Receiver question

S

Spanks

Weaksauce
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
94
I just started looking into new audio setup for my computer and I found these while searching craigslist. Since I'm not very knowledgeable yet, are either of these worth the $200 they are asking? Or is there something in that price range that would work better? I plan on going 2.1 for now.

Yamaha RX-V661
Marantz SR4500

Thanks in advance
 
Out of those two I’d go for the Marantz, it seems like a very good price. :)


If you do get it just be careful it is five years old and is a budget model so try not to push it too hard. I had an older Sherwood avr blow up on me half way through Gladiator and it was roughly the same age. ;) :)


My audio room:

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:)
 
Upgrade that monitor :p Otherwise I like the setup.

Well if its a 5yr old budget receiver, would I be better off getting a newer budget receiver? Something along the lines of a Onkyo TX-SR308?
 
I think the Marantz would sound a lot better, but you’d probably be best looking for a newer model second hand, like a nr1501. Or something similar that’s 2-3 years old. :)
 
I've also been looking at the Onkyo TX-SR308 or the YAMAHA RX-V367. Is there something else in that price range I should consider?
 
Well I'm going to recommend Denon, as I always do. I really like the features on their receivers. They are made by the same people as Marantz (D&M Holdings, which is what the D and M mean). More or less Marantz is their "boutique" brand sold to audiophile types and Denon is their "professional" brand, sold to installers. I find Denon gets you more for the money.

If you can swing it, get a Denon receiver with Audyssey MultEQ. It is 100% worth the cost of admission in my opinion.
 
Sycraft said:
Well I'm going to recommend Denon, as I always do. I really like the features on their receivers. They are made by the same people as Marantz (D&M Holdings, which is what the D and M mean). More or less Marantz is their "boutique" brand sold to audiophile types and Denon is their "professional" brand, sold to installers. I find Denon gets you more for the money.

If you can swing it, get a Denon receiver with Audyssey MultEQ. It is 100% worth the cost of admission in my opinion.
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Will the Audyssey MultEQ make a difference since I'm planning on a 2.1 system for now? I Thought that was for more of a 5.1/7.1 setup?
 
It is just a general purpose room correction system. Works with as many channels as you have. Basically what it does is send some sweeps out of your speakers, measure the response, and then try to generate a FIR filter to compensate. Net effect is it flattens out the frequency response, helps clear up some phase issues and so on.

It isn't magic, it can't make a bad system great, but it can improve on a good system, and can do so without a lot of room treatment. While a fully treated room is always the very best idea, let's be real here about how often that is feasible.

I'm just very pleased with the improvement it made in my system. In particular, one of the eigenmodes of my room is around 30Hz meaning I'm always going to have problems there. Ok well getting material to treat a room at that low a frequency is almost impossible. However, MultEQ did a good job helping. It's not perfect, but there isn't this massive audible dip around 30Hz like there used to be.

It also does setup for levels and delays and the like, which I recommend you make sure to get a receiver that can do no matter what (MultiEQ isn't the only thing that does it, pretty much any receiver with a mic will, MultEQ just does it as part of its functions). It is a really nice thing to have all that balanced, and a huge pain in the ass to do it by hand. There can be more variation than you'd think too. For example my front speakers are all the same distance away from me, and I don't have any of them set to different volumes or anything none the less the levels are set to +0.5dB, -6.5dB, and +1.0dB for the left, center and right respectively. Probably because the center is up higher, it ends up being a lot louder and need to be turned down. Even the left and right aren't perfectly balanced, and I took a lot of time to set them up equidistant.

So it is just the kind of thing that makes your system better, in my experience. I was real pleased with the improvement. It is also quite easy, if time consuming. You set the mic up, let it take a measurement (takes maybe 10 minutes with 6 speakers). Move it to the next position (you want to take measurements around your seating area) and take a measurement. When it's done, let it crunch the numbers and there you go.

It's good stuff, good enough that IMAX theaters are using it now.

So personally, I will never get another receiver without it. I use a AVR-3808CI for my computer and I'm going to replace my HTR-5860 in the living room with an AVR-1911 or AVR-1611 soon.

Do note that Denon isn't the only one who uses it. Marantz (of course) NAD, Onkyo, Integra, and Creston all use it too. I just like Denon's offerings the best.
 
Good stuff, I didn't know it worked like that. I was looking at the AVR1610, its a little out of my budget but if its worth the extra $$ then I'll get it. I know its subjective but will the sound quality be noticeably better with this receiver over the cheaper ones I looked at earlier?
 
