Who's responsible when item is lost in transit

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playah

playah

[H]ard|Gawd
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Curious to find out what you think about a situation where a i7 860 was bought in the forum, seller ships USPS and while en route it is missent by carrier, when package arrives it is empty and it is evident that the package had been torn open and taped up, also it is marked by USPS "WE'RE SORRY that your article was damaged during processing"

Cpu was sent without HS and in a cushion mailer, also without insurance, who would be responsible for the loss.
 
There is no good way to handle this..

Not your fault cause you packed and mailed it
Not USPSs fault cause you didnt insure it
Not Buyers fault because he paid and never received.

In the 2 times this happened to me, I had to bite the bullet as the seller for not ensuring the recipient would receive an item or his money back.. Lifes a bitch.
 
i would say that the buyer is responsible unless the seller mis-communicated about the shipping. the buyer should be aware of USPS shipping practices and the risk associated. as a buyer, if you want more secure shipping than what the seller is offering you should communicate that before paying for the item.

i have been in this situation before as the seller and did end up refunding half of the money as a courtesy but i don't feel that i was obligated to. my ads always include *basic* shipping for free (USPS or UPS ground at my discretion) but i will gladly ship however the buyer wants if they want to pay for it.
 
From a buyer perspective, I paid for an item and didn't receive it, shouldn't it be the sellers obligation to get it to me.

From a sellers perspective, buyer didn't ask for ins and I shipped out the package as agreed, obligation fulfilled.

or is there an intermediate area with 50/50 responsibility
 
That's a tough call Playah. I personally have never had a package lost (I refuse to use usps). I can say that I remember reading another thread similar to this, and IIRC someone stated that it is the seller's responsibility to get the package to the buyer at any cost. I can see the dilemma however, considering the buyer did not ask for insurance. To be honest, I -always- put ins on the item I sell regardless if the buyer wants it or not. Ins is a two-way street, as it protects the seller as well as the buyer. Ins isn't that much, tbh, and it saves so many headaches. When I list my prices, I always try to count in Ins, packaging materials and what-not. I fear nothing more than a package that gets lost, or gets to my buyer damaged, or in this case "tampered" with. It truly sucks sir, but IMHO it's the seller's responsibility to get the item to the buyer by any means.
 
My first question is was shipping insurance offerend and declined by the seller. If it was, then it's the sellers problem, he declined insurance against this specific thing happening. If it was not discussed, then I'd say the buyer.
 
I ALWAYS offer insurance for an added fee (even on "free shipping items). If buyer declines the insurance or signature confirmation fee buyer is responsible if package is lost or stolen.
 
As a seller I always make sure the my packaging can handle the drop, kick, smash test. If this was damaged in shipping, in it wasn't packaged good enough. In my opinion, it is the sellers responsiblility to get the package to the buyer. If I was the buyer, I would be asking for a refund.
 
In business the responsibility fell to the person that paid for the freight legally.
 
Buyer paid for item that wasn't delivered. That's the only relevant fact.

Insurance exists to protect the shipper (seller) for just these types of problems. If the seller didn't get insurance on his expensive item then that isn't the buyers fault.

Seller is responsible here. "Fair" doesn't really apply to business transactions.
 
I say its the sellers fault. When selling, I always build in insurance in my shipping fees for this reason.
 
playah said:
From a buyer perspective, I paid for an item and didn't receive it, shouldn't it be the sellers obligation to get it to me.

From a sellers perspective, buyer didn't ask for ins and I shipped out the package as agreed, obligation fulfilled.

or is there an intermediate area with 50/50 responsibility
Click to expand...


As a seller, you are obligated to get the item to the person in the condition advertised, since they are paying for your item.
I always insure a package for the amount it costs to replace so if it does get damaged or lost, I'll get my money back and the buyer gets his/her money back.
UPS covers up to $100 automatically.
Why take risks for a few bucks?
 
The person that pays for the shipment is at fault legally. Obviously the seller has to have proof of shipment in that situation...
 
You're basically dancing with death if you're shipping with USPS w.o any type of insurance. I've had them lose x3 packages so far in the 6 or so years I've been Ebaying and what not.

How they lose packages so frequently is beyond me..
 
I've always worked off the belief that it is the sellers responsibility to get the item to the buyer and insurance is irrelevant. Insurance is there to protect the seller, not the buyer.
 
