Wow, this guy is an idiot

[Unabomber]

For a long, long time, Intel did have a very large advantage over AMD. By the time AMD finally came out with its own (and that's debatable) 486 CPU, Intel was already pushing the Pentium. By the time AMD finally came out with K5, Intel's Pentium was already well above it in terms of clock speed, etc. K6 (K6/2, and K6/3 included) lagged behind its Pentium II counterparts in the gaming world.

Despite this disadvantage, AMD still managed to survive, although they did it by being more of a bottom feeder.

It really wasn't until the Athlon finally came out, that AMD was able to compete with Intel on an equal footing. Opteron, AMD64, etc., even gave AMD the advantage.

Now, Intel has reclaimed the advantage with Core2, and as expected, until AMD comes out with its next line, AMD will have to settle for the lower echelon again. Of course they're not going to be as profitable, but are hardly going to die out.

In this day and age, though, the CPU really isn't as much of a factor as the video card, which is why this effect isn't nearly as pronounced as it was a decade ago.

For those of you who read Usenet postings, does anyone remember that Intel fanatic named John Corse?

 

[jonathonball]

if i remember correctly AMD originally lured me in because of equal or near equal performance for less money... the fact AMD ever surpassed Intel in terms of performance was a BONUS. i've been running AMD since i was old enough to make my own purchasing decisions. and i don't think i'm alone in saying that i will continue to buy AMD's products well into the future. OP, that guy *IS* a shmuck.

 

[Donnie27]

For a long, long time, Intel did have a very large advantage over AMD. By the time AMD finally came out with its own (and that's debatable) 486 CPU, Intel was already pushing the Pentium. By the time AMD finally came out with K5, Intel's Pentium was already well above it in terms of clock speed, etc. K6 (K6/2, and K6/3 included) lagged behind its Pentium II counterparts in the gaming world.

Despite this disadvantage, AMD still managed to survive, although they did it by being more of a bottom feeder.

It really wasn't until the Athlon finally came out, that AMD was able to compete with Intel on an equal footing. Opteron, AMD64, etc., even gave AMD the advantage.

Now, Intel has reclaimed the advantage with Core2, and as expected, until AMD comes out with its next line, AMD will have to settle for the lower echelon again. Of course they're not going to be as profitable, but are hardly going to die out.

In this day and age, though, the CPU really isn't as much of a factor as the video card, which is why this effect isn't nearly as pronounced as it was a decade ago.

For those of you who read Usenet postings, does anyone remember that Intel fanatic named John Corse?

Raises hand!

How about PopeGoldX and AJ?

Man, Germany was nice

 

[Dan_D]

if i remember correctly AMD originally lured me in because of equal or near equal performance for less money... the fact AMD ever surpassed Intel in terms of performance was a BONUS. i've been running AMD since i was old enough to make my own purchasing decisions. and i don't think i'm alone in saying that i will continue to buy AMD's products well into the future. OP, that guy *IS* a shmuck.

But see, Intel is currently offering more performance, for less money. If you are building a machine today, you'd be a fool to buy AMD in the $150 and up processor segment. Loyalty to a specific company in this industry does not serve any consumer well at all.

 

[Sabrewulf165]

But see, Intel is currently offering more performance, for less money. If you are building a machine today, you'd be a fool to buy AMD in the $150 and up processor segment. Loyalty to a specific company in this industry does not serve any consumer well at all.

Money is money. If you're on a tight budget, the extra $35 you'd save on an X2 3800+ over an E6300 and the extra $40 you'd save on an AMD motherboard over a similar quality Intel motherboard is a pretty big deal. $75 is nothing to sneeze at no matter how loaded you are. That's a soundcard, a TV tuner, or a hard drive.

Not to mention NOT EVERYONE OVERCLOCKS. I know this is an enthusiast site but even still I'd be willing to bet there are a lot of people here who are not big overclockers. Stock for stock an X2 4200+ and a Core 2 E6300 are pretty much dead even on price and performance, with a slight (perceptually insignificant) edge to the E6300 on performance.

