Voodoo/HP Blackbird

BigMikeRich said:
thank you for the detailed review and open criticism. the online reviews read like giant ads, nice see some objective feedback.

I have a couple of questions that I was hoping you could address:

1) do you feel it's a good purchase? I mean does the quality of the case warrant the extra cost?

2) Would you have just bought the case if that option was available or are the tweaks part of the reason you purchased it?

3) You mentioned removing a video card - are the video cards cooled and if so, can you remove the cooling without damaging either part?

4) Can you comment on returns, it sounds like that thing weighs a ton, if you had to return it, who pays shipping?

Thanks again for the great review!

-Mike
Click to expand...


Mike, to address your questions:

1. I feel it's a good purchase, but I can't quantify it in terms of the case alone. There's a review online that adds up the components in the system and they came up with about $500 for the case and labor. As you know, a Lian Li or Silverstone will run more than half that, but this case is way, way better than anything either of them offer at the moment.

2. I bought from them rather than building myself because I wanted an integrated system that I didn't have to troubleshoot and test. I like being able to call someone for help if I need it and if something does fail, there's some comfort in knowing it'll get looked after without question. It is modertately overclocked, not to the point of instability, but enough that it is maximizing the components.

3. The video cards are watercooled and although I haven't tried to remove one of the blocks, I'm sure that it can be done if need be. As I mentioned in the review, the video cards are eVGA 8800 Ultra's.

4. The thing weighs a lot, but really, how much more is it than a Voodoo or an Alien or any other boutique system? The box size is about the same as any other full sized system. As far as who pays for shipping, if there was a warrantable problem that required the whole system be returned, they would pay for the shipping.

Hope this answers your questions and feel free to ask more.
 
Thankls for the anwers!
I have been on the fence about getting this but your review might have pushed me over the top.

My only concern now is when to buy - we seem so close to so many new tech updagrades, I would hate to miss out.

Couple of questions:

1. The recovery disk - is it an image of the drive as it was delivered to you or just a Vista disk?
2. any T-shirt or Blackbird promo items (hat, pen, sticker)


thanks.
 
BigMikeRich said:
Thankls for the anwers!
I have been on the fence about getting this but your review might have pushed me over the top.

My only concern now is when to buy - we seem so close to so many new tech updagrades, I would hate to miss out.

Couple of questions:

1. The recovery disk - is it an image of the drive as it was delivered to you or just a Vista disk?
2. any T-shirt or Blackbird promo items (hat, pen, sticker)


thanks.
Click to expand...

1. It comes with the full Vista OEM box as well as a system specific recovery disk -
2. I forgot to mention that it comes with a cool Blackbird mousepad that's the same shape as the case - slightly trapezoidal. It also comes with the bonus game software - orange box half life, etc., but no hat, pen or sticker.

There's always something newer/faster around the corner. The standard response is that what's out there now is relatively mature and the new stuff will have some problems to be worked out.
 
thanks for the answers. The upgrade thing is always a challenge, but I think this is one of those time when you have many new tech all coming out at the same time:
new CPU architecture
new video chip and features (not just die shrink)
new motherboard spec

I can wait a few more months

A few more questions?

- I had an Alienware a Looong time ago and they included a printout of some benchmarks that were run on my machine - any such thing with the bird?

- did you have the option of configuring the hard drives (partitions and such)?
- was the game pre-installed or did you have to install it? If not, was it an option?
 
Mike,

You gotta do what ya gotta do, just remember, when all that new stuff comes out in a few months, there will be more new stuff that will come out in a few months after that, and on and on. The big developments with the Intel chip architecture, i.e. on board memory controller , won't be out until Q4 '08.

The Blackbird didn't have any printouts. The Dedication Edition comes with one standard specification, no changes allowed. If you want to custom configure, you can, but you'll wait a while longer to get it.
 
I hear ya - If I got a BBird now and i see the new Nvidia stuff in a week, I'd die of a severe case of buyer's remorse. I can hold out until Jan or Feb to get a new box, by then HP will have worked out some bugs, things should be a little bit cheaper, new hardware, games will be patched and gaming goodness should be at it's best!

I know the price of being on the bleeding edge are problems and being obsolete realively quick, but for a while I'll be king of the hill!!!
 
Stevo,

Thanks for the great review. I ordered my BB DE a week ago, so based on your experience I hope to get it sometime next week. I live in Calgary, perhaps I should see if I can pick it up and save on the delivery charges.

