Upgrade GTX 460 to ? for 1440p?

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Citizen _insane

Gawd
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Right now I'm running an MSI Talon Attack GTX 460 and I'm getting a 1440p monitor. With only 1gb of ram, I'm guessing the 460 will not be up to the task. I'd like to keep the price around $200.

From what I've read it seems the Radeon 7870 would be a good choice because of the high memory bandwidth. Comparing it to the 660 (non-ti) in BF3 (the only game I play where FPS matters really) it beats the Radeon by a good margin. I think those benchmarks were at 1200p, not 1440.

SLI is not an option, my mobo will drop a 2nd PCI-E card down to 8x, didn't realize it when I bought it, but too late now, I'm not upgrading everything.
 
Citizen _insane said:
Right now I'm running an MSI Talon Attack GTX 460 and I'm getting a 1440p monitor. With only 1gb of ram, I'm guessing the 460 will not be up to the task. I'd like to keep the price around $200.

From what I've read it seems the Radeon 7870 would be a good choice because of the high memory bandwidth. Comparing it to the 660 (non-ti) in BF3 (the only game I play where FPS matters really) it beats the Radeon by a good margin. I think those benchmarks were at 1200p, not 1440.

SLI is not an option, my mobo will drop a 2nd PCI-E card down to 8x, didn't realize it when I bought it, but too late now, I'm not upgrading everything.
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That 8x isn't going to demolish your performance at all, but if you're looking for a good card, I'd go with what JTC428 says: the 7950. Even better would be a single 7970.
 
JTC428 said:
Do you have some sort of a budget? You could get a 3gb 7950 for rather cheap now. Plus they're running the never settle thing too with 3 free games.

$279 AR + 3 games http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202006
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As stated in my OP, my budget is around $200. I'd prefer not to jump into the $300 range. I've been buying at the $200 price point for the last 10 years and I haven't personally felt that the performance gains were worth it by going higher. However, if 1440p is going to be drastically more load than a 7870 or 660 can handle, I'm okay with spending a bit more (I'm a cheapskate, not poor :p).

I've looked at the 7950, but in the benchmarks that I've seen it looks like the main advantage of the card is being able to crank up the AF and AA to higher values and that's about it. I don't mind turning down some of the eye candy. I'm currently very happy with how BF3 looks on my 1200p monitor with my 460.

Mostly I will be playing Eve, BF3 and DayZ. (Which means BF3 is the main GPU taxer, I don't play any single player games).
 
At minimum I would say a 6950/7850/GTX660 (and these all sit at the $150-200 price point). However, you wouldn't be able to max out all your games. If you can afford a 1440p monitor, then you can afford a 7950/GTX670. And that will allow you to crank up the settings at that resolution.
 
The monitor is only $300, it's not that expensive. Spending more on a graphics card than on a monitor seems silly to me. Spending $400 on a graphics card seems insane (I realize I'm the minority here :D).

Looking at the HARDOCP 2012 roundup, BF3 is more than playable at 2560x1600 on a 7870 at Ultra with the AA turned down.

http://hardocp.com/article/2012/11/12/fall_2012_gpu_driver_comparison_roundup/3

That's at ultra. I don't even care if I can run the game at ultra.

What I want to know is if it'll be smooth and easily playable at those resolutions. Like I said, I'm happy with my 460 right now, but I know it won't hack it at 1440p. If I can get similar or a little better performance at 1440 with a 7870 than I'm getting now on my 460 @ 1200, I'll be more than happy.
 
7870 will do Ultra with 2xMSAA no sweat... And you can OC it to within 7950 performance levels. All for ~ $200...;)
 
Well, hate to get philosophical on you, but why are you getting a 1440p monitor then? Typically we get large, high quality monitors so we can have nice pretty pictures. The problem is that now we need to generate pretty pictures for that high quality monitor. The catch is, because we have a bigger, clearer monitor, we can now notice more imperfections in our pictures, which means we have to work even harder to make sure our pictures are as nice as possible.

That being said, I don't know what a 460 can do for you at 1200p, but a 660/7870 can drive 1440p at medium-high settings in bf3. If you are willing to sacrifice that image quality, then go with it:
http://media.bestofmicro.com/H/U/349266/original/Framerate 2560x1440 FPS.png

However, a 7950 goes for around 250-300 with free games, and the GTX 670s are heading near the $300 mark too.

