How to Activate Hardware PhysX to play with an ATI Video Card

CharonPDX said:
Should work just fine. I have had a 9600 GT in an open-back x4 slot for a long time as a PhysX card. Not too many motherboards have open-back x1 slots, though. If yours does, you should be fine. If you're thinking about hacking, just be very careful about it, and make sure that there are no motherboard components directly 'behind' the slot where the card-side connector would be.

Cheapest card? A used 8400 GS; although new ones can be had for as little as about $30, if you dig around. (Although the intergrated-chipset GeForce 8100 can also do it, but I don't know if that chipset will leave the onboard GPU active when you have a non-nVidia card add-in card. Heck, nVidia only officially offers "Hybrid SLI" when you plug in an 8400 GS.)
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actually the physx requirements have been updated for a while now to:

GeForce 8-series GPUs and later (with a minimum of 32 cores and a minimum of 256MB dedicated graphics memory) support PhysX.

so the lowest i think would be an 8600gt (or 9500gt), though it is usually recommended that a 9600gt is the minimum in order to obtain decent performance.

list of compatible gpus:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/physx_gpus.html

home page:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/physx_new.html

powerpacks for those that may be interested:

http://www.nvidia.com/content/graphicsplus/us/download.asp
 
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Many ppl Bought nvidia's older generations like 8800gt and want a new ati card and still use their nvidia card. Nvidia is trying to screw me up.

No different than Apple Not allowing Iphone 2G to send MMS when it was 100% capable of it.

"To get users to upgrade"
 
Works like a charm on Windows 7 Pro x64. I have a GTS 250 dedicated to Physx and I'm rendering with two 4890s. Batman was fun without the GTS, but with Physx? Damn :D
 
I always love how PhysX stirs up a mess every time it's mentioned :)
In the case of the game everyone always brings up (Batman), it adds some neat visual effects that in no way affect the game...but are still cool looking.
However if you have an older Nvidia card laying around...why wouldn't you want those effects?
There's no way I'd go out of my way to buy a card for PhysX, but it's irritating that we have to use this hack for hardware we already have.
I'd much rather have Nvidia not support PhysX in combination with ATI cards, BUT they wouldn't block access either.
 
Hardware Physx is pretty much Batman Arkham Asylum Graphical Enhancements. Pretty useless.
 
PM is not a new invention...
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i am aware of this atech, but i thought it better that everyone reading this thread be able to see that comment, that way if anyone was or is confused like you, they can read that explanation also and begin to understand why people are upset about nvidia locking them out from using ati and nvidia hardware together.
But im glad you now understand
 
Anything special to try if it doesn't work?

Windows 7 x64, installed beta 191.03, installed patch, set display options, but no Physx options in the NV Control panel. I get the Physx icon in the Win Control Panel but it just puts me into the regular NV Control Panel... I threw a spare G210 in which has Physx plastered all over the box but isn't listed on Nvidias Physx capable website. Although when I do System Information from the NV Control Panel, under components, it shows Physx in there...
 
Hi guys:

I just recently found the post where the workaround was originally posted and want to give it a try, but the nVidia card I would be using is a 9800 GX2 (because I already have it from a year or so) because of that, my question is: it would be worth the amount of energy the card will be consuming?, or should I get a "smaller" nVidia card?.

The one I'll be using as primary card is an ATI 4870X2.

Thanks a lot in advance for the advice.
 
kumquatsrus said:
actually the physx requirements have been updated for a while now to:

GeForce 8-series GPUs and later (with a minimum of 32 cores and a minimum of 256MB dedicated graphics memory) support PhysX.

so the lowest i think would be an 8600gt (or 9500gt), though it is usually recommended that a 9600gt is the minimum in order to obtain decent performance.

chart of compatible gpus:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/physx_gpus.html

home page:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/physx_new.html

powerpacks for those that may be interested:

http://www.nvidia.com/content/graphicsplus/us/download.asp
Click to expand...

Passively cooled & cheap. 9500GT $35AR.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814500072

Actively cooled & 96 SPs, $40AR.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121320

Question is, is it worth risking $40 just to have nvidia disable such functionality before I even get the card?
 
Unoid said:
Many ppl Bought nvidia's older generations like 8800gt and want a new ati card and still use their nvidia card. Nvidia is trying to screw me up.

No different than Apple Not allowing Iphone 2G to send MMS when it was 100% capable of it.

"To get users to upgrade"
Click to expand...

Um, it's completely different. As dumb as it is, Apple never stated/advertised/promised that the original iPhone would support MMS. NVIDIA stated/advertised/promised/sold PhysX capability as very clearly indicated feature present/available/useable in their GPUs and then later narrowed that definition down to systems running only NVIDIA. This has absolutely no parallel to the Apple MMS SNAFU.
 
