So...wuts the latest word on 30incher release dates???

Ok I've spent over a day reading this ENTIRE thread... Often off topic and not very concise.

Anyway we've got the following monitors which are currently available:
  • Dell 30" 3007WFP-HC
  • HP 30" LP3065
  • Samsung 30" 305T
  • Apple 30"

The new dell is almost exactly the same as the older 3007WFP-HC but uses a newer panel and or backlighting which gives better color and improved response times. So definitely better and should always be picked above the standard 3007WFP, unless you're able to get a stellar deal on the older 3007WFP.

The new Dell 3007WFP-HC supposedly uses the same panel (S-IPS) as the HP LP3065, so features and quality wise very very similar. They differ in that the HP has 3 DVI dual link inputs where as the dell has one. These extra two inputs can only really be connected to computers which are able to provide the required resolution to drive the monitor. So not really that useful unless this is what you're after. By the sounds of it the HP doesn't natively support the 1280x800 over single link DVI??? Which could be useful (e.g. connecting up an older computer that doesn't support dual link). It seems the consensus is that the Dell looks a little "prettier" (both the monitor and the stand) compared to the HP. The Dell is also the only monitor supporting the built in card reader hub.

The Samsung 305T uses their own S-PVA panel, so has both benefits and drawbacks compared to S-IPS. Seems like most lean towards S-IPS, even though the difference isn't too major. The big missing feature of the Samsung is HCP, which isn't to important now, but may very well be in the near future. Again the 'looks nicer' than the Samsung which has quite a plain looking stand. The Samsung has one DVI port and a USB hub.

The Apple 30" uses the oldest technology, and is the most expensive. So the worst deal really.


There was a Benq 30" monitor many were waiting for, but they have no plans of releasing it anytime soon. It was supposed to have many different input types and a built in scalar.



Other factor to consider is return and dead pixel policy, which is *fairly* similar between brands.

A fairly good review which compares the new Dell 3007WFP-HC and Samsung 30" 305T:
http://www.behardware.com/articles/661-1/the-new-30-inch-monitors-dell-and-samsung.html

So overall it seems to me like the Dell 3007WFP-HC is the best choice price being equal...


Future 30" Monitors

There are new panels being released this year mostly based on Samsungs S-PVA panel (seems Dell, HP, Apple etc will be using it). And *probably* no more S-IPS panels??

LED backlighting will be used in new monitors released towards the end of this year, which will provide improved color (and supposedly longer life). Seems this will be quite expensive when released but will eventually come down and meet non LED panel pricing.

New 30" monitors being released this year are also rumored to have built in scalars and OSD (which non of the existing monitors have). I guess this is a nice to have so long as it doesn't add to much onto the price. But for strictly professional use and getting the most out of the monitor not required at all, everything can be done by the video card.

I think this is largely a summary of where everything is at - at this point in time.


On too the questions...

I'm wanting to purchase a new 30" display. Currently I'm using a 22" Mitsubishi Diamond Pro 2070SB CRT monitor. Which cost slightly less 4-5 years back when I bought it compared to these 30" displays.

Currently Dell has a special offer that I'm thinking of taking advantage of...

These are my ranked choices along with what it'd cost me to get them.
  • Dell 30" 3007WFP-HC NZ$2199 (~US$1649)
  • Samsung 30" 305T NZ$2140 (~US$1605)
  • HP 30" LP3065 NZ$2445 (~US$1833)

Costs vary quite a bit depending on country so I'm just wondering on your opinions on which to get based on the relative pricing? Or is it really worth waiting for a newer panel? Is the picture/color quality really going to be much worse than my CRT? I'm a website developer, mostly coding, occasional graphics, and yeah gaming. So reasonably decent color is important to me. Oh and I'm wondering if it's worth paying to up the 3 year warranty?

Thanks,
Shaun
 
> I'm just wondering on your opinions on which to get based on the relative pricing?

Based on pricing, forget the LP3065. Based on input lag, probably forget the 305T. ;) In case you don't know, the Samsung 214T and 244T have horrendous input lag. I'd expect Samsung repeated the same problem with the 305T. I saw unreliable info that showed the 305T having 30ms of input lag, and I'm surprised your behardware article omitted this since they've closely addressed the issue in the past. Then factor in the 92% gamut, HDCP support, and the better viewing angle with S-IPS, and the Dell wins by a long shot as far as I can see.


