mzs_biteme
[H]ard|Gawd
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Socket AM3+ is DEAD
- Thread starter Sheppard
- Start date
AntiSocialMunky
Gawd
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You're going to make more defective mobos if you make more mobos.
ITSTHINKING
[H]ard|Gawd
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I wasn't "crying" about it, actually I was referring to the person you know, that I QUOTED. I was essentially just saying what you just said to me.
Mr. Bluntman
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My thought's exactly. Many OEMs shunned Athlon in it's infancy because of the horrible 3rd party chipset support (or kickbacks/blackmailing by Intel). Sure, they were fast, but they definitely weren't what I would quantify as "stable" at any rate.
Now during the end of the original Athlon's life (and onward) things improved, but Intel had solidified a reputation for the go-to brand if you wanted stable. Almost any IT guy would tell you this circa-2000...
Now, with that said, I certainly hope they are just converging sockets and not giving up making "high end" CPUs... Other than my Core i5 3570 system (and the C2D E8400/C2Q Q9550 system before it) ALL of my systems have had AMD inside since the original Athlon. It would be sad to see them go, and Intel needs some kind of competition to keep the 486/Pentium days from coming back where we paid a small fortune for our systems...
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ManofGod
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The chipsets that AMD have been producing are entirely solid and stable. They have been producing chipsets at least the last 9 years and I have not nor have I meet anyone who has had experience with instability of those chipsets.
My systems run solid and stable, you can take that pic and shove it.
My systems run solid and stable, you can take that pic and shove it.
ITSTHINKING
[H]ard|Gawd
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Yep, I don't know what the hell people are talking about. I've had more problems over the years with intel chipsets than AMD. In fact I have NEVER had a bad amd motherboard, and the 970/990 chipsets are fucking awesome. Yeah let me just go back and ask any IT guy from 2000
like I give a shit of what some IT guys opinion is in the first place. Also that .gif is stupid.drescherjm
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I have had more problems with AMD boards over the last 17 years (work experience) than Intel boards but I have also had like 2:1 AMD to Intel boards so that would be expected. Although I am only talking about a few hundred boards total so its also in no way sceintfic.
dragonstongue
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well even though my AMD Athlon socket AM2 ( 5600+) was a more or less OEM to hp asus board it was rock solid stable even when pushed to its upper end hell even was playing oblivion at decent settings via the onboard IGP(Nvidia 6150le)
my Intel E8400 used P5K then P5Q-E both of which were quite fast but not that stable, sometimes use for an hour or other times use for months on end but eventually would BSOD
now using a 980x based board for my Phenom II and if I do not go monkeying with what it "wants" for speeds and voltages I can leave it running 24/7 for months on end and it does not blue screen and does not "lose" speed like the Intel boards I had.
Anyways, AMD does not build bad chipsets, Nvidia did for various time frames FOR AMD, so, point is, call them out on something that is factual, they are electronics, they are computer parts, the rely on things working very well together to work properly, generally speaking, for some of the older AMD chips sure they had issues as they relied on way to many to do chipsets for them but since they stopped relying on many others to do them they have been ALOT more stable and overall better (minus of course some issues with XP and so forth)
AMD has made the whole computer world a better place, so remember when and if they do say "we are done" all the fanboys of the other makers will only have themselves to blame when shit goes down the crapper cause they will have lost one of the only makers who fought an uphill and difficult battle to TRY to make the whole ecosystem better for ALL makers not just themselves and their shareholders.
my Intel E8400 used P5K then P5Q-E both of which were quite fast but not that stable, sometimes use for an hour or other times use for months on end but eventually would BSOD
now using a 980x based board for my Phenom II and if I do not go monkeying with what it "wants" for speeds and voltages I can leave it running 24/7 for months on end and it does not blue screen and does not "lose" speed like the Intel boards I had.
Anyways, AMD does not build bad chipsets, Nvidia did for various time frames FOR AMD, so, point is, call them out on something that is factual, they are electronics, they are computer parts, the rely on things working very well together to work properly, generally speaking, for some of the older AMD chips sure they had issues as they relied on way to many to do chipsets for them but since they stopped relying on many others to do them they have been ALOT more stable and overall better (minus of course some issues with XP and so forth)
AMD has made the whole computer world a better place, so remember when and if they do say "we are done" all the fanboys of the other makers will only have themselves to blame when shit goes down the crapper cause they will have lost one of the only makers who fought an uphill and difficult battle to TRY to make the whole ecosystem better for ALL makers not just themselves and their shareholders.