*IF* you are building a whole new machine today from scratch, then I agree, Core 2 is compelling. But from what I've seen on the forum, there are a lot of people still using their single core 939 systems who are jumping all over the price drops. ~$200 for a fast drop-in dual core upgrade is a lot more enticing than $550 to $600 (minimally) for a whole new CPU/RAM/Mobo that is only going to be (maybe) 10-20% faster. 1.2x the speed for 3x the money is not what I would call "more performance for less money."

 

[Dan_D]

Money is money. If you're on a tight budget, the extra $35 you'd save on an X2 3800+ over an E6300 and the extra $40 you'd save on an AMD motherboard over a similar quality Intel motherboard is a pretty big deal. $75 is nothing to sneeze at no matter how loaded you are. That's a soundcard, a TV tuner, or a hard drive.

Not to mention NOT EVERYONE OVERCLOCKS. I know this is an enthusiast site but even still I'd be willing to bet there are a lot of people here who are not big overclockers. Stock for stock an X2 4200+ and a Core 2 E6300 are pretty much dead even on price and performance, with a slight (perceptually insignificant) edge to the E6300 on performance.

*IF* you are building a whole new machine today from scratch, then I agree, Core 2 is compelling. But from what I've seen on the forum, there are a lot of people still using their single core 939 systems who are jumping all over the price drops. ~$200 for a fast drop-in dual core upgrade is a lot more enticing than $550 to $600 (minimally) for a whole new CPU/RAM/Mobo that is only going to be (maybe) 10-20% faster. 1.2x the speed for 3x the money is not what I would call "more performance for less money."

Your last points are valid, which is why I said "If you are building a new system today". If you already have a Socket AM2 or Socket 939 setup, then of course Core 2 Duo might not be worth the cost over a drop in X2.

 

[Donnie27]

Your last points are valid, which is why I said "If you are building a new system today". If you already have a Socket AM2 or Socket 939 setup, then of course Core 2 Duo might not be worth the cost over a drop in X2.

Sure, but many of us were negatively hammered for trying to get guys to wait for the AMD price cuts. Some folks here acted like personal sales reps for AMD. They were saying stuff like, "Buy Now" and "AMD will not cut prices until next year" LOL!

I compared my Bud's overclocked FX-60 (2.8GHz) to another's [email protected]. The poor thing was running on a *Jerry-Rigged i865. All Conroe Really had to do was be 12 to16% faster and even an FX-62 gets trumped (Not to hurt anyone's feeling with words like ass handed to it, spanked, creamed, crushed or like words used when X2 was faster).

I have a Socket 939 and may later upgrade to an X2 of some kind. But no way in hell would I not upgrade to a C2D 6600 NOT overclocked that runs as fast as a FX-62 (slightly faster more times than not BTW). Wulf is right, not everyone overclocks I'm currently not, after running mine at 3GHz I set mine back to stock. I love this fast, quiet, lower power using system.

Sure some guy can build a cheaper much slower rig like some guys here say. Again, though, this is [H] and [C]. I'm sure there are some sites where the best Bang for the Buck and Great Budget systems are the talk of the day. I didn't think that's what [H] was about. Maybe it's time for another Sub Forum called "Budget System" complete with Intel and AMD sections? That way Semprons, Celerons and 805s could be left out of threads like this?

Lastly, the guy doesn't get it if he thinks AMD is going anywhere, they're not. The Germans (government and the state of Saxony) and the EU have way too much at stake to let that happen. So does their Banks. Hell, even Intel has a lot of AMD stock

 

[Sabrewulf165]

Sure, but many of us were negatively hammered for trying to get guys to wait for the AMD price cuts. Some folks here acted like personal sales reps for AMD. They were saying stuff like, "Buy Now" and "AMD will not cut prices until next year" LOL!

I have to shamefacedly admit that I was one of those people thought that AMD would not drops prices on the X2 and furthermore had no reason to. I was unaware at the time of what a kick-ass processor the Core 2 would turn out to be!

 

[GreenMonkey]

I still so no reason to upgrade from socket 754. This is 2nd longest I've been on a single socket since my original K6-2 350mhz box. I grabbed a Venice 3400+ for $99 in the early summer from my newcastle 2800+. I saw no point in a whole new motherboard, CPU, RAM, etc.

