Nvidia GTX 660 Ti Detailed

Maplehamwich said:
Comparing overclocks at this time is pre-mature (as there is no record of any), but so is jumping ship on the 660Ti after one review, where it posts an average of 84% of 7970 performance across 5 games, at a rumoured almost half the price.
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AMD will definitely be dropping prices when the 660ti comes out, so price comparisons now are also premature. If the true performance of the 600ti is around what this review shows (and the price really is $250), I'd bet the 7950 will at least drop down to $249 MSRP...it basically has to or there's no reason for anyone to ever buy one. The 7970 would probably jump down to where 7950 prices are right now too. However, I have my doubts about the 660ti being released at $250 anyway. I'd guess it will release at $300.
 
blade52x said:
There are new rumors that the 660Ti is going to be a 2gb 256-bit part with 1152 cuda cores. And the vanilla 660 is going a 1.5gb 192-bit part, also with 1152 cuda cores.

It'd be funny if TT ending up reviewing an ES that was nmakes it to final production.
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That memory configuration makes a lot more sense, at least.
 
AMD will definitely be dropping prices when the 660ti comes out, so price comparisons now are also premature. If the true performance of the 600ti is around what this review shows (and the price really is $250), I'd bet the 7950 will at least drop down to $249 MSRP...it basically has to or there's no reason for anyone to ever buy one. The 7970 would probably jump down to where 7950 prices are right now too. However, I have my doubts about the 660ti being released at $250 anyway. I'd guess it will release at $300.
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Amd doesn't need to drop prices on the 7950. Look at what they come with, most of them come with 3 games, and have rebates. Also they overclock very well, and is only a tad slower than a 7970. In other words even if NV launches the 660ti at 250$, There would still be no need to drop the prices further.

Granted we are likely to see gtx 660-250$, and a gtx660ti-300$ i dunno. Lets wait to see some better reviews first before passing judgement.
 
blade52x said:
There are new rumors that the 660Ti is going to be a 2gb 256-bit part with 1152 cuda cores. And the vanilla 660 is going a 1.5gb 192-bit part, also with 1152 cuda cores.

It'd be funny if TT ending up reviewing an ES that was nmakes it to final production.
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Haha oh man, that would burn if so. I could believe that rumor.
popcorn.gif
 
if 660 ti is 2 GB 256bit, then what is going to make it slower than the 670?

has to be something that makes it slower and draw less power. Otherwise no one will be buying the 670.
 
DASHlT said:
Speak for yourself AA/AF are a must for any game period no matter the resolution.

I cant play a game like consoles with jaggy lines everywhere
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It was designed to reduce jags at low resolutions.

JayJapanB said:
Are you running a <20" monitor?
Depending on the game and aa method aa is good but probably doesn't need to be set as high as people do.
I run a 27" at 1080p and anything above 4x is pretty pointless though I always like a bit of aa. Even FXAA if it is well implemented.
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Yes. 24inch. If the game gives me an absurd amount of FPS like source games for example. I might turn on 2x. But don't really see any difference.
 
Swingman said:
if 660 ti is 2 GB 256bit, then what is going to make it slower than the 670?

has to be something that makes it slower and draw less power. Otherwise no one will be buying the 670.
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Originally the speculation was that it would have another SMX disabled (7/8 for the 670, 8/8 for the 680).
 
Dion said:
It was designed to reduce jags at low resolutions.



Yes. 24inch. If the game gives me an absurd amount of FPS like source games for example. I might turn on 2x. But don't really see any difference.
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So your saying people who see jagged lines at 1080p are lieing?
 
Jaggies @ 800x600 are a pita!
but at 1080p they're tolerable. I'd say i'd rather see aliasing compared to aa flickering or fxaa blurring.
 
Swingman said:
if 660 ti is 2 GB 256bit, then what is going to make it slower than the 670?

has to be something that makes it slower and draw less power. Otherwise no one will be buying the 670.
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simple less cuda cores. just like the gtx 680 compared to the 670.
 
I don't see jaggies either, at least in games that are actually fun. :shrug:
 
Dion said:
It was designed to reduce jags at low resolutions.
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The first anti-aliasing method available, FSAA, was introduced at a time when display pixel density was higher than is commonly seen on displays available today. It was designed to overcome sampling limitations which manifested as visual artifacts due to insufficient display pixel densities. Display resolution plays only a part in that.
 
If you buy a card for high resolutions, this most likely isn't the price bracket for most.

If you buy these cards with no intention of pushing AA, well thats your goal but I'm sure you can save money and get something with less power.
 
xorbe said:
I don't see jaggies either, at least in games that are actually fun. :shrug:
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Me too, It doesn't exactly bother me, the few jaggies I actually notice while I'm having fun playing a game.