Tup3x
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I have had truckloads of problems with AMD mobos. That being said I have never had chipset built by AMD. Only VIA and NVIDIA when it comes to AMD.
Tup3x
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AMD mobos were dominated by NVIDIA and VIA for long time. At one time there weren't any available so... Mobos for AMD CPU's have been rather shitty and unreliable at least in my case. Last AMD CPU that I've had (was in HTPC) was Athlon 64 X2 7750 (AM2+) and NVIDIA mobo. It was rather unstable combo (it was more than likely NVIDIA's fault, extremely crappy and hot chipset). I was talking about motherboards for AMD cpu's in general, not mobos with AMD chipsets.
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dragonstongue
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There is a reason why I still do not use Nvidia to this day, they tend to just flake out cause they are not made very well, just well enough for them to ship.
Anyways for the older AMD chipsets was Tyan, Via, Nvidia, ULi, PC Chips, SiS to name some, Via was always huge for AMD as they made many of the controllers and south bridges, Nvidia did provide some decent chipsets however, their driver support was WAY worse then what AMD does with their GPU drivers lol, and at least with AMD we had quality behind the design, with Nvidia chipset you got slow, pricey, hot, and prone to failure, there is a reason why AMD and Intel both left Nvidia behind, they could make better with other partners as Nvidia was unwilling to change their practices so it seems.
Anyways. its IYHO that amd motherboards in general all sucked, well you are allowed your opinion of course, does not mean it is correct however, the "new" boards are stellar compared to ones of past generations, if the "user" does not review the product quite well before getting and it flakes out, performs poorly and so forth that is not the makers fault(directly) that is the user who got something they probably should not have, period.
Anyways for the older AMD chipsets was Tyan, Via, Nvidia, ULi, PC Chips, SiS to name some, Via was always huge for AMD as they made many of the controllers and south bridges, Nvidia did provide some decent chipsets however, their driver support was WAY worse then what AMD does with their GPU drivers lol, and at least with AMD we had quality behind the design, with Nvidia chipset you got slow, pricey, hot, and prone to failure, there is a reason why AMD and Intel both left Nvidia behind, they could make better with other partners as Nvidia was unwilling to change their practices so it seems.
Anyways. its IYHO that amd motherboards in general all sucked, well you are allowed your opinion of course, does not mean it is correct however, the "new" boards are stellar compared to ones of past generations, if the "user" does not review the product quite well before getting and it flakes out, performs poorly and so forth that is not the makers fault(directly) that is the user who got something they probably should not have, period.
Exactly what "real"issues were you having, because most people on here probably just heard someone else complain about something and just continue to reiterate what they have already heard
I was using nvidia boards since my nforce 1 and then overclocking heavily on my nforce 2. I havnt owned every generation since them but ive owned quite a few. Other than easily solvable driver issues I have had no problems. Every so often I have had a board go bad and had to roma but thats random and from every manufacture
I was using nvidia boards since my nforce 1 and then overclocking heavily on my nforce 2. I havnt owned every generation since them but ive owned quite a few. Other than easily solvable driver issues I have had no problems. Every so often I have had a board go bad and had to roma but thats random and from every manufacture
DeathFromBelow
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I started building PCs in the socket 939 days (my first motherboard was an MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum). The only problem I've ever had on the AMD side was a Gigabyte board with a bad PCI-E slot. I've had all kinds of weird issues with Intel-chipset boards.
ITSTHINKING
[H]ard|Gawd
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I never had any of the nforce motherboards back in the day, I know they were very popular though, I had a shitty emachine pentium 4 machine for years until I built my first rig when the 3000+ venice core was still the shit. I overclocked the crap out of that thing, I remember it being faster than my friend's 4000+ and how pissed he was for paying more. His fault for not being willing to overclock
Tup3x
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Abit KT7A-RAID was by far the worst, unstable mobo I've ever had. Asus M3N78-EM takes the second spot (horrible driver support). I've had bunch of VIA based mobos before 939Dual-SATA2 and they all had their issues or limitations. Two MSI boards were quite nice though (VIA KT333 based and one for Athlon 64 3400+ before socket 939). My first intel mobo (Asus P5B) since Pentium 2 era was incredibly stable. I was really happy that I did not have any issues at all. I have had issues with Intel boards too (Asus P5Q Pro just crapped on another system and one Q35 or Q33 based board has not been the most stable) but still, I have had better experience with Intel mobos.
