Oracle vs. Google Day 3

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It is the end of day #3 in the Oracle vs. Google case. Normally we aren't big on following lawsuits but this case is actually far more interesting than I thought it was going to be.

Google acknowledges using Java to develop Android and Page today confirmed that Google didn’t take a Java license. Google says its use was fair and legal and Google engineers wrote original code for Android. Google rejected a proposal by Sun in 2006 that the search engine company pay $100 million for a three-year technology partnership to build Android jointly, Google’s lawyers said in the case last year.
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hell I wouldn't pay $1 Billion then buy a licence for said Java. Better watch it, Google will develop there own java virtual machine...haha
 
Oracle is a huge wart on the face of software. They buy up open source products and run around making them crappy and trolling.
 
Java is dead to me. Google should just build a VM for Python and be done with it. This is what Microsoft did with C# and the .NET CLR and it was with good reason.
 
Terminus said:
Java is dead to me. Google should just build a VM for Python and be done with it. This is what Microsoft did with C# and the .NET CLR and it was with good reason.
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Care to elaborate on how Java is dead? Apps are still written for it everyday and I know people that are learning the language to ultimately learn programming.
 
Java is anything but dead. I see it as in its prime right now. 10 years ago if you told me you could write a 3D game like Minecraft in Java and have it run at a playable framerate I'd have laughed my ass off.

You still need Javascript to pull off some of the more advanced browser stuffs. HTML5 & CSS3, despite all its advancing features, is not a replacement for the likes of JQuery.

If anything, the mobile device surge we've had over the last 5 years or so has made Java more popular than ever. Moreso than C#, Python, Objective C, etc. It's aggregated such a rich collection of libraries over the years that most developers not looking to reinvent the wheel start with some premade Java library. It's just too enticing.

Us geeks like to root for our favorite programming languages. I'd personally like to see Eiffel bust onto the scene. It's already permeated the .NET scene, so why not? Reality is that it's going to sit in its quiet little corner like it always has.
 
InternationalHat said:
Oracle is a huge wart on the face of software. They buy up open source products and run around making them crappy and trolling.
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+1
Oracle is behind the times imo, and much of the software they release at this point has been out-done by other software developers.
Guess they don't like the competition and are now realizing the error of their ways.
 
Red Falcon said:
+1
Oracle is behind the times imo, and much of the software they release at this point has been out-done by other software developers.
Guess they don't like the competition and are now realizing the error of their ways.
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Someone once said, either on this forum or another one, that Oracle is no longer a software company, just a bunch of fleabag lawyers. I've never heard any better way of putting it, so the phrase comes to mind every time I hear about Oracle...they're nothing short of embarrassing.

They presumably acquired Sun solely to sue Google over Java...because they'd rather make money by patent trolling over bought-up patents than by actually developing something and selling it. Meanwhile, they threw up a middle finger at some of Sun's best open source assets like OpenSolaris and OpenOffice.org.

I don't even like Google, but I hope they come out unscathed from this and leave Oracle to their long, slow death. You never know with patents though...I wouldn't be surprised if they end up cutting a deal to give Oracle royalties if things don't seem to be going their way.
 
Mini-Me said:
Someone once said, either on this forum or another one, that Oracle is no longer a software company, just a bunch of fleabag lawyers. I've never heard any better way of putting it, so the phrase comes to mind every time I hear about Oracle...they're nothing short of embarrassing.

They presumably acquired Sun solely to sue Google over Java...because they'd rather make money by patent trolling over bought-up patents than by actually developing something and selling it. Meanwhile, they threw up a middle finger at some of Sun's best open source assets like OpenSolaris and OpenOffice.org.
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That makes way too much sense though.
 
Terminus said:
Java is dead to me. Google should just build a VM for Python and be done with it. This is what Microsoft did with C# and the .NET CLR and it was with good reason.
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Why would you build a VM for python? There's no point for an interpreted language to have a VM, it's already cross-platform. Python wouldn't be a good choice for Android anyway, too slow and CPython lacks real threading support thanks to the GIL. Go would be a better choice.

trav04 said:
hell I wouldn't pay $1 Billion then buy a licence for said Java. Better watch it, Google will develop there own java virtual machine...haha
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Google developed their own JVM already - that's what Oracle is suing over ;)
 
kllrnohj said:
Google developed their own JVM already - that's what Oracle is suing over ;)
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Not exactly that. To be sincere, I think even Oracle doesn't know what they are suing Google anymore, they keep changing the accusation as the lawsuit goes on.

It began as patent infringement and the patents got tossed out by USPTO; then it was all about code copying, reaching an astoundingly number of 9 lines of code over 15 million, code used by it's original author when working for Sun. Seems like the definition of de minimis infringement to me. Now it's all about "copying" the API names, method names and parameters. Don't they know API names, method names and parameters are not copyrightable? It's functional, to use the API you need to know this specification. It's like the door maker owning your house cause you followed his specification for size, width and position of the hinges. Absolutely insane in the real world, how can it be accepted in the software world?

Google built Dalvik, very similar to Java, but it's not a Java Virtual Machine.

What you do is write something in Java, compile it with Java compiler and then run DX to convert the generated bytecode to dalvik bytecode.

And they did it by using API specifications and some Apache Harmony code, not Sun/Oracle code.

I predict a hard time to Oracle. If they win, everyone will be suspicious of Java, Oracle itself will be in trouble infringing SQL, C and whatever they used to base Java and Oracle Database. If they lose, they will have a hard time explaining why they paid MORE than SUN was valued at the time of purchase.

Flavio
 
The documents Oracle are providing to the court demonstrate that Google was aware of their need to gain licensing from Oracle so it's going to be difficult for Google to prevail in this case.
 
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