The Audacity! Buyer's Beware!

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Cmustang87

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Oct 4, 2007
Messages
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So, check this out guys. You may get a kick out of this.

I cannot believe Gateway had the jewels to even attempt this garbage.

A friend of mine bought a Gateway FX-6800 LINK and lately she was having crazy system crashed, completely random and vertical lines in her screen. She brings it to me for help because the guys at Geek Squad told her it was a software issue and all the hardware tested OK and they were going to charge her.

So doing some testing, i couldn't really figure out. I try doing new video drivers and everytthing still getting crazy crashes. Backed her data up and re-imaged the system (Vista Home Prem) and when copying her data back over, the system crashed on me again!

I was like wtf is going on? I opened up the damn case and looked inside. This is a Core i7 machine, and they had a 500w LiteOn PSU in there powering this rig witha 4850 in there, and the PSU isn''t rated over 450w. Not only THAT, they had a 4 pin power connector on the CPU power connector which requires a fucking 8 pin :mad:. How in the world are they getting away with this? This is absolute garbage and completely irresponsible on their part screwing high dollar spending customers.

For shits and giggles I ran Linpack on the CPU to see how it would test, and it instantly fails. I will get in touch with Gateway and Best Buy and let them know what's going on. In the meantime, I'm replacing this shitty PSU for a new BFG LS 550 to give this i7 the juice it deserves!
 
And now Gateway's rep in my eyes have dropped considerably.
 
Good for you for looking out for your friend's best interests.

And thanks for warning us about Gateway's (latest) attempt to half-ass things. Let us know of the responses that Gateway and Best Buy give you.
 
I will def let you guys know. This is insane, I know with computers you get some half assed things, and arrogance... but THIS, from a Multi-Billion dollar company? :rolleyes:
 
Danny Bui said:
And now Gateway's rep in my eyes have dropped considerably.
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lol gateway had a good reputation in your eye's? what world are you from? gateway has been one of the worst pre-build system companies since its existance.. i mean hell they make compaq look good.. they use bottom of the line everything on hardware.. anything they can get for cheap they will throw it in a system..

btw you should feel lucky that system even came with a 500w psu.. one of my idiot friends due to his lazyness and lack of wanting to learn anything new bought an i7 system as well from gateway and it came with a 300w psu.. which didnt even have the correct connectors for the system.. it had 2 sata hard drives in it.. but there were no sata power cables on the psu.. heck it didnt even have a 6 pin pci-e connector for the 4870.. let alone the second one it would of needed to run the card..
 
Best Buy isn't going to say anything other than "Sorry, we can't do anything about it. It's the manufacturer's problem"

Also, the Geek Squad diag software is regulated by BBY. It can only have diag software that has been approved for use. It receives updates every now and then. It doesn't really test for any power related issues; rather, it tests stability issues with hardware integrity.
 
p4gs said:
Best Buy isn't going to say anything other than "Sorry, we can't do anything about it. It's the manufacturer's problem"

Also, the Geek Squad diag software is regulated by BBY. It can only have diag software that has been approved for use. It receives updates every now and then. It doesn't really test for any power related issues; rather, it tests stability issues with hardware integrity.
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These were my thoughts intentionally. I wanted to tell her to pitch a fit with Gateway and have her go that route to get a new one, but they would just send her junk again anyway. I am inclined to have Geek Squad give her a free installation of a new PSU when she buys it though as a courtesy "SORRY WE MISSED THAT" type of deal.
 
sirmonkey1985 confirmed what I feared: this is an ongoing Gateway issue, not Best Buy.

Maybe you guys could inform the good people of The Consumerist of what seems to be (yet another) oncoming trend.
 
It's the Gateway to a huge headache from your PC.
 
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Looks like the eMachines people started working on the Gateway machines now, lol.

Cmustang87 said:
... This is a Core i7 machine, and they had a 500w LiteOn PSU in there powering this rig witha 4850 in there, and the PSU isn''t rated over 450w. ...
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:confused: ... its a 500W thats not even rated to run at 450W? huh? got a pic of the label?