Unfortunately, seller's fault. You would expect Newegg to replace an item if they did not get it to you.
 
Seller's responsibility 100% to deliver the goods.

Offering the buyer "hey do you want to pay to insure the package is a cop out"

If you can't take the hit on a 100% loss pay for the insurance out of your own pocket.
 
Insurance was never discussed, unfortunately I am the buyer, the padded mailer should have been adequate, it looked like a gorilla tore it in half.
Seller refuses responsibility, I proposed we each eat half, since I didn't ask for insurance, I receive a lot of items and have had only one damage b4 on a case
 
aren't we all forgetting something here...?

I don't see how this ISN'T teh USPS's fault, they even slapped a sticker on the package saying that it was damaged/opened (and let's not be naive here, stolen) while in their possession, that sticker has no legal implications here...? seriously...?

:confused:

and also, I don't think ALL packages are covered by $100 automatically (although I may be wrong), I go to the same USPS every time I ship and get along well with the two ladies that work the counter, obviously they are smitten with my good looks, manly physique, boundless machismo and witty banter, but I digress, now back to the point, I bought insurance for a video card I just sent out to a friend (a 4850 for bitcoin mining) and they asked me how much the package was worth, I said $100, if $100 would've been covered automatically they would've told me to save my $ and not insure it as a ploy to curry favor with me, no...?
 
Sellers fault if seller didn't offer the buyer insurance.

Buyers fault if seller did offer insurance at additional cost but buyer refused
 
Zepher said:
As a seller, you are obligated to get the item to the person in the condition advertised, since they are paying for your item.
I always insure a package for the amount it costs to replace so if it does get damaged or lost, I'll get my money back and the buyer gets his/her money back.
UPS covers up to $100 automatically.
Why take risks for a few bucks?
Click to expand...

PClark99 said:
Seller's responsibility 100% to deliver the goods.

Offering the buyer "hey do you want to pay to insure the package is a cop out"

If you can't take the hit on a 100% loss pay for the insurance out of your own pocket.
Click to expand...

These people are correct.

Seller.
 
seller 100% end of story.

Even if insurance was offered to the buyer it doesnt matter. Its the sellers job to get that package to the buyer so he/she should insure it to cover their own ass.


Id expect a full refund from the seller....Id want the same from Newegg, Amazon etc and they DO NOT give me an option for insurance cause its on them to get it to me.
 
Seller is responsible unless they offered insurance and the buyer declined it. That is what insurance is for.

Buyer's responsibility is payment, seller's responsibility is to ensure they get the item to the buyer.

In this case, the buyer paid and did not receive the item, therefore the seller should be liable IMO.
 
Seller. I ALWAYS insure the stuff I ship. Even if it is not for the full amount the item is worth, some insurance usually keeps sticky handed postal employees from messing with the package. Plus, insurance usually only costs a few bucks & it is worth my piece of mind.
 
DriZzLe said:
Seller. I ALWAYS insure the stuff I ship. Even if it is not for the full amount the item is worth, some insurance usually keeps sticky handed postal employees from messing with the package. Plus, insurance usually only costs a few bucks & it is worth my piece of mind.
Click to expand...

Totally agreed. I've never had a lost/damaged package when shipping USPS, but I still add insurance for every item I ship out. Assuming this processor was sold for under $200, insurance from USPS would cost an additional $2.85. Absolutely no reason not to include it.

And I agree with everyone else. In this scenario, the seller is responsible. As a buyer, I would expect a full refund and nothing less.
 
I'd say there is plenty guilt to go around, however...

If insurance was offered to the buyer, and s/he declined, then it's the buyer's fault. (though personally, I never offer insurance --- I ALWAYS ensure anything > $50)

If the seller did NOT offer insurance, then it's their fault.

Since there is no insurance, I'd say whoever of the two bears the blame (seller not offering vs buyer declining) needs to contact USPS and see if there's anything they can do.

As for the carrier itself, my personal experience is that USPS > UPS. I REGULARLY get damaged UPS shipments (and they come from FL to GA, so it's not a long trek) while I get USPS packages from all over the country (world) and have only had a few instances of damage EVER. (Never filed a complaint with either, so I don't know how well that works, the one time I had severe damage I contacted the seller's complaint department (TigerDirect) and they sent me a new motherboard with included prepaid label to send the damaged one back.)