Anyways, this cards LOOKS TO BE a solid 1080p card, with AA and all turned on. I'm not understanding the whole "meh, it's crap. Look at the drop with AA" since it's not that far from the drop you see with a 670. I'm just not seeing why it "sucks" because of an expected lost of performance when you turn on a demanding feature. :rolleyes:
 
CrimandEvil said:
Me too, It doesn't exactly bother me, the few jaggies I actually notice while I'm having fun playing a game.

Anyways, this cards LOOKS TO BE a solid 1080p card, with AA and all turned on. I'm not understanding the whole "meh, it's crap. Look at the drop with AA" since it's not that far from the drop you see with a 670. I'm just not seeing why it "sucks" because of an expected lost of performance when you turn on a demanding feature. :rolleyes:
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lol, a next gen $300 card that chokes when you turn on AA and that is okay? I swear people will happy with almost any piece crap that comes out this generation. we are getting ripped off by getting relatively small gains over last gen for the same price points. Nvidia cant even put a decent cooler on the 660 or 670 and cuts as many corners as they can even though they are already selling us what would have been a mid range card at high end price points.
 
cannondale06 said:
lol, a next gen $300 card that chokes when you turn on AA and that is okay? I swear people will happy with almost any piece crap that comes out this generation. we are getting ripped off by getting relatively small gains over last gen for the same price points. Nvidia cant even put a decent cooler on the 660 or 670 and cuts as many corners as they can even though they are already selling us what would have been a mid range card at high end price points.
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Show me the MSRP of $300. :rolleyes:

For all we know it could come out at $199 or $299. :rolleyes:
 
cannondale06 said:
that is all you can come up with? if you think the gtx660ti will be $199 then you have lost your mind.
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Where did I say that? All I said was that you have no idea either what the MSRP is but you talk like you do. Hell, it's been mentioned that they're doing a vanilla 660 as well. Care to speculate, I mean, tell us all how much it sucks and how it's going to be priced at $300 as well? Cause, you know, you seem to have all the answers concerning unreleased hardware. :rolleyes:
 
CrimandEvil said:
Where did I say that? All I said was that you have no idea either what the MSRP is but you talk like you do. Hell, it's been mentioned that they're doing a vanilla 660 as well. Care to speculate, I mean, tell us all how much it sucks and how it's going to be priced at $300 as well? Cause, you know, you seem to have all the answers. :rolleyes:
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and you have no answers at all. $300 has been the price that nearly everyone is speculating so that is the price I mentioned. and what the hell does the vanilla 660 have to do with the 660ti that we are talking about? oh I can roll my eyes too :rolleyes:
 
The fact that people keep comparing AMD's HD 7950 to the GTX 660 Ti is making the unreleased product look very good. No matter where the performance ends up being on the 660 skus, if what is considered to be a midrange part can compete with AMD's high end parts, this is a win for Nvidia. The best thing about this entire situation is that we'll see the prices drop on the HD68XX series of cards if the GTX 660 Ti delivers good performance. Things will get very interesting once the legit reviews start to pop up.
 
cannondale06 said:
lol, a next gen $300 card that chokes when you turn on AA and that is okay? I swear people will happy with almost any piece crap that comes out this generation. we are getting ripped off by getting relatively small gains over last gen for the same price points. Nvidia cant even put a decent cooler on the 660 or 670 and cuts as many corners as they can even though they are already selling us what would have been a mid range card at high end price points.
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I'm looking at the review again, and I don't see how you can say it is choking. It's about 10-15% slower than the 670 without AA, and in most games it is about 10-15% slower with AA as well (at 2560).

In Just Cause 2, the 670 is 71 without AA and 52 w/AA. The 660 Ti is 65 without AA and 43 w/AA. So it goes from 6 to 9 behind.

In Far Cry 2, the 670 is 143 w/o and 82 with. The 660 Ti is 124 w/o and 63 with. So that's 19 behind and 19 behind.

In Metro 2033, the 670 is 55/46 and the 660 Ti is 38/30, so it is 17 behind w/o and 16 behind with.

I don't see that as choking. It's slower than the 670, but that kind of fits in the obvious category, no?
 
Forceman said:
I don't see that as choking. It's slower than the 670, but that kind of fits in the obvious category, no?
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This is what's confusing about cannondale's "point." You're disappointed that it scales the way it's suppose to? Disappointed that it somehow doesn't perform better then a 670? What? :rolleyes:

I'm just glad that what we're seeing with this unreleased product scales better then the previous generations crappy mid-range cards.
 
Forceman said:
I'm looking at the review again, and I don't see how you can say it is choking. It's about 10-15% slower than the 670 without AA, and in most games it is about 10-15% slower with AA as well (at 2560).

