When will eGPU prices come down?

[UnknownSouljer]

I am not a technologist, at least in the sense of knowing component pricing. However it seems to me that eGPU's are terribly overpriced for what they are.

eGPU's have been available for several years now, thanks mostly to Akitio. Alienware's solution is at least a year and change old. And even TB3 ones exist.

So when will we start getting eGPU's that cost closer to $100, rather than $300? At $300, it's virtually doubling the cost of a midrange GPU (well at least without inflated mining pricing).

 

[chx]

Aikito was never meant for GPU, they state that so. The biggest challenge is Intel's pricing of Thunderbolt controlled and the not being able to apply economics of scale. Now that Apple is endorsing eGPU you can trust the sheep who buys anything with a fruit logo on it no matter how unusable or overpriced to take care of the economics of scale so we might get something out it.

Also, the Gigabyte Aorus GTX 1070 Gaming Box is expected around $500, where the 1070 has an MSRP of $350 if memory serves. Add the price of a 450W flex ATX PSU and the TB converter is almost free.

 

[RanceJustice]

I too would like to see the prices come down. Heck, better yet I'd like to see "build your own eGPU" using standard components. Pick your case, pick your PSU (internal vs external power brick etc) , pick your mainboard/ TB3 or newer card etc.. to let people build the way they want. I've been waiting for an eGPU solution for a long, long time that is universal and powerful enough and it seems that Thunderbolt 3 is finally that option (though I'll be honest, I am waiting for whatever Thunderbolt 4 controller that would alllow full PCI-E 3.0 x16 speed. One reason I'd like to be able to upgrade the mainboard of my eGPU box etc). Now we just need to be able to configure it properly and build our own

 

[UnknownSouljer]

Aikito was never meant for GPU, they state that so. The biggest challenge is Intel's pricing of Thunderbolt controlled and the not being able to apply economics of scale. Now that Apple is endorsing eGPU you can trust the sheep who buys anything with a fruit logo on it no matter how unusable or overpriced to take care of the economics of scale so we might get something out it.

-First, You are incorrect. https://www.akitio.com/expansion/node
-Second, the market for eGPU's is going to be everyone with a laptop that wants a single solution, and doesn't want battery life <2 hours or a laptop that weighs 5 lbs+. Additionally it's also for people that want a rig that is as compact as possible. Akitio as an example shows the Node with a NUC. This could also make an excellent setup for a TV gaming/HTPC system.
-Third, condescention isn't necessary. There are plenty of price sensitive people that buy Apple because it the platform necessary for the work they do. If you're not into them, fine, but don't speak like an entire population of people are idiots just because they disagree with your position.

Also, the Gigabyte Aorus GTX 1070 Gaming Box is expected around $500, where the 1070 has an MSRP of $350 if memory serves. Add the price of a 450W flex ATX PSU and the TB converter is almost free.

That would be a viable option. If it's coming any time soon.
Gigabyte announced an eGPU enclosure last year, and then just never bothered to release it. Crazy considering that they worked with Silverstone to make it, and then just literally never released it. It's been well over a year since its reveal.
http://www.startlr.com/gigabyte-gp-t3gfx-docking-for-external-graphics-thunderbolt-3-video-test/

I too would like to see the prices come down. Heck, better yet I'd like to see "build your own eGPU" using standard components. Pick your case, pick your PSU (internal vs external power brick etc) , pick your mainboard/ TB3 or newer card etc.. to let people build the way they want. I've been waiting for an eGPU solution for a long, long time that is universal and powerful enough and it seems that Thunderbolt 3 is finally that option (though I'll be honest, I am waiting for whatever Thunderbolt 4 controller that would alllow full PCI-E 3.0 x16 speed. One reason I'd like to be able to upgrade the mainboard of my eGPU box etc). Now we just need to be able to configure it properly and build our own

I would love if they made that viable. But I just sort of don't seeing it happening since it would require an entirely new segment of case building and competition for cases as well as like you mention the PCI-E conversion parts as well as a standardization in backplates.

It could happen. I am just sort of am skeptical. But if it comes around, I'd welcome the competition.

If anything it's far more likely that they'll sell an enclosure with everything in it except the PSU, and then it might allow for a standard PSU (of which it would make the most sense to buy something that's modular of course).

 

[chx]

-First, You are incorrect. https://www.akitio.com/expansion/node

I stand corrected. I would've sworn the Aikito TB2 said something like that but apparently I am wrong.