I don't see any point to the slightly faster chips. I don't even see the point of dual-core 939.

Dual core is only useful for the multitasking fiend. Everyone is working on more cores and I don't even see the worthwhileness of 2 cores. Video compresses fast enough for the rare times I need to do it, gaming is bottlenecked elsewhere and designers aren't writing multithreaded games, etc.

I need a major and necessary improvement to upgrade. I'm still not seeing it.

 

[BigMacAttack]

I still so no reason to upgrade from socket 754. This is 2nd longest I've been on a single socket since my original K6-2 350mhz box. I grabbed a Venice 3400+ for $99 in the early summer from my newcastle 2800+. I saw no point in a whole new motherboard, CPU, RAM, etc.

I don't see any point to the slightly faster chips. I don't even see the point of dual-core 939.

Dual core is only useful for the multitasking fiend. Everyone is working on more cores and I don't even see the worthwhileness of 2 cores. Video compresses fast enough for the rare times I need to do it, gaming is bottlenecked elsewhere and designers aren't writing multithreaded games, etc.

I need a major and necessary improvement to upgrade. I'm still not seeing it.

Ditto. I'm not saying its useless for everyone - just for my needs. One day I'll upgrade - we all will. To those who need the power these are great times. To those of us who don't - they're still good times too.
I'd really be interested to see how the new C2D systems run Autocad since that's what I use at work. I imagine they run it very quickly. I'll have to check out Cadalyst magazine for some evaluations.

 

[Optik]

Ditto. I'm not saying its useless for everyone - just for my needs. One day I'll upgrade - we all will. To those who need the power these are great times. To those of us who don't - they're still good times too.
I'd really be interested to see how the new C2D systems run Autocad since that's what I use at work. I imagine they run it very quickly. I'll have to check out Cadalyst magazine for some evaluations.

agreed

at the time 939 was on fire, and i opted for the much cheaper and economical proc. i think i came out on top with my 3000+

 

[harpoon]

True, but a single core Athlon at the same price OCed could be as fast as both 805 cores in multi-threaded programs. With less heat.

No it can't. Single core A64s can't even touch my 3 year old Northwood P4C HT rig with multitasking/multithreaded apps, let alone an overclocked P-D. DC -> P4 HT -> SC

That said, the heat generated by an overclocked PD-805 is [H]ardcore , I think the X2 3600+ (it is available here in Australia, dunno about US) for a little more is a much better buy.

 

[MrGuvernment]

The P4/Xeon really _sucked_ and couldn't compete with athlon64/opteron.

From what i recall the P4 Northwood was doing a good job at everything but gaming and often holding it's own againt A64 if more then enough applications to stay ahead.... Not to mention the overclocking on the C chips was incredible.

i really hate when people says P4 / Xeon "sucked" it hardly "sucked"....

Dan_D [H] Motherboard Editor

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathonball
if i remember correctly AMD originally lured me in because of equal or near equal performance for less money... the fact AMD ever surpassed Intel in terms of performance was a BONUS. i've been running AMD since i was old enough to make my own purchasing decisions. and i don't think i'm alone in saying that i will continue to buy AMD's products well into the future. OP, that guy *IS* a shmuck.

But see, Intel is currently offering more performance, for less money. If you are building a machine today, you'd be a fool to buy AMD in the $150 and up processor segment. Loyalty to a specific company in this industry does not serve any consumer well at all.

Ignorance is bliss Dan_D , this person calls the OP a smuck... they arent one to talk.... Let buy a product from a company cause i always have, even thought something better could potentially be out there (this also goes for thos who say the same about intel)

 

[malicious]

socket a forever

 

[OC_LeGeND]

socket 939 4 ever lol

 

[GreyMatterTripp]

Intels lack of an integrated FSB memory controller is going to hurt it until it fixes this design flaw. The K8L is going to out class the conroe, quite predictably. Everyone forgets that before Conroe no Intel Chip even at 3.6Ghz could beat a 2.6Ghz AMD solution, the contrast was stark and painted in endless detail by the thousands of posted benchmarks. Its all peaks and valley's for both companies. Thats the way any buisness works espicially when their are only 2 that control the industry (psuedo-monopoly) they sway back and forth as far as competitive edge. It's all pretty predictable, they need eachother like pepsi needs coke, to promote the false image of real competition and enable branding and the easy splitting of consumer demographics. I digress from the point which is that soon AMD will be top dog again so don't worry.

