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The answer of the age-old question: 4x512mb or 2x1024mb?
- Thread starter robberbaron
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i think they are be-5's
edit: CE-6 Infineons
her's a link for a good o.c.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?p=1002254#post1002254
edit:
Treyshadow, where did you get those patriots? it seems the old stock has be-5's and the new has ce-6's. also, there has been a price jump of $20 today on these at monarch which might mean they are carrying newer stock.
edit: CE-6 Infineons
her's a link for a good o.c.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?p=1002254#post1002254
edit:
Treyshadow, where did you get those patriots? it seems the old stock has be-5's and the new has ce-6's. also, there has been a price jump of $20 today on these at monarch which might mean they are carrying newer stock.
Treyshadow
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Got em at Fry's. I have seen them on Outpost.com also.
Good sticks too.
Good sticks too.
(cf)Eclipse said:
I am currently running 3x512mb right now on my XP setup and saw this comment. What kind of things do I have to look out for when I upgrade to a A64 Setup? I am planning on going X2 anyways, but I was just wondering what issues you were speaking of, always good to have a broad outlook on things =)
I
infiniti029
Guest
grendelrt said:
I'm getting an MSI Neo4 Plat w/ Venice 3000+... i was wondering the same thing cuz i'm in the same situation (3x512). In my current rig I HAVE to have at least 1.5GB of ram for BF2 or the game starts to choke occasionaly.
infiniti029 said:
From what I have read I got this, and I may be wrong since I am new to the subject. If you are running any A64 pre revision E6 and you use more than 2 sticks, it defaults to 333MHZ. If you are using revision E6 and have more than 3 sticks, it defaults to T2 but at 400MHZ.
thanks for the post OP, was exactly what i was looking for. I'm going to be getting 2gb (4x512mb) of ram next week and have been looking into both crucial xms, but lately have been leaning towards mushkin. I hear the redline is good, but wondered if anyone had experience with these:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820146355
Should be similar, but better performance, just wondered if anyone had experience with them (i've owned other mushkin mem in the past and have been very happy with it). I'll do minimal if any OC'ing.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820146355
Should be similar, but better performance, just wondered if anyone had experience with them (i've owned other mushkin mem in the past and have been very happy with it). I'll do minimal if any OC'ing.
misterE said:
That used to be true, but now you have to worry about 1T and 2T , so you are better off with 2x1gb since it will run at 1T. Even though its a minimal performance difference. If anything it allows you to upgrade to 4gb in the future since you are only using 2 slots.
Yes, it seems to be performing very well. I'm currently running at stock speed (i.e. no overclocking) and the timing does show up as 2-3-2-5, which is consistent w/ the stated specs. If you plan on OC'ing a lot and want 2x1 GB, then, this won't go too far before you have to loosen the timings. And even after loosened to something like 3-3-3-8, from what I've read, it still doesn't OC that much.AthenaX said:
Basically, this is one of the fastest 2x1 GB memory sticks you can get when running at the stock PC 3200 speed. But it does not OC very much. For good OC'ing, get the Corsair TWINX2048-3200C2 that was recommended in the 2 GB memory shoot out someone mentioned a page ago.
Thanks for the quick response.. Putting together a new system can be a pain, when faced with millions of reviews.. Yes there will be overclocking.. Thats why its got me scratching me head on the RAM.. Definetly going 2 x 1gig.. Leaning again to OCZ.. Heres another ?.. On newegg theres Two 2 x1gig kits from OCZ ones more expensive.. but the only diff looks like the heat spreader.. True?
You're welcome. I know exactly what you're going through. I built my first system ever (from scratch) and went through the entire process, through good and bad. My PC project literally started in Jan. when I bought my case. I got serious about buying the other stuff when I decided I was going to get my mobo and CPU from the AMD Tech Tour (which was held in late July for the NJ show). I finally flipped the switch 2 weeks ago and am now installing stuff and trying to transfer files from the old PC to this one.AthenaX said:
Anyway, to get back on topic, I bought my memory when it was on sale (rebate) and after reading good reviews about OCZ Platinum. I got in before that AMD Zone article was published, but even after reading it, I probably would've still gotten OCZ, but would've given that Corsair model more serious consideration due to its better OC capability, esp. if I found a good price on it.
I don't know which 2x1 GB OCZ kits you're referring to - the ones I'm familiar with are the Platinum kit (2-3-2-5) and Performance kit (which I think is 3-3-3-7). I read mixed things about the utility of a heat spreader, but the Platinum came w/ it, so I figured what the heck.
2x1 GB is definitely the way to go. 4x512 MB locks you out for future upgradeability. Good luck on your system buid.
I'm lost.
I have a rev E Venice 3000+ and 4x512mb PC3200 (DDR400) memory and it is booting at DDR333 (PC2700). No matter what I change....still boots DDR333.
All 4 sticks are double sided and are all the same brand. Crucial Value memory.
I am not an overclocker at all.