Cmustang87 said:
... Not only THAT, they had a 4 pin power connector on the CPU power connector which requires a fucking 8 pin :mad:. ...
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Well, an 8-pin isn't required, just strongly recommended. The board should run fine with a 4-pin; its still getting +12V and ground from that cable, whether 4 or 8 pins are used.
 
i don't have a pic of the label, she already came and got the computer. The fact that the system instantly fails a Linpack test and blue screens anytime the computer does anything stressful is a tell tale sign that something is wrong out of the box.

Why would they use a 4 pin in an 8 pin connector and go "DAR THAT LOOKS GOOD TO ME, PUT IT IN DA BOX AND SELL THE SHIT."
 
Cmustang87 said:
Why would they use a 4 pin in an 8 pin connector and go "DAR THAT LOOKS GOOD TO ME, PUT IT IN DA BOX AND SELL THE SHIT."
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Something tells me that the guys who assembled it actually speak that way... :D
 
PC_User said:
Something tells me that the guys who assembled it actually speak that way... :D
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id actually put 100% of the blame on the people that design these systems.. not the people that actually build them.. the people building them are following set directions by gateway them selves..
 
enginurd said:
:confused: ... its a 500W thats not even rated to run at 450W? huh? got a pic of the label?
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I think OP meant that the 500W rating is probably at 25C's or less. Real world, it's probably 450 or less at 35-40C's. Again, air quotations are needed here.
 
Again, as far as I know, unless the CPU is pulling more than 135W (eg. when OC'ing), the 4-pin plug should work fine. The only thing the 8-pin does is spread the current out between more wires, AFAIK.
 
About what has happened, you are a good friend to take matters into your own hands for her.

Eager to see what Gateway/Best Buy has to say.
 
sirmonkey1985 said:
id actually put 100% of the blame on the people that design these systems.. not the people that actually build them.. the people building them are following set directions by gateway them selves..
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Is that really true though, the builders will likely have some discretion in case they have a shortage of recommended parts which brings a whole load more people into question.
Its down to their quality control to catch problems like this so their QC sucks for sure as well as either the wrong people are making decisions or some managers are making bad decisions.
Either way, at least one manager needs discipline.

Maybe the designers really did do a crap job, but as their work is scrutinised by everyone afterwards, you would expect someone to pick up on it.
If what you say is really true, Gateway need to close shop as that is deplorable.
 
The main question at hand really (regardless is the 4 pin connection may or may not work as efficiently) is WHY would they do that?

@Enginurd: Don't you think this is why the system blue screens under any stress or trying to multi-task? She started noticing it when trying to play world of warcraft, and after I re-imaged it, started happening to me when I was just browsing through data trying to see real world performance and testing to see where the crash comes from.
 
After dealing with Gateway customer service for the last three months everyone needs to be aware that they are not a company ANYONE should be dealing with.
They make it hard by putting out items like the P7811 and the P7805 laptops but now we can see why they are so inexpensive: you get what you pay for.
The problems with the 7811 are well known but the 7805 is a great little machine for a very good price. It's beastly powerful and have never had problems with it, unlike the 7811.

However, having said that, I will NEVER buy Gateway again based purely on my experiences with their customer support. ACER CS I might add.

All this other stuff is bonus negativity to remind me that they are the suck.

Good luck getting anything out of them as far as replacement or repairs but I will be rooting for you.
 
Cmustang87 said:
The main question at hand really (regardless is the 4 pin connection may or may not work as efficiently) is WHY would they do that?