 

[GreyMatterTripp]

just to add this is my first up to date system and it is an AMD and compared to the Intels I've seen and the superior design of AMD's solution I can't see any reason to by a new mobo and be stuck with Intels high latency mem controllers

 

[harpoon]

I digress from the point which is that soon AMD will be top dog again so don't worry.

Wow! You seem to have some secret insider info!!!

Since you know so much that nobody else does, perhaps you will care to enlighten us with a glimpse of the future?

1) When exactly will AMD be 'top dog' again? K8L is slated for Q3 07, that's quite a while off, maybe you know of some 'AMD secret superweapon' that nobody knows about?!

2) By how much (% wise) will K8L beat C2D? 20%? 50%? You seem pretty certain, give us some numbers!

3) Will K8L beat Yorkfield? After all, they are supposed to be launched at the same time... I'm sure you have these two chips running in your lab already and can conclusively say that K8L comes on top, right???

Since you have ALL the answers, please do tell!!! LOL

 

[dmens]

Intels lack of an integrated FSB memory controller is going to hurt it until it fixes this design flaw. The K8L is going to out class the conroe, quite predictably.

yeah, some flaw. mobile merom and its crippled bus can beat a fx offering in plenty of traces... not to mention dual package will dominate the market well into 2008. yeah, that fsb is really hurting that segment. lol.

it is amusing so many fans are saying things like "wait til K8L grrrr!!". but fyi, if k8l cannot significantly beat conroe in simd/float, then amd's cpu biz is finished. if that unlikely scenario materializes, nehalem will rip k8l to shreds. so keep praying, hahaha.

 

[Pepster64]

I don't think AMD is going anywhere, I heard People saying that about Intel when they were struggling and AMD was King. I also predict that AMD/ATI will develope somekind of motherboard with intergrated video that a person will be able to buy and say "Hey, this video doesn't suck!!!!" This will boost AMD tremedously if they were to do this.

 

[Donnie27]

I have to shamefacedly admit that I was one of those people thought that AMD would not drops prices on the X2 and furthermore had no reason to. I was unaware at the time of what a kick-ass processor the Core 2 would turn out to be!

Yup, 4 of my buds thanked me for getting them to wait before upgrading their AMD rigs. For the record, you weren't as wrong as some here.

 

[jonathonball]

Ignorance is bliss Dan_D , this person calls the OP a smuck... they arent one to talk.... Let buy a product from a company cause i always have, even thought something better could potentially be out there (this also goes for thos who say the same about intel)

I didn't call the OP a schmuck, I called the guy he was talking about a schmuck because he said AMD was doomed.

I didn't mean to say that I would buy from a company just because i always had. I guess what i was trying to communicate was that when I started buying AMD it was because they were a damn good alternative. I meant to say that I would continue to buy AMD because I beleive they will get back to that point (if not outright catch Intel again.)

If i had to build a computer right now it would probably be C2D, but that's not what i was saying in my post.

 

[Donnie27]

yeah, some flaw. mobile merom and its crippled bus can beat a fx offering in plenty of traces... not to mention dual package will dominate the market well into 2008. yeah, that fsb is really hurting that segment. lol.

it is amusing so many fans are saying things like "wait til K8L grrrr!!". but fyi, if k8l cannot significantly beat conroe in simd/float, then amd's cpu biz is finished. if that unlikely scenario materializes, nehalem will rip k8l to shreds. so keep praying, hahaha.

No matter what happens, AMD isn't going anywhere=P It is not in many folks' intrests to invest in Intel as I stated before. Some folks in Germany even complained that Saxonia (AMD + Saxony) was a porkbarrel project.