In Just Cause 2, the 670 is 71 without AA and 52 w/AA. The 660 Ti is 65 without AA and 43 w/AA. So it goes from 6 to 9 behind.

In Far Cry 2, the 670 is 143 w/o and 82 with. The 660 Ti is 124 w/o and 63 with. So that's 19 behind and 19 behind.

In Metro 2033, the 670 is 55/46 and the 660 Ti is 38/30, so it is 17 behind w/o and 16 behind with.

I don't see that as choking. It's slower than the 670, but that kind of fits in the obvious category, no?
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you need to go off percentages not framerates. its an additional 6-7% slower than the 670 when AA is used. thats not too bad though but to be honest the 670 is not exactly stellar with AA either.
 
.... What? You'd rather look at a percentage instead of a real number that actually has a real value? WTF? How does that make any sense? How does that tell you really how a card performs? I'd rather see actual real numbers like FPS since that's what really matters.
 
CrimandEvil said:
.... What? You'd rather look at a percentage instead of a real number that actually has a real value? WTF? How does that make any sense? How does that tell you really how a card performs? I'd rather see actual real numbers like FPS since that's what really matters.
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okay genius, I will give you a simple explanation. if you go from 60 to 40 that is 20 and if you go from 40 to 20 that is also 20. it would be silly to say they both drop by 20 because the point would be that going from 40 to 20 would be 50% drop as opposed to the 33% drop of going from 60 to 40. so to find out how much more the 660ti suffers with AA then you will look at the percentage difference between framerates.
 
cannondale06 said:
OMG!!!!!111!!! IT SUXORS CAUSE IT'S A 50 PERSENT DROP!!!!!
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Going from 60 to 40 fps is hardly the same. Saying it's a 50% drop without a context means nothing and is nothing but a lazy way to convey that information. If we're only looking at the percentages like you want then it wouldn't be that hard to make a 7750 look or even beat a 690 GTX. That's why the FPS is important, you can hide so much behind a percentage. Anyone that remembers NV's PR during the 5000 FX series knows this :rolleyes:
 
CrimandEvil said:
Going from 60 to 40 fps is hardly the same. Saying it's a 50% drop without a context means nothing and is nothing but a lazy way to convey that information. If we're only looking at the percentages like you want then it wouldn't be that hard to make a 7750 look or even beat a 690 GTX. That's why the FPS is important, you can hide so much behind a percentage. Anyone that remembers NV's PR during the 5000 FX series knows this :rolleyes:
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what are you on about now? the FACT is to see how much more the 660 suffers then you have to look at how much more the difference is in percentage. the framerate numbers mean nothing without calculating the percentage difference. so its 10-15%(according to Forceman) slower than the 670 without AA and an additional 6-7% slower than the 670 with AA.
 
DarkLegacy said:
The fact that people keep comparing AMD's HD 7950 to the GTX 660 Ti is making the unreleased product look very good. No matter where the performance ends up being on the 660 skus, if what is considered to be a midrange part can compete with AMD's high end parts, this is a win for Nvidia. The best thing about this entire situation is that we'll see the prices drop on the HD68XX series of cards if the GTX 660 Ti delivers good performance. Things will get very interesting once the legit reviews start to pop up.
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I dont understand why nobody mentions that, since the 7970 is pretty close to as fast as 680, then by default the 660 Ti makes the rest Nvidias lineup, eg the 670 and 680, look stupid and overpriced as well.

It annoys me, it smacks of reviewer bias, and pretty much all sites did the same for GTX 670 reviews. It's as if they're trying to paint AMD in a bad light, but yet cards dont just compete against cards from the other vendor. 670 made GTX 680 look just as stupid and overpriced as it did 7970 at the time, yet nobody pointed that out. But yet I have seen plenty of reviews criticize AMD cards that dont fit a good price performance slot within AMD's own lineup, so I know they understand the concept, yet they choose to ignore intra-lineup issues when it comes to Nvidia.

And btw, it's not a "mid range part" since it uses the same GK104 chip that goes in 680 and 670. It's not like it's a true "mid range" chip, like say Pitcairn is.

But yeah, personally I'm hoping this causes another round of price cuts on the AMD side, which already has some great deals. I just wonder if it's enough to push 7850 down much if at all, or even 7870.

And I'm also wondering if there is supposed to be two SKU's, 660 Ti and 660, released the 16th or just one?