I purchased a VooDoo system 8 years ago and dealt directly with Rahul. He was great to deal with back then, and its good to hear that he still has that same commitment to his customers.

Can you comment on the noise level of the BB? Do you have it on or under your desk?
 
giz,

Congratulations on joining the 1337 BB community! You won't regret it. As far as your question about noise, I too have an old Voodoo, probably about as old as yours and it is twice as noisy as the Bird. The BB isn't silent, but it's not like an F-18 on afterburner either. It's hard to quantify sound with out a decibel meter, suffice it to say, you'll know that it is running, but it won't be too distracting.
Enjoy the BBird!

PS, I'd call them to see about local pickup, you might get it sooner.;)
 
Thanks for the review

Stevo,
I have a question. I forgot to ask to HP when I ordered BBird DE.
What kind memory do they used?
is it Cosair dominator (latency ?)?
If you can find the model number, it will be helpful.
I want to upgrade to 4g memory, and will order more memory before BBird is in my hand.
This will be my 6th PC in my life and first time brand computer.

Thank you,
 
itsooh said:
Thanks for the review

Stevo,
I have a question. I forgot to ask to HP when I ordered BBird DE.
What kind memory do they used?
is it Cosair dominator (latency ?)?
If you can find the model number, it will be helpful.
I want to upgrade to 4g memory, and will order more memory before BBird is in my hand.
This will be my 6th PC in my life and first time brand computer.

Thank you,
Click to expand...

I did the same thing, just added a couple of sticks of Dominator TWIN2X2048-6400C4D - I think it's 4-4-4-12.
After adding it, my Performance Index went from 5.5 to 5.9
Just be aware that Vista 32bit will not recognize it all. Even using the PAE switch only shows 3089Mb on my system. For tips on using the PAE switch check here.
BTW, depending on where you get the RAM, there's a rebate program underway right now until the 16th. I got it in Canada from NCIX for $174.99 and then take off another $40 rebate for a net of $134.99.

All the best,
 
Thank you :)
I am in US, and the company will pay me for the memory, so maybe get it from newegg.

thanks again~
 
Thanks for all the info stevo! I've been trying to decide if I should buy a Blackbird or a decked out rig from CyberPower. The CyberPower system would've been about $800 cheaper for similar components, but in the end, I decided the case and Voodoo aspects of the system were worth the difference. Ordered today and I hope it arrives soon! Pics and review to follow...

One thing I'm wondering about is the liquid cooling system. If I were to replace the motherboard, processor, and video cards a year or two down the line, will I still be able to use the liquid cooling system, or will I have to buy something different?
 
I've been considering the HP blackbird as well. I don't like how they don't list prices on their website for the different configuration options (I don't mean the 3 default configurations) ... you have to call a sales person to discuss them. I'm hoping this changes soon or at least when the next gen high end video cards come out.

I also don't like that you only receive a one year warranty on the system. For a system that pricey it should come with a 3 year warranty or at least have the option for one.
 
stevo.k said:
I did the same thing, just added a couple of sticks of Dominator TWIN2X2048-6400C4D - I think it's 4-4-4-12.
After adding it, my Performance Index went from 5.5 to 5.9
Just be aware that Vista 32bit will not recognize it all. Even using the PAE switch only shows 3089Mb on my system. For tips on using the PAE switch check here.
BTW, depending on where you get the RAM, there's a rebate program underway right now until the 16th. I got it in Canada from NCIX for $174.99 and then take off another $40 rebate for a net of $134.99.

All the best,
Click to expand...


Stevo,
Thanks for the great review! I just received my BB DE on Friday and I have to say I concur with everything you've said about it in the review! I've also been thinking about taking advantage of the current $40 RAM rebate and was wondering if the 2gb addition made any diffference to your performance? I was under the impression that the current 2gb + 768mb x 2 GPU memory was supposed to be the "sweet spot" in Vista at 3.5gb total usuable memory?

Thanks for your help,
DaveF
 
I got the delivery notice from UPS on Friday. It came faster than I expected (took 1 week).
But it is still in the UPS center. Tried to pick it up on saturday but they closed :mad:

So I have to wait till tomorrow. It will be delivered to my work.
I cant wait!!!~~~~(hate ups >.<) :D
 
Looks like they've stopped selling the Dedication Edition systems. They've added an online configuration utility, and if you order the same parts that come with the Dedication system, it comes to around $6,075. Looks like I got my order in just in time. :) I'm told it should ship by Friday.
 