What are my options? Can I get my memory to run DDR400?
I have a rev E Venice 3000+ and 4x512mb PC3200 (DDR400) memory and it is booting at DDR333 (PC2700). No matter what I change....still boots DDR333.
All 4 sticks are double sided and are all the same brand. Crucial Value memory.
I am not an overclocker at all.
What are my options? Can I get my memory to run DDR400?
I assume it would since you still have 4 memory sticks in there. If you can sell your 4x512 MB of RAM for a decent price, I'd recommend in doing so and then get 2x1 GB of RAM.Tiny said:Dang.
EDIT***
Wait....what if I want to run 4x1gb memory...will I run into the same problem as I had with 4x512?
BTW, did you try removing a pair of sticks to run 2x512 MB to see if that memory boots up at 400 MHz instead of 333 MHz? Also, are you positive the Crucial value RAM you bought is indeed PC3200 and Not PC27000?
beowulf7 said:
Yup. Tried them in every way I could...one in, two in, one in the first bank, one in the second bank and one in the third bank...etc... All booted at DDR400 except 4x512mb. 3x512mb booted at DDR400 too.
One of the reasons I bought this motherboard was because it could hold 4xmemory.
Since I am only running 2gig of memory now, I could just buy 2x1gb mem sticks and be happy for a while.
What should I get so I run 1T? I have no knowledge when it comes to timings.
And take into account that I don't overclock...nor will I ever.
If you don't overclock and want to get the fastest 2x1 GB memory for a "reasonable" cost, get OCZ Platinum, which has 2-3-2-5 memory timings.Tiny said:Yup. Tried them in every way I could...one in, two in, one in the first bank, one in the second bank and one in the third bank...etc... All booted at DDR400 except 4x512mb. 3x512mb booted at DDR400 too.
One of the reasons I bought this motherboard was because it could hold 4xmemory.
Since I am only running 2gig of memory now, I could just buy 2x1gb mem sticks and be happy for a while.
What should I get so I run 1T? I have no knowledge when it comes to timings.
And take into account that I don't overclock...nor will I ever.
That's why I said "reasonable" price.Tiny said:Cool thanks.
$269 isn't that cheap, but I can offset it by selling my current sticks.
A year ago, one would have had to ask for a home equity loan to buy 2 GB of RAM. Today, you can buy top quality 2 x 1 GB RAM for less than 3 C notes.
They should ban you from these forums for life for saying such thingsTiny said:
.You can get around the ddr333 issue by dropping the multiplier and HT multiplier, and then increasing the HTT speed to about 240-250 or so. That would still run your cpu at stock, would bring your memory to stock ddr400, but would overclock your bus speed by a small margin.
Considering that most modern A64 chipsets are designed to handle htt up to 330MHz, there's no danger to to running at 240 instead of 200.
Another idea would be to get your head on straight and overclock that puppy.
(cf)Eclipse
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two things:
1. there's no telling if your memory controller can actually handle 4 sticks at 200mhz. some don't, thus the 166mhz, 2T rating.
2. show me a via based K8 board that consistantly does >240mhz
1. there's no telling if your memory controller can actually handle 4 sticks at 200mhz. some don't, thus the 166mhz, 2T rating.
2. show me a via based K8 board that consistantly does >240mhz
(cf)Eclipse said:two things:
1. there's no telling if your memory controller can actually handle 4 sticks at 200mhz. some don't, thus the 166mhz, 2T rating.
2. show me a via based K8 board that consistantly does >240mhz
Eclipse, my man. You write beautiful guides, but your language is tainted by these nasty spelling errors. Come on man, at least spell check stuff.
I have 2 sticks of 512mb Corsair XMS 3200CPT and a friend is giving me two more of this same memory. So right now i am running 2.5-3-3-6-1T @ 225mhz (1:1). If make my system 4x512mb will I be able to maintain 225mhz(1:1). I know I have to give up the 1T but thats fine I just want to make sure I wont have any issues with my overclock decreasing.
Please respond to my post with the understanding that I do not concern myself with OVERCLOCKING.
Ok.. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but what you are saying is that
the 1T: 92FPS was acheived with 2x1024MB PC3200 sticks running @ 200mhz with 1t timing
the 2T: 90fps was acheived with 4x512MB PC3200 that, because of an amd limitation, get dropped to 166mhz
Is that the definitiona of a signifigant performance hit? 2FPS? a little over 2% performance degradation from a 16% memory frequency drop, and a doubled "tick" time?
Even more of a hit [not] Less than 1% performance hit by a 16% frequency drop
I was not aware that the amd64 memory controller was so crappy that It could not properly handle 4 main stream memory modules. With this being the case, I would say that it would have been advisable for amd to ... softly discourage ... 4 slot motherboards. - People are GOING to put 4 sticks of ram in them. This information about the processor limitations is NOT publicly disclosed on amd.com - I'm sure it's buried in some white paper. I know for a fact that MY motherboard manual doesn't tell me that, nor does the owners manual that came with any of the AMD64 cpu's I've purchased.