Mobo situation now is almost certainly different now for AMD since they are in similar situation than Intel (both have chipset monopoly). In my opinion odds were higher to get bad mobo for AMD cpu before than now.
Mobo situation now is almost certainly different now for AMD since they are in similar situation than Intel (both have chipset monopoly). In my opinion odds were higher to get bad mobo for AMD cpu before than now.
dragonstongue
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cheers to that and good point Tup3x, anyways there was ALOT of reported issues with Nforce boards by and large, spotty drivers, heat related deaths you name it, Via suffered on available speed but generally were far more stable in regards to drivers and general performance, they did not suffer nearly as bad as many Nforce boards did as Nvidia had a very nasty habit of using IRQ and such that caused major issues with many other makes things like hubs, sound cards etc.
There is a lot of people in the K5 and newer areas that became AMD fans or enemies cause of issues brought on by chipset vendors screwing around as they did, so yeh tables have drastically changed as AMD and Intel both do the chipset themselves and get others(such as Asus, Gigabyte etc) incorporate the specs into a final board design so there is way less deviation in base spec list.
Nforce were known for stellar performance for many of them, but were also known to have a bunch of issues that never got sorted generation after generation, nforce 4 apparently did away with many of the early issues, but even the newest ones(980a for AMD and 700 series for Intel) were apparently not all that great for many reasons, its better now that you can go SLi on boards that were not just Nvidia forced I suppose, as there are so many others that provide better things such as sound, usb, sata, pci-e and so forth, it was only in the "early" days that Nvidia did have a nice feature set compared to everyone else really.
There is a lot of people in the K5 and newer areas that became AMD fans or enemies cause of issues brought on by chipset vendors screwing around as they did, so yeh tables have drastically changed as AMD and Intel both do the chipset themselves and get others(such as Asus, Gigabyte etc) incorporate the specs into a final board design so there is way less deviation in base spec list.
Nforce were known for stellar performance for many of them, but were also known to have a bunch of issues that never got sorted generation after generation, nforce 4 apparently did away with many of the early issues, but even the newest ones(980a for AMD and 700 series for Intel) were apparently not all that great for many reasons, its better now that you can go SLi on boards that were not just Nvidia forced I suppose, as there are so many others that provide better things such as sound, usb, sata, pci-e and so forth, it was only in the "early" days that Nvidia did have a nice feature set compared to everyone else really.
I read through this thread a few days ago but couldn't make a post due to various issues.
However, I don't see why people ganged up on the guy who said this thread wasted him time. No offense to the TC, but it is mostly a waste of time because the manner in which the thread title is phrased makes it seem as though one thing is true, but upon reading the linked article, it turns out that this thing isn't actually true.
I read the quote and it specifically said "AM3 will be phased out", not "AM3+ will be phased out". It's interesting that they mention FM1 as well, because I was on Newegg about two weeks back and noticed that none of the Llano-based APU's and Athlon II's were available anymore. AM3 CPU's stopped being produced in 2012, but they have been available for purchase on sites like Newegg and Amazon well past that period. I guess this is part of AMD's new desire to cut costs and streamline everything.
By removing this older products, it just puts more focus on the newer tech. I'm not saying removing these is necessarily cost-cutting, since I'm sure it doesn't cost them anything to get rid of old leftover stock. But they are putting even more focus on FM2/FM2+ by only having Trinity/Richland parts available on places like Newegg, for example. AM3+ will obviously be supported with Vishera even if there won't be an FX Steamroller on it.
In regards to Steamroller FX, it's worth noting that the only main reason people are being doomsday about it is based on the company's past long-standing tradition of basing their mainstream/enthusiast desktop CPU's from the server variants, which usually released first. There is literally no reason as to why there couldn't be a Steamroller FX chip built which isn't based on a server variant. It's just people using previous actions to justify their baseless conjecture (which admittedly most stuff surrounding Steamroller in general is) predictions for what the future will hold.
Also the fact that it says Vishera for 2013 shouldn't alarm anyone since Kaveri itself won't be available for retail purchase on the desktop sector until very-early Q1 2014. Piledriver debuted in mid-2012 in mobile products, then later appeared in Oct. 2012 with the Trinity APU's and a week or so later with Vishera as the CPU-only part. This time we will see Kaveri on the desktop first, mobile second, then (possibly) a CPU-based part.
