"They Wonder Why People Don't Make PC Games Any More"

It's sad that the only industry that is seriously threatened is the only industry that can't start protecting itself against piracy. With the RIAA it's only a matter of "Oh noes our profits are 20,000% instead of 30,000%!" Game pirating is really harmful to the industry, and the people who don't buy game are really screwing over the people who do buy them, because game sales pay for the game's support. I really hate that the money I paid for a game goes to funding two other guys who didn't pay for it.

Chombo said:
Thats definitely the worst idea ever. The only reason I haven't purchased Half Life 2 Episode whatever is because it requires registration and I will not pay any ISPs for their overpriced service.
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So... how are you on the internet again?

BUT TEH GAME HAS TEH BUGZ
You play old school cartage games? Shit was riddled with bugs and horrible translations, and there was no XBL to download patches, you just dealt with it. This isn’t exactly a new problem, and demanding a perfect product is unrealistic. You can name anything and someone somewhere can bitch about it
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This argument is so dumb. "Gee really? Maybe because no one paid for it!" If you don't like the product, don't buy it. The fact that you play means that you are a hypocrite.
 
I don't see what the big deal is. Some of the most pirated PC games out there are also the most bought.

Tons of people pirated The Sims, Quake and Unreal Tournment series, Half-life, Oblivion (still sold millions), The Witcher (sold 1 mil at least), CoD games (sold millions), BF2 (one of the most played FPS games), BF2142 etc. I could go on but I think you get the idea.

Great (mostly online) games and very advertised games will sell well even if a million people download cracked copies. Even single player games like Prey, Oblivion, The Witcher and Bioshock did really well and they had little to no multiplayer and were all easily cracked and very downloaded.

I bought all my favorite games of the past few years (Prey, DoDS, Orange Box, ETQW, SupCom, etc.) but I would never pay even 10 bucks for the majority of games released, just like I wouldn't pay for most movies. Why? Because they suck. If I pay 60 bucks plus 15% on a game only to find out it sucks, I'll feel like an idiot. I don't know how normal people do it. Either you need very low standards or you go back to the store to return a game every week. If I play a game for more than a couple of hours and enjoy it (SupCom, ETQW, DoDS, etc.) I'll go buy it...preferably off STEAM so I don't have to look for updates, change DVDs, etc.

Also, I'd like to point out that a LOT of people who download games buy them if they find them cheap. TONS of people bought good games from STEAM at 10-30 bucks even after having finished them. If a game is worth money, pirates will be the first to give them recognition and spread the word because they play ALL games, big, small and independant, unlike average people who only know about the huge games with tons of advertising.
 
Is it just me, or am I not seeing a single number in that "article"
 
This is only in response to the "pirating hurts the industry" argument. Countless people have "pirated" countless copies of countless games. The industry is still here and doing well (subjectively).

If more people paid the $50-$60 per title, it would NOT bring prices down. If anything it would drive them HIGHER because the industry would believe people are ok with paying that much. Supply and demand don't work here because the supply (digital) is infinite.
 
So I was on this russian facebook, in xbox 360 forum, and all they talk about is where to get new updated firmware and where they can get pirated 360 games.

And in PC gaming forum... ehhh, I just hope that no game developer sees what they talk about there :(
 
So... if console games are "impossible" or more difficult to copy, why are they just as expensive as PC games? There's clearly not as much pirating going on in the console market as in the PC market according to you guys.

I'd also like to reiterate what Big D said. Piracy is only going to hurt crappy games(since you'll know they're crappy, and thus avoid them) and possibly purely singleplayer games(such as oblivion, but then again, that did extremely well, so...). If someone pirates a game, likes it, and then wants to play it online, then they'll most likely buy it. And since most games, especially FPS games, provide more playing time online than off, this should be the case for most games.

Also, saying pirates are immoral in all areas is too sweeping of a statement. Some will preview the game by copying it illegally, and then buy it if it's good, or stop playing if it's bad. It's like an old business model where someone would release a program for others to use, and the users would donate if they liked the program or thought the author deserved it. There will always be leeches, but this way the producer actually gets what they deserve, to an extent. Some will, of course, never pay for anything they aren't forced to pay for. However, most multiplayer systems do a pretty good job of making sure people are legitimate(see previous posts). If Activision failed to verify online users, then sure they're not directly to blame for pirates playing online and never buying the game, but they have no room to whine if they made a stupid/naive decision.
 