Configuration page is up, and the cheapest you can get a Blackbird system is for:

Configuration: $2,531.10 USD*
Shipping: $60.00 USD*
Subtotal: $2,591.10 USD*
~System setup:
Processor: Dual Core - Intel(R) Core2(TM) Duo 2.66GHz E6750
Memory: 2 GB 667 MHz PC2-5300 DDR2 SDRAM
Thermal Management: Air Cooling
Motherboard: ASUS Striker Extreme for Intel(R) processors
Operating System: Microsoft(R) Windows Vista(TM) Ultimate (Free Upgrade)
Warranty: 1 year limited hardware and 1 year technical support
Graphics Cards: NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GTS with 256MB of GDDR3 SDRAM
Audio Boards: ADI Onboard
Power Supply: 900 Watt Power Supply
Primary OS Storage: 320GB 7200rpm SATA
Optical Disk Bay 1: Super multi-drive, slim slots with Lightscribe (DVD+/-R/RW+/-DL)

Not a horrible deal, and not a great deal, but if you calculate in the case and the amount of room and upgrade path you have it seems very solid.
 
theDreamer said:
Configuration page is up, and the cheapest you can get a Blackbird system is for:

Configuration: $2,531.10 USD*
Shipping: $60.00 USD*
Subtotal: $2,591.10 USD*
~System setup:
Processor: Dual Core - Intel(R) Core2(TM) Duo 2.66GHz E6750
Memory: 2 GB 667 MHz PC2-5300 DDR2 SDRAM
Thermal Management: Air Cooling
Motherboard: ASUS Striker Extreme for Intel(R) processors
Operating System: Microsoft(R) Windows Vista(TM) Ultimate (Free Upgrade)
Warranty: 1 year limited hardware and 1 year technical support
Graphics Cards: NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GTS with 256MB of GDDR3 SDRAM
Audio Boards: ADI Onboard
Power Supply: 900 Watt Power Supply
Primary OS Storage: 320GB 7200rpm SATA
Optical Disk Bay 1: Super multi-drive, slim slots with Lightscribe (DVD+/-R/RW+/-DL)

Not a horrible deal, and not a great deal, but if you calculate in the case and the amount of room and upgrade path you have it seems very solid.
Click to expand...

667 RAM, 333FSB CPU, 8600GTS for $2,600

Please...

The Blackbird only exists for the SLi Ultras and Quads :rolleyes:
 
Hazaro said:
667 RAM, 333FSB CPU, 8600GTS for $2,600

Please...

The Blackbird only exists for the SLi Ultras and Quads :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

That is very true, and I priced out what I thought were the top parts (Top quad, SLi, 4gb, 10k HD, etc.) and I was still under 6k I believe, very impressed.
 
DaveF said:
Stevo,
Thanks for the great review! I just received my BB DE on Friday and I have to say I concur with everything you've said about it in the review! I've also been thinking about taking advantage of the current $40 RAM rebate and was wondering if the 2gb addition made any diffference to your performance? I was under the impression that the current 2gb + 768mb x 2 GPU memory was supposed to be the "sweet spot" in Vista at 3.5gb total usuable memory?

Thanks for your help,
DaveF
Click to expand...

The additional RAM doesn't make a huge difference but I do a fair amount of Photoshop work and it is one of the few programs that can see additional RAM. You are correct that 2Gb is the sweet spot. So unless Photoshop is in your repertoire, you can probably cruise on 2gb until the 64 bit version of Vista is fully sorted and supported.
 
I'm glad to see they got the online configurator up and running finally. I'm also really glad I got in early on the DE, since I probably saved about 500 bones.
I also have to give props to HP/Voodoo since they adjust their price to reflect the Canadian dollar and we Canucks actually got it for less than the Yanks. Woot!
Thanks HP/Voodoo for actually rewarding the early adopters! Now maybe I can get them to swap out the QX6850 for one of the new 45nm Penryn QX9650's....:D
 
This is a question for all you Blackbird owners... how long did it take for you to receive your BB from the time you ordered and the time you received it? Did you receive any call or email indicating that your BB had been built and shipped?
 
gizhola said:
This is a question for all you Blackbird owners... how long did it take for you to receive your BB from the time you ordered and the time you received it? Did you receive any call or email indicating that your BB had been built and shipped?
Click to expand...