-Second, the market for eGPU's is going to be everyone with a laptop that wants a single solution, and doesn't want battery life <2 hours or a laptop that weighs 5 lbs+. Additionally it's also for people that want a rig that is as compact as possible. Akitio as an example shows the Node with a NUC. This could also make an excellent setup for a TV gaming/HTPC system.

The size of that market remains to be seen.

 

[UnknownSouljer]

The size of that market remains to be seen.

True. But I would bet on small and light weight.
Laptop sales are consistently going up while desktop sales are consistently going down.

I think that either eGPU's will continue in their current form or they'll start making and selling eGPU graphics cards like Gigabyte's option, but even more compact. Like, perhaps, even half that size as they start to shrink all the components down to the smallest size necessary. Or they'll integrate eGPU enclosures on monitors so that there is no middle part of the solution. (Laptop=>eGPU=Monitor becomes Laptop=>Monitor with eGPU built in).

I feel like all of this is a matter of time... I'm just impatient about then when, especially regarding pricing.

 

[m_isom]

Intel is going to move Thunderbolt into future CPUs and make it royalty free I hear, Then we just need a nice powered enclosure for the video card, expansion dock with a USB hub, and Thunderbolt 3 USB-C charging for the laptop without a built in GPU other than the intel iGPU, yet still have nvidia optimus like features so the external card can display back to the LCD using the intel iGPU frame buffer over the Thunderbolt 3 link.

Use it as a portable with iGPU for work or school, then when time to relax and game, dock up and use that eGPU!

The dock eGPU should be $99 imo, because I am using a $10 dell DA-2 220W PSU with a beast exp gdc $40 and their $30 plexiglass enclosure. Those $300 docks before installing a GPU are insane.

 

[chx]

There's a mismatch though: mobile users want lighter laptops which by necessity mean limited CPU. Games, though, want faster CPUs.

Basically your market consists of those gamers who are not satisfied with mobile and console gaming but want to play PC games and yet are not constrained by the typically low wattage laptop CPU. This is your fundamental mismatch.

Also, the laptop might be provided by the workplace which won't be happy if you install games on it.

And gaming laptops are rapdily growing up, https://www.notebookcheck.net/Gigabyte-Aero-14-7700HQ-GTX-1060-Laptop-Review.211666.0.html

Our Wi-Fi test proved that the Aero 14 will comfortably last all day when used as a mobile office device, a unique feature for a gaming laptop and case in point for its versatility.

It's less than 2kg, even.

The new XPS 15 has an 1050 Ti in it. That might not be the fastest but there are a lot of games where it's enough in 1080p.

 

[RanceJustice]

You know, eGPU SHOULD herald the coming of an entirely new class of laptop - powerful. luxury machines that are made with eGPU in mind. . We have some that are close these days - I really like how some of the latest gaming laptop models from Asus, Razer, and Sager are finally being made out of premium materials (ie metal chassis) with high end components. Now all we need are those that transition away from including the GPU but without reducing the power/features of the other components; the current critical flaw.

For instance, look at the Razer Blade Stealth. Launched to be the companion to the TB3 "Razer Core" eGPU box, it comes so close to getting things right. It is relatively thin and light, with a 12.5" form factor , 4K IGZO display, RGB backlit keyboard, full metal chassis... but they made one critical flaw that stopped it from going to the top of my list - using a low-power, dual core mobile i7! Now honestly considering that there are 13 and 14" luxury laptops (including the Razer's own Blade) that offer a full power quad i7 plus a discrete gaming-grade GPU up to GTX 1070 level (1080 class I only see used in 15" and higher that I can recall), it would seem to me that with very little change to the Blade Stealth's chassis it could easily handle a full power quad-core hyperthreaded i7 CPU (optionally, including the very best Intel Iris integrated GPU would be a nice feature as well). I'd much rather it be slightly thicker if need be then have the CPU be a weak point. Likewise, they are soldering in the RAM it looks like, which is LPDDR3 maxed out at 16GB. This is slightly less of an issue (though I'd rather they give a 32GB option if nothing else), but I'd still rather have DDR4 sodimms that aren't soldered. The ability to upgrade the internal components, even if its cramped, is an important feature in my eyes and I'd much rather add a little increase in weight or thickness to make this happen, not to mention provide ample cooling.

With eGPU they ensure that the graphics do not become obsolete the way laptops used to, so the rest of the components should be designed with a long-life in mind as well as upgrades if possible. The Blade Stealth and others are so close to getting most of it right, but manufacturers need to understand that with eGPU comes the possibility for a new paradigm. There are already "make it the thinnest, lightest you can" laptops out there and that's fine - sure, you can use a universal eGPU standard like Thunderbolt on them, but it doesn't mean its ideal. Sure make them as thin and light as reasonable, use luxury materials, but these "eGPU focused/gaming" should also include high end core components like CPU in order to best pair with the eGPU for a long, long time.