> Or is it really worth waiting for a newer panel?

Probably not; you'll end up waiting forever.


> Is the picture/color quality really going to be much worse than my CRT?

I'd say it might be a lot better than your current CRT. Color quality and clarity on my 30" is unbelievable, and blows away my old CRT.


> Oh and I'm wondering if it's worth paying to up the 3 year warranty?

Ask Dell if you can decide to purchase a longer warranty in 2 years--they might let you, so then you don't have to decide now.
 
Thanks. Some helpful feedback.

Re input lag on the 305T. I've read about 3 reviews on it and none of them mention this as an issue. I'm going to guess that it's using much better and newer technology than the other Samsung panels you're comparing it too. Though yeah viewing angle seems to be the major drawback, besides the non HDCP support which is a deal breaker for most people.

Here's another review of the Samsung 305T but vs. the old dell, their conclusion was that they were quite similar and was down to personal preference (the seemed to miss the lack of HDCP support). So from this also I come to the conclusion that the new Dell is probably better if they thought the Samsung was on par with the older Dell...
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/other/display/xxl-monitors.html

Samsung seems to be on par with the Dell specs wise (color, response etc) - but as we all know manufacturer specs are often over stated. If there was more input lag yeah that would be very very bad...

So anyway in my case seems reasonably obvious to spend just a little more and go for the 3007WFP-HC. Unless anyone is convinced the Samsung panel is better - which seems unlikely. I guess I'm just a little worried like everyone else that as soon as I buy this something much better comes around the corner. As I can wait - my CRT is still serving me well, I really would just like the extra jump in size. And I'd probably hold onto the new 30" for quite few years as I have done with my CRT... When I bought my CRT didn't think I'd be replacing it for a long long time as it really was the best I could get my hands on at the time. And yeah never owned an LCD personally so just a bit worried about it.

Interesting that you'd say you think the quality is better than your old CRT? Did you compare them side by side? What was your old CRT if I may ask? LCD's still have not supposedly caught up to high quality CRT's but are getting close and within 1-2 years may surpass them.

I didn't even think of asking if I can extend the warranty later. That's a much better option if that's possible. I will investigate that when making my purchase.
 
While I still think the Dell falls a bit higher in the pecking order than the 305T, I don't think the 305T has any serious input lag (think they must have delayed the thing to get some newer tech into it). I've read several reviews on it and some of them have done gaming and none have noted any difficulties.

What I like about the 305T is that I do have a preference for the contrast ratio and picture quality on a s-pva panel, but more than that I do prefer a brighter screen and knowing that the backlights dim slowly over time, I prefer the brighter 305T because over time it will maintain brightness longer.

However, hdcp is going to be another longer term feature that I don't think should be left out of any monitor that you expect to be using over the next 3-5 years. If your monitor replacement cycles are shorter that might change this as a priority, but to me, that's just something that we should have in any high end monitor today. Possibly having it in, would have made more of that input lag, and it's possible Samsung left it out in order to improve the 305T in some other area.

The Dell falls just slightly higher, because it has a lower initial brightness 300 cd/m and that's frankly (as it dims over time) going to lower the lifespan of the monitor to me. But it has hdcp. It has a very good return policy and thus covers me if I find screen defects.

In the end, I'm going to wait on the large volume of LED backlit panels that are coming soon (with an eye on OLED panels that might start out at the high end and work down), because at the cost of a 30" monitor I don't want compromises in lifetime from the get go. But I'm not moving from a CRT either. The move from a CRT to a good LCD today is quite dramatic, and your eyes will thank you. So weigh it out. I'd say and of the 3 is likely to be a good monitor, with the slight edge to the 3007, next 305T (but those two could change places depending on preference) and the HP a very close 3rd.

$.02
 
Hi Anemone thanks for the reply.

Samsungs replacement 30" due roughly Aug this year is said to have HDCP.

From what I've read almost all LCD's are too bright and are set on lower brightness settings, so this gives it a bit of extra brightness that can dim over time.
How big an issue is this dimming? And over what period of time? As I understand possibly worse than the dimming is the tubes actually change color over time as well...
So yeah I just have no idea if this dimming is something really to be worried about - is it an issue?

