Non-Grainy 4k Monitor

E

elitebox

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I currently have a Samsung 28" SA850 Monitor. Text and graphics are very smooth, just like on my MacBook Air. The display surface is between glossy and matte. More importantly, there is no graininess or sparkles when you are up close to the monitor.

I recently purchased a Samsung UD970 4K monitor, thinking it would display texts and images just as smoothly as my SA850. However, it was awful. When you are up close, there are sparkles and graininess all over the display, despite whatever resolution is selected. I attribute this to the AR coating.

I then purchased a Dell UP3214Q 4K monitor. While the graininess and sparkles weren't as bad as on the Samsung UD970, the Dell monitor was not nearly as clear as my SA850 or my MacBook Air. Once again, I attribute the sparkles and graininess to the AR coating.

Is there any 4K monitor on the market that displays texts and images smoothly like the Samsung SA850 or MacBook Air and that has a non-glossy display?

Many thanks,
Chris
 
lG 31MU97 probably could be defined as semi glossy. Most things designed for "professionals" like the Eizo EV3237 and Samsung UD970 is probably going to have a very strong AG coating since its designed for people sitting under pretty intense lighting.

You could try the Acer B326HK its I heard it has less coating than the UD970.
 
I've read posts on Amazon that users are returning the LG 31MU97 because it too has a grainy coat. I've read that the BenQ BL3201PH will not. Thoughts?
 
dragonageinquisition said:
lG 31MU97 probably could be defined as semi glossy. Most things designed for "professionals" like the Eizo EV3237 and Samsung UD970 is probably going to have a very strong AG coating since its designed for people sitting under pretty intense lighting.

You could try the Acer B326HK its I heard it has less coating than the UD970.
Click to expand...

The entire Flexscan series barring the EV2436W uses a semi-glossy coating. The Samsung uses our joyous friend PWM which would take it our the running for a professional monitor.

elitebox said:
Many thanks. What about the Prolite B2888HSU-B1?
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I'm 100% sure that's just a rebrand of the 28" 4k TN panel multiple companies have put out already.
 
So, to be clear, the Eizo EV3237FX is not grainy, shimmery, or sparkly when viewing it up close?
 
elitebox said:
So, to be clear, the Eizo EV3237FX is not grainy, shimmery, or sparkly when viewing it up close?
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We have no way of knowing; I'd assume it uses the same panel as UD970, but said monitor never received an in depth review from a trusted review site. I don't really want to knock the 4k fanatics; however, their definition of 'grainy' seems to be a lot different from the general consensus (it's a huge struggle just to get them to check for basic things like PWM). Not to mention, it would be extremely odd for Samsung to choose a grainy matte coating for their PLS panel when all of their monitors in the past few years have used semi-glossy coatings; they're not exactly stupid when it comes to image clarity.

Basically, unless a review site comes forward with a microscopic pic of the subpixels or mentions that it uses a semi-glossy coating in passing I believe nothing.
 
elitebox said:
Any thoughts on the BenQ BL3201PH?
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I don't believe anyone has received a BL3201PH yet. It most likely uses the same panel as the newly released Acer B326HK. SashaX made a post about his Acer B326HK's AG coating here; he describes it as very soft, and he's coming from a BL3200PT which uses a semi-glossy coating, so I imagine he'd have an idea.
 
AUO (AHVA), LG (IPS) , Samsung (PLS) and Sharp's (IGZO 4K) lightest coatings are very similar. AUO and LG's coatings are marginally lighter than Samsung's, but I think people will soon realize that 4K and matte coatings do not jive.
 
