen and option on my V10 and I don't really see that many options. Sure, you can change the background, font, and maybe some colors but I haven't found anything that game changing in terms of customizing. I think it is a bit unfair to say iPhone is for people who don't want to do anything but basic phone functions as I haven't found anything I could do with the V10 that I couldn't with the iPhone and vice versa. Customizing would be the only exception but I'm not sure what more could be changed that would make a difference.

As for other phone options, I probably would have tried a Samsung device but the V10 was only $49 and all of the Samsung Note 5s and Edge+s were $299+, even more expensive than the iPhone which were $100 off at Best Buy where I got mine. I don't believe Verizon offers the Lumia 950 XL. The only other top choices aside from the ones mentioned already appear to be the Droid 2 Turbo and Nexus 6 (not 6P which I was interested to check out). I am hoping the Samsung Galaxy S7 and Note 6 lines will release in the next few months as they are supposed to as that would probably be my choice. I also hope the Nexus 6P is offered on Verizon soon as it looks quite nice as well.
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Customization is more than that. It usually means things like the home screens (widgets, icon layouts) and custom launchers like Action Launcher -- even Microsoft has its own Android launchers. There's also the matter of changing default apps.

With that in mind, you're right in that some Android fans seriously oversell the importance of customization. It's entirely possible to be a power user with an iPhone -- you just don't spend as much time getting your phone exactly so. Having widgets and special launchers can make life a little easier, but smartphones at their heart are about the apps and what they let you do.
 
Melee said:
If you don't mind, can you go a bit more in-depth on your comparison? The main thing I always see people valuing about Android over iOS is Customization. However, I've been through every screen and option on my V10 and I don't really see that many options. Sure, you can change the background, font, and maybe some colors but I haven't found anything that game changing in terms of customizing. I think it is a bit unfair to say iPhone is for people who don't want to do anything but basic phone functions as I haven't found anything I could do with the V10 that I couldn't with the iPhone and vice versa. Customizing would be the only exception but I'm not sure what more could be changed that would make a difference.
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The power and versatility of Android over iOS isn't obvious on the surface but through use. It's like comparing the Tesla S against a golf cart on paper. On the surface, they seem similar since they're both electric with steering wheel and pedals but one is powerful and versatile while the other is basic and limited. If really depends on what you want. Get the Note 5 if you're a power user and use it more like a PC, file/media server, for creativity with pen, etc. otherwise if you prefer basic get the iPhone. As far cost, unless you're broke I wouldn't worry too much about it if you pick a phone that's future proof as the cost is spread over two to three years vs something obsolete out of the box like the iPhone 6 and 6 Plus were with 1GB DRAM that you'll replace after one year or less. Not any different than buying a PC and going with the faster CPU, higher DRAM, faster storage, etc. for the same cost.
 
I'm not an Android fan. I'm currently using a Windows phone. I'm a big anti Apple person though. I don't like parasitic companies.
Anyway, iPhone is good for non-tech people who want gadgets that look "good" (objective, I find them ugly) and simply work. You won't have bugs with an iPhone, it's ecosystem is simply the best.
But not neccessarily the best.
Google doesn't have as much grip on its ecosystem. So Android simply offers more of everything, at a price. You can mess up your phone. You can make it buggy and slow, but you can change it in any way you like.
You want to make your screen look like iPhone? Sure. Windows? Sure, that works too. Anything else that doesn't look like any other OS? That's possible as well.
You can root it, install apps that can automatise your home. There are some really powerful apps that can do many things. But they are not for everyone.
All in all, you can make your Android phone truly personal. So no, I don't think Android fans are overselling the customization.
 
Nebell said:
I'm not an Android fan. I'm currently using a Windows phone. I'm a big anti Apple person though. I don't like parasitic companies.
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What about Apple is "parasitic," exactly? That's not to say that it isn't -- I'm just curious, because I don't think I've heard even the most rabid Anything But Apple type describe it that way.

As it stands, I don't like the notion of harbouring hatred for a specific company that isn't intentionally doing anything illegal or immoral. I may use an iPhone as my main phone, but I'm cool with Android and Windows gear as long as it works well and remains above-board.


All in all, you can make your Android phone truly personal. So no, I don't think Android fans are overselling the customization.
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The personalization is true, but I still think my point stands. Some Android fans make it sound as if iPhone users are straining under a yoke of oppression because they don't have control over every aspect of their home screen. No, they just aren't as fixated on customization as others are. They're more interested in what's inside Facebook or Twitter than how you get to it.

I'm reminded of how some hardcore PC gamers are convinced that all "real" PCs have fast GPUs and plenty of expansion, and can't imagine why anyone would ever buy an ultraportable or all-in-one. It's that tendency to confuse personal tastes with universal must-haves, to forget that the majority of people are not like them. Customization is certainly important to a subset of the smartphone community, but most people don't even know what a custom launcher is, let alone care enough to install one.
 
For many people it is Apple's arrogant attitude and business practices that piss them off. Apple and their proprietary this and that. They want to suck people into their walled garden and never let them leave. Anti-competitive. Hardly compatible with anything that isn't Apple. Overpriced. Sheep are the majority of their consumers and they know how to exploit them.
 
anon said:
For many people it is Apple's arrogant attitude and business practices that piss them off. Apple and their proprietary this and that. They want to suck people into their walled garden and never let them leave. Anti-competitive. Hardly compatible with anything that isn't Apple. Overpriced. Sheep are the majority of their consumers and they know how to exploit them.
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See, the thing is that Google and Microsoft do this too... it's just a question of which kind of walled garden you prefer, and what kind of sheep herd you're joining. Google wants you to stay within its services -- that's why it forces OEMs who want any Google services to include all of them, and to feature them in a certain order (this is why Russia found it guilty of antitrust abuses not long ago). Microsoft wants you to use its services and software, which is why it encourages using its in-house formats (Office, anyone?) and at one point illegally created a PC monopoly.