What would be the correct way to unistall the physx card or update the ati drivers.I have just had a nightmare with my system trying to update the ati drivers,in the end i had to format the system.Would you remove the nvidia card then uninstall the drivers?uninstall the drivers then remove the nvidia card or just install the ati drivers over the top of the last ones?
 
Domingo said:
I always love how PhysX stirs up a mess every time it's mentioned :)
In the case of the game everyone always brings up (Batman), it adds some neat visual effects that in no way affect the game...but are still cool looking.
However if you have an older Nvidia card laying around...why wouldn't you want those effects?
There's no way I'd go out of my way to buy a card for PhysX, but it's irritating that we have to use this hack for hardware we already have.
I'd much rather have Nvidia not support PhysX in combination with ATI cards, BUT they wouldn't block access either.
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except until Atech opened his big mouth the thread was completely civil.. so no phsyX doesnt stir up a mess.. Atech does which isnt a surprise from him..

for me physX really doesnt matter.. but now that ill be able to use my 8800GT plus a 5870 when i get it just makes it better.. otherwise the 240 dollar piece of hardware i bought would of been collecting dust in my closet like everything else i cant or dont need to use anymore..
 
So I have 2 questions.

First I have a couple of 8800 GTS 320MB cards laying around from an old SLI setup. Will one of these work for a PhysX rendering card?

Second is this even possible in Vista x64 or do I need to wait till I upgrade to Win 7 x64?

Thanks
 
chipstien said:
So I have 2 questions.

First I have a couple of 8800 GTS 320MB cards laying around from an old SLI setup. Will one of these work for a PhysX rendering card?

Second is this even possible in Vista x64 or do I need to wait till I upgrade to Win 7 x64?

Thanks
Click to expand...

1) yes
2) no for vista - yes for 7
 
sirmonkey1985 said:
except until Atech opened his big mouth the thread was completely civil.. so no phsyX doesnt stir up a mess.. Atech does which isnt a surprise from him..

for me physX really doesnt matter.. but now that ill be able to use my 8800GT plus a 5870 when i get it just makes it better.. otherwise the 240 dollar piece of hardware i bought would of been collecting dust in my closet like everything else i cant or dont need to use anymore..
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No it's people that want something for nothing. They went back to ATI and expect phsyx to go along with them. It's not like ATI is just going to up Eyefinity to Nvidia
 
GTS250's can be had for under $100. In Batman my performance in the benchmark didn't change at all with PhysX changed to "Full." I still pull 59-60fps with vsync on and everything turned all the way up.
It's not to say there might not be more PhysX intensive games out there or on the way, but it's pretty much the benchmark everyone is using at the moment.
I still wouldn't buy a secondary card for PhysX right now, no matter the cost, though. It's neat if you have one laying around, but paying even $30 for fog and leaves/papers will lead to disappointment.
 
Blazemore said:
No it's people that want something for nothing. They went back to ATI and expect phsyx to go along with them. It's not like ATI is just going to up Eyefinity to Nvidia
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No, it's people that stayed with Nv for the 10 or so games that suport GPU PhysX and just added a newer/faster Ati card for rendering, that suddenly had something that previously worked, stop working due to an "update" that has the community pissed. That certain people are so stuck up Nv's ass to see that, or see it and think it is just fine, is astounding.
 
GORANKAR said:
No, it's people that stayed with Nv for the 10 or so games that suport GPU PhysX and just added a newer/faster Ati card for rendering, that suddenly had something that previously worked, stop working due to an "update" that has the community pissed. That certain people are so stuck up Nv's ass to see that, or see it and think it is just fine, is astounding.
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No it's the people that switch their hardware and expect it to work like a charm. Physx was intended to be used with only on Nvidia GPU's. Those people made to the choice to switch which lost their ability to use Physx. It was their decision not Nvidia's. Nvidia just narrowed down the requirements of only Nvidia GPU's which piss people off.

So I should be able to use 295 for rendering and buy 5850 just get eyefinity. Ati going to support that :p
 
Blazemore said:
No it's the people that switch their hardware and expect it to work like a charm. Physx was intended to be used with only on Nvidia GPU's. Those people made to the choice to switch which lost their ability to use Physx. It was their decision not Nvidia's. Nvidia just narrowed down the requirements of only Nvidia GPU's which piss people off.

So I should be able to use 295 for rendering and buy 5850 just get eyefinity. Ati going to support that :p
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Sweet Mary mother of Jesus, will you shut the hell up? It's not even close to the same thing in that PhysX worked just fine for multi-gpu setups until NV decided to screw the pooch. Go troll somewhere else. Your English sucks by the way. :D
 
Blazemore said:
No it's the people that switch their hardware and expect it to work like a charm. Physx was intended to be used with only on Nvidia GPU's.
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Wrong. PhysX is an API. The calculations run on the CPU or the GPU (accelerated). The GPU portion at the moment is limited to Nvidia GPUs. The API still works the same for now until Nvidia does something to change that.

