soundcard or dac ? suggestions needed !

shadowlord

shadowlord

2[H]4U
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Jan 6, 2005
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Hello all!

currently i'm building a pc only for music listening, which will be placed next to my cd player.
base is a via epia itx mobo with coax digital out onboard.
all my cd's are ripped in flac format. amp is a harman/kardon, speakers are elac bookshelves and an active elac sub.

i think the best way to connect the pc to the amp would be a dac? or will a modded x-fi or auzentech hold up agains a dac? ( only auzentechs are hard to buy here in austria)

my price limit is about 250 euros.

for this i could get an used arcam alpha black box, or procced pdp2 here in austria.
or maybe order a zhaolu from diykits?
there is hardly a way for me to listen to any of these :(

would it be better to buy a additional soundcard and connect it to a dac?

any help would be appreciated.
 
update time..

while making good progress with the pc for my project i'm still unsure about the audio parts.

saturday i will visit my local hi-fi dealer and buy a new amp ( looking at the rotel ra04) and maybe speakers as well.
after a bit of research i found that most new dac's cost way more than what i wanted to spend. i may try it with my modded x-fi first.

but has anyone a suggestion for an used dac, or an sub 250€ one ?
 
Get an X-FI, use it's Coax out to an external dac. USB is not a good transport IMO. A couple of good, inexpensive Dacs are the Zhalou, the Beresford 7510 Mk6(easy to modify) or an older Music Fidelity dac. Depends what you can find in Austria but try buying used.
 
OP says he already has digital coax out on the motherboard, I don't think the X-fi digital out would be much of an improvement.

Could you get something like an entech number cruncher off of ebay?

I think any kind of external DAC is going to be much better than an internal sound card, getting it away from all that electrical "noise" is a good thing.
 
He could run it off the mobo and save some $$ now but the X-FI really does a better job.
 
Usually, a well designed standalone DAC unit will yield better audio quality than the XFi alone.

Whether or not to use USB, I've read reports that it is not as good as going via Digital out.... but whether you yourself can hear the difference, you'd probably need killer speakers and a good ear.
 
spaceman said:
Get an X-FI, use it's Coax out to an external dac. USB is not a good transport IMO. A couple of good, inexpensive Dacs are the Zhalou, the Beresford 7510 Mk6(easy to modify) or an older Music Fidelity dac. Depends what you can find in Austria but try buying used.
Click to expand...

like i said. only using the x-fi as an improved transport/
 
hello all.

today i was visiting my audio dealer and after a long test listen i bought a new amp

amp00001.jpg



i listened to new elac speakers with the jet tweeters as well, and now i know for what i use the next paycheck for ;)

seems like i need to raise the budget for the DAC now.

i could order the beresford 7510 mk6 for about 200€, will it still sound as good enough?

does anybody ever heard a moodlab dac?

when it improves sq i could install a soundcard to, will the esi maya be a good choice or is a x-fi enough. i'm owning a x-fi music and there is no coax or optical connector on it, it seems that i will need a special cable for it or ??

thanks for your input...
 
Shadow,

HOw does the Azur 640a compare with the previous amp you had?

Also, what are these ELAC speakers?
 
hi pinipig !!

the cambridge has a wider soundstage and plays with more "power"
it sounds more balanced, bass is less "boomy" but with better punch.
highs are awesome...more "airy" than the harman/kardon.

right now i'm owning the elac el52s , but i listened to the elac 204.2 (awesome to my ears) in the shop and i think i will buy them soon

i now have a hard time finding the right dac... after the amp and the new speakers i'm a bit on a budget.

right now i consider the zhaolu 3.0 or the moodlab nos dac and i'm still searching ebay for a used one.

maybe you know a good one with a budget of ~350euros?
 
thanks all.....

even if its a little over my budget i won the auction for a paradisea today...:)
soundcard is a esi maya44 for the digital output.


the worklog for the transport is already online
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1229032

on a side note: i had to excange the cambridge amp since it had slight humming noise when no music was played. the new one is dead silent now ;)
 
That will sound great. There is always better but it is really a difference in tastes more than anything. If you love it then you love it lol.
 
it's here !!!!

parad00001.jpg


parad00002.jpg


parad00003.jpg


tube glow
parad00004.jpg


ok...to be honest it arrived a week ago already i was only to busy to post pics.

after about 20h playing time i'm getting used to it. the more analogue sound is fantastic.

since my transport pc is giving me troubles the source is now my old harman/kardon cd player. i could easily compare the two by switching inputs on the amp.

compared to the h/k the paradisea sounds more flat, or if the h/k is the flat device the paradisea has more defined mid's (but i found the h/k always "loudness" sounding). it doesn't sound that detailed in the highs like the h/k but it's overal sonic picture is more appealing... more "round". very nice for relaxed, long listening sessions.

let's see how it will sound with the maya44 as source.

np: Mostly Autumn - Passengers
 
I am curious...how are external DACs connected to an amp? I am assuming via a digital connection like HDMI, Optical, etc.

Is a DAC and a OPAMP the same thing?

What is the benefit of having the amp seperate from the DAC (why not by an AV Receiver)?

Super high-end components fascinate me, but sadly they are usually waaaay out of my price range (and yes I have been known to spend insane amounts of money on toys LOL!)

Im running a Marantz receiver with Ascend Acoustics speakers, HSU sub & a PS3 for audio play back by streaming .wav files from my computer. All cables are Blue Jeans.
 
lol ok just think of the dac as a way to change and or upgrade the sound from your cd player or PC. Just plug an optical cable from your source aka cd player or Pc into the dac and the dac basically takes that info and outputs it as rca analogue aka regular ole rca stereo into your amp for a new "flavor"

Dacs are not expensive unless you want an expensive one. There are $50 dacs and there are $15000+ dacs.
 
I am suprised the speakers outs are not on the back of these DACs.

Anyways, are you sure it makes sense to be using your computer to send music to these high quality audio devices (amps, DACs, speakers, etc.)?

As far as I have read on AVSForums, Windows and/or the soundcard mess with the original source before sending it out. I highly doubt you are getting bit perfect 44.1kHz 16bit audio from your computer via optical when playing CD source material ripped to a lossless format. I would say that it is most likely being touched/altered by Windows or your sound card.

I know that the X-Fi has a bit-perfect output mode in Audio Creation mode, but I think Windows still may be altering the source. In WinXP, I think you can bypass some of this stuff (Kmixer, etc.), but not sure in Vista since it is a new audio system from the ground up.
 
You are right that XP is not exactly pure and the X-i has dc voltage saturating the digital out which does not help either. In other words, the Pc is not the ideal transport. However, for gaming, what choice do we have? An external dac does MUCH to improve the output of a pc though.

Vista appears to have much improved sound quality. I am unsure as to the specifics but have read and heard on my laptop the change.

To the OP. You have it about right with your impressions. Know that you can do some "tube rolling" to change/improve the sound.
 
thx spaceman i maybe try an other tube...

i will use win xp with an esi maya44 which bypasses windows mixer.
foobar with flac files -> asio ->maya44 -> optical cable-> dac -> amp....
 
hi all

today i installed a new tube in the paradisea
i bought the WE396A which got some positive reviews on the net.

open paradiesea

para00001.jpg


tubes side by side...on the left the new one and on the right the old GE one.

para00002.jpg



right out of the box i could hear better instrument separation and the bass has a bit more impact. let's see how it changes over time. the old tube had about 100 hours playing time on it and the sound changed noticeable.

np: kansas - lonely street
 
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