I'd say yes, because of MultEQ. In terms of amps or DACs and the like, there doesn't tend to be a massive difference. Audiophile types will carry on about it but when you get down to testing it turns out that most equipment does a good job, at least on any normal priced speakers. Both Yamaha and Marantz are high quality, so you'll be happy with the sound overall. Personally though, I think the room equalization is well worth it.

Rooms just really screw up sound, in particular bass frequencies. You can have some nice speakers that are maybe +-2dB deviation from flat, put them in a room and get a +-10dB or worse actual frequency response. You can also get smearing from reflections and so on. Ok well ideally you deal with this by treating a room. You put in bass trapping, you make sure the walls are not parallel (parallel walls are a big problem), you put absorption and diffusion material on the walls, etc. That's the "right" way to do it.

Well, we all know how likely it is that you want to do that in your house, never mind that you've got the money to spend on it (room treatment is a couple grand easy). So, a good room equalization system is a good second best. It can really help deal with the problems a room introduces.

Prior to MultEQ, I'd never found one I was happy with. Yamaha's YPAO is ok, but all in all I found that it didn't do much. I have a Yamaha receiver in the living room and it matches the rear speakers to the fronts a bit better, but it isn't great. I also tried a Behringer DEQ2496 and found it made the sound harsh and unnatural, didn't like it at all. MultEQ XT though improved the sound noticeably, I'm extremely happy with it.

So I think it is worth it, so long as you are willing to spend time setting it up. You have to calibrate it right or the results aren't likely to be good. That means putting the mic on a tripod at ear level and taking multiple readings around the area you sit.

Something to note if you are looking at Denon stuff is that you can often get it cheaper than the dealers list. Denon enforces MRSP with their authorized dealers, but you can call and get a better price. I bought mine from 6th Ave and when I called them got it for significantly under what it was listed at. Also if you don't mind used gear Dakmart is an authorized seller of refurbished Denon gear.

So I don't think you'd be unhappy with the Yamaha or the Marantz, however if it were my money I'd get a Denon. If you do decide to get one of the others, I'd go for the Yamaha. Reason is it had HDMI inputs. You don't need that now, but you might decide you want it later.
 
Thanks for all the help, I'll be checking prices for a Denon receiver. The only issue I see is the depth. I have a 15" shelf I was planning on putting it on. Guess I'll have to come up with a new spot for it. :p

Now onto speakers...
 
What's your budget on speakers? They can get very expensive (of course) and are worth spending some coin on since they are generally have the most sonic problems.

Also something to think about is do you value good bass more, or better mids/highs? Reason is that if you are spending a lower amount of money, you may have to choose between a better sub or better bookshelfs.

Always have to start with a budget though. There's just so much out there in the world of speakers.
 
If you're looking at Denon receivers, set up some deal alerts at places like slickdeals. Their current models are going to go on clearance for the new models soon. The Denon 3310 was being sold for $650 a week ago (to make way for the 3311).

Budget yourself so you spend ~75% of your budget on speakers and the rest on a receiver. You'll hear the difference between good speakers more easily rather than a more expensive receiver. And you're more likely to keep speakers and just upgrade receivers as new features come out.
 
Budget wise I think I'll end up spending slightly more then 25% of my budget on my receiver. I would also really like to get a sub and I know there are a few around $100 that would suffice. As for speakers I would like to stay right around $200. I know its not much but it will be worlds better then my Logitech system.
 
Well, I'm a huge SVS fan personally. I own their MTS speakers and one of their PC+ subs. So for speakers I'd say go get some SBS-02s. They've got them on sale for $200.

For a sub, you aren't getting an SVS one for that price (they are rather expensive on subs, worth the price though). I haven't really looked at anything down in that price range so I can't give a good recommendation. Someone else will have to help you there.
 
I'll be hitting up some B&M stores this weekend to see if I can find a good deal on a Denon receiver. As for the speakers the SVS SB-02's aren't available till late July. Any other brands I should look at in that price range? I've seen Energy speakers getting good reviews, and decent reviews on Polk speakers. Or are the SB-02's worth waiting till late July for?
 
Spanks said:
I'll be hitting up some B&M stores this weekend to see if I can find a good deal on a Denon receiver. As for the speakers the SVS SB-02's aren't available till late July. Any other brands I should look at in that price range? I've seen Energy speakers getting good reviews, and decent reviews on Polk speakers. Or are the SB-02's worth waiting till late July for?
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IMHO Yes. If you cant wait the Polk Monitor series on newegg (older version of the TSI series carried at Best Buy) is a very good price to performance purchase, but I would wait for SVS. Energy's are also good but I hate paying close to MSRP which is what you will find at the B&M stores. In the meantime personally I would suggest purchasing a Denon 1910 reciever from E-cost (under 300) who are a manufacture approved refurb location (which means you do get a warranty of some sort), and a good sub (also suggest SVS there).