The LED backlit panels should hit the market later this year, but at almost double the price of existing 30" panels? This was rumored earlier in this thread. So probably only this time next year when they might reach acceptable price points.
I fully agree with you on the not willing to compromise on a 30" from the get go. But like I said is this really an issue?!? What about taking an extra 2 years warranty giving 5 years total... Or perhaps dimming is considered normal aging or wear and tear and is not covered by the warranty?

Any specific product you're waiting on? With rough a eta? I'm assuming the Samsung LED backlit panels and their resulting market shakeup?

Again interesting re the comment LCD vs CRT. I fully agree with LCDs being easier on the eyes for reading and such, but color, response time, etc CRT has yet to be surpassed from what I understand.
 
I would buy rather than wait. New technologies (LED backlighting) are going to years getting affordable and you can enjoy a top end panel while you wait.

I would get the Dell for the reasons you cite: Looks, S-IPS, Price, HDCP.

The extra inputs on the HP seem near useless, since you need another computer to use them. So it is hard to justify the extra price when that seems the only advantage.

I wouldn't worry about brightness. Most LCDs are way too bright. A properly calibrated monitor is around 100 cd/m2. Most of these monitors don't even go that low at minimum brightness. So unless you have special needs any LCD will be more than bright enough.

My next monitor will be the Dell 3007-HC (on sale of course). I am building a new computer with it in mind. Issue to keep in mind. Current HDCP cards don't work properly over Dual link for playing protected HD content. I am waiting to see if the new DX 10 cards from Nvidia/ATI work properly with dual link and HDCP. Not to mention it looks like the new DX 10 cards will do video decoding and offload the CPU. Once the video card is sorted, a cheap BluRay/HD drive and I have a wicked movie/gaming/general display.
 
cshaun said:
my CRT is still serving me well, I really would just like the extra jump in size.
Click to expand...

That was also my mindset. Then once the 30 came in, it suddenly became obvious how poor the colors and clarity were on the CRT. It was a 5-year old 19" Samsung 955DF. I also use a 21" Trinitron G520, and the colors on it are also pathetic. These are old monitors, so I really don't know how much better they were when they were new. I've only used the video card's color optimization wizard (nothing professional), but the 30" is 100 times better. And that makes sense in terms of the gamut specs (92% versus <72%).

But then again, maybe your 2070SB is already very good. I can only share my experiences.
 
Didn't want to go too off topic regarding hardware. But buying a monitor such as this definitively requires other hardware considerations...

Currently I have this down on paper as the system I'd assemble for the monitor.

  • 1x Intel Core 2 Duo E6420 2.13GHz 4M 1066MHz LGA775 VT, 65nm Conroe NZ$275.00
  • 1x ASUS P5B Deluxe, ATX, INTEL LGA775, dual-core/Core2Duo/Core2EE, P965 chip NZ$289.00
  • 1x Kingston HyperX 2GB 800MHz DDR2 Low-Latency CL4 NZ$272.00
  • 4x Seagate 320GB 7200 RPM SATA 3Gb/s 16MB cache Barracuda 7200.10 NZ$472.00
  • 1x Pioneer High-quality 18x DVR112D DVD WRITER BLACK OEM NZ$50.00
  • 1x GIGABYTE GeForce 8800GTX 768MB PCI-E 2560x1600 HDTV DirectX 10 SUPPORT NZ$890.00
  • 1x Case? NZ$500.00
  • 1x Thermaltake 750W Toughpower Cable Management ATX 12V 2.2 & EPS 12V/Black/w PFC/ silent 14cm Fan NZ$204.60
  • 1x Creative SoundBlaster X-Fi Xtreme Music NZ$179.00
  • 1x Dell 3007WFP-HC Monitor NZ$1,955.00 (NZ$2199.00 inc tax)

Total = NZ$5,086.60 (US$3815)
* All prices exc NZ sales tax (GST 12.5&#37;)


The new Exx20 CPU's seem to be excellent value, and the E6420 seems to be about right in the middle for value/performance. CPU is something that can easily be upgraded later. So this will likely become something much better in a year or two.