I agree, it may not be K8L or Rev-B vs. C2D or even Woodcrest. They'll be old news by the time K8L ships.

 

[drizzt81]

but fyi, if k8l cannot significantly beat conroe in simd/float, then amd's cpu biz is finished. if that unlikely scenario materializes, nehalem will rip k8l to shreds. so keep praying, hahaha.

Just like I am sceptical when it comes to the performance of K8L, I am sceptical that your doomsday scenario will come true.

 

[Sabrewulf165]

yeah, some flaw. mobile merom and its crippled bus can beat a fx offering in plenty of traces... not to mention dual package will dominate the market well into 2008. yeah, that fsb is really hurting that segment. lol.

it is amusing so many fans are saying things like "wait til K8L grrrr!!". but fyi, if k8l cannot significantly beat conroe in simd/float, then amd's cpu biz is finished. if that unlikely scenario materializes, nehalem will rip k8l to shreds. so keep praying, hahaha.

ROFL @ this guy... dropping names like an out-of-work L.A. actor at a dinner party. Hey future man, think you can pick the winning lotto numbers for me while you're at it?

 

[MrGuvernment]

I didn't call the OP a schmuck, I called the guy he was talking about a schmuck because he said AMD was doomed.

I didn't mean to say that I would buy from a company just because i always had. I guess what i was trying to communicate was that when I started buying AMD it was because they were a damn good alternative. I meant to say that I would continue to buy AMD because I beleive they will get back to that point (if not outright catch Intel again.)

If i had to build a computer right now it would probably be C2D, but that's not what i was saying in my post.

Thank you for the clarification

 

[MrGuvernment]

ROFL @ this guy... dropping names like an out-of-work L.A. actor at a dinner party. Hey future man, think you can pick the winning lotto numbers for me while you're at it?

So that is the only thing you have to say to him?

Funny, cause is true, perhaps in the future Intels lack of ICM could be a bad thing, but so far it doesnt seem to matter at all, since it is after call giving AMD a kick in the butt with out an ICM.......

 

[Sabrewulf165]

So that is the only thing you have to say to him?

Funny, cause is true, perhaps in the future Intels lack of ICM could be a bad thing, but so far it doesnt seem to matter at all, since it is after call giving AMD a kick in the butt with out an ICM.......

I never said he was right or wrong, I just always laugh when people start dropping future CPU codenames as if they have any idea what they're talking about. You could paraphrase such assertions like this and it would be no less speculative:

"Intel is always going to be better than AMD, because Intel says so."

I'm not ragging on just this guy in particular, there are presumptuous arguments like that on both sides of the fence, I just think it's funny that so many people are so sure of what's going to transpire a year from now.

PS - I think you meant to say "IMC." I also think that people are getting way too liberal with acronyms

 

[dmens]

I never said he was right or wrong, I just always laugh when people start dropping future CPU codenames as if they have any idea what they're talking about. You could paraphrase such assertions like this and it would be no less speculative:

"Intel is always going to be better than AMD, because Intel says so."

I'm not ragging on just this guy in particular, there are presumptuous arguments like that on both sides of the fence, I just think it's funny that so many people are so sure of what's going to transpire a year from now.

PS - I think you meant to say "IMC." I also think that people are getting way too liberal with acronyms

ever consider some people around here might actually be working on those future products?

 

[Sabrewulf165]

ever consider some people around here might actually be working on those future products?

Ever consider that those people can't possibly be working at that high of a level for AMD and Intel at the same time?

 

[dmens]

Ever consider that those people can't possibly be working at that high of a level for AMD and Intel at the same time?

yeah, that's why im not speculating on k8l performance, unlike everyone else.

and since when did someone have to be a high level person to know the perf of a part.

 

[Sabrewulf165]

yeah, that's why im not speculating on k8l performance, unlike everyone else.

and since when did someone have to be a high level person to know the perf of a part.