Would you say that 4K and semi-gloss or gloss coating do jive? If so, what about Acer B326HK's AG coating? (I'm trying to avoid having to buy all these monitors, test them myself, and return them if they don't meet my needs.)
 
elitebox said:
Would you say that 4K and semi-gloss or gloss coating do jive?
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Technically the semi-glossy coatings are matte. Only TV's and 2x passive 3D monitors (Asus VG23 & 27AH) use true semi-glossy coatings (left VG23AH vs. semi-glossy/grain-free matte F2380). To avoid confusion some of us refer to the very light/grain free matte coated monitors as semi-glossy to ensure people know the monitors use light coatings. The 4K monitors use grain free matte or 'semi-glossy coatings,' but they are not actually semi-glossy and their coatings are too strong for 4K monitors from what I've read.
 
BL3201 is also grainy, it does bother me, the monitor looks like there is some dirt all over the screen.
Philips BDM4065UC is not so grainy.

There is not much choice then buying a display and removing the coating yourself. :/
 
elitebox said:
I recently purchased a Samsung UD970 4K monitor, thinking it would display texts and images just as smoothly as my SA850. However, it was awful. When you are up close, there are sparkles and graininess all over the display, despite whatever resolution is selected. I attribute this to the AR coating.
Click to expand...

How close is 'up close'? I have one of these and sit about 24" away and cannot see any sparkles or graininess.
 
There is a huge difference between the UD970 and BL3201 when sitting 15" away under medium incandescent light conditions. I am curious how much better the BDM4065UC is.
 
Don't quote me on this, but I was under the impression that the Philips 40" 4K is pretty much the only truly glossy 4K monitor out there since it uses a similar anti-reflective gloss coating found in many TV's. There was a link to the Nordic HW review in the philips topic, you can see how it does suffer from reflections, but shouldn't have the grainy matte look. The rest seem to use the 3H anti-glare matte coating. Doesn't bother me, but of course glossy will give you a more vibrant look.
 
Are the reflections comparable to the Apple Cinema Display where you can see your reflection?
 
Thanks! I am also very interested to know if the BDM4065UC suffers from the reflection problem that plagues the Apple Cinema Display.
 
elitebox said:
Are the reflections comparable to the Apple Cinema Display where you can see your reflection?
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I think it might be slightly less reflective, and possibly less sharp too since the semi-gloss is more aggressive than the Apple's glass panels. Still, as long as it is classified as glossy, there will be reflections. I don't have the Philips but my LG tv has a similar semi-gloss coating that does annoy me at times with darker content, reflecting my red couch easily.
 
NCX said:
Technically the semi-glossy coatings are matte. Only TV's and 2x passive 3D monitors (Asus VG23 & 27AH) use true semi-glossy coatings (left VG23AH vs. semi-glossy/grain-free matte F2380). To avoid confusion some of us refer to the very light/grain free matte coated monitors as semi-glossy to ensure people know the monitors use light coatings. The 4K monitors use grain free matte or 'semi-glossy coatings,' but they are not actually semi-glossy and their coatings are too strong for 4K monitors from what I've read.
Click to expand...

elitebox said:
So, the Philips is classified as "glossy" rather than "semi-glossy"?
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See NCX's post above. The Philips is actual semi-gloss, or what we've come to consider glossy at this point.

TFTCentral's review of it discusses this.
 
elitebox said:
So, the Philips is classified as "glossy" rather than "semi-glossy"?
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Well semi-glossy is just a variant of glossy. Most glossy panels claim some sort of anti-reflective coating. But I suppose you can separate them to a sharp glossy panels like the S27A950D and the slightly heavier semi-gloss coating that's usually found on some tv's. There's a distinct separation between a light matte coating and even the heaviest anti-reflective closs coatings.

Here's a glossy Samsung with a light matte MX299Q on the side.
S23A750D_glossy.jpg


The Philips has a heavier AR-coating than the Samsung monitors but it will still reflect things much more than a light matte.
Philips_glare.jpg
 
So the bottom picture is the BDM4065UC? That seems too reflective to me. I wonder what type of panel the MacBook Air has. It doesn't reflect too much and it's not grainy.
 