 

[UnknownSouljer]

There's a mismatch though: mobile users want lighter laptops which by necessity mean limited CPU. Games, though, want faster CPUs.

Basically your market consists of those gamers who are not satisfied with mobile and console gaming but want to play PC games and yet are not constrained by the typically low wattage laptop CPU. This is your fundamental mismatch.

Also, the laptop might be provided by the workplace which won't be happy if you install games on it.

And gaming laptops are rapdily growing up, https://www.notebookcheck.net/Gigabyte-Aero-14-7700HQ-GTX-1060-Laptop-Review.211666.0.html

To be a slight critic of your argument, you first state that CPUs are a problem, then say the solution is simply just getting a gaming laptop.
I think there is an opportunity for a greater market here.

Look, even if users are becoming CPU limited by having a 2.4GHz i7 (as an example), an eGPU with a 1070 would still be a quantum leap in their gaming experience in comparison with most integrated GPUs. Such as anything made by Intel or any low wattage part. The idea is that a single system could be the best of both worlds, with the only compromise being that an eGPU is 'necessary' to game on.
However, people that travel and need to do work wanting a light laptop wouldn't have to compromise. Or wouldn't need a desktop machine if they're so inclined. While that may not be appealing to you, only having to update one system instead of two, and only needing to buy a graphics card every so often instead of an entire machine, is favorable over time (I realize that most people will recycle parts from desktop builds. But in the eGPU example ONLY the graphics card depreciates, whereas in an entire desktop system the entire machine depreciates, meaning less money is spent or used over time).

Work computers are work computers. That doesn't really factor into this at all. You've created a straw man argument, as a gaming laptop that was "given to you by a workplace" still would have the same issue. eGPU or no. Obviously this is for people that have their own machines that they can play with. The same as it would be for any mobile gaming solution.

It's less than 2kg, even.

The new XPS 15 has an 1050 Ti in it. That might not be the fastest but there are a lot of games where it's enough in 1080p.

Okay. But this seems like it contradicts your earlier thoughts on CPU limitation. But to your credit yes, a 1050 would be a viable solution that that is enough for and battery life on that particular model is good. However, 4.14 lbs isn't exactly light. At least not in my world.

Secondly, with the GPU being built in, you've missed one of the great advantages of the eGPU in the first place. I can upgrade my graphics card in the eGPU without having to buy a new laptop. That's a massive advantage making my laptop be able to work multi-generationally.

Third, There hasn't been a difference at all in IPC from Intel since Sandy Bridge. H|OCP proved this. That's a 6+ year old processor at this point. Meaning, I could buy a laptop, use it for 5 years easily and just upgrade the eGPU every so often and replace the battery if and when that's necessary and save a bunch of money.
With a GPU built in, if I want to keep up with gaming AT ALL, I'd have to replace the laptop every 1-2 years with a $1000+ dollar investment. Especially if the GPU in the laptop is only midrange like a 1050 is. Once again, savings over time drastically favors an eGPU over buying a mid-range gaming laptop.

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eGPUs great pluses generally are:
*makes having a single system viable without major compromise (needing ONLY a laptop and not a laptop and a desktop to game on)
*makes upgrading to one or more systems kept to an absolute minimum
*best value and cost over time as the eGPU enclosure should be viable for several upgrade cycles (Graphics cards can't saturate TB2 let alone TB3 at this point. The TB penalty is extremely low).

eGPU's minuses generally are:
*Possibly CPU limited in comparison with desktop parts (although this could be mitigated with fast GPU's and playing at 4k)
*Requires an eGPU box if you want to game versus having a (somewhat) portable gaming laptop. (Somewhat portable because a gaming laptop will be much heavier and bulkier). Although in theory, if you're going to some place for a while, one could just take their eGPU box with them.

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Look, chx, we're getting a bit off topic. If eGPU's aren't for you, that's fine. But they would do a lot for my workflow and make my life a lot better. I really have no interest in upgrading and keeping up to date a desktop machine if I don't have to. An eGPU would be an awesome solution for me, as well as a lot of other people (especially those looking to do compute, there is a lot of talk about using TB to daisy chain enclosures in the future to be able to do general compute on, which isn't possible yet).

So if it doesn't make sense to you, cool, it's not something you need. But I'd rather talk about the future of eGPU's and when I'm going to get one that's viable priced and/or when the SLI/crossfire eGPU enclosures are coming out.