It is, in my opinion, a very poor design if I can buy a motherboard with 4 memory slots on it, buy an amd processor, and pick up say.. 4 sticks of kingston 512mb PC3200 / 200mhz and it's not even going to run at 200mhz because of a cpu limitation, unless I buy a "special" cpu - Revision E [so, what, there were 4 more fuckups that I don't know about?]
Should I be waiting for the Revision QRP a64-3500+ cpu to come out?
robberbaron said:
Ok.. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but what you are saying is that
the 1T: 92FPS was acheived with 2x1024MB PC3200 sticks running @ 200mhz with 1t timing
the 2T: 90fps was acheived with 4x512MB PC3200 that, because of an amd limitation, get dropped to 166mhz
Is that the definitiona of a signifigant performance hit? 2FPS? a little over 2% performance degradation from a 16% memory frequency drop, and a doubled "tick" time?
Even more of a hit [not] Less than 1% performance hit by a 16% frequency drop
I was not aware that the amd64 memory controller was so crappy that It could not properly handle 4 main stream memory modules. With this being the case, I would say that it would have been advisable for amd to ... softly discourage ... 4 slot motherboards. - People are GOING to put 4 sticks of ram in them. This information about the processor limitations is NOT publicly disclosed on amd.com - I'm sure it's buried in some white paper. I know for a fact that MY motherboard manual doesn't tell me that, nor does the owners manual that came with any of the AMD64 cpu's I've purchased.
It is, in my opinion, a very poor design if I can buy a motherboard with 4 memory slots on it, buy an amd processor, and pick up say.. 4 sticks of kingston 512mb PC3200 / 200mhz and it's not even going to run at 200mhz because of a cpu limitation, unless I buy a "special" cpu - Revision E [so, what, there were 4 more fuckups that I don't know about?]
Should I be waiting for the Revision QRP a64-3500+ cpu to come out?
(cf)Eclipse
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er, why do you say that. even at 2T, the K8's bandwidth efficiency and latency is far better than any intel or K7 based mobo at equivilent speeds and timings. hardly "crappy" in my bookMalogato said:
(cf)Eclipse said:er, why do you say that. even at 2T, the K8's bandwidth efficiency and latency is far better than any intel or K7 based mobo at equivilent speeds and timings. hardly "crappy" in my book
My question was two-fold.
1ST)
If I put 4 quantity, 2-3-2-6-1T, (Pc3200) 200/400Mhz, double sided 512mb ram modules into a motherboard..
What will be my memory configuration?
2-3-2-6-2T - 200mhz - 2,048
or
will the 200mhz drop to something slower, like 166/333mhz [PC2700]
[which was what I infered by the posting].
That's why I said... "correct me if I"m wrong"
My 2nd question was
2-3-2-6-1T gives 92/109 FPS
but
2-3-2-6-2T gives 90/108 FPS
And that difference is called a performance hit? I consider that .. "random power fluctuation"
If the 2T ram is running @ not only a higher "T" time, [instead of 1T] but is also running at a lower FREQUENCY.. [say 200/400 vs 166/333] then, honestly, I'd say that it shows that 2T is actually superior.
If 200MHZ, 2-3-2-6-1T Gives 92/109
and
If 166MHZ, 2-3-2-6-2T gives 90/108....
That would lead one to believe (I'm sure.. incorrectly.. that.. )
200MHZ , 2-3-2-6-2T would give.. oh, 94/112
I think it's "Crappy" that the the processor cannot run 4 memory modules at their full speed. It's not a chipset, or memory limitation. It's an AMD, integrated memory controller limitation.
Just imagine what would happen if those 4 memory modules were not "crippled" by the fact that the amd processor is not living up to IT's full potential.
Comparing it to completely different architectures abilities is irrelevant. - the K7 and P4 platforms are not the same design.
If the power the CPU had to run 2 chips was able to CARRY OVER to 4 chips.. it would be an improved design.
This of course has been addressed in the rev-E cpu's.. as is my understanding.
The "hits" that are shown don't seem even important, but it makes me wonder what would have happened if the chip could REALLY handle 4 memory modules.
If I am misunderstanding the "problem" with the cpu.. I'll be more than happy to be corrected.
But, to reiterate.. My understanding is that
2 x 512mb PC-3200, 200Mhz/400Mhz 2-3-2-6-1T modules will run at their native speed..
but
If you stick 4 of them in, you're going to get something like 166/333 [or, i dunno.. 180/360..whichever], 2-3-2-6-2T which means the memory ultimately becomes "slower, crappier ram" but not through any fault of the motherboard, OR ram... I mean... I don't think paying for 4 512MB pc3200's and getting 4 512mb PC2700s on my system as a bonus.
(Which is why 2x1024 is the 'smarter' choice than 4x512 - if you don't have a revision E cpu, that is)