There is NO reason for there NOT to be a Steamroller-based FX chip whatsoever, especially given the numerous fixes to the uarch which would (theoretically at this time) drastically improve by multi-threaded and single-threaded performance. What socket it is on, FM2+ or AM3+ or both, doesn't matter. For them to just neglect to produce an eight-core chip which can actually finally scale to true 8x performance in multi-threaded tasks would be pure lunacy. It's highly unlikely that the 2M/4T Kaveri would beat out even a Vishera 4M/8T chip (barring HSA) in compute performance.
It would just be great to have an AMD chip that finally makes a notable leap above the performance level of Phenom II, a processor line from 2009, on the CPU-side of things for fuck's sake, lol.
However, I don't see why people ganged up on the guy who said this thread wasted him time. No offense to the TC, but it is mostly a waste of time because the manner in which the thread title is phrased makes it seem as though one thing is true, but upon reading the linked article, it turns out that this thing isn't actually true.
I read the quote and it specifically said "AM3 will be phased out", not "AM3+ will be phased out". It's interesting that they mention FM1 as well, because I was on Newegg about two weeks back and noticed that none of the Llano-based APU's and Athlon II's were available anymore. AM3 CPU's stopped being produced in 2012, but they have been available for purchase on sites like Newegg and Amazon well past that period. I guess this is part of AMD's new desire to cut costs and streamline everything.
By removing this older products, it just puts more focus on the newer tech. I'm not saying removing these is necessarily cost-cutting, since I'm sure it doesn't cost them anything to get rid of old leftover stock. But they are putting even more focus on FM2/FM2+ by only having Trinity/Richland parts available on places like Newegg, for example. AM3+ will obviously be supported with Vishera even if there won't be an FX Steamroller on it.
In regards to Steamroller FX, it's worth noting that the only main reason people are being doomsday about it is based on the company's past long-standing tradition of basing their mainstream/enthusiast desktop CPU's from the server variants, which usually released first. There is literally no reason as to why there couldn't be a Steamroller FX chip built which isn't based on a server variant. It's just people using previous actions to justify their baseless conjecture (which admittedly most stuff surrounding Steamroller in general is) predictions for what the future will hold.
Also the fact that it says Vishera for 2013 shouldn't alarm anyone since Kaveri itself won't be available for retail purchase on the desktop sector until very-early Q1 2014. Piledriver debuted in mid-2012 in mobile products, then later appeared in Oct. 2012 with the Trinity APU's and a week or so later with Vishera as the CPU-only part. This time we will see Kaveri on the desktop first, mobile second, then (possibly) a CPU-based part.
There is NO reason for there NOT to be a Steamroller-based FX chip whatsoever, especially given the numerous fixes to the uarch which would (theoretically at this time) drastically improve by multi-threaded and single-threaded performance. What socket it is on, FM2+ or AM3+ or both, doesn't matter. For them to just neglect to produce an eight-core chip which can actually finally scale to true 8x performance in multi-threaded tasks would be pure lunacy. It's highly unlikely that the 2M/4T Kaveri would beat out even a Vishera 4M/8T chip (barring HSA) in compute performance.
It would just be great to have an AMD chip that finally makes a notable leap above the performance level of Phenom II, a processor line from 2009, on the CPU-side of things for fuck's sake, lol
.http://www.game-debate.com/blog/ind...amroller CPUs FX-9450 and FX-9650 benchmarked!
These guys seems to think a FX steamroller chip will exist and there are even benchmarks.....
If the charts are true, I will be upgrading. Then again i highly doubt these are creditable sources.
These guys seems to think a FX steamroller chip will exist and there are even benchmarks.....
If the charts are true, I will be upgrading. Then again i highly doubt these are creditable sources.
Comixbooks
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http://amdfx.blogspot.com/2013/05/amd-steamroller-fx-9650-45-ghz-48-ghz.html
Dates back as far as May =)
Isn't there a AMD guy on these forums? That can confirm this type of stuff? Too busy marketing procs =)
Dates back as far as May =)
Isn't there a AMD guy on these forums? That can confirm this type of stuff? Too busy marketing procs =)
Yeah those links got brought up a few times in various places and basically they weren't credible at all. The benchmarks were all just synthetic and theoretical benchmarks based off the very little information AMD gave about Steamroller half-way through 2012.
