Paypal gift vs purchased item

A

allen5055

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 25, 2012
Messages
1,553
When buying things here I know one way to avoid paypal fees is to claim it's a gift. However, doesn't this also mean you have no buyer protection?
 
As a seller,asking for PayPal gift is against the TOS of PayPal and also against our rules here...

(23) Charging fees for PayPal is not allowed, nor is requesting a "gift" payment for goods (which gives the buyer no protection). Both violate PayPal's TOS.
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but to answer your question, yes, you pretty much give up all your rights to charge backs and any protection that otherwise might be available with bank transfer or credit card payments
 
really? 3 measely dollars on the $100?

1. it's against the Paypal ToS to do so

2. yes, you give up all protections, on both sides

3. stop being cheap and do it right
 
Well, I don't like it personally, but I was talking to someone on this forum that has impeccable heatware feedback, and he wanted me to pay him via paypal gift.
 
I would much rather just stick to Amazon payments. I don't want to buy $500 worth of goods and have no legal recourse if I get in trouble.

However, his Heatware is like 540 positive ratings.
 
allen5055 said:
Well, I don't like it personally, but I was talking to someone on this forum that has impeccable heatware feedback, and he wanted me to pay him via paypal gift.
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Well, its entirely up to you.....if you feel comfortable doing it, have at it...but just know that going into it if it goes bad, your pretty much screwed
 
allen5055 said:
Well, I don't like it personally, but I was talking to someone on this forum that has impeccable heatware feedback, and he wanted me to pay him via paypal gift.
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don't do it. it's not worth it. it's 3 damn dollars on every $100.....if he was so worried about the fee and had an item that he wanted to clear $25 on for instance, he should just ask for $28 for the item and then the "cost of doing business" is absorbed like any other transaction online. That way he isn't asking you to pay the fee, and is not penalizing you for Paypal's policies. This way you also retain the protection. If you send as a "gift" you may as well send a money order or cash.

if it's $500 worth of stuff, that's like $15 in fees....big whoopie....if he is really enough of a tightwad for that to matter, offer him $515 to accept payment with all protections in place. if they won't take that it would throw up an immediate red flag. why would the seller want to actively avoid the protections, especially if they are at no cost to them?
 
Hm, this guy has been on this forum for like 10 years. However, I'll just try to convince him to do Amazon.
 
allen5055 said:
I would much rather just stick to Amazon payments. I don't want to buy $500 worth of goods and have no legal recourse if I get in trouble.

However, his Heatware is like 540 positive ratings.
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Have you verified that its actually his heat?
Not just on this deal, but this should be done on every deal..
also get a phone number, get a real name, and get a full address, and confirm them all.....
 
allen5055 said:
Hm, this guy has been on this forum for like 10 years. However, I'll just try to convince him to do Amazon.
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you aren't listening

pay the guy whatever it costs extra to do it the right way and get your protection

paypal is much better for the buyer if you do it right
 
Crosshairs said:
Have you verified that its actually his heat?
Not just on this deal, but this should be done on every deal..
also get a phone number, get a real name, and get a full address, and confirm them all.....
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Well, his username is the same as his heatname so I'm pretty sure it's him.
 
allen5055 said:
Wait, don't Amazon payment have buyer protection?
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better read the fine print but i am sure it does. im just not that familiar with it

but here's what i do know

if you use paypal correctly so all the protection policies are in place, and you aren't satisfied with the results, you as the buyer will be covered
 
My limit is $60 for gifting... anything over I'll make my offer and add 3% to it. Just bought a 2600k and they asked for a GIFTING.. hell no on $300 bucks.


EDIT: Why does AP ask for SSN now? They didn't when I signed up.
 
To be honest, I do the gift thing at certain times......I have been using paypal for years, paid a lot of fees, keep money in there that they earn interest on, ship thru them, which I am sure earns them a cut, etc...in other words, they have made money off me, and continue to do so, which is only fair.

With that being said, if I am dealing with a trader I have traded with many times in the past, we usually save each other money and do the gift thing......the trust has already been established.

Also, I'll offer it as a option to some buyers, since I can give them a better price, or give them upgraded shipping at no extra cost to myself.

I have no problem with paypal making what they can, and since they are the leader in online payment, they seem to be doing fine. Its just that the fee's can seem excessive at times, and when two parties who have already established trust are doing business, then why not gift? I'd pay the person cash if you was close enough, and he could still ship later.

I have done that a few times at hardware swaps, were people sent me money later as a gift. Same principal.
 
HardOnForMe said:
My limit is $60 for gifting... anything over I'll make my offer and add 3% to it. Just bought a 2600k and they asked for a GIFTING.. hell no on $300 bucks.


EDIT: Why does AP ask for SSN now? They didn't when I signed up.
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Its so they can send your transaction totals to the IRS if you exceed 200 transactions and accept payments of over $20,000 in a year. New law passed by everyone's buddies in Congress that started for the 2011 tax year.
 
DPOSCORP said:
To be honest, I do the gift thing at certain times......I have been using paypal for years, paid a lot of fees, keep money in there that they earn interest on, ship thru them, which I am sure earns them a cut, etc...in other words, they have made money off me, and continue to do so, which is only fair.

With that being said, if I am dealing with a trader I have traded with many times in the past, we usually save each other money and do the gift thing......the trust has already been established.

Also, I'll offer it as a option to some buyers, since I can give them a better price, or give them upgraded shipping at no extra cost to myself.

I have no problem with paypal making what they can, and since they are the leader in online payment, they seem to be doing fine. Its just that the fee's can seem excessive at times, and when two parties who have already established trust are doing business, then why not gift? I'd pay the person cash if you was close enough, and he could still ship later.