I buy all the music and movies and games I get hold of, I'm a good and honest man, but I'm also unemployed because of muscle problems and as a result, poor. That doesn't keep me from tending to my many expensive hobbies, so I was thinking about picking up Call of Duty 4 after reading page after page of how good it was in so many forums so I opened up Steam, e-card in my virtual hand and..

$69.95 for CoD4?

No thanks.
 
ShagnWagn said:
This is only in response to the "pirating hurts the industry" argument. Countless people have "pirated" countless copies of countless games. The industry is still here and doing well (subjectively).
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Tell that to Ion Storm, Looking Glass and Troika. Yeah, they are all dead, and they all made excellent games too. Companies that try to innovate gameplay die, while companies that churn out massmarketed games such as Madden 'XX becomes gigantic.

There's a reason why we keep seeing "non-gamer" games on the top charts, such as The Sims. The casual users buy the stuff. I'm certain that if everyone actually bought their PC games, The Sims wouldn't be near the top of the charts.

Andrew_Carr said:
So... if console games are "impossible" or more difficult to copy, why are they just as expensive as PC games? There's clearly not as much pirating going on in the console market as in the PC market according to you guys.
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Because Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony is getting a share from each sold game. It's on the games they get the money, and is why they are prepared to sell the consoles with a loss at launch.
 
Same thing goes on in movies and to a certain degree music. You won't get anywhere with a new original production that the reviewers fawn upon and the public doesn't get into, you will make millions and millions with dime a dozen crap that has a big name and lots of hype attached to it and you will keep getting contracts to produce more because your shitty shit sold.

CoD4 seems to be really good shit, have a big name, and sell really well, it's just that it's also pirated real well, and from what I can see the crackers broke their verification system and server files pretty fast.


and in my country, console games are actually 15-25% more expensive than their PC equivalents. Nobody has figured out why it is like that yet.
 
sfsuphysics said:
"Don't get me wrong I'm not condoning piracy, but crying that pirates are ruining it for everyone mentality does get a bit old. Hell didn't microsoft drop the cost of Windows Vista in china to like a couple bucks to combat piracy? Obviously they're not hurting that much if they're selling copies for that cheap, so let us good ol' Westerners pick up the slack!
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Microsoft has a shitload of money. Game developers are one or two bad games away from extinction. Every little bit hurts, so fuck piracy, and fuck pirates.
 
wow I wish I could pay $50 for a pc game and then still bitch about how much it costs. In Australia we are paying $100 per pc game and $120 per xbox360 game. Last time I checked $50 usd was only $56.42 aud.

Therefore can we please stop bitching about how much PC games cost when in other countries, people are paying nearly double of what you pay for the exact same thing.
 
Both game and music industry need to look in the mirror with piracy - they pumped the prices so high that people can't afford to pay for them.

And it's a complete fallacy to assume everyone who pirates would buy it otherwise. It's not true - most couldn't simply afford the product.

Consoles are popular with developers because consoles have a 20% premium in the game price i.e. even more ridiculously priced.
 
When it comes to pirating console games, they are RIGHT in the damn open around here. In Toronto, I can easily find places that will sell or will modify ANY console on request. Once your console is modified, it's up to you to download or buy the games dirt cheap, albeit copied from the same place.

When I was in Hong Kong, for some damn reason I had a knack for finding these places too. I found whole shopping malls (bigger than what you would find in North America, seriously) that would have dedicated stores to wii, ps2, ps3, and even XBox 360. There was one mall in particular that specialized in console modding. Floor 1 Wii, Floor 2 PS2, Floor 3 PS3...

Seriously developers need to get out of their holes and realize that for all the numbers you get that are legitimate sales, I'm willing to bet that there is at least double that in "pirated" sales. Take HK, it's only got 7 million people there, but they supply a lot of what goes out to the world, or at least is a hub for that stuff. I find the same stuff in San Francisco or New York or Toronto, albeit at higher prices BUT the same stuff I found in HK.

If anything, due to the popularity of consoles, I'm thinking there are MORE pirated games on consoles than there are on PC. It's just consoles have equally a larger paying legitimate base too...
 
tisb0b said:
wow I wish I could pay $50 for a pc game and then still bitch about how much it costs. In Australia we are paying $100 per pc game and $120 per xbox360 game. Last time I checked $50 usd was only $56.42 aud.