From what I was told here (and eventually witnessed via post history) the last AMD guy that was on this forum was a guy named "JF-AMD" or something like that. He was posting here and various other tech forums talking about Bulldozer before it released. Some of the stuff he said was legit but people began to get angry/annoyed because it turned out some of the things he said were apparently BS.
That poster was a confirmed AMD employee and he was one of the reasons why Bulldozer was hyped up beyond its own capabilities (as well as generally tech community nonsense where everything gets unrealistically hyped). He was a part of the massive purge that AMD did starting in 2011~2012 I believe.
I haven't seen any confirmed AMD employees actively being in the tech community, and I think that's a good thing. No matter how credible and nice the person would be, everyone would be skeptical and there would be the jerkwads that shit-talk them as usual as well. I'm glad AMD is focusing more on their marketing and products rather than doing stuff like that again.
From what I was told here (and eventually witnessed via post history) the last AMD guy that was on this forum was a guy named "JF-AMD" or something like that. He was posting here and various other tech forums talking about Bulldozer before it released. Some of the stuff he said was legit but people began to get angry/annoyed because it turned out some of the things he said were apparently BS.
That poster was a confirmed AMD employee and he was one of the reasons why Bulldozer was hyped up beyond its own capabilities (as well as generally tech community nonsense where everything gets unrealistically hyped). He was a part of the massive purge that AMD did starting in 2011~2012 I believe.
I haven't seen any confirmed AMD employees actively being in the tech community, and I think that's a good thing. No matter how credible and nice the person would be, everyone would be skeptical and there would be the jerkwads that shit-talk them as usual as well. I'm glad AMD is focusing more on their marketing and products rather than doing stuff like that again.
Pieter3dnow
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John has moved on to another company he is no longer with AMD.
If you referring to him he said he made a mistake where the information he got was wrong and he based his conception on this.
Originally the Bulldozer was heading for 4 ghz+ speeds. This due to circumstances did not happen. If it did it would be a lot closer.
on Rage3D there is Jim .
If AMD needs to focus on one thing it is making sure stuff gets out the door. I'm still waiiting for my Temash based tablet.
If you referring to him he said he made a mistake where the information he got was wrong and he based his conception on this.
Originally the Bulldozer was heading for 4 ghz+ speeds. This due to circumstances did not happen. If it did it would be a lot closer.
on Rage3D there is Jim
.If AMD needs to focus on one thing it is making sure stuff gets out the door
. I'm still waiiting for my Temash based tablet.
dragonstongue
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long-standing tradition of basing their mainstream/enthusiast desktop CPU's from the server variants
say what? FX overall to my knowledge is the only real architecture that was server first desktop second, where previous to this there was very much segregation from desktop and server side of the designs(they shared similarities but they were also quite their own base designs, as was mobile for the last while, prior to FX, mobile was nearly always desktop but cherry picked which posed their own issues)
But I agree, would be great to see and actual 8 core from AMD not one called 8 core when it is not(I wont argue on this one but if they had a full fat 4 cores for years, then decided to use "modules" where only 1/2 of them are fat and the rest slim for lack of a better term the should NOT have called FX 4, 6, 8 core chips, they should have just called them FX 4, 6, 8 without adding the "core" part in, am sure it made 0 difference in sales and probably hurt them more then it helped)
It could be that AMD is holding the steamroller refresh for vishera replacement AFTER they get to test the waters with Kaveri and get things all hunky dory not once did AMD state "there will be NO steamroller for AM3+" so, I have a feeling they just really want the devs to have had time to play with Jaguar and the like to get ready for the arch that steamroller brings, this way here when people finally get to use it and combine it with hd9000 series and such they will be astounding performance improvements instead of just a slight bump like vishera was.