Best Buy's prices (including open box) on the Denon's were nowhere near what they were at Electronic's Expo (and E-cost is even lower). I dont know what your price limit is but they have some massive deals on Denon's there (and are running a fathers day sale as well). Google for the coupon code (should be dad and then a set of numbers).
 
I've got an SVS 2.1 + Marantz receiver setup for my PC and enthusiastically recommend both brands. I'd wait for the SBS-02 if you can. Have you checked www.accessories4less.com for Marantz or Onkyo refurbs? I bought my Marantz SR8001 from them last September. They've got great deals in all price ranges.
 
Spanks said:
I'll be hitting up some B&M stores this weekend to see if I can find a good deal on a Denon receiver. As for the speakers the SVS SB-02's aren't available till late July. Any other brands I should look at in that price range? I've seen Energy speakers getting good reviews, and decent reviews on Polk speakers. Or are the SB-02's worth waiting till late July for?
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I would, but like I said I'm an SVS fanboy. I don't have direct experience with their S line of speakers, but I can relate to you my experience with their M line of speakers:

So I own some B&W 604 Series 3 speakers. They have been supplanted by new models but they were about $1500 or so speakers (I got them used for like a grand). High quality audiophile type speakers. However, I am an audio head and I had money and wanted something better. What I was after was speakers that can provide a truly seamless sound field, where you don't hear speakers, you just hear a wall of sound. The B&W 700 series could do that, I liked those a lot but hadn't been able to afford them. I was looking at them, but it was really stretching the budget, like $3000 for a pair.

Well I had an SVS sub and loved it, so I started looking at their speakers. Their tweeters (critical to a good sound field) really were, no shit, $200+ units. They didn't hide what they were, you could buy them online yourself from places like Madisound. I e-mailed them and started asking questions. When the questions got too technical for the customer service people they handed me off to an engineer. I decided to give them a try. They were $1200 so just a little more than I'd paid for my B&Ws, and actually less than the retail. Far less than the 700 series. I was a little apprehensive since, while SVS has a return policy, you are out shipping costs if you return and shipping is a lot on towers.

However when I got them hooked up, all doubts went away. They are WAY better than my 604s (which I still have for my living room). They are even slightly better than the 700 series. Just positively amazing speakers given the price. $1200 speakers that best $3000-4000 (or more) speakers. I was thrilled.

My experience with SVS has just been that they give you extremely good quality at extremely good prices. As such, they are who I buy when it comes to speakers these days. The only thing they don't have it budget subs. That is not to say their subs aren't a good value, they are extremely awesome, they have bass output that some companies say you just can't get, but they don't have any real cheap ones.

So were it my money, I'd wait for the SVS speakers. That isn't to say there aren't other good speakers out there, just what choice I'd personally make.
 
One day when I am rich and famous I'll have nice speakers like that :D

I'm really kinda settling on the Denon AVR-1610 vs the AVR-1910. Saves me some money so I can get the SB-02's.

So Package wise I'm looking at:

Denon AVR-1610 - $215
SVS SB-02's - $200
Dayton SUB-100 - $135

Total: $550 + Shipping and cables.

Tad bit over budget as these things always end up being. But I think its respectable. Any additional thoughts?
 
I think that's a good choice for a setup. Should give you good sound and you can expand upon it as you like.

One good thing about a modular system is you can replace single components or retask things as needed. So maybe you decide you want to move to 5.1 some day, you get some small satellites. You then decide you need a better sub so you swap the dayton out for something else. You decide you want better front speakers so you get STS speakers and move the SBS to the back. You decide you need more power and new features so you replace the receiver, and so on.

You can upgrade components as you feel it is useful/necessary and keep the rest. It all depends on your needs, your taste and your budget.
 
Spanks said:
One day when I am rich and famous I'll have nice speakers like that :D

I'm really kinda settling on the Denon AVR-1610 vs the AVR-1910. Saves me some money so I can get the SB-02's.

So Package wise I'm looking at:

Denon AVR-1610 - $215
SVS SB-02's - $200
Dayton SUB-100 - $135

Total: $550 + Shipping and cables.

Tad bit over budget as these things always end up being. But I think its respectable. Any additional thoughts?
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I run the 1610 and love it in my setup. Your speakers are better than mine (Infinity Studio Monitor 185's as fronts and Infinity Primus 162's as surrounds w/ no sub).

Good purchase and you will really enjoy it lots!
 
Thanks guys for all the recommendations and answering my noob questions. I'll post some pictures once I get things setup.
 
Well technically Onkyo and Denon are just as related, since Denon is short for Denki Onkyo and share the same umbrella holding company :p
 
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