Therefore can we please stop bitching about how much PC games cost when in other countries, people are paying nearly double of what you pay for the exact same thing.
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Ebay. You can buy games at our prices. Though shipping might be a bitch.
 
ShagnWagn said:
I agree with the other posters in this thread. The inflated prices of games is its own deterrent. The game industry seems even more greedy than the music industry let alone the movie studios. The reason I think this is because even when you buy a game directly from the manufacturer, they still charge the same price as going to the local store. They cut out the "fat cats" and middle-men, why is it still $50-$60?? This would be like music artists getting the full $15 from a music CD instead of the <$0.10 they are getting now. Movie and music studios pay their actors and artists tens of millions of dollars let alone everybody else in the food trough. But they are charging 3-4 times more for games? :confused:
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The reason why they, the devs, still charge full price is that the part of the money that would've gone to the middle-men goes to the devs instead. So the devs get more money/profit out of their own work. People are willing to pay full price for games if they know that more of the profits are going to the devs.
 
I am not surprised at this fact. In fact I personally believe that the pirates are not the pirate. You say what? But I have had enough of these games companies stealing money from us, the user, on the price of the games. It is these companies that are raping, pillaging and plundering our hard earned income.

You ask for proof.

Steam has COD4 for US$49.95
And where I live in Australia it is (on Steam) $88.50

Using xe.com’s converter US$49.95 = AU$56.6655 ( rate at working out was 1 AUD = 0.881488 USD)

Now if my maths is remembered correctly that is an increase of 56.18%, and I say WTF?

Now I am not against paying for a game or music or movies or tv shows, but I am against paying more than everyone else in the world. Hence my comment that the pirates are not the pirates we should be concerned with.

Then you ask for proof.

Australian COD4 Steam page
http://storefront.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=game&AppId=7940&cc=au

American COD4 steam page
http://storefront.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=game&AppId=7940&cc=us

You do the maths...
 
TopGun said:
It may be true but if people want to pirate they'll pirate.
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What the hell does that mean? What has happened to simple values? It's okay to steal because people will do it? It's okay to use things for free because you wouldn't have bought it anyway? It's okay to steal because they charge too much?

Basically, in all cases, someone else is paying your way. Whether it's taxpayers, legitimate customers, people who can't find work because production has been decreased due to lack of revenues, etc. etc. etc. Catch a crotch disease and die, freeloaders.

If you think you're hurting rich people, you're dead wrong. If you think you're not hurting anyone, you're just a moron.

This rant applies to games, movies, music, health care, high paying jobs, money for losing your house in a hurricane...anything people these days think they're entitled to because other people have them. While you go off on your trips to Vegas, drink your weekends away, pimp your rides, talk on your fake-jewel encrusted MotoRAZR... you go on to complain about how you can't afford health insurance, video games, CDs, food for your kids, savings accounts, retirement, a shower. It's no one else's responsibility to pick up the slack you create with your financially moronic behavior. Those of us who work crappy jobs, don't waste money on frivilous vacations and obscene amounts of alcohol, save every penny for every game, CD, Christmas presents, and future concessions (like retirement or the unknown demon lurking around every corner that could give you things like cancer or a burned down house) end up having to carry your sorry asses around while you enjoy everything we have to pass on.

Screw you.



Ahhhhh...I feel much better :D
 
Elipsn said:
You know, I realize I'm going to get flamed to all hell for this, but here goes:

I consider the video game industry a lot like the movie, and music industrys.

They demand profits that far exceed the value of their product. When a game is priced at 50 bucks or so no wonder people say to hell with that, it should be 5. I view this as a fault of the publishers, not the developers..

The video game industry is a racket. Lets create one copy of intellectual property, and sell rights to use copy's of that original copy, regardless of the fact that it cost us practically nothing to produce more copy's...That system is FUBAR! It looks attractive when you're the one making the profit, but the profit isn't justified. The fact is, until reasonable prices for games are charged (and by reasonable, I'd say 2-3 bucks for the cardboard and media, and then perhaps another 2-3 bucks for the game/software/intellectual property.) piracy will continue to occur - and it should.

The belief that its alright to MASSIVELY overcharge the end user of intellectual property, be it games, movies, or music - is flat out wrong. The only reason its still done today is because publishers have gotten away with it in the past.

Treat your customer fair, and they will treat you fair, by actually paying you for the product.
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Hey buddy, have you played the game and finished it? Did you see the entire credits roll down (if you didn't, it was as long as a movie credit roll)? You think those people get paid peanuts?