Giz,

I got it about 2 weeks after placing the order by phone. But, I called them several times for updates because I never received any other contact from them after the invoice on the first day. I have let them know that I wasn't too happy about the lack of communication.
 
Thanks again for your quick reply Steveo.

I just spoke with someone, and my system is either about to enter production or in production (I ordered 10 days ago). The lady (Judy) was very helpful and updated my file and contacted shipping to let them know that I would like to pick up my BB rather than have it shipped. If all goes well, I hope to have it in my sweaty little hands in 7 to 10 days. :D
 
I just ordered my DE model on Friday. When I inquired about when it might ship, I was told that they were wrapping up production on all the DE models and hoped to have them all shipped by this Friday. After that, they were supposedly going to start work on the custom models. I really hope they can ship Friday! :)
 
My DE took a little extra time (4weeks total) to deliver. HP/Voodoo received a bad shipment of chassis, with some sort of manufacturing defect, which delayed production. I was more than happy to wait, and kudos to HP/Voodoo for maintaining quality control. Still haven't received the Orange Box software pack, but was told by the sales team that it's shipped seperately from HP direct. (along with a Blackbird Tshirt and some other goodies)
 
stevo.k said:
The additional RAM doesn't make a huge difference but I do a fair amount of Photoshop work and it is one of the few programs that can see additional RAM. You are correct that 2Gb is the sweet spot. So unless Photoshop is in your repertoire, you can probably cruise on 2gb until the 64 bit version of Vista is fully sorted and supported.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info Stevo! Glad to hear you got an increase in performance. Some of the things I'd read on other forums, seemed to indicate that there was a good chance that the extra 2Gb of RAM could actually cause a performance decrease.
 
I bought an extra 2GB of RAM from Newegg for $139 because of the rebate offer they were running this week. It'll only be $99 after rebate which is a pretty good deal. Now, I just don't know if I should put it in right away, or if performance will be adversely affected. I do a fair amount of web design and development work (a fair amount of Photoshop). Any comments? How would adding the extra memory affect the overclock? I've heard it's difficult to overclock when there are four dimms vs. two. If I put in the other two dimms, does that negate the factory overclock?
 
In my case, it just took 1 week for the delivery, but the UPS hold it for 3-4days.
I have odered 2gb memory from newegg too.

I have not tried much the BBird yet.
I just opend the computer panel and I was really impressed with the design.

There were some missing items like orange box, HP said orange box and goodies (usb key, window live) will be delivered seperatley next week.
Also, I asked about 64bit Vista. They say they do not support it and if I want i have to do it myself. (OEM vista dvd came with only has 32bit).
 
tjmaxwell said:
I bought an extra 2GB of RAM from Newegg for $139 because of the rebate offer they were running this week. It'll only be $99 after rebate which is a pretty good deal. Now, I just don't know if I should put it in right away, or if performance will be adversely affected. I do a fair amount of web design and development work (a fair amount of Photoshop). Any comments? How would adding the extra memory affect the overclock? I've heard it's difficult to overclock when there are four dimms vs. two. If I put in the other two dimms, does that negate the factory overclock?
Click to expand...

Yo TJ Maxx - According to the PC Tools diagnostic, 4Gb of RAM has no effect on the overclock, I'm at 3.33 GHz just like always. Maybe it hinders performance on more aggressive overclocks, but the conservative overclock by the factory is for maximum stability rather than maximum speed.
As I mentioned earlier, the Windows Experience Index on my Blackbird went from 5.5 to 5.9 when I added the extra 2Gb DIMMs
I'd stay away from the 64bit version for now, driver support and gaming performance are not what you'd call mature yet.
Hope this helps.
 
I contacted BB sales today and am going to purchase an additional 2Gb of RAM from them for $130.00. Price isn't bad and if the price quoted is in U.S., I might be able to save a little in exchange with our stronger Canadian dollar. Will find out tomorrow when I pick it up, here in Calgary. :)

I was dissappointed as well, to find out that our OEM copy of Vista Ultimate doesn't come with 64-bit for future upgrading. Looks like we're on our own if we want to upgrade....

With regards to overclocking, I also just found today, that we can overclock the cpu up to 3.6 and still remain under full warranty according to BB sales/support.

Thought I would share the info.
 
Dave,

That's a very reasonable price for the RAM. Good luck with the BB, did they give you any tips for achieving the 3.6GHz overclock?
 
Someone over on the Voodoo Blackbird Forum stated that you can not install Windows XP on the BB. Have any of you existing BB owners tried/done this?