One thing to take note of: do not look at average frame-rates and expect to see the whole story. It's the minimum that counts, because even if you can't hold 60fps all the time, if you never drop below 30fps then your gameplay will be smooth, but if your average is 40fps and you have 20fps dips, then gameplay will be very bad. Look for reviews at 1440p that actually include minimum framerate counts.
 
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Eureka! said:
Well, hate to get philosophical on you, but why are you getting a 1440p monitor then? Typically we get large, high quality monitors so we can have nice pretty pictures. The problem is that now we need to generate pretty pictures for that high quality monitor. The catch is, because we have a bigger, clearer monitor, we can now notice more imperfections in our pictures, which means we have to work even harder to make sure our pictures are as nice as possible.

That being said, I don't know what a 460 can do for you at 1200p, but a 660/7870 can drive 1440p at medium-high settings in bf3. If you are willing to sacrifice that image quality, then go with it:

[IMAGE OMITTED]

However, a 7950 goes for around 250-300 with free games, and the GTX 670s are heading near the $300 mark too.

One thing to take note of: do not look at average frame-rates and expect to see the whole story. It's the minimum that counts, because even if you can't hold 60fps all the time, if you never drop below 30fps then your gameplay will be smooth, but if your average is 40fps and you have 20fps dips, then gameplay will be very bad. Look for reviews at 1440p that actually include minimum framerate counts.
Click to expand...

There's more than just playing games on a PC you know. In general I use my PC for about 20% gaming, 80% other stuff. A lot of that other stuff is graphics based, like CAD work or image editing.

Also, the free games with the 7950 are kinda worthless to me unless I can sell them somehow. I don't really have any interest in playing any of those.

Med-high settings are fine with me, I don't care about turning up ultra and having the most eye candy, the gameplay is what matters (and often turning up the settings can make the game more visually confusing and harder to play - I'm looking at you depth of field blur, fucking hate that shit).

What I guess I'm trying to say, is that the difference between high and ultra settings is not worth $75-100 to me. I just want to be sure that I'll not be stuck with a dog of a card that can't push the monitor and will be horribly outdated in a year.
 
Well, if you're doing CAD/image editing, I believe (don't quote me on this) that Fermi cards actually have an advantage over Kepler/Southern Islands. You might be better off trying to find either a used or low-priced Fermi (GTX 570 or 580) with 2.5 GB of vram. The GPU power of these things are actually higher than GTX660/7870, and is more optimized for CAD work. The 2.5 GB, although rarer, will give you the extra vram in case you do ever want to turn up AA/texture.
 
The 7950 is the minimum you want if you care about maxing your games, but since you don't mind sacrificing some IQ, a 7870 would be sufficient for 1440p. Overall, I think AMD offers better performance at higher resolutions, especially when comparing mid-range cards this generation.
 
Eureka! said:
Well, if you're doing CAD/image editing, I believe (don't quote me on this) that Fermi cards actually have an advantage over Kepler/Southern Islands. You might be better off trying to find either a used or low-priced Fermi (GTX 570 or 580) with 2.5 GB of vram. The GPU power of these things are actually higher than GTX660/7870, and is more optimized for CAD work. The 2.5 GB, although rarer, will give you the extra vram in case you do ever want to turn up AA/texture.
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The CAD stuff I do won't tax the system. Any modern GPU will be fine for what I do in Solidworks. I actually run my personal 8800GT from home in my work computer and it performs great, better than the shitty min spec Quadro the computer came with.

Mr. K6 said:
The 7950 is the minimum you want if you care about maxing your games, but since you don't mind sacrificing some IQ, a 7870 would be sufficient for 1440p. Overall, I think AMD offers better performance at higher resolutions, especially when comparing mid-range cards this generation.
Click to expand...

Thanks, that's the kind of answer I was looking for!
 
I'm in the same boat and read through many and been a part of a few discussions. I've decided to go for a 7870. Not only because it fits my budget/quality expectations, but it also fits my case!!(10" limit).

The dilemma I now have is that in maybe 6mo the 8000 series will be out and the same mid-range card is 'supposed' to cover 7970 and above performance.

I was actually thinking of picking up a GTX 460 for maybe $50 in the meantime while I wait :D
Maybe not such a good idea though.
 
eatkabab said:
I'm in the same boat and read through many and been a part of a few discussions. I've decided to go for a 7870. Not only because it fits my budget/quality expectations, but it also fits my case!!(10" limit).

The dilemma I now have is that in maybe 6mo the 8000 series will be out and the same mid-range card is 'supposed' to cover 7970 and above performance.