Besides, there's always an irony to decrying Apple users as sheep when you're embracing a majority platform like Android. It's trying to position yourself as the counterculture rebel when you're really the conformist, like saying that real indie music fans listen solely to the top 40 pop chart. Hate to break it to you, but most phone buyers (of any stripe) aren't thinking about customization, openness or sticking it to authority. They bought their phones because they were the best within a given budget, because they liked the hardware design or because it was what the carrier sales reps were pushing that day.
 
Aurelius said:
See, the thing is that Google and Microsoft do this too... it's just a question of which kind of walled garden you prefer, and what kind of sheep herd you're joining. Google wants you to stay within its services -- that's why it forces OEMs who want any Google services to include all of them, and to feature them in a certain order (this is why Russia found it guilty of antitrust abuses not long ago). Microsoft wants you to use its services and software, which is why it encourages using its in-house formats (Office, anyone?) and at one point illegally created a PC monopoly.

Besides, there's always an irony to decrying Apple users as sheep when you're embracing a majority platform like Android. It's trying to position yourself as the counterculture rebel when you're really the conformist, like saying that real indie music fans listen solely to the top 40 pop chart. Hate to break it to you, but most phone buyers (of any stripe) aren't thinking about customization, openness or sticking it to authority. They bought their phones because they were the best within a given budget, because they liked the hardware design or because it was what the carrier sales reps were pushing that day.
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I think it's also kind of naive to say that "Google and Microsoft do this too" and end it at that. This is basically equating single-offender of vehicular homicides to serial rapist homicides saying they are all murderers. Apple is by far the worst offender of the "walled garden." It's really silly to be blind to that fact. Reason why Apple hasn't been fined is Apple could argue that they do not own the majority of the market. But you are pretty much locked in to just the choices Apple gives you.

It's actually ironic that you point Android out when you're talking about conformity. It's like accusing democratic countries of being conformists, because most modern post-industrial countries are democratic. CONFORMISTS!
 
CHANG3D said:
I think it's also kind of naive to say that "Google and Microsoft do this too" and end it at that. This is basically equating single-offender of vehicular homicides to serial rapist homicides saying they are all murderers. Apple is by far the worst offender of the "walled garden." It's really silly to be blind to that fact. Reason why Apple hasn't been fined is Apple could argue that they do not own the majority of the market. But you are pretty much locked in to just the choices Apple gives you.

It's actually ironic that you point Android out when you're talking about conformity. It's like accusing democratic countries of being conformists, because most modern post-industrial countries are democratic. CONFORMISTS!
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Oh, I'm not denying that Apple is more aggressive about walling you in. I'm just irked when people act as if Google and Microsoft are bastions of freedom... they're not. They're still corporations out to make money, and they still try to hem you into their ecosystems.

And on the conformity bit: it's more about pitching yourself as somehow unique or special... by buying the same phone that everyone else does. If you really want to avoid herd mentality while embracing openness, you get a Jolla phone -- a Galaxy S6 is about as mainstream as McDonald's. There's a certain amount of individuality you get on Android that you don't on iOS, but it's relative.
 
Google and Microsoft are hardly as bad as Apple. What is Apples only Android application? "Move your Android contacts to iOS". There's plenty of Google apps on iOS.
Microsoft does have Office, but it's available for both Android and iOS.


And Apple phones are butt ugly with those huge bezels.
 
Nebell said:
Google and Microsoft are hardly as bad as Apple. What is Apples only Android application? "Move your Android contacts to iOS". There's plenty of Google apps on iOS.
Microsoft does have Office, but it's available for both Android and iOS.


And Apple phones are butt ugly with those huge bezels.
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Ah, you haven't been keeping up with current events, have you? Ever heard of Apple Music? Apple even made sure that it was a quality app with an Android-native interface, not just a quick and dirty port.

Google and Microsoft are on multiple platforms because that's how their business models work, not because they're doing it out of kindness. At their heart, they're selling services and have to go wherever the users are. It's at this point that I'd remind you that Google purposefully avoids supporting Windows phones to hurt Microsoft's search business, and Microsoft is running a patent licensing scheme to punish Android OEMs that don't sell Windows phones.

That's the thing that bugs me: that people try to set up companies as saints or sinners, but it usually falls apart the moment you actually look at their practices. Google's altruism in mobile usually stops at the point where it's worried that it won't make money.
 
Compared to Apple, Microsoft is a saint! (Especially when you see what Bill Gates is doing with his charity!) Google might not be a saint like Microsoft, but still Google is far more consumers friendly than Apple. Without Google, Apple will probably try to sell its their new 1080p AppleTV at over $200. Google is keeping Apple honest.

Thank you for bringing Microsoft's android licensing scheme. Microsoft at least tries to keep things out of court, and I also would argue that their patents have way more validity than Apple's ridiculous abuse of the patent system like swiping, on screen buttons, and rectangular shape design patents.

Sure, Apple is not all evil and no innovation. Apple really did design a good smartphone with a good SoC chip. Apple supported open source for a long time such as with webkit. Apple supports green power. And Apple makes others innovate.

But when you try to say that because Microsoft and Google have their own shareholders interests to worry about and that they do have some evil dealings, and then justify Apple to not being as evil as they actually are, it's pretty asinine. Microsoft and Google's combined "evilness" compared to Apple's is like a couple of molehills to an extinction level asteroid. To even bring them up to say Apple isn't all that evil is ludicrous.

That said, Apple's evilness compared to Comcast or Monsanto is like an asteroid to a frigging blackhole. (And Samsung is more evil than Google and Microsoft combined but still way less than Apple.) And some evils are necessary...
 
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