General Lee said:
Well semi-glossy is just a variant of glossy. Most glossy panels claim some sort of anti-reflective coating. But I suppose you can separate them to a sharp glossy panels like the S27A950D and the slightly heavier semi-gloss coating that's usually found on some tv's. There's a distinct separation between a light matte coating and even the heaviest anti-reflective closs coatings.

Here's a glossy Samsung with a light matte MX299Q on the side.
http://i.hardware.fi/storage/pictures/news/S23A750D_glossy.jpg

The Philips has a heavier AR-coating than the Samsung monitors but it will still reflect things much more than a light matte.
http://i.hardware.fi/storage/pictures/450/Philips_glare.jpg
Click to expand...

I would definitely call either of those glossy upon seeing them. I get what you mean though about the coating on the Philips being like a TV.

elitebox said:
So the bottom picture is the BDM4065UC? That seems too reflective to me. I wonder what type of panel the MacBook Air has. It doesn't reflect too much and it's not grainy.
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I think it looks the same as my Macbook Air and 19" Sony SDM-HS95P... it's just so big that it's more obvious. It looks the same as an LG TV.

Using a glossy (or two) right next to a matte, I can say the problem is that it's a trade off. Glossy definitely has better clarity, but you're going to see yourself and reflections in a dark scene in a game or movie.

I think this kind of returns to the perpetual discussion or logic of there's no single, perfect display for every task.
 
The macbooks have glossy screens. The benefit of a laptop is you can adjust the viewing angle to reduce reflections. Also it won't look as bad on a bright screen.
 
The Philips has no grain from what I can see.
I tried to take 2 pictures to show the difference but it does not work so well.

Philips:


Benq:


But the difference is similar to this, not so badly tho:

Xt2jmFE.gif


:p
 
Last edited:
Nikyo said:
a BL3200PT which uses a semi-glossy coating
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If the BL3200PT is considered to have a semi-glossy coating, then I'm officially confused about which coating is which. I have a BL3200PT, and the coating is definitely grainy. Nothing like it is on TVs that use semi-glossy coatings. Their whites are pure. The BL3200PT isn't.
 
Well guys, I discovered today that all BenQ BL3201PH monitors have an inherent flaw -- there's a ghosting effect that occurs when they wake from sleep if connected via DisplayPort or Mini DisplayPort. BenQ technical support confirmed this today via telephone and e-mail. See example:

dzOGMGy.png


New topic: I'm wondering whether a 40" 4k monitor (e.g., BDM4065UC) negates the benefits of scaling considering the monitor is so large. What I do on my Mac is use the scaling feature so that text and the OS X GUI appear crisper than what would appear at a native resolution. Hence, it appears as though I have a "retina" display. Would upgrading to a 40" monitor negate this effect?
 
elitebox said:
New topic: I'm wondering whether a 40" 4k monitor (e.g., BDM4065UC) negates the benefits of scaling considering the monitor is so large. What I do on my Mac is use the scaling feature so that text and the OS X GUI appear crisper than what would appear at a native resolution. Hence, it appears as though I have a "retina" display. Would upgrading to a 40" monitor negate this effect?
Click to expand...

I think it would be like having 1080p on 40" inch display, text will not be so crisp. But maybe I am wrong.
 
Would you say that the Philips 4065UC is less glossy and less reflective than the iPad Air?
 
elitebox said:
Can't really see much of a difference in that pic. Would it be fair to say that the Philips is not as reflective as an iPad Air because it doesn't have a glass display?
Click to expand...

Try cranking the brightness on your display. I can see a clear difference on multiple panel types (TN, IPS, PLS). Not sure about the iPad air, but my Asus transformer tablet with regular glass is extremely reflective by comparison. You should not buy the Philips on principle alone anyway since it uses 240hz PWM and PWM free competitors should be out soon. Go to the the store and look at some Sony TV's.
 
PWM flicker is only noticeable if you're really sensitive to it, or go looking for it. People tend to overplay its significance here, like most other minor problems that come up in some specific circumstances.
 
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