Blazemore said:
Those people made to the choice to switch which lost their ability to use Physx. It was their decision not Nvidia's. Nvidia just narrowed down the requirements of only Nvidia GPU's which piss people off.
Click to expand...
Nvidia is full of shit. If I ran the hack and I had issues then I would agree, buuuut that DIDN'T HAPPEN. Batman AA, Mirror's Edge, Cryostasis, all ran GREAT with my GTX280 doing physics and the ATI5870 rendering the shit out of the scenes.

The only thing that makes sense is that they want to keep customers in their camp exclusively and they feel that locking down PhysX will help them towards that end. Fuck that, I switched knowing that I would lose PhysX. I got lucky and only had to go a couple of days without it.

Blazemore said:
So I should be able to use 295 for rendering and buy 5850 just get eyefinity. Ati going to support that :p
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Fail.
 
Would putting a 7800gt into a system that has a 4890 do any good? Also, you don't need to have SLI enabled right? I can just plug the 7800 into one of the lower slots under the PCI-E and then enable it?

Let me know if this is even worth anything... thanks guys.
 
topslop1 said:
Would putting a 7800gt into a system that has a 4890 do any good? Also, you don't need to have SLI enabled right? I can just plug the 7800 into one of the lower slots under the PCI-E and then enable it?

Let me know if this is even worth anything... thanks guys.
Click to expand...

Only the 8,9, and GTX series support Physx so no, it won't work. Here's a list for you:

PhysX capable GPUs
 
Blazemore said:
No it's the people that switch their hardware and expect it to work like a charm. Physx was intended to be used with only on Nvidia GPU's. Those people made to the choice to switch which lost their ability to use Physx. It was their decision not Nvidia's. Nvidia just narrowed down the requirements of only Nvidia GPU's which piss people off.

So I should be able to use 295 for rendering and buy 5850 just get eyefinity. Ati going to support that :p
Click to expand...


From a technical aspect your analogy is plain stupid.
What would Ati have to do to make Eyefinity work on Nv's hardware? Write drivers for / add hardware to Nv cards.
What would Nv have to do to let CUDA/PhysX run on Nv hardware with an Ati card doing rendering? Stop blocking it with drivers.



Meh whatever. the hack works for me with 9800gtx+ and 5870.
 
topslop1 said:
Okay, would the return for performance be worthwhile to pick up an 8800 used? Would I really see a benefit to how my games are running or just more fluidity in the physx?
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Depends on the games. Cryostasis and Batman AA benefit from it.

The question isn't about performance, the shit works, plain and simple. What you want to ask YOURSELF is whether or not you value extra eye candy enough to spend a few extra bucks to get it, knowing that down the road the setup may no longer work.

Do a search on YouTube for the 9minute HD PhysX comparison in Batman. There might be some Cryostasis stuff up there too along with Mirror's Edge. Darkest of Days is supposed to take really good advantage of the tech as well.
 
topslop1 said:
Okay, would the return for performance be worthwhile to pick up an 8800 used? Would I really see a benefit to how my games are running or just more fluidity in the physx?
Click to expand...

From what I've read and tested the best bang for the buck PhysX card is a 9600GT. I tried a 9500GT before that which was horrible. With the 9600GT I get in Batman: AA (4xAA, 16xAF, PhysX on high) an avg. fps of 60, min 45 fps, and a max of 110 fps with the system in my sig. To get those speeds I overclocked the 9600GT a bit to 800 / 2000 which brought my framerate up about 5-10 fps.

I picked my 9600GT up for $50 on the Amazon Marketplace. I'm sure if you look around you can find a pretty good deal on one or maybe even something a little better.
 
How would a GTX-275 function paired with CrossfireX 5870s? Is that overkill?
 
AppaYipYip said:
How would a GTX-275 function paired with CrossfireX 5870s? Is that overkill?
Click to expand...

compared to the performance you can get with a gts250 for dedicated physx processing - yes, it is overkill. you would get like 90% of the performance for half the price.
 
snaggletooth said:
From what I've read, 8800GT is the least powerful GPU you'd want to process PHYSX with. Anything less powerful will just bring disappointment.
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http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,...eia-card-Alternative-to-Nvidia-Physx/Reviews/

There's not much difference between a 9600GT and a 9800GTX+ in terms of PhysX performance when is used as a PhysX card, its quite interesting that an outdated AGEIA PhysX card is even faster than a 9600GT for PhysX calculations which proves that the AGEIA card was well designed for such tasks and that its obsolence is just a mimick to promote users to buy more nVidia cards.
 
Does ATI's OpenCL And Stream SDK V2.0 Driver Release Utilise Physics Drivers In Games?