I was hoping to put 3 OS's on my BB; XP, Vista, and a flavor of Linux.
 
gizhola said:
Someone over on the Voodoo Blackbird Forum stated that you can not install Windows XP on the BB. Have any of you existing BB owners tried/done this?

I was hoping to put 3 OS's on my BB; XP, Vista, and a flavor of Linux.
Click to expand...

I don't see why you couldn't, unless they built something into the BIOS to prevent it. I was thinking about dual booting with XP as well.

Where is the BB forum?
 
gizhola said:
Someone over on the Voodoo Blackbird Forum stated that you can not install Windows XP on the BB. Have any of you existing BB owners tried/done this?

I was hoping to put 3 OS's on my BB; XP, Vista, and a flavor of Linux.
Click to expand...

I was hoping to do something similar. I suspect it might be because of the bios modifications they made to enable both ATI and nVidia video card support, but I'm not techie enough to know for sure.

stevo.k said:
Yo TJ Maxx - According to the PC Tools diagnostic, 4Gb of RAM has no effect on the overclock, I'm at 3.33 GHz just like always. Maybe it hinders performance on more aggressive overclocks, but the conservative overclock by the factory is for maximum stability rather than maximum speed.
As I mentioned earlier, the Windows Experience Index on my Blackbird went from 5.5 to 5.9 when I added the extra 2Gb DIMMs
I'd stay away from the 64bit version for now, driver support and gaming performance are not what you'd call mature yet.
Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info! I'll go ahead and pop it in when it arrives then. I just heard from somewhere that filling all the dimm slots makes overclocking more difficult. I'm not sure if that's true or not.

I got an email today saying my system is "on the bench" and should have a tracking number today! :) I can't wait to play some Crysis on this thing. Has anyone tried this game on a BB yet? I read Cannis' blog and saw his sample video, but I'm not sure if that was DX9 or DX10, and I don't know what resolution he used. I'm curious about performance at 1920x1200, since that's the native resolution of my monitor.

Blackbird forums are here, though they aren't working properly for me today. Voodoo's message boards are the buggiest I've ever seen.
 
Here's a link to the thread where someone stated that there were warning sheets included about not using generic motherboard drivers and the only ones being available are ones for Vista. (link) It's towards the bottom of the thread.
 
gizhola said:
Here's a link to the thread where someone stated that there were warning sheets included about not using generic motherboard drivers and the only ones being available are ones for Vista. (link) It's towards the bottom of the thread.
Click to expand...

Like TJ stated, and I did on the Voodoo forums, it probably has to do with custom build drivers so they can use ATi on an nVidia board. Not saying you could not use "normal" drivers, but you would probably lose any work they put in to the BB so I would stay away from it.
 
stevo.k said:
Dave,

That's a very reasonable price for the RAM. Good luck with the BB, did they give you any tips for achieving the 3.6GHz overclock?
Click to expand...


Installed the extra 2Gb of RAM today and everything went smooth. Windows now shows 3Gb of system memory and my Performance Index score has gone up to 5.9 as well. :D (Bios shows the full 4Gb)
I re-ran 3DMark06 to see how the new RAM changed my score, and it seems to have had little affect. Score is still running in the 16,600's. Best so far is 16,649 at default settings.

Living here in Calgary, I was fortunate enough to be given a tour of the Voodoo/BB facilities and got to see the BB's all in different stages of being built and to meet quite a few of the BB sales/support stafff. One of them actually had a part in the final design of the case. His contribution was the right side case design which houses the wiring. Anyways, to get back on topic, he's going to email some tips for the further overclock. They're currently in the process of moving to the new addition that was added on when HP bought them, so I'm not expecting the info until the move is completed. Once I get it, I'll post it in this thread.
 
DaveF,

I was also at the HP/Voodoo offices today picking up my brand new BB DE. I didn't get offered a tour, but I did see all the tech's in white lab coats working on the BB's. It was a sight to behold; rows of BB's being assembled. I asked if I could take a picture, but was denied. For those of you that have your BB's on order and have not received them yet... they are coming.

My initial impression.. my God this box is freak'n huge!!! And heavy too!!!

I'm taking a ton of pics of the unboxing. If people are interested I'll post them up somewhere.

Time to get back to unpacking "The Beast".... :cool:

Once again a huge thanks to Judy at HP/Voodoo for keeping me up to date on my BB status and for calling me as soon as it was ready to be picked up.
 
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