If you do research on the gaming industry, the vast majority of products are money losers (I think it was something like, over 60%). Sure you can say that it is because there are many crappy games out there, which is partly true. But what about games like Beyond Good & Evil, Psychonauts, Zack & Wiki, etc.? What is sold is based on a combination of content appeal/trends/accessibility/advertising/etc... if you have all of those things and then happen to have quality content, you might have a best seller. This is exactly WHY companies usually don't take risks and why we have a billion World War II games in the past few years.

Top quality games usually require dozens of people (recently, even over 100 or 200) to work on them and easily takes over 1 year of development. You have to factor that, in addition to the cost of advertising, the chunk that the publisher takes out, etc. etc.
 
circlework said:
I am not surprised at this fact. In fact I personally believe that the pirates are not the pirate. You say what? But I have had enough of these games companies stealing money from us, the user, on the price of the games. It is these companies that are raping, pillaging and plundering our hard earned income.

You ask for proof.

Steam has COD4 for US$49.95
And where I live in Australia it is (on Steam) $88.50

Using xe.com’s converter US$49.95 = AU$56.6655 ( rate at working out was 1 AUD = 0.881488 USD)

Now if my maths is remembered correctly that is an increase of 56.18%, and I say WTF?

Now I am not against paying for a game or music or movies or tv shows, but I am against paying more than everyone else in the world. Hence my comment that the pirates are not the pirates we should be concerned with.

Then you ask for proof.

Australian COD4 Steam page
http://storefront.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=game&AppId=7940&cc=au

American COD4 steam page
http://storefront.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=game&AppId=7940&cc=us

You do the maths...
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Hey now, translation work costs alot of money.




/kidding
 
I'm of the general consensus if games were reasonably priced, perhaps more will buy. Wait, they aren't reasonably priced. Take the previous COD4 example. That's been blatant to Canadian's all this time. A more prominent example is the Z06, why is it $74000 in the US and $105000 in CAD. Last I recall most of the parts are made in Canada but assembled in the states. The price difference goes from all cars, to clothes to shoes to VIDEO GAMES.

While in the USA, you may enjoy "reasonable" pricing, the rest of the world is shafted. Anywhere from 10% to 50% more, for a few items even DOUBLE the price. Add to that the rest of the world DOESN'T have the income the US has, yet is bombarded by US marketing saying live like us and have stuff like us, just not have the money like us, and you find people put in a situation where pirating and counterfeiting is the only way to get a semblance of said life.
 
I'm getting kind of annoyed at all the comments about games being too expensive and publishers soaking up all the profits.

Who the hell do you think provides the upfront costs to create the games in the first place? A publisher. Who takes on the risk that millions of dollars will end up in the trash if the game doesn't do well, or gets canceled? A publisher.

Making games is NOT cheap. Examples, Gears of War cost $10 MILLION dollars to create, and that is considered "cheap" nowadays. Divide that by $50/game and the company has to sell at minimum 200,000 copies just to break even (At the completely idiotic idea that games should be $5/each it would require 2,000,000 games sold). And that is for a game that was considered "cheap" to make! Now, most games aren't going to be smash hits, and a lot of games will take a loss. Also on the topic of the "expensive" middle man. The publisher for Gears of War made a measly 1.5% of the games sales. Great, cutting out the "middle man" would mean games could be $1 cheaper! :rolleyes:

(sources: http://www.gamepro.com/news.cfm?article_id=96188 and http://www.garagegames.com/blogs/37536/11924 )
 
It's kind of funny but I don't know anyone who has pirated COD4. A bunch of people at work have 360's and they all bought COD4, and I bought it myself even though I usually HATE FPS games on the console, but it's actually a lot of fun.

I know people who bought it for 360 AND PC!

I usually know someone who has pirated a game but in this case I don't know of a single person.

Of course, I have a good job now and work with people who make good money and can afford to buy games instead of pirate them. I bought Gears of War on 360, didn't like it, and bought it for PC. I bought Crysis, The Orange Box, CoD4, Forza 2, Oblivion, Battefield 2, and there are many other games I'll be buying in the near future even though sometimes the prices are too high. I can afford it.