If there is something like a vanilla 660 at 249, then that very well could push 7850 price down (what I'm interested in one price is right)
 
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Shark974 said:
But yeah, personally I'm hoping this causes another round of price cuts on the AMD side, which already has some great deals. I just wonder if it's enough to push 7850 down much if at all, or even 7870....
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That'll happen when Nvidia continues the trend and releases another GK104 card with only, like, 3 SMs or something. ;)
 
Shark974 said:
I dont understand why nobody mentions that, since the 7970 is pretty close to as fast as 680, then by default the 660 Ti makes the rest Nvidias lineup, eg the 670 and 680, look stupid and overpriced as well.

It annoys me, it smacks of reviewer bias, and pretty much all sites did the same for GTX 670 reviews. It's as if they're trying to paint AMD in a bad light, but yet cards dont just compete against cards from the other vendor. 670 made GTX 680 look just as stupid and overpriced as it did 7970 at the time, yet nobody pointed that out. But yet I have seen plenty of reviews criticize AMD cards that dont fit a good price performance slot within AMD's own lineup, so I know they understand the concept, yet they choose to ignore intra-lineup issues when it comes to Nvidia.

And btw, it's not a "mid range part" since it uses the same GK104 chip that goes in 680 and 670. It's not like it's a true "mid range" chip, like say Pitcairn is.

But yeah, personally I'm hoping this causes another round of price cuts on the AMD side, which already has some great deals. I just wonder if it's enough to push 7850 down much if at all, or even 7870.

And I'm also wondering if there is supposed to be two SKU's, 660 Ti and 660, released the 16th or just one?

If there is something like a vanilla 660 at 249, then that very well could push 7850 price down (what I'm interested in one price is right)
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I'll wait till a reviewer worth their salt shows me performance numbers. As already pointed out these guys used their old numbers for 7970 using old drivers, I doubt I'll click another link to TweakTown.
 
I find it astonishing that so many so called "enthusiasts" didn't notice that this joke of a review only showed a handful of AA/AF enabled benches as an afterthought until on page 7 of the thread. Thanks for pointing out the obvious Bahanime.

This tweaktown review is a shambles due to the mix of old and new drivers and poor game choice. The AMD 7870/7950/7970 are showing benches from older AMD release drivers. The GTX 680 is also showing benches from the release drivers. You can go ahead and add another ~ 5-10% performance onto the 7850/7870/7950/7970 and GTX 680 benches.

On top of this the card is getting matched by a HD 7850 using older drivers on many of the "more modern" titles. If anyone believes that winning a few benches using Far Cry 2, Lost Planet 2 and Just Cause 2 are a worthy indication of performance then they are in dire need of a dose of reality.

A card that by most accounts will retail for $300, comes out 5 months after the HD 7870, which now retails for $259.99 with Rebate for MSI Twin Fozr OC variety. Why are people getting excited about this card?

I may be wrong, but I'm seeing a card released 5 months later than the 7870 OC, with less performance using AA/AF and priced higher, what's not to like. :rolleyes:
 
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They need to come out with 4k monitors then every single card won't be enough to run anything at 60fps.
 
Those are all valid criticisms, but don't discount the fact that it is a pre-release review so you kind of have to lower your expectations a little. It's still better than some faked up "my sources tell me" crap on some message board, or misleading marketing slides like we often get before new hardware releases.

And the AA/AF benchmarks at the end is the way Tweaktown always does it, so it's not like they are doing it different this time around.

ICDP said:
I find it astonishing that so many so called "enthusiasts" didn't notice that this joke of a review only showed a handful of AA/AF enabled benches as an afterthought until on page 7 of the thread. Thanks for pointing out the obvious Bahanime.

This tweaktown review is a shambles due to the mix of old and new drivers and poor game choice. The AMD 7870/7950/7970 are showing benches from older AMD release drivers. The GTX 680 is also showing benches from the release drivers. You can go ahead and add another ~ 5-10% performance onto the 7850/7870/7950/7970 and GTX 680 benches.

On top of this the card is getting matched by a HD 7850 using older drivers on many of the "more modern" titles. If anyone believes that winning a few benches using Far Cry 2, Lost Planet 2 and Just Cause 2 are a worthy indication of performance then they are in dire need of a dose of reality.

A card that by most accounts will retail for $300, comes out 5 months after the HD 7870, which now retails for $259.99 with Rebate for MSI Twin Fozr OC variety. Why are people getting excited about this card?

I may be wrong, but I'm seeing a card released 5 months later than the 7870 OC, with less performance using AA/AF and priced higher, what's not to like. :rolleyes:
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I don't think this thread has enough sarcasm and holier than thou opinions. I will now add to the douche level of this thread.

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I haven't read this whole thread, but getting a general vibe in the last pages, just want to re-assure everyone I intend to push AA. I think people want to know if this will be a capable card at 1080p with high levels of AA. If so, it'll be a winner, if not, it won't. We will see. Also, absolute latest drivers as always, and latest patches on all games.
 
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