Also a few thoughts on this matter:
1. Always ensure anything you cant afford to replace (I've never had insurance cost more than $4.99 and this was for ensuring a faillry high-dollar laptop) If you must pass along the cost, add $4 to your asking/shipping price.
2. if a package looks suspicious, when you pick it up, ask the clerk if they will witness you opening it, so you have official proof to file a complaint (technically you could lie and try to scam the PO, this way there is _NO_ question that the item was mishandled) I've done this several times (no problems yet thankfully) and the PO attendant never had a problem with my request.
3. and on the insurance note: always have (as the seller) pictures of the object in question to show as proof of what condition it was in when you shipped it.
 
Maybe the seller put a sign on it that said sorry the package was damaged during shipping, and then taped it up to appear like it had been opened. Ever think of that?
 
Whether insurance was offered or not makes no difference. Seller is responsible to get the package to the buyer.

Like I said, Newegg/Amazon doesnt offer insurance but they cover their own ass thats for sure.

If the seller couldnt fork over the $3 for insurance then shame on him and the buyer should be refunded in full. If not, start a Paypal claim.
 
If the item is worth more than $50 then I would insure it.

Sorry OP but you might have to bit the bullet on this one =(
 
deepinya said:
...Seller is responsible to get the package to the buyer...
Click to expand...

Assuming there is no plank, the seller DID get the item to the buyer, but the carrier damaged (or stole) the item and even acknowledged it. If no package ever shows up, then I agree with what you stated.
 
The item that was purchased didnt make it....I dont think he paid for an empty envelope :)

If it was insured then USPS would cover it. As a seller you eat the small fee for insurance to protect your ass from this very situation.
 
Seller should refund the buyer in this situation, then work with the carrier to recoup the loss (GL HF with that).
 
JCNiest5 said:
Assuming there is no plank, the seller DID get the item to the buyer, but the carrier damaged (or stole) the item and even acknowledged it. If no package ever shows up, then I agree with what you stated.
Click to expand...

No he didn't. He got an envelope to the buyer.
 
If insurance was discussed and buyer turned it down then buyers fault.

Since insurance was not discussed - I lean toward's seller's fault.

Like the one guy said. If I purchase something at newegg or amazon I expect to get my product, if I don't I contact newegg or amazon and they get my my product. Heck I even had newegg actively follow my product one time and give me a notification that my product was lost in shipping by UPS, and they gave me a refund. UPS confirmed the story when I called after newegg contacted me. That's active and fantastic customer service. A week later my $15 game arrived anyway through UPS -- must have been found and put back in the system.
 
It is the sellers responsibility to get the item to the buyer. Regardless of what happened, if the item didn't make it to the buyer, the seller is at fault. If you don't buy insurance you are accepting the possibility that this could happen and you have to refund the buyer.

The only exception to this is if the buyer explicitly arranged for no insurance with the seller. Then the seller has been absolved.
 
Zoson said:
It is the sellers responsibility to get the item to the buyer. Regardless of what happened, if the item didn't make it to the buyer, the seller is at fault. If you don't buy insurance you are accepting the possibility that this could happen and you have to refund the buyer.

The only exception to this is if the buyer explicitly arranged for no insurance with the seller. Then the seller has been absolved.
Click to expand...

Agreed except I can't think of any situation that the buyer would have anything to do with insurance as that is to protect the shipper. Perhaps if the buyer supplied his own shipping label but then he becomes the shipper.
 
I think I brought up a discussion about this a while back, and it boiled down to this :
Buyer paid seller's price - obligation fulfilled.
Seller provided goods as described within time frame - fulfilled.


I'm not sure why people are not insuring things for that extra couple of bucks in case these situations occur.
 
The Post Office tries to run just about anything they can through their automated equipment, especially if it's fairly thin. The problem is that the equipment is made to sort letters, not padded envelopes with things inside. I have seen envelopes with holes ripped in them and the contents were missing before, it's nothing new. This is why I wouldn't use a padded envelope for a cpu. A small flat rate box is about $5, use that instead, or a small box of your own. They can't run those through the same machinery so it is less likely to get destroyed or lost. Oh, and as everyone has said, insurance is a must for anything of decent value.
 
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