I think pirating a game is fine to see if you even like it, but if you do like it and play it a lot you should go out and buy it, even if it's months later. I think I started playing Battlefield 1942 by downloading it, but when I realized it was good and I was going to play it a lot I bought it. Too many times a game has looked good on the surface but I buy it and dislike it and never touch it after a half hour. Gears of War was like this. I supported them by getting it for the 360, then when I didn't like the controls I bought it on PC, and I've played it less on the PC than I did on the 360 because even with a keyboard and mouse I'm still not a big fan. That's $100ca down the drain to support a game TWICE that I don't even care for. I suppose I should retry it with my new pc because it might run better and be more enjoyable.
 
Oh and yeah, pirated copies shouldn't be working on legitimate servers. People usually either: (1) crack the server files so that the authentication server isn't accessed or (2) reverse engineer the server software by analyzing data packets that are sent between client/server and write up software that mimics the real server software (common for cracked MMO servers).
 
Slade said:
If anything, due to the popularity of consoles, I'm thinking there are MORE pirated games on consoles than there are on PC. It's just consoles have equally a larger paying legitimate base too...
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World-wide, there are actually more people who own PC's able to play Crysis than there are people who own PS3's or 360's combined.
 
circlework said:
I am not surprised at this fact. In fact I personally believe that the pirates are not the pirate. You say what? But I have had enough of these games companies stealing money from us, the user, on the price of the games. It is these companies that are raping, pillaging and plundering our hard earned income.

You ask for proof.

Steam has COD4 for US$49.95
And where I live in Australia it is (on Steam) $88.50

Using xe.com’s converter US$49.95 = AU$56.6655 ( rate at working out was 1 AUD = 0.881488 USD)

Now if my maths is remembered correctly that is an increase of 56.18%, and I say WTF?

Now I am not against paying for a game or music or movies or tv shows, but I am against paying more than everyone else in the world. Hence my comment that the pirates are not the pirates we should be concerned with.

Then you ask for proof.

Australian COD4 Steam page
http://storefront.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=game&AppId=7940&cc=au

American COD4 steam page
http://storefront.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=game&AppId=7940&cc=us

You do the maths...
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Man you guys do get assraped on prices.
 
I only download a game to see if it is runnable on my PC without hassle and if its worth a buy. If I like how it works then I buy it. I have CoD4 for 360 and PC.
 
Slade said:
I'm of the general consensus if games were reasonably priced, perhaps more will buy. Wait, they aren't reasonably priced. Take the previous COD4 example. That's been blatant to Canadian's all this time. A more prominent example is the Z06, why is it $74000 in the US and $105000 in CAD. Last I recall most of the parts are made in Canada but assembled in the states. The price difference goes from all cars, to clothes to shoes to VIDEO GAMES.

While in the USA, you may enjoy "reasonable" pricing, the rest of the world is shafted. Anywhere from 10% to 50% more, for a few items even DOUBLE the price. Add to that the rest of the world DOESN'T have the income the US has, yet is bombarded by US marketing saying live like us and have stuff like us, just not have the money like us, and you find people put in a situation where pirating and counterfeiting is the only way to get a semblance of said life.
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Uh, you know what we get shafted for drug prices that is much more important and costly. So until you Canadians start paying more for American researched medicine, you can enjoy paying more for the games :D
 
This is one of those games that is worth buying, it was the first pc game I bought in a long time. This is not because I have a lot of money, but it is actually a good game and from a great dev studio Infinity Ward rocks. I would prob be in the minority here by saying this, but if a good solid game is made it is worth buying. What kills me is all these crappy games are put out like the transformers game where companies get millions of dollars to develop, but all they do is mimic almost exactly what the movie is about..... they are junk and should not be bought (not pirated, i mean not even played) especially when you could have a wonderful game,


Maye originality guys if any one is listening...
 
Way too many piracy "apologists" in this thread.

Asking what's wrong/not wrong with it is a moot point. The point is you're stealing something. Wether or not you see something wrong with that is entirely up to your conscience.
 
circlework said:
I am not surprised at this fact. In fact I personally believe that the pirates are not the pirate. You say what? But I have had enough of these games companies stealing money from us, the user, on the price of the games. It is these companies that are raping, pillaging and plundering our hard earned income.

You ask for proof.

Steam has COD4 for US$49.95
And where I live in Australia it is (on Steam) $88.50

Using xe.com’s converter US$49.95 = AU$56.6655 ( rate at working out was 1 AUD = 0.881488 USD)

Now if my maths is remembered correctly that is an increase of 56.18%, and I say WTF?

