ABS Ultimate X8 @ [H] Consumer

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Jason_Wall

[H] Consumer Managing Editor
Joined
Jul 22, 2005
Messages
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ABS is back in the [H] Consumer offices after coming off of an Editor's Choice Gold Award. But things have changed at ABS, most notably in the support of RMAs and defective hardware. If you get a solid system, then you may never have to worry about it, but if you need ABS' help, you might be in trouble.

The market is desperately seeking a company to replace Monarch. ABS is the logical alternative given its association with Newegg.com, but should we be looking elsewhere?

When we tried to take our problems to ABS, the techs we spoke to were very helpful. But we also got the impression that there was a supervisor standing behind them with a corporate practices document in one hand and a cattle prod in the other. There’s something peculiarly ironic about a company called Always Better Service refusing explicit requests for better service. We really would have liked for them to extend just a little bit of courtesy our direction, if only to apologize for delivering defective hardware to a customer.
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Thanks for reading!
 
Awesome review as ever.
It sounds like cut backs on the support dept, but at the same time wasted resources such as automated phone system that really does nothing and the receptionist who just passes the support call along.

That RMA process would have seriously p!$$3d me off to say the least, can you imagine forking out that kind of dosh for a gaming pc to have to let it sit idle for over two weeks?

Did you make any calls on when the new ram was going to be returned?

Any normal customer would be baying for the CEO of the company after the first few days of waiting, I don't know how you were able to keep your patience!!!
 
Pretty disappointing seeing this level of customer service from the parent company of Newegg :(

I have to concur that the RMA process is seriously flawed. After the end of the evaluation, did you try to find out the reasoning behind it from ABS? Since RMA is a big reason for your not recommending the system, I'd think ABS would jump at the chance to tell their point of view...

Also, if this were my computer, I'd press on about the motherboard. I don't find their response particularly reassuring. It's highly likely that those "bad" slots will be used over the life of the sytem and it makes sense to resolve this in the beginning and not one year down the line, especially since you'd have to pay for RMA shipping of the whole system back to ABS.
 
Pretty soon, I will have to send my laptop in for repairs. The left hinge is cracked on the LCD display, and is getting worse by the day. Sometimes the screen will fluctuate between brightness settings. Regardless: I hope ABS's support will not give me hell.
 
Excellent article and review.

Does [H] ever do motherboard RMA's/returns? I know you have done full system returns, but over the last few reviews, you guys stopped short a bit....
This one probably had a bad mobo causing the RAM issues.
The last one (or the one before??) had that weird "choosy" soundcard that liked come PCI slots but not others, possibly a mobo issue....
 
Hi all,
Thanks for your questions, and thanks for reading.

Did you make any calls on when the new ram was going to be returned?
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We called once at the very beginning because we received an email notifying us that we had an RMA number, but it didn't mention shipping the label to us. After that, we didn't see any point. Our techs outlined the process pretty clearly for us, and it proceeded according to plan--however sad that may be. Regardless, one nice thing is that ABS kept us fairly up to date.

I have to concur that the RMA process is seriously flawed. After the end of the evaluation, did you try to find out the reasoning behind it from ABS? Since RMA is a big reason for your not recommending the system, I'd think ABS would jump at the chance to tell their point of view...
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We haven't heard anything from ABS yet. We definitely hope they'll jump in to explain the process or, hopefully, outline some changes.

Also, if this were my computer, I'd press on about the motherboard.
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Were we keeping this computer around, we would too. But as it was, we gave tech support several chances to offer up mobo problems as an explanation, but we were constantly reassured that it was probably just an issue with the one stick of ram in the one slot. That is possible, and it is only fair to note that even though that configuration wouldn't run run all three instances of Prime95, it would run Battlefield for a good 2 or 3 hours.

Does [H] ever do motherboard RMA's/returns? I know you have done full system returns, but over the last few reviews, you guys stopped short a bit....
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From my own personal experience, which has included a couple full system RMAs, companies seem more willing to RMA the full system than just the mobo. I guess--and this is only a personal guess--that they figure it's more likely to get the job done that way. Even if they pay shipping on a full system, it hopefully fixes the problem once and for all. And it's important to remember that for a lot of people swapping out motherboards can be a fairly daunting task.

Thanks again for reading. Adios.
 
Joey_Seiler said:
From my own personal experience, which has included a couple full system RMAs, companies seem more willing to RMA the full system than just the mobo. I guess--and this is only a personal guess--that they figure it's more likely to get the job done that way. Even if they pay shipping on a full system, it hopefully fixes the problem once and for all. And it's important to remember that for a lot of people swapping out motherboards can be a fairly daunting task.

