New Rig for an Old Gamer - Recommendations Please?

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MacDubhgal

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May 16, 2006
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I won't waste your time posting anything that looks like a configured setup yet. Way too much reading to do, but here's the deal. I'm looking to put together a new Gaming/Graphics PC for myself. My old one is a PIII 733 upgraded to within an inch of its' life at 1Ghz w/ 512 Mb RAM installed. Stop laughing... !! I'll keep that as a file server and build new from scratch.

SO that outta the way... From having read what I have over the last days, I am thinking in the direction of AMD X2 7600 or 7800 with twin video cards. been a while since I built my own system and I have a LOT of reading to do, but since you all are so helpful I hoped I might get some recommendations. I'll tell you right now I have NO experience with AMD. Old Intel boy from way back, but the specs sound too good to ignore. Does an AMD 2.4 Ghz processor really do everything an Intel 3+ Ghz processor can do? That just seems so bizarre to me... Also looking for recommendations on Case and PSU. Function is more important than form. Want to keep things cool and long-lasting, though I'm certainly not against a "cool looking" box for the new hardware.

Primary uses are Games (currently started playing World of Warcraft, have City of Heroes, Sid Meyer's Pirates, and a few others on the shelf waiting). I also use Poser. A LOT. Anyone know it? It's 3D rendering/Animation software, and it is as leaky a piece of code as has ever been written. LOVES eating up the memory and resources. Yes I will be doing some music editing/copying and manipulating as well as the same for video/DVD. I'll also be doing 3D Model rigging on this machine (3DS MAX, Lightwave, Hexagon, Rhino.. that sort of thing).

A few concerns I have are expandabilty and multitasking. Not so much real time multitasking, but the ability to switch to a broad variety of functions. Looking at the top end Asus boards, iIam concerned by the apparent lack of enough slots. 3 PCIe slots and little else to put a card into? Am I missing a bunch of stuff somehow?

I have always liked the Creative Soundblaster line. Have an Audigy Silver I'm pretty happy with, and a decent 5.1 set of speakers. Also have a legal sized scanner that runs off of a SCSI card. Another slot consideration is that sadly, I'll need a Modem as well as a Nic as I live in a weird backwater of NJ that has one-way broadband, with an outgoing modem line and an incoming Cable line. So, in addition to dual video (which hopefully speeds render times for Poser and eases resources for scene manipulation as well as making my games look spiff) I'd like to put together a setup that's AMD x2 based, expandable, and has room for my SCSI Scanner controller, a Modem, and a decent sound card at Minimum.

Looking at External Hard drive for backup solution? Rather run RAID0 and have speed than RAID1 and have redundancy, though I'm open to arguments for all sides. Budget is probably in the 2,000-3,000 range. I'd prefer to keep it down, but I am willing to lay out a few bucks to make a system that kicks some serious butt in the graphics dept. Tired of turning down game features so that Morrowind doesn't crawl along at 12 fps. And Oblivion is just out there, calling to me... I'm sure there's be a flood of salient questions I haven't addressed in this first post, so go ahead and ask 'em. Any help you all can offer, I More than appreciate! Thanks in advance...
 
humm this will be a complete rebuild. Few words of advice snice this will last you a long time, don't skimp on the thing we usally don't upgrade very offten.

Monitor
Speakers
Computer Chair
Case
Power supply

Here is what I recomend as a core System:

Motherboard: Intel Bad Axe Rev 304. Its Conroe ready, and is a solid board Intel 975 chipset, Also Crossfire ready as well
Processor: 631 cedar Mill, 805 as temp cpu till conroe comes.
Memory: 2GB kit of 667 DDR2 memory
Video card: X1900XT/7900GTX
HDs: single raptor 150GB + 500GB SATA 2 for storage
Monitor: 20inch Widescreen Monitor, Dell, Benq, I would read up before you buy
Speakers: Promedia 2.1's for cheap if you can find them. I prefer 2.1 for gamming or headphones

I update my post latter with more recomendations
 
Well that'll give me some reading to start with. Any educational links are more than appreciated too! I should also mention that I'm not really comfortable with OC, though happy to learn, and this rig will be in a shared office near the bedroom, so I want to keep it as quiet as possible.