I have done that a few times at hardware swaps, were people sent me money later as a gift. Same principal.
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I agree 100%
 
nobody_here said:
don't do it. it's not worth it. it's 3 damn dollars on every $100.....if he was so worried about the fee and had an item that he wanted to clear $25 on for instance, he should just ask for $28 for the item and then the "cost of doing business" is absorbed like any other transaction online. That way he isn't asking you to pay the fee, and is not penalizing you for Paypal's policies. This way you also retain the protection. If you send as a "gift" you may as well send a money order or cash.

if it's $500 worth of stuff, that's like $15 in fees....big whoopie....if he is really enough of a tightwad for that to matter, offer him $515 to accept payment with all protections in place. if they won't take that it would throw up an immediate red flag. why would the seller want to actively avoid the protections, especially if they are at no cost to them?
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I agree that including the pp fee in the asking price is the best way to go. Hey, a buyer could always offer less or offer an alternative payment that doesn't include fees.

I believe it's illegal to charge you extra to use a credit card for a purchase, but it's not illegal for a merchant to offer you a discount for using cash/check instead.

I bought an instrument offered on another forum and the seller wanted me to do a gift payment but I wasn't comfortable with that, so I offered to cover the seller fee for my own protection.
 
How do you know if it's a gift payment? I sold my touch pro 2 the other day for $60 and I have $60 in my PayPal account.
 
Zepher said:
How do you know if it's a gift payment? I sold my touch pro 2 the other day for $60 and I have $60 in my PayPal account.
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A gift payment will come through with no shipping address..
 
I don't remember which payment option I used in PayPal, but whichever alternate method it was, it asked me if I wanted to pay the fees or have the recipient pay the fees.

PP should have this option on their standard money transactions. I would be willing in many instances to cover the transaction fees and retain protection for both buyer and seller.
 
Zepher said:
How do you know if it's a gift payment? I sold my touch pro 2 the other day for $60 and I have $60 in my PayPal account.
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Then you just got gifted. Paypal takes about a 3% fee for every transaction that isn't a gift payment.

As for the TS's question, I agree with what others have already said. Don't ever gift a payment meant for purchase, especially on high dollar items. High heat or not, it's best to be safe than sorry.
 
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If the seller quickly responds to questions when I ask etc, I'll usually add the 3% on top of what he asks so he feels better about it. So I'll send $103 instead of the asking $100, that way he ends up getting $100 still.

I just feel it to be much more secure than sending as a gift. I do send gift payments from time to time but they're for small things like a cheap hard drive or whatnot

*edit* also, the seller asking the buyer to cover 3% is also against rules (pretty sure), but there should be no problem just doing it when he doesn't even ask
 
I think the Mods are going to delete this post because it is a bad influence, but I have to be the lone dissenter. You guys are all correct when you say it's better to send a regular payment, or use Amazon Payments. But at the same time be realistic about it. If, for example, you trade with someone who has firmly established a good reputation, and you are buying an item that's relatively inexpensive, you have a 90%+ chance of not having any issues. The person is not going to throw away a clean record for a small item. And if you really want to see if the person is genuine, ask for his phone number and send him a string of numbers, then have him send you the same string via [H]. My point is that it really depends on the individual you are dealing with, and the vast majority of people here have good intentions. On the other hand, it's better to be safe than sorry, so use common sense at all times if you take this advice.
 
XacTactX said:
I think the Mods are going to delete this post because it is a bad influence, but I have to be the lone dissenter. You guys are all correct when you say it's better to send a regular payment, or use Amazon Payments. But at the same time be realistic about it. If, for example, you trade with someone who has firmly established a good reputation, and you are buying an item that's relatively inexpensive, you have a 90%+ chance of not having any issues. The person is not going to throw away a clean record for a small item. And if you really want to see if the person is genuine, ask for his phone number and send him a string of numbers, then have him send you the same string via [H]. My point is that it really depends on the individual you are dealing with, and the vast majority of people here have good intentions. On the other hand, it's better to be safe than sorry, so use common sense at all times if you take this advice.
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At the same time, its very easy to say my Heat is under your heat name. There have also been people who have had accounts hi jacked and used for nefarious things on the forums. Just have to use your best judgement. I've gifted before, but only to people I've already dealt with who have been long upstanding members.
 
Well in forums I've been to like FM, things are sold as $price + 3% pp fee. Sometimes if you try hard enough they'll waive the fee for you but there's no such rule that you can't charge the buyer the 3% in terms of forum selling. It's pretty good if you're the seller. And if you're the buyer it's like you're just paying protection for your purchase.
 
jacqg said:
Sometimes if you try hard enough they'll waive the fee for you but there's no such rule that you can't charge the buyer the 3% in terms of forum selling.
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There most certainly is a rule....Its right in the TOS of PayPal...

Paypal user agreement section 4.5:
4.5 No Surcharges. You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as a payment method. You may charge a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge and is not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal transactions.
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Just price the item with a built in fee if you don't want to eat the cost or violate their TOS.

It's all semantics, just don't advertise that they have to pay extra.
 
BlueAqua said:
Just price the item with a built in fee if you don't want to eat the cost or violate their TOS.

It's all semantics, just don't advertise that they have to pay extra.
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Right, you just can't say the fee is to cover paypal fees. You could charge a 3% "handling fee" which is common for all online businesses. Or you could just add it into your sale price and never mention it at all. I don't know why other forum boards go out of their way to itemize a 3% fee.
 
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