say what? FX overall to my knowledge is the only real architecture that was server first desktop second, where previous to this there was very much segregation from desktop and server side of the designs(they shared similarities but they were also quite their own base designs, as was mobile for the last while, prior to FX, mobile was nearly always desktop but cherry picked which posed their own issues)
But I agree, would be great to see and actual 8 core from AMD not one called 8 core when it is not(I wont argue on this one but if they had a full fat 4 cores for years, then decided to use "modules" where only 1/2 of them are fat and the rest slim for lack of a better term the should NOT have called FX 4, 6, 8 core chips, they should have just called them FX 4, 6, 8 without adding the "core" part in, am sure it made 0 difference in sales and probably hurt them more then it helped)
It could be that AMD is holding the steamroller refresh for vishera replacement AFTER they get to test the waters with Kaveri and get things all hunky dory
not once did AMD state "there will be NO steamroller for AM3+" so, I have a feeling they just really want the devs to have had time to play with Jaguar and the like to get ready for the arch that steamroller brings, this way here when people finally get to use it and combine it with hd9000 series and such they will be astounding performance improvements instead of just a slight bump like vishera was.It goes beyond the latest version of FX. Deneb and such was still based off Barcelona's Opteron chips, same thing happened with the previous K8 designs. I wasn't necessarily talking about a mostly 1:1 similarity, just that in general the Opteron's would release first and then they would be modified and have desktop cores designed from there on. Intel did (and I think may still do) the same thing.
Yeah, AMD never said there wouldn't be a SR FX on AM3+ indeed. Good point about the HD 9000 thing, I mentioned that once. No way they would release a new GPU series finally and then eventually not have a new flagship CPU core to pair it up with. I think Kaveri will come first, then people will get a taste of the CPU-only parts with more cores later.
Current and predicted APU's are not a solution for performance desktop users, if that changes we shall see, but I'm happy with AM3+ and I'm not sure it's dead yet, until official news comes out I'm on the fence.
And the grim reality of all CPU's is that sockets change at some point. AMD has, overall been quite good here with backwards compatibility. Just ask any Intel user what it's like changing sockets frequently.
In the end I suspect there will be a unified socket for AMD, but I don't feel I'd be updating pc for quite some time so socket AM2+ isn't going to be around and it will be DDR4 era and so on and so forth.
And the grim reality of all CPU's is that sockets change at some point. AMD has, overall been quite good here with backwards compatibility. Just ask any Intel user what it's like changing sockets frequently.
In the end I suspect there will be a unified socket for AMD, but I don't feel I'd be updating pc for quite some time so socket AM2+ isn't going to be around and it will be DDR4 era and so on and so forth.
dragonstongue
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opteron
well seems almost splitting hairs as the desktop version were first in some cases, in others where the server side needed various boosts they were made first then the desktop culled from them, with FX though straight up seems to be the server side/desktop side were made almost in tandem with a certain concept set into motion with AMD seeing how it would pan out, a chicken and an egg are similar lol. I know Intel however does design the server side first majority of the time and they use this to trim and tweak desktop and Nvidia very much uses the workstation grade to pay for the desktop end development(so they state)
Anyways, this is what I think they are doing, test the waters to see how devs are going to use jaguar in PS4/XB1, see where the various issues might be or how they do very well at, do a final tweaking to them, release kaveri and allow a higher end card to hybrid with them, consumers see what they bring to the table, release steamroller with all the various tweaks added and the deficiencies sorted out.
I could be wrong but it does seem Intel maybe programmed more into their cpu so their version of HT and the like on average has a higher use % though AMD concept is more refined they did not program as much into the uarch and so it does not bear fruit as readily. Forget where I seen someone say this.
"AMD makes some of the best hardware out there, however, for their hardware to really show what it can do, they rely on the developer community for the software to make it all happen, the whole make it now, make it well, make it better later. Intel does not design supreme chips in comparison, what they do very well however is to ensure that the software only makes it easier to glean the extra performance, not nearly the same impact on their baseline performance in this regard, that and Intel is quite crafty with hiding their inefficiencies be it for power consumption, or for pipeline misses, they got really crafty over the last decade or so, partially cause of the strengths AMD and others have shown.
well seems almost splitting hairs as the desktop version were first in some cases, in others where the server side needed various boosts they were made first then the desktop culled from them, with FX though straight up seems to be the server side/desktop side were made almost in tandem with a certain concept set into motion with AMD seeing how it would pan out, a chicken and an egg are similar lol. I know Intel however does design the server side first majority of the time and they use this to trim and tweak desktop and Nvidia very much uses the workstation grade to pay for the desktop end development(so they state)
Anyways, this is what I think they are doing, test the waters to see how devs are going to use jaguar in PS4/XB1, see where the various issues might be or how they do very well at, do a final tweaking to them, release kaveri and allow a higher end card to hybrid with them, consumers see what they bring to the table, release steamroller with all the various tweaks added and the deficiencies sorted out.