Also, looking at the Manchester vs. the other core that I can't remember the name of right now on the 7000 line of Video cards (Toledo??), my impression is that Manchester is better as it doesn't disable half the onboard cache. So am I better off going with a slightly older Manchester based card like the 7600 GT? or going for the upgraded capabilities of a newer 7800 or 7900 even though there doesn't seem to be a Manchester variation available for the 7900? And is there enough of a performance boost to justify the 100+$ difference between 7800 and 7900? I'm ok with a few fps missing if it's going to save me a ton of money. Also wiling to spend extra if it's going to mean the difference in turning AA or AF or whatever off or down if I go with a clotted-edge card (as opposed to bleeding edge...)
 
Also, looking at the Manchester vs. the other core that I can't remember the name of right now on the 7000 line of Video cards (Toledo??), my impression is that Manchester is better as it doesn't disable half the onboard cache. So am I better off going with a slightly older Manchester based card like the 7600 GT? or going for the upgraded capabilities of a newer 7800 or 7900 even though there doesn't seem to be a Manchester variation available for the 7900?
Click to expand...

? I thought the core names Manchester and Toledo referred to the CPU. The Toledo X2s are better than the Manchester because the L2 Cache is 2 x 1MB, as apposed to 2 x 512MB that the Manchesters have. AMD Dual core opterons are great processors, but since you are not overclocking you should get an X2, 3800+ for a cheaper solution, 4400+ if you are willin go spend more. Don't waste your $ on an FX-60 because the new Intel Core Duo 2 (Conroe) chips will be a lot faster. (The 2.4GHz, which will cost around $300-400 once the hype dies, will have similar/better performance than the FX-60, which costs over $1K now)

With that being said, you can go with what Vengance_01 suggested and get a motherboard that is Conroe-ready and use that processor until Core Duo 2 CPUs come out (expected in July). The motherboard supports DDR2, which the current AMD Socket 939s do not. When you upgrade, basically all you have to do is replace the processor. You can still build a good AMD system now that will last you a good 2-3 years, but why not build something that is easy to upgrade since next gen processors are coming out very soon.

As far as the video card is concerned, you should get the 7900GT/GTX (or X1800XT / X1900XT if you choose to go the ATi route). It will last you longer and you will be able to play the games you want at max resolutions. Even tho the 7600GT is a relatively new card, it is based for a lower budget/mid-range PC and will not last you as long. Although you are paying more now, you won't have to upgrade anytime soon.


For the Power Supply, you will need atleast 500W, and make sure its something quality because the wattage doesn't mean jack if you have a crappy PSU. Enermax Liberties, OCZ Powerstreams, Fortron Epsilons seem to be the popular right now..also check out Seasonic and PC Power & Cooling.

For the monitor the Viewsonic VX2025WM is a good gaming 20" LCD for around $300-400, and the NEC 20WMGX2 is the best overall 20" widescreen LCD..but comes with a $700+ pricetag. There seems to be some color banding issues with the Dell 2007WFP and I wouldn't recommend it until the problems are solved, but I have the 2005FPW and it works well (not the best for gaming but good enough for me) You don't have to get a 20" WS LCD but they are hot right now.

Get whatever case you want, but Lian Li, Antec and Silverstone make quality cases. You don't need a $300 case, but try not to get a real cheap case..afterall, its a house for all your PC components!

Edit: Don't forget about an OS. Vista will not be out for atleast a few months I believe, and you don't exactly have to upgrade to it right away..XP should work fine for a while.
 
Grap3S0da said:
? I thought the core names Manchester and Toledo referred to the CPU.
Click to expand...

Clearly I have been reading too much too quickly. You're, of course, absolutely right. i was tired when I wrote that and must have mashed things together in my head. I'll write a more cogent response shortly. But to tide over till then, Thanks for some informative and thoughful replies! I obviously have more reading to do!!
 
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