Well, at this stage and considering the processors you mentioned, I would think that the front desk secretary or janitor is gonna have access to engineering sample benchmarks

In any case, I agree. It's foolish to speculate about the potential performance of K8L. But it's also just as silly to speculate about the performance of Intel products beyond Kentsfield. Time will tell. I have no vested interest in whose product is faster. I doubt I will have any compelling reason to upgrade my 939 4200+ before DDR3 comes out. In fact I plan to deliberately skip DDR2 altogether.

 

[dmens]

Well, at this stage and considering the processors you mentioned, I would think that the front desk secretary or janitor is gonna have access to engineering sample benchmarks

In any case, I agree. It's foolish to speculate about the potential performance of K8L. But it's also just as silly to speculate about the performance of Intel products beyond Kentsfield. Time will tell. I have no vested interest in whose product is faster. I doubt I will have any compelling reason to upgrade my 939 4200+ before DDR3 comes out. In fact I plan to deliberately skip DDR2 altogether.

who the hell needs a sample. performance simulations are running before design work even starts.

so now you say speculation is silly, when you and others have been praising K8L's imminent awesomeness referencing a bunch of marketer slides, in this and other threads. hahaha hypocrites.

not to mention all the K8L hyping came about as a result of some idiot's letter to the Inq. if that guy were a troll, he did an awesome job baiting the fans.

 

[Sabrewulf165]

who the hell needs a sample. performance simulations are running before design work even starts.

so now you say speculation is silly, when you and others have been praising K8L's imminent awesomeness referencing a bunch of marketer slides, in this and other threads. hahaha hypocrites.

not to mention all the K8L hyping came about as a result of some idiot's letter to the Inq. if that guy were a troll, he did an awesome job baiting the fans.

I don't know what you're talking about... I personally never "hyped" the K8L, and any hyping that has been done in this thread was purely coincidence, as my intention was simply to show how ignorant the letter writer is of the way the CPU business actually works. I don't see that we have anything further to discuss about this, so please stop polluting the thread...

 

[GreyMatterTripp]

I'm not considering building a PC until mid 2007 my brilliant collegue and a year isn't very long unless your still in high school which you no doubt, judging by your attitude, are. My point was to switch to Core 2 Duo before the K8L comes out would be like getting a p4 a couple of months after it came out in 04/2002 and getting blown away by the K8. Look at the release dates pre K8 you'll see it might have seemed Intel had an advantage. This is how it goes, back and forth. If a processor is released far after its competition isn't it obvious the outcome. Give me a break, you guys have to much time on your hands and haven't even researched the facts AND history. What I stated was opionion based on evidence all around and in front of you. If you want to be ignorant and argue instead of converse go ahead but I will not partake. Plain and simple. I hope you wasted $900 on a top of the line Core 2 Duo because my 3800+ 1900XTX and 2gb can handle anything modern apps can throw at it so spending an extra $900 makes you a !!!!!! not the computer geek you so wish to be. Just so you know I never said for sure witch CPU would be "better" since there is no such way to provide either solution with this title without a doubt. Its clear the Core2Duo is the power machine of now, yet the IMC on a comprabably powerd AMD core and I'm sure you'll have a good race. And the benchmarks will most likely show the newest, and thus fastest CPU as being the winner.

Here is an OLD example of the back and forth I was describing before K8 which put AMD back on top and then the Core2Duo which reversed the roles once again.

http://mywebpage.netscape.com/CPUreleases/CPU_94-02-.png

 

[fubar569]

I'm not considering building a PC until mid 2007 dim wit and a year isn't very long unless your still in high school which you no doubt are. My point was to switch to Core 2 Duo before the K8L comes out would be like getting a p4 a couple of months after it came out and getting blown away by the K8 look at the release dates pre K8 you'll see it might have seemed Intel had an advantage. This is how it goes, back and forth. If a processor is released far after its competition isn't it obvious the outcome. Give me a break, you guys have to much time on your hands and what I stated was opionion based on evidence all around and in front of you. If you want to be ignorant and argue instead of converse go ahead but I will not partake. But AMD is less seedy. Plain and simple. I hope you wasted $900 on a top of the line Core 2 Duo because my 3800+ 1900XTX and 2gb can handle anything modern apps can throw at it so spending an extra $900 makes you a !!!!!! not the computer geek you so wish to be.