Need a fairly decent motherboard, don't plan on changing this for quite a while. The boards I'm considering are the Asus P5B Deluxe, Asus Commando, and Gigabyte GA-965P-DQ6 - all similar pricing. Performance of the P965 chipset very similar to the more expensive Nforce 680i etc. The thing that makes the P965 much better is far far better RAID performance.

I'm in two minds about ram. Often the cheapest generic ram seems to work just as well more expensive ram that costs a few times the price. But I figure I shouldn't think about it to much and just get reasonably decent brand name ram. Hence the Kingston. Also seems price of 4Gb is not out of reach. Believe it's better to have 2 sticks of 2Gb but these are a little hard to come by. 4x 1gb sticks only a few percent slower as far as I'm aware. The major issue here is that any 32bit operating system can only address 3gb memory? Was originally leaning on Vista 64bit but been a bit put off that with regards to drivers and general support for it (especially games). So not to sure what I'll do here with regards to 32bit vs 64bit.

Seagate 7200.10 320Gb seems to be the best value hard drive. Performs well, only 2 platters (less noise, heat, moving parts). Planning on using the onboard Intel matrix raid to create a RAID 5 array, and probably a much smaller RAID 0 array for a scratch/temp disk. Need at least 3 drives for RAID 5. So I'll either get 3 or 4. Probably 4 it's not much more cost wise.

Not too sure what DVD-RW drive I'll get, SATA preferable but comes at a slight cost premium, and this for me anyway seems like it gets replaced every year or so anyway.

Was thinking about a 8800GTS for cost reasons, but figure if a spurge on the monitor I should get a decent video card to suit, and in this case the insane price probably worth it. Haven't quite decided on what brand etc yet - but that's a little trivial.

I currently have a Thermaltake Xaser III case. Kinda annoying me atm with the looks and 7 80mm fans. Would replace it, but I actually haven't seen to many cases that I feel address all issues. Silverstone TJ07 and TJ09 seemed closest to what I'm after. Anyway will need to replace the 430W PSU I currently have. And seems will be needing something in the 750W range. After high efficiency and quiet operation. Thermaltake 750W toughpower just by far the cheapest / best value - but haven't fully evaluated it yet.

I'll probably try the onboard video for a little while, and then upgrade to the cheapest X-Fi sound card (Xtreme Music).

Monitor already discussed...



Near term future

Intel is releasing the bearlake chipset and new 1333mhz FSB cpu's within the next 1-4 months. When these CPU's are launched seems as though current CPU's pricing are almost going to halve and quad core will become much more affordable. Would be nice to get cheaper/faster CPU's and also jump on the bearlake chipset so that the mobo can hopefully last a bit longer and probably perform slightly better. (All the current mobo's I'm looking at do however support the 1333mhz FSB of these new processors.)

AMD/Ati is to release their new RD600? graphics card lineup within approx 1 month. Seeing as these have been delayed for so long, and all the extra time they've had it seems fair to expect these to be better than the Nvidia 8800 cards. Also they are said not to have support for HDCP over dual link DVI. Hopefully this is a refined product with all the issues already ironed out. If at worst these new cards should provide some competition and force the prices of the 8800 line to drop...

Been a while since Seagate launched the 7200.10 hard drive lineup. Hitachi just launched their 1TB drive, and Seagate should follow soon - maybe this is when they release 7200.11? This is not of huge concern importance but possibly something good that may happen within the next few weeks/months.


I was really wanting to wait for the new AMD/Ati cards and possibly the new Intel CPU/Chipsets before proceeding with my upgrade. But with the current special on the Dell 3007WFP-HC I feel my hand being forced.

I've been watching and recording the 3007WFP-HC price since 15th Feb. It changes every 1-2 weeks and this is what it's done: 2899, 2499, 2899, 2349, 2599, 2499, 2599, 2499, 2899, 2799, 2199.

And am just a bit worried I don't get such a good deal within the next 1-3 months when the above all goes down. Wouldn't mind waiting another month or two. But yeah, just a really good price on the monitor now. Perhaps it will go even lower?!?!

If I go ahead now I may be missing out on some impressive stuff happening in the very near future. I'm not worried about the new Penryn cores and other things planned etc (don't want to wait forever) the stuff I've mentioned should be happening very soon.