@Enginurd: Don't you think this is why the system blue screens under any stress or trying to multi-task? She started noticing it when trying to play world of warcraft, and after I re-imaged it, started happening to me when I was just browsing through data trying to see real world performance and testing to see where the crash comes from.
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I'd attribute it more to the PSU, not the 4-pin cable. Why would they use a 4-pin cable? because it should work fine with one. Why would they use such a shitty PSU? because they're idiots. The 4-pin cable should still deliver the needed power, but if the PSU wasn't up to the task, then it doesnt matter if a 4 or 8-pin cable is used. I simply don't see the 4-pin cable usage as a big deal. The shitty PSU, on the other hand, is a huge deal, and reminds me of their eMachines (mainly refurb parts), which are notorious for shitty PSUs killing mobos. I agree, stay away from Gateway these days. Though, back in the day ('00-'04), we used a shitload of gateways at my old job, and they did fine -- no high end machines like your friends' system, though (mainly the profiles, for comp labs).
 
Well I will be speaking with the Geeks and also one of the Mangers' at Best Buy to see if I can squeeze a free install of the power supply when she gets it in. Hopefully they have their Earthwatts 550 in store, otherwise it'll be the BFG LS550 from the egg.

Give this 4850 and Core i7 some real juice :cool:

Thanks for your guys' inputs, and if I feel inclined to do so.. I'll give Gateway a call and tell them how to be [H]ard.
 
Write some product reviews everywhere, if you can, lol. You know, like on amazon... if its offered there.
 
enginurd said:
Write some product reviews everywhere, if you can, lol. You know, like on amazon... if its offered there.
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I would love to, but.... that's just too much damn work. Usually people take customer reviews with a grain of salt and it would end up falling on deaf ears. Oh well...

EDIT: I used a term that is offensive to some people, I deleted it. I guess that goes to say don't say things you don't have the definition for!
 
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I simply don't see the 4-pin cable usage as a big deal. The shitty PSU, on the other hand, is a huge deal,
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There ya have it. Perfect and concise.

As usual, ya get what ya paid for but it's a shame that uneducated consumers can't depend on a company to assemble a machine that's going to be reliable "right out of the box".

Technically a 500 watt PS should run that machine and maybe another 500w LiteOn PSU would work, but ya get what ya paid for.
 
Pre-built computers are almost universally shit. The only way to really get a decent computer is to build it yourself. I had very bad experiences with every overpriced prefabbed piece of shit I've ever owned.. The last two computers, I built myself and never had a single issue with them.

I still remember when I got a Gateway, and had finally gotten the stuff from my old my old PC to the new one, and *poof* the damn thing refused to boot out of the blue. I called Gateway and told the guy that I had partitioned the hard drive and recently reinstalled Windows-- and that I had 4 years of data that I couldn't back up until I got out to get CD-Rs.. So the bastard told me to put in the Gateway OS disk and press a key that pretty much automatically deleted all of the partitions of the drive, reformatted and reinstalled the OS without any warnings or prompts. I yelled at the guy and I could almost see the smirk on his face as he told me "read your agreement, we aren't responsible for data loss. Have a nice day. *click*"

fuckers.
 
No, not all pre-built computers are shit. I've personally bought over a dozen for friends and family, and they rarely have problems. I've also setup and maintained hundreds of Dells and Gateways for computer labs at my old university; they did much better than the "custom built systems" in the "ArtsLab." :rolleyes: My next job after that, we used mostly HPs, and again, they worked fine for the most part (company of 3000+). Even now, at my current job, we use all Dells for both our dev workstations and desktops, and they all work fine out of the box. So, IMO, Pre-built computers are NOT almost universally shit. I think a more accurate blanket statement would be that Gateway and eMachines are almost universally shit. Sure, custom built systems are fine if you have certain needs, but pre-builts work just fine, for the most part and if they suit your needs.
 
I would have held back ranting until you know for sure that the problem is the PSU. That might be it, but it's far from definite.

And in general, there's really nothing wrong with the OEM LiteOn PSUs in OEM systems. Dell uses those and the pair of Dell Vostro Q6600 systems with LiteOn PSUs I had worked fine, even after upgrading the video cards.
 
Old Hippie said:
I feel the same way about blanket statments. :)

Ya get what ya pay for. ;)
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in this case its not far from the truth. anything with a reasonable price tag is usually garbage and anything worth using costs about double of what the hardware costs.
 