I was actually thinking of picking up a GTX 460 for maybe $50 in the meantime while I wait :D
Maybe not such a good idea though.
Click to expand...

Well, the answer for you, and probably the OP too, is dependent on when you plan to spend the money on the monitor. If you have it already, you might as well get a card now to support it, since every day you don't have the card is a day you don't use the monitor, in order to save maybe $50-100 in the long run? If you don't have the monitor yet, get the right card when you get the monitor.

But if you were to get one right now, and you only need midrange performance, the 7870/660 is the solution. And I believe a lot of the 660s are only 6-8" long (I know the Zotac is), use less power and generate less heat than the 7870s. The downside is that they are not as well performing as the 7870s, but I believe that difference is within 5-10% in most games, and they do not overclock, while the 7870 can overclock bundles.
 
I'd suggest the Tahiti LE chipset (confusingly labeled by AMD as a 7870 variant, when in fact it's actually a slightly cut-down version of the 7950): PowerColor PCS+ AX7870 Myst --Tahiti LE

Based on a review from TechPowerUp, it's only about 3% slower than a stock 7950, and can be easily overclocked for higher performance like the rest of the 79xx series cards. It's the card I'd grab if I were in the market for them. At $239.99, it's not a bad deal at all.

TechPowerUp Review

IMO Tahiti LE should have been called the 7875 or 7950 SE ...
 
tungt88 said:
I'd suggest the Tahiti LE chipset (confusingly labeled by AMD as a 7870 variant, when in fact it's actually a slightly cut-down version of the 7950): PowerColor PCS+ AX7870 Myst --Tahiti LE

Based on a review from TechPowerUp, it's only about 3% slower than a stock 7950, and can be easily overclocked for higher performance like the rest of the 79xx series cards. It's the card I'd grab if I were in the market for them. At $239.99, it's not a bad deal at all.

TechPowerUp Review

IMO Tahiti LE should have been called the 7875 or 7950 SE ...
Click to expand...

Why would you do this to me? Now I have more options to consider!
 
tungt88 said:
I'd suggest the Tahiti LE chipset (confusingly labeled by AMD as a 7870 variant, when in fact it's actually a slightly cut-down version of the 7950): PowerColor PCS+ AX7870 Myst --Tahiti LE

Based on a review from TechPowerUp, it's only about 3% slower than a stock 7950, and can be easily overclocked for higher performance like the rest of the 79xx series cards. It's the card I'd grab if I were in the market for them. At $239.99, it's not a bad deal at all.

TechPowerUp Review

IMO Tahiti LE should have been called the 7875 or 7950 SE ...
Click to expand...

That's awesome. Thank you very much. I'll for sure go after this card now. The one and only limitation it doesn't meet is that it's not a completely closed shroud reference cooler that my case prefers, but it's closed enough so it'll just have to deal...

I can't seem to find a card length anywhere. I have a hard max of 10" :-/
This card seems to be very similar and says 10.5" http:///N5PUm
 
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eatkabab said:
That's awesome. Thank you very much. I'll for sure go after this card now. The one and only limitation it doesn't meet is that it's not a completely closed shroud reference cooler that my case prefers, but it's closed enough so it'll just have to deal...

Also, this seems to be the same card, no?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131466

Different cooler design...? has different specs listed. it's probably the older version
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That is not the same card. If you want to get it from Newegg the one to look for is here:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131484

Look at the core and memory clock rates. The new one has lower core and higher memory frequency.

Right now that's the only one on Newegg.
 
Citizen _insane said:
That is not the same card. If you want to get it from Newegg the one to look for is here:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131484

Look at the core and memory clock rates. The new one has lower core and higher memory frequency.

Right now that's the only one on Newegg.
Click to expand...

yeah, crap, 10.5". Does that length include the little tabs that stick out the end for the slot screws? The absolute max I can fit is gonna be 10.3 and that's with very minor modifications

http://www.powercolor.com/global/products_features.asp?id=430#Specification

266.65mm board length. I have exactly 262mm of space. Think I can just flex the card those last 4.65mm? Also, any idea if that includes the PCI screw holes poking out?(I'm not that lucky)
 
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I don't know how the length is specified, but I definitely would not bend the card by almost 5mm. I would suggest modding the case if that's the card you want.
 
Citizen _insane said:
Why would you do this to me? Now I have more options to consider!
Click to expand...