Now I am not against paying for a game or music or movies or tv shows, but I am against paying more than everyone else in the world. Hence my comment that the pirates are not the pirates we should be concerned with.

Then you ask for proof.

Australian COD4 Steam page
http://storefront.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=game&AppId=7940&cc=au

American COD4 steam page
http://storefront.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=game&AppId=7940&cc=us

You do the maths...
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I have no idea why it's so much in Australia. Neither do you. By charging so much, they'll be losing a lot of sales. Which is what I have to say to people that think something costs too much: don't buy it! There are millions of things you can spend your money on where you won't feel like you're getting raped. If you feel like you're getting raped buying video games, it's your own fault. No one is holding any guns to your heads. You can choose not to get raped if you wanted to.

Stealing just makes the price go higher. You know. To make up for the thefts.
 
i have no sympathy for game developers/ software companies.

just do the math, gears of war was used as an example, 10m to make over 4m copies sold for 50-60$ each.

you get to 10 million really quick with a metric shit ton left over.

i would love to see these numbers they talk about but wont show. makes it really not so "astounding"


chances are it is no more pirated then any other game.
 
What I say to the devs, "Boo Hoo the world is such a bad place for you, OMG people pirate your game/s, it is like the worst life in the world, I mean seriously go live in Sudan or Kenya and then report back to me on how bad life is because of the amazement of how many people pirate your game/s!"
 
It's funny how people say don't buy and it'll send a message... what about the messages that people who do buy send to those that can't buy? It's a double standard, you say don't buy, but will rub it in to those that if you aren't in or don't have this etc, you are inferior...

One doesn't have to go far to see how hard marketing is pushed on us...
 
We'll I was waiting for somene to say this or post it, but it hasn't been posted. Most likely due to the fact that half the people who post here were probably 10-14yrs old in age when I read these articles or when the systems themselve's were released.

Anyway, I remember reading back in the early 90's ...around 94-95...maybe a bit earlier in each of the 3 big gaming mags (EGM, Gamepro & Next Gen) I used to read regularly an article about how games were going to get cheaper in the future once the cd based systems took a foothold on the industry.

All three articles I recall all mentioned about the same thing on the issue of game prices and how cd media would lower them, even quoting pricing from publisher's saying that your most expensive games would be $34.95-39.95. That's your Tier1 titles like COD4, Mass Effect, GOW, MGS4,Madden and so on. Your tier 2-4 games being the lower budget, quality, advertised, etc would only be $15-25 bucks.

Today budget titels cost the same as your top seller's and always have for the most part with the exception of a few titles. A lot of us who are the so called "hardcore gamers" pick and choose our titles and hold the publishers/dev's to a certain quality or set of standards and don't buy the crap games.

Your avg gamer doesn't have those same set of standards and would buy/enjoy a lot of the less spectacular titles that are released if it wasn't for the high price tags. You'd be suprised at what children and casual's gamers will enjoy that a large part of the gaming community consider's utter crap.

They play the game casually and enjoy it for pure fun, not demanding tight controls, sound, bugg-free gameplay or dazzling graphics/effects. I've watched numerous friends and family members/kids play games that I wouldn't give a 2nd look or would be bored out of my mind with. They could sell more of these titles as well as the AAA titles if prices were more budget friendly.

These prices have never come to pass and have only gotten more expensive as time as went on. I do understand that as the economy get's better worse prices fluctuate and as time goes on, everything get's more expensive b/c of rising gas prices and so on.

I just don't see it being a necessasity that all games are $50-60 bucks and some collector's editions hitting $70-$100. I know games take a lot of people, time, effort and it's people's hard work put into them and I truely value them being paid for their work. I don't agree with the publisher's ripping consumer's left and right to make massive and record profits trying to squeeze the most they can out of every last item the produce for sale.

Let's say 100 of us were to get together from [H] forums and we all had the technical knowledge and know how to create a game for pc/console or both. It doesn't matter whether it's an average game or a techinical wonder but it's at least a good game. Let's say we produced the game and it cost us $22,000 to produce the game, theoretically.

Now let's say we could sell 1000 copies of the game at $50 like most of your console/pc games sell for which would net us $50,000 and split by 100 people we'd each get $500 measily bucks.

Now let's say we lower the price to like $30 and because of the reduced price we're able to sell 3500 copies b/c the price is more reasonable for the average consumer, kids etc. We now have a profite of $105,000 over double our original profit and everyone get's $1050 each for their said time/effort/work.