I could be wrong but it does seem Intel maybe programmed more into their cpu so their version of HT and the like on average has a higher use % though AMD concept is more refined they did not program as much into the uarch and so it does not bear fruit as readily. Forget where I seen someone say this.
"AMD makes some of the best hardware out there, however, for their hardware to really show what it can do, they rely on the developer community for the software to make it all happen, the whole make it now, make it well, make it better later. Intel does not design supreme chips in comparison, what they do very well however is to ensure that the software only makes it easier to glean the extra performance, not nearly the same impact on their baseline performance in this regard, that and Intel is quite crafty with hiding their inefficiencies be it for power consumption, or for pipeline misses, they got really crafty over the last decade or so, partially cause of the strengths AMD and others have shown.
http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Editorial/AMDs-Processor-Shift-Future-Really-Fusion
Darn, i was really hoping to find an 8 core 95W Steamroller.
I like pcper, but what roadmaps are they talking about? I haven't seen any roadmap that shows Vishera as being the desktop performance CPU for all of 2014.
Also don't understand what he meant by Warsaw being Steamroller... Warsaw is "enhanced Piledriver". AM3+ might be dying, but that doesn't necessarily mean the end of the FX line. They could still bring FX to FM2+ since it's a more evolved chipset design than AM3+. Native USB 3.0, PCI-e 3 (even if it's not needed right now), HyperTransport no longer needed, Northbridge directly on the CPU, etc. I don't blame AMD for canceling 1090FX. They might as well make FM2+ their unified socket now and get it over with.
Also don't understand what he meant by Warsaw being Steamroller... Warsaw is "enhanced Piledriver". AM3+ might be dying, but that doesn't necessarily mean the end of the FX line. They could still bring FX to FM2+ since it's a more evolved chipset design than AM3+. Native USB 3.0, PCI-e 3 (even if it's not needed right now), HyperTransport no longer needed, Northbridge directly on the CPU, etc. I don't blame AMD for canceling 1090FX. They might as well make FM2+ their unified socket now and get it over with.
ManofGod
[H]F Junkie
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- Oct 4, 2007
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- 12,883
It is still possible for a Steamroller cpu to come out on the AM3+ platform. However, AMD better realize that us 990FX users are not going to stand for just a overclocked FX 8350 as an upgrade path. (That is, unless, they can produce a 5.4GHz cpu at the 125 Watt TDP limit.) Also, I do not see myself going backward and picking up a 4 core cpu at all because they do not an will not serve my needs at home or at work.
So, AMD, I would be very, very careful what you do in the next year or so. You have the potential to bring us along or push us away, what will it be? NaroonGTX: I do not mind that idea either of bringing the FX line to the FM2+ chipset since, not everyone wants or needs integrated graphics.
So, AMD, I would be very, very careful what you do in the next year or so. You have the potential to bring us along or push us away, what will it be? NaroonGTX: I do not mind that idea either of bringing the FX line to the FM2+ chipset since, not everyone wants or needs integrated graphics.
Would like to see some better AMD AM3+ M-ATX boards. The current crop are a bit stale with 700 series chipsets.
I don't know why all the ones with 800/USB3.0/e-SATA largely dried up. Glad I got one in before they went.
Don't really have much use for full ATX boards anymore.
The current AMD AM3+ M-ATX situation is a bit like how Intel M-ATX boards were a couple of years ago. All serial and parallel ports and no fun.
I don't know why all the ones with 800/USB3.0/e-SATA largely dried up. Glad I got one in before they went.
Don't really have much use for full ATX boards anymore.
The current AMD AM3+ M-ATX situation is a bit like how Intel M-ATX boards were a couple of years ago. All serial and parallel ports and no fun.
I just wish AMD came out openly to say whether there will be a Steamroller for AM3+ or not. I am tired of guessing and reading speculations. I don't complain, i really loved the AM3 CPUs, but if there is no Steamroller for AM3+, i 'd like to know and decide whether to get an FX-6300 95W or not. The 1090T is a bit too hot for the summer here.
Other than that, i will be glad if AMD unifies sockets, but please, let us know about the fate of AM3+! I intend to stick with it for a good time.
Other than that, i will be glad if AMD unifies sockets, but please, let us know about the fate of AM3+! I intend to stick with it for a good time.
Yeah, I'm usually cool with AMD being quiet, but right now a LOT of their fans are very confused and worried because they don't know the fate of their current platforms. I think most current people on AM3+ wouldn't mind going to socket FM2+ as long as they could buy 6 and 8-core Steamroller parts. The socket could handle it no problem.