but it won't get you that extra 3.6fps in teh uber1337 awesomz benchi3z!!!!!!111!!!!!111!!!

all you people are fussing about C2D this and K8L that...and all i'm left to wonder is...what's all this hype about? personally, my XP 2500+ Barton at 2380mhz with 512mb of dual channel pc3200 can handle 99% of today's apps. so what? no one cares. i built it for a HTPC, to play FF11, and do all my casual stuff...and it succeeds marvelously...on a 200 dollar budget...

to each his own i guess....

my next upgrade will not come till after vista has the crap bugs worked out, DX10 shows me something im missing out on, and this "core war" or e-penis flogging contest between AMD and INTEL calms down to the point there is a somewhat clear cut winner here...by that i mean what am i trying to accomplish and what is the best part for that job...for right now everything is overkill for what i do...and that's the same for prolly greater than 90% of you too...

oh...and AMD is not going anywhere. without competition...intel would likely be broken up...and we cant have that...no one else would be able to even come close to stepping up to make up for the loss of what AMD provides...as a company, times are rough for AMD, but there aren't going anywhere anytime soon...

 

[MrGuvernment]

^^^ try rendering a 1600 x 1200 image in Bryce, or a large Poser scene in a decent amount of time?

Try encoding a DVD and using your computer with a single core

Try Burning a DVD and do much of anything else and not get buffer underruns or thiungs go slow.

sure, most people could still be using PIII's and many still do, and many others require more power and use their comps for alot more then you do.

Your say, word document may take 7 seconds to open, on a C2 it may take 2-3 seconds... the time adds up in the end.

 

[GreyMatterTripp]

Like he says INTEL needs AMD its the facade of competion that keeps free market capitalism alive. Just like Pepsi needs Coke.
To be honest fubar's system is probably the most impressive considering the time and resources compared to the performance of his system simply dwarves ours. While I enjoy the luxury of lighting quick downloads and internet travel with the 3800+ and even more luxury with gaming apps on the X1900XTX I relize that it is not a NECCESSITY. Even though my system is only at $900 including the X1900XTX I still got a very good deal but its hard to argue with $200. And as fubar points out he runs modern apps fine. Which means that there is not really any tangible difference between the AMD 64 and the Core2Duo lines. Only prestige of winning useless benchmarks. I play Oblivion maxxed with distant land and the whole nine yards and it flows like a steam even in combat. Go ahead and waste cash for the right to flog your E-Penis (LOL thats funny shit...and right on the mark too). I'll wait with fubar until the technology is as usefull as it is affordable, since neither criteria is substantially met at this point forget it.

P.S. I'm building a new system for my friend and got a 939 socket, not even considiring Core2Duo or AM2 simply because the user is not going to utilize all of that power and all of the potential problems bleeding edge tech usually encounters. Doing light gaming and music recording and only costing about $300's. Your computers are out Multi-tasking YOU. Can you really play Q4, Webbrowse, play an MP3, edit movies, graphic design, burn a CD, all at once as I hear many claiming??? I mean burning discs while playing media or games would be nice, but thats it and thats a very small reason to spend alot more $$$. And I can do all of the other stuff at the same time on a single core currently.

 

[Donnie27]

I don't know what you're talking about... I personally never "hyped" the K8L, and any hyping that has been done in this thread was purely coincidence, as my intention was simply to show how ignorant the letter writer is of the way the CPU business actually works. I don't see that we have anything further to discuss about this, so please stop polluting the thread...

Meanwhile.

AMD Quadcore News.

SAN JOSE, Calif. — Advanced Micro Devices Inc. (AMD) provided a deeper look into the quad-core Opteron, detailing six areas where it will enhance the CPU expected to appear in 2007.

 

[Sabrewulf165]

Meanwhile.

AMD Quadcore News.

Very nice. There had been some architectural information given out about K8L before (I think Anandtech did a short bit on it?) but until AMD starts making some % claims or better yet releasing bench numbers, none of us Joe enthusiasts have much to go on but speculation.