Hmmm, amazing isn't it that if the game industry were to pull their heads out of their said asses, fire their bean counters and get a clue, things would be better for them and for the consumer. So let's say they sell 1million copies of the GOW2 when it's released at $60 bucks, which is $60million. Say they sell it at $35 I"m sure they'd sell 2.5 or more b/c of the reduced price bringing in $87.5 million dollars.

I've always said that if you offer something a value that most people can relate to or afford you'll sell 3-5 times as many at a slightly reduced cost and make more money, than if you milked every last nickle you could out of the product by increasing the price by 50% or more and selling 1/5 of the product.

Game company's make a fortune of their huge titles and take a loss on a lot of budget titles, yet they don't charge budget prices. It only takes a little common sense imho to get more people to buy your games and fix your piracy issues if you're willing to see the light and do something about it.

Doing something about it shouldn't require your consumer's to have to deal with DRM issues, secure-rom, steam, etc to play/install a game or to make a legitimate back up of a title they own. Backup's are nice when you have children by the way or for some people who don't take care of something they borrow/own b/c they think little of money or things in general.

This is why I wait for games to drop to the bargin bin or lower to a discounted price before buying them like I used too, with a few exceptions. I do have the means but I don't see the need/desire to pay an exorbitant amount for something apon release. It will be the same game in 6months -1yr when the price is half or less and I will or will not enjoy it the same.

So why not release the title at that same price point and sell 5-10x as many copies making record profits/sales on release day? Their business model definitely needs some work and they need to hire some finacial adviser's with common sense and knowledge of the average consumer.

/Rant off
 
Companies need to let go of their out-dated distribution models and embrace online distribution (like Steam.) It should be cheaper to get the games to customers since they don't have to pay for the manufacture, assembly, and delivery of CDs, CD cases, manuals, inserts, boxes, or retail shelf space. Those savings should, at least in part, be passed on to the customer.
 
gesicht said:
i have no sympathy for game developers/ software companies.

just do the math, gears of war was used as an example, 10m to make over 4m copies sold for 50-60$ each.

you get to 10 million really quick with a metric shit ton left over
Click to expand...

You do understand that if you go into <store that sells games and junk> and plop down $67.32 or whatever for a game, that money doesn't go via the magical underground railroad of customer reaming straight to the big bad developer's castle of terror where he rolls around in it cackling with delight... right? Just wanted to make sure.

A lot of different things go into getting a game out there on the shelf for you to buy it. All of the people who do all of those things expect a cut. That isn't pure developer profit. Also, none of these places are a charity for your enjoyment. They expect a big cut.

Don't get me wrong, I think games are getting a tad too pricey. Obviously inflation and increased development costs will result in games not costing the same as they did in years past, but 360 and PS3 games, in particular, seem to be going beyond that rate and just into milking the customer on some titles. Now, with that said, this "Games should cost $5, because I work at McDonalds and that is all I can afford and if they cost more I will pirate them and be angry about it" and "My legislature likes to get a cut of anything coming in and game developers should take that in stride, because I am damn well not paying for it!" crap is silly. It is an entertainment business, not a lifeline service. They want to sell you something and the only thing it is up to them to do is make it something you want to buy.

Again I am not totally on the side of developers/publishers/wallmart-gametops here. I personally think it is total crap that pirates who paid nothing often get a BETTER experience than I, as a paying consumer, get. Why do I have to dig up my CD when I want to play the game? Is that really a viable method of copy protection in the age of broadband and massive storage? Why am I stuck with SecruRom malware? Why do I have to watch stupid "You wouldn't steal a car, would you?" ads when A) I already paid for this movie so why are you calling me a theif and B) If you want me to be honest, I probably would download a Bugatti into my garage if I could. Why do I get CDs that make me go through hoops to get them on my iPod while the guy who just downloaded it doesn't? Etc. If they want more people to buy the game the real deal should be better in every way possible. No crap 3 page manuals, no annoying copy protection, maybe add some extra features etc.

But even with all that it doesn't just make it ok to pirate stuff.

* The quotes above were made up from things I have read not just in this thread by from all of the collected tubes of the intranetz combined.
** It is ok to pirate Metalica music just because I hate them... Lars in particular.
*** I expect someone to start work on the car to garage download technology asap. Go!!
 
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