Well to say you "get what you pay for" really isn't fair in this sense. This computer costed her over $1300. Any uneducated consumer knows if they walk away from the budget to mid range line of PC's in a B&M store they should expect top dollar performance and quality.

Of course most of us at [H] know that isn't typically the case, but... she paid top dollar for this machine. She didn't go cheap by any means at all.
 
Any uneducated consumer knows if they walk away from the budget to mid range line of PC's in a B&M store they should expect top dollar performance and quality.
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I dunno about "top dollar performance and quality" but like I said before, it should be a machine that will be reliable right out of the box.

But I'm with pxc...let's see what the problem is and how Gateway handles it.
 
p4gs said:
Best Buy isn't going to say anything other than "Sorry, we can't do anything about it. It's the manufacturer's problem"
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When I thought I had a failed BIOS flash, I called there asking if they knew whether or not they had the tools necessary to do a direct flash to the chip (Which would require something like an EEPROM burner). I knew they didn't but I had to be through. I explained the situation and the guy was like "Well, we'd have to take a look at it to really tell. Why don't you bring it in".

And I thought to myself... You bastards, I know damn well you aren't equipped to do that (Or any other simple hardware repair; I'd be surprised if anyone there even knew what a soldering iron was). But instead you will directly evade my question and tell me to bring it in so you can charge hundreds of dollars for and inspection and a software diagnostic? I'd rather throw my money away.

On topic though, I find most big computer vendors (Dell, HP, Gateway, etc) to be all the same in my eyes. Put in inadequate hardware, with a short 1 year warranty, and it's like pulling teeth to get the robots in India (Which you are lucky if you can ever understand) to replace of fix anything. Anyone would be better to learn how to build a PC themselves (and you get nice warranties directly from manafacturers, like mobo's at 3 years and CPUs at 5) or buy from a smaller vender known for a better rep like http://www.pugetsystems.com/
 
I'm not sure why anyone woudl be shocked, this is how Dell/HP/Gateway etc have always operated. Flash the shiny "intel inside" and hype the "sexy components", then use crappy compenents on the less sexy components (PSU, mobo, drives, etc). It's alwasy been this way.

On an aside, to run your firends system stock, 500W is more than enough.
 
Yeah, well you can be shocked but not surprised. I do find it appalling some of the things these PC companies do, still, might even make me shocked. But not surprised.

This reminds me of the time I had a Radeon 9800 PRO 256MB graphics card in an HP computer, and after normal gaming it literally melted because it had a heatsink/fan that was way to small for a card of it's size. When I asked them to send me a replacement, I got a GeForce FX 5700 (which if I remember correctly had half the memory on it and did perform much lower than the 9800). It came with the exact same fan as the 9800 had :eek:
 
When you repair computers for a living everyday like I do, you see it all.

I see things like this all the time, usually not to this extent but cost cutting for prebuilts is a huge deal.

Like a i7 Dell I upgraded the other day, it had a 300w power supply trying to drive a i7 920 and a 4850... that will end well.
 
So here's an update for ya'all:

She swapped out the PSU with a new one... the system is still crashing. So I'm not sure what the hell is going on with this. She got Gateway on the phone and they said they can get it back to her in 10-15 days.

If a new PSU didn't fix it, my vote is on a bad mobo or video card. The system is crashing everytime they open a program of any kind. After a re-imaged system I doubt it's anything software related... I suppose it could be a bad hard drive... but I'm not sure.

Any other thoughts guys? :confused:
 
I vote bad mobo. If not then RAM or hard drive (almost interchangeable they fail so much). Working in IT, motherboards are a common failure point with our prebuilts (laptops and desktops). When it comes to sudden instability from an end-user with a prebuilt, I would say from most common to least is:

1) Software (messed up OS, drivers, etc)
2) Mobo
3) RAM
4) Hard drive (bad clusters - believe it or not it causes hangs/crashes all the time)
5) Power Supply
6) Some other peripheral
7) and finally, CPU (rare)

I don't list video cards because I rarely ever see anything other than onboard video, which means when on-board video fails, it just adds to the motherboard failure statistics.
 
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