I think one of the reasons we didn't see more mATX and mITX boards for AM3/AM3+ is because of the fact that those chipsets had the northbridge directly on the boards. FM1 and FM2 have the northbridge functions right there on all the chips, hence the ability to create smaller boards and why FMx processors couldn't work in AMx boards.
FM2/FM2+ has a lot of features that people have been asking for. People wanted smaller form factors, now they have them. People wanted PCIe-3.0, they will have it. All AMD has to do is make an official announcement at some point soon about the socket situation and Steamroller, and they will be golden.
I kinda don't see why they're so tight-lipped about it honestly, because we know that Steamroller exists. I guess we really will just have to wait on the new roadmaps.
I think one of the reasons we didn't see more mATX and mITX boards for AM3/AM3+ is because of the fact that those chipsets had the northbridge directly on the boards. FM1 and FM2 have the northbridge functions right there on all the chips, hence the ability to create smaller boards and why FMx processors couldn't work in AMx boards.
FM2/FM2+ has a lot of features that people have been asking for. People wanted smaller form factors, now they have them. People wanted PCIe-3.0, they will have it. All AMD has to do is make an official announcement at some point soon about the socket situation and Steamroller, and they will be golden.
I kinda don't see why they're so tight-lipped about it honestly, because we know that Steamroller exists. I guess we really will just have to wait on the new roadmaps.
John Walrath at Pc perspective had this to say about the possibility of another am3+ processor:
"This was later confirmed when roadmaps were released and showed that the Vishera lineup would be supported for the AM3+ platform throughout 2013 and 2014. The Steamroller architecture, which will be introduced with the Kaveri parts, will not be represented on AM3+. Steamroller does appear to be a big step up in both IPC and multi-processing as compared to Zambezi and Piledriver architectures. Sadly, for those users hoping for one last upgrade on the AM3+ platform, it looks like prospects of a large Steamroller based product on that platform are slim.
"
Read his entire article here
http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Editori...-Really-Fusion
"This was later confirmed when roadmaps were released and showed that the Vishera lineup would be supported for the AM3+ platform throughout 2013 and 2014. The Steamroller architecture, which will be introduced with the Kaveri parts, will not be represented on AM3+. Steamroller does appear to be a big step up in both IPC and multi-processing as compared to Zambezi and Piledriver architectures. Sadly, for those users hoping for one last upgrade on the AM3+ platform, it looks like prospects of a large Steamroller based product on that platform are slim.
"
Read his entire article here
http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Editori...-Really-Fusion
All you need to do is undervolt and underclock and that will fix your temps. Or you know, don't buy a hex core cpu.
DeathFromBelow
Supreme [H]ardness
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- 7,315
Will socket FM2+ be able to support 40 PCI-E lanes like AM3+?
They don't want to hurt current product sales or cause another PR letdown like the lead-up to the Bulldozer launch.
The problem with the Bulldozer launch was that the product was hyped up by the terrible marketing team at AMD (at the time) as well as by baseless speculation from AMD fanboys and tech enthusiasts in general. It didn't help that people went and took some of the hype back from when Bulldozer was originally supposed to launch (like back in 07 or 08) and tried to apply it to the then-current date.
I understand not wanting to market against themselves, but lots of people are looking forward to what Steamroller can do. They don't need to hype it up, but I guess nothing has changed from the original slides and info they released back in mid-2012 for the most part. Still, if they'd just come out and say whether or not Socket AM3+ is "dead" as in "won't receive anymore chips", that wouldn't hurt anything.
As for the PCI-e lanes, I don't know how many FM2+ supports, but I get a sarcastic rhetorical vibe from your comment, so I assume FM2+ doesn't support that many. People who use a single-GPU or even xfire with two cards should be fine on FM2+, regardless.
I understand not wanting to market against themselves, but lots of people are looking forward to what Steamroller can do. They don't need to hype it up, but I guess nothing has changed from the original slides and info they released back in mid-2012 for the most part. Still, if they'd just come out and say whether or not Socket AM3+ is "dead" as in "won't receive anymore chips", that wouldn't hurt anything.
As for the PCI-e lanes, I don't know how many FM2+ supports, but I get a sarcastic rhetorical vibe from your comment, so I assume FM2+ doesn't support that many. People who use a single-GPU or even xfire with two cards should be fine on FM2+, regardless.