Anyway hopefully other people considering a 30" monitor will find these thoughts on hardware useful/interesting.
 
mmm interesting conclusion they came to regarding hardly any noticeable different in real world applications and games.

Primary reason for RAID is redundancy and peace of mind. The 320Gb is one of the cheapest per gb drive, so cheaper buying a few of them compared to one or two big drives. RAID5 is a compromise between performance, redundancy and wasted space.

To be honest I would have expected just a little more difference in level load times and things such as that. You're always hearing that the hard drive is a bottle neck and is one of the components that's progressing at snails pace compared to CPU/memory/video etc.

I'm currently running RAID 0 on two 120gb drives. Definitely noticed the difference... Especially if you're copying off the drive and doing something else like watching a video playing a game etc. Besides everything is sitting on the hard drive it needs to read from there to put it in memory...

Anyway like I'd said primary reason is redundancy and it's actually cheaper buying a few smaller drives than one or two bigger ones. Increased performance is basically free.

If I created a small RAID 0 partition it's basically only be for swap/scratch files, and temporary files - thus giving maximum read/write performance while also wasting no space on redundancy.

Here's a comparison of different RAID modes on different chipsets/platforms:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/01/03/the_southbridge_battle/page17.html
 
30" LCD's are tempting. But lack of scaling and such is bad for me, as I also would want to use it as a bedroom HDTV with a cable or satellite box...

Maximum PC magazine has some 30" coverage this month...
 
SH1 said:
Maximum PC magazine has some 30" coverage this month...
Click to expand...
Those magazines never seem to cover stuff nearly as adequately as [H] forums. They probably won't mention input lag, buzzing, or return/exchange policies, all of which are very important.

You should look into the Dell 2407 to meet your HDTV needs. It's a lot cheaper and has the proper inputs.
 
zzz said:
Those magazines never seem to cover stuff nearly as adequately as [H] forums. They probably won't mention input lag, buzzing, or return/exchange policies, all of which are very important.

You should look into the Dell 2407 to meet your HDTV needs. It's a lot cheaper and has the proper inputs.
Click to expand...

I don't want to venture into copyrighted territory, but actually Max PC was pretty negative about the current crop of 30 inchers...
 
cshaun said:
Can you summarize what their issues with them are?!?!?
Click to expand...
I can guess what they're negative about: lack of inputs, cost, and an expensive video card is required to run games at 2560x1600. But I think my Dell 30" is the best monitor ever.
 
Yeah but being negative towards costs both of a monitor and video card are quite stupid. It's only an issue if you can buy something the same or better for less. If it's price is reasonable for it's class how can you complain it's "expensive". Anyway annoying whenever this sort of argument is made.

And inputs, yeah maybe later this year or next year you'll see 30" with different inputs and a scalar, which yes will be slightly more functional... but hey I've had my monitor for years, it has two inputs and I've NEVER used the second input. It's a computer monitor... you wouldn't complain if a 15inch LCD only had one input.

Anyway if there's anyone that's actually read the article and it mentions any issues with the panels themselves, lifespans, quality, etc then yeah a brief summary would be good.
 
Ok I'm going to pull the trigger on the Dell 3007WFP-HC in approx 4 hours (just before the special ends). No new news making this a bad idea?

I'll do it then, because I can probably cancel the order if the price drops even more after 12:00, and order at the lower price. I doubt it will... but better to have a fall back.
 
I thought dell's telephone hours would be 24/7 (sounded like an indian when I last phoned). But they were closed (Australia) when I phoned. Wanted to ask if I could extend the warranty later.

Anyway I ended up agonizing over whether I should buy the 4 or 5 year warranty. Was very tempted. But didn't. Could possibly phone them today and change that... But what do you guys think of the extended warranty?! I would never pay for extended warranties on anything else. Just a monitor this expensive......
 
it's BS. The money you pay for ext. warranty, by the 3rd to 5th yr., not only this LCD would be so cheap that the ext. warranty $$ can be used to buy a new one equvialent, but we would have tech. long before that to replace LCD. The industry is about to launch Laser TV. In 3 yr., your LCD is a door stopper, just like an Aqua water block.
 
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