I wish HardOCP would do a review of the Tahiti LE, but I doubt it. Just like they passed on the GTX 560 Ti 448 -- although the nice thing is that Tahiti LE can Crossfire with a 7950 or 7970. :)
 
Citizen _insane said:
I don't know how the length is specified, but I definitely would not bend the card by almost 5mm. I would suggest modding the case if that's the card you want.
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Unfortunately I don't have the machinery to cut through the what seems to be 1/16" steel :(

I'm not getting my monitor until the last week of Jan so I'll just wait till then. Hopefully something will come around
 
eatkabab said:
Unfortunately I don't have the machinery to cut through the what seems to be 1/16" steel :(

I'm not getting my monitor until the last week of Jan so I'll just wait till then. Hopefully something will come around
Click to expand...

I'm sure you could get another case. They go on sale all the time for about $50. Otherwise I guess you're stuck with a card that's shorter.
 
Citizen _insane said:
I'm sure you could get another case. They go on sale all the time for about $50. Otherwise I guess you're stuck with a card that's shorter.
Click to expand...

I have a very very special, pretty case: http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=333
So I'll just have to wait and hope something good becomes available in the next month. Either the old 7870 for under $200 or the Tahiti version at 10.2" or less. This is the very last component and before building it all I didn't realize video cards had gotten so damn big. My last computer was SIX years old and had an 8800GT which broke then I got a GTS 250 a few years back off ebay (third hand) for $40. I'm still using the GTS 250 in the new computer. It does perform shockingly well at 1080p. I'm able to play Metro2033 at low to med settings. I thought that thing was giant at 9".
 
eatkabab said:
I have a very very special, pretty case: http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=333
So I'll just have to wait and hope something good becomes available in the next month. Either the old 7870 for under $200 or the Tahiti version at 10.2" or less. This is the very last component and before building it all I didn't realize video cards had gotten so damn big. My last computer was SIX years old and had an 8800GT which broke then I got a GTS 250 a few years back off ebay (third hand) for $40. I'm still using the GTS 250 in the new computer. It does perform shockingly well at 1080p. I'm able to play Metro2033 at low to med settings. I thought that thing was giant at 9".
Click to expand...

Case is beautiful and well worth any size restrictions. I'd recommend a card with a blower fan at the end rather than a central. Just because the case is small and has a very direct air flow.
 
tungt88 said:
I'd suggest the Tahiti LE chipset (confusingly labeled by AMD as a 7870 variant, when in fact it's actually a slightly cut-down version of the 7950): PowerColor PCS+ AX7870 Myst --Tahiti LE

Based on a review from TechPowerUp, it's only about 3% slower than a stock 7950, and can be easily overclocked for higher performance like the rest of the 79xx series cards. It's the card I'd grab if I were in the market for them. At $239.99, it's not a bad deal at all.

TechPowerUp Review

IMO Tahiti LE should have been called the 7875 or 7950 SE ...
Click to expand...

That card seems like an awesome deal for the money, especially if you can get some decent boosts via overclocking like the current 79xx cards do..Do you know if it uses a reference PCB (either 7870 or 7950/70)? I am curious because a friend is doing a new build and wants to watercool everything, and I am going to recommend this board to him.
 
ccityinstaller said:
That card seems like an awesome deal for the money, especially if you can get some decent boosts via overclocking like the current 79xx cards do..Do you know if it uses a reference PCB (either 7870 or 7950/70)? I am curious because a friend is doing a new build and wants to watercool everything, and I am going to recommend this board to him.
Click to expand...

I asked your question over @ the TechPowerUp forums, hopefully I'll get a response soon.
 
It's also worth noting that a dremel tool is a good investment. I don't think I've ever said to myself, "you know what, spending $50 on a multi-tool that can do almost anything was a complete waste of money".
 
I havea 1440p monitor & a 2gb 560 now.. Honestly it does OK, but I am thinking of upgrading to a 660ti 3gb to get the performance back up closer to what I was used to when gaming at 1080..
 
Citizen _insane said:
It's also worth noting that a dremel tool is a good investment. I don't think I've ever said to myself, "you know what, spending $50 on a multi-tool that can do almost anything was a complete waste of money".
Click to expand...

yeah it sure is. I'm currently going to school in SF and left my dremel back at home. I'm actually going to dental school and I can tell you that our pneumatic handpieces, particularly the ones used to polish after a cleaning, put the dremel to shame. Then again they do require an air compressor and cost about $1000 ea. Essentially it's the exact same thing that fits the exact same, albeit much more industrious, bits/burr's.

Unfortunately I'd have to haul my computer to the clinic. Not to mention disassemble the whole thing to avoid metal flakes all over everything...lazy :eek:
 
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