Yesterday, I reported on the release of ATI's OpenCL platform beta release and I thought it rude not to give it a try!

The release consists of ATI Stream SDK beta V2.0, and ATI OpenCL beta driver V2.0. Having downloaded this to run on a PC primarily used for animation using Blender, I decided to try it on my main gaming machine.

Installation was painless as I utilized the ATI 9.9 Catalyst with the downloads and installed the drivers in a specific order.

The ATI catalyst was upgraded by the OpenCL kit to Catalyst 9.11 and has support for the new HD 5850/HD5870 series of cards from ATI, as well as the 4XXX series of cards.

While running Futuremark's 3D Mark Vantage to check the stability of the drivers, I noticed that the driver tests were clearer, and that some previously unseen (using an ATI card) parts of the test were now visible. As these are normally only seen when running an NVidia graphics card using PhysX, I was intrigued enough to run Futuremark's 3DMark 06 update to see if any there were any further physics utilisations now visible and to my surprise, there were!

These drivers not only gave my humble HD 4890 a boost, but somehow made it faster than ATI's new flagship HD 5870 in both benchmarks. I saw an increase in score of over 900 points in 3DMark Vantage and 2700 points in 3DMark 06 from ATI catalyst 9.9, so the results appear to be impressive so far.

As these are just synthetic tests, I thought I would try out some in-game physics and what better to do it with than Batman Arkham Asylum?

As NVidia worked with the developers of the game and ATI didn't, you would think that a flagship game from NVidia's "The way it's meant to be played" series wouldn't be able to utilise physics on an ATI graphics card would you? especially after NVidia stopping people using older 8 series cards as a separate PhysX card last week Well, you'd be wrong!

First off, running the game with the highest NVidia PhysX settings enabled produced the following screen shot.
Batman can be seen heading off into a wall of steam - unfortunately, this setting made the frame rate drop in parts briefly to a low of 12~20 FPS, but as the ATI cards aren't supposed to be able to show this anyway, I can live with that for now.
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87029124.png


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Update

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4069254&postcount=63

Clunk said:
Guys, I apologise if the article has misled or upset anyone, that was not the intention. I did not write the article, nor do I even have the Batman game or a 4890, one of our news team stumbled across the drivers and decided to try it for himself. It was the drop in CPU usage that was shown in the video that led him to the conclusion that there was some kind of physics happening and with hindsight, it probably shouldn't have been posted until it had been tested further. I have since removed the article from the site. You win some, you lose some and some you fail miserably :)
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evolucion8 said:
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,...eia-card-Alternative-to-Nvidia-Physx/Reviews/

There's not much difference between a 9600GT and a 9800GTX+ in terms of PhysX performance when is used as a PhysX card, its quite interesting that an outdated AGEIA PhysX card is even faster than a 9600GT for PhysX calculations which proves that the AGEIA card was well designed for such tasks and that its obsolence is just a mimick to promote users to buy more nVidia cards.
Click to expand...

i thought it's obsolescence was a result of very few people buying ppus, lol.
 
I found some instructions in another forum to fix the nvcuda missing with AGEIA card users, is as the following:

I downloaded CUDA drivers (includes yes nvidia graphis so there is nvcuda.dl_).
I started installing them and very fast stuck to graphis card place (where starts installing them and see i dont have nvidia) then it has unzipped all stuff to C:\NVIDIA -folder,

Go to C:\NVIDIA\Win764\185.5\IS <--Folder. There is one very important file (not nvcuda.dl_)... called by "nvcuda32.dl_"

-------------------Now we need expand that file back to working *.dll---------

Start cmd from start menu

Use cd.. (back from folders) or cd FOLDERNAME commands come back to C:\

Then go to C:\NVIDIA\Win764\185.5\IS -folder by those commands. Then Write next...

"expand nvcuda32.dl_ c:\" (without "" -marks)

Its now expands that back to nvcuda32.dll to C:\, so go to C:\ -Drive and found it, rename it to nvcuda.dll and copy (or cut) it to

C:\CUDA\bin (works for me)
C:\Windows\System32 (sometimes(?))
C:\Windows\WOW64 (?)

and start play... (8.09.04 this, not yet tested try play with newest)

Yeah!!!!

This helps those who are stucked into 8.04.25 physx drivers with Ageia PPU (100). Getting better ones.
You with Nvidia card, u get easy that nvcuda.dll´s right version. With only CUDA tool kit this doesnt come and its make hard to launch anything! says error to found "nvcuda.dll" And all whats i found from internet (nvcuda.dll) didnt work on 64 bit Win7!

Link: http://www.ngohq.com/graphic-cards/...sx-when-ati-card-is-present-52.html#post83896

As soon as I get my AGEIA card I will test it to check that out.
 
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