Thanks again for reading. Adios.
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Roger dodger!
 
Thats rediculous! they got great techs there. told you to memtest very quickly, and hit the nail on the head. James told you to swap slots on a hunch, and hit the nail on the head there. but they have the most RETARDED policy, i have EVER heard of for a high end builder lmfao

Great Review. ABS needs to smarten up with their RMA process... seriously, what could go wrong with cross shipping unless it was a screw up on their end if they already have a deposit? :rolleyes:
 
when i was looking into purchasing my computer (still waiting for delivery) I had narrowed it down to Vigor, ABS, and AVA. I ended up choosing Vigor and hopefully they will be ok. Boy am I glad I didn't go with ABS, especially after reading this review. Another great article. Made for a nice read, thanks!!!
 
Modred189 said:
Excellent article and review.

Does [H] ever do motherboard RMA's/returns? I know you have done full system returns, but over the last few reviews, you guys stopped short a bit....
This one probably had a bad mobo causing the RAM issues.
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Yes, we do occasionally. In fact, we have a system out for RMA right now. Incidentally, it's been gone for like 3 weeks. I bet you guys can't wait to read that article :).

Anyway, we only do things like that if the machine is totally non-functional or has so many problems that we can't responsibly report on its performance. We avoid full system RMAs like the plague because of the immense downtime it puts on my writing staff. They've gotta eat, too :). But if the system needs it, then we do it.
 
Jason_Wall said:
Yes, we do occasionally. In fact, we have a system out for RMA right now. Incidentally, it's been gone for like 3 weeks. I bet you guys can't wait to read that article :).

Anyway, we only do things like that if the machine is totally non-functional or has so many problems that we can't responsibly report on its performance. We avoid full system RMAs like the plague because of the immense downtime it puts on my writing staff. They've gotta eat, too :). But if the system needs it, then we do it.
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Ah, makes sense.
I was thinking also, if a system needed a mobo rma'd that kinda says something about the company and/or system build anyway. To the point that rma'ing for review purposes becomes pointless...
 
Jason_Wall said:
They've gotta eat, too :).
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Heh, with the reviews you guys write I hope you eat well.

Nice review...the 'value' part of the review process is definitly probably one of the best additions to the reviewing process.
 
Good read. Do you think that the fast shipping time was directly related to the only adequate build quality?
 
ChiZZad said:
Good read. Do you think that the fast shipping time was directly related to the only adequate build quality?
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I think even the reviewer himself points to the fact that the fast build time may have prevented a thorough testing and QC. ABS probably figures that -- given small component failure rate -- it's more profitable to them to have shorter build times & testing (and then RMA/repair/support whatever issues that come up) opposed to being more thorough and slower. :rolleyes:
 
The ram problem should not have happened, that should have been caught and fixed at the factory. The mobo may be more sensitive on some of the memory slots. I know I've seen that on several mobos, so the mobo (or the RAM) might not be "bad". We've all also seen mobos that don't like specific brands/models of RAM, need timing or voltage tweaks, etc. Whatever, that should have been caught and fixed at the factory.

They also maybe should have offered expedited RMA service (and charged extra for overnight shipping).

Those items aside, I think the reviewer is a bit too picky and unrealistic about some of his expectations. I saw no problems at all with the wiring and I think it's silly to expect it to be "stealthed" or hidden. Likewise on picking about the not flashy but effective packing, icons on the desktop, etc. The tech support sounded responsive and effective to me too.

Many of the complaints did not affect the functionality or value of the system at all, they were a matter of personal preference or taste. I think ABS responded fairly on the memory problem and fixed it. I personally do not see a problem doing business with them.
 
ChiZZad said:
Good read. Do you think that the fast shipping time was directly related to the only adequate build quality?
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Actually, we think that the only adequate build quality was directly related to the fast shipping time :).
 
I got frustrated just -reading- that article, because I am in an almost identical situation.

Bought a new X8, and of the 3 weeks I've had it, it has been out of commission for 2. I've already had to RMA a faulty video card to EVGA, and now the SAME EXACT memory problem mentioned in the review is plaguing me. Unfortunately I have 4 sticks of RAM, so I can't use the solution provided in the article without wasting 2gb of RAM. Right now I have my mobo on a very long RMA back to them. I'm a patient guy, but receiving a product that is defective OUT OF THE BOX is totally unacceptable for a top tier integrator.

I would like to return the system for a refund, but the fact that I don't have the money to pay $150 in shipping costs and a restock fee means I'm SOL. I really, really hope ABS reads this review and gets themselves back in gear.

(I do give Hector credit though, since in the 3 weeks I've had my system, I have probably spent 10 cumulative hours on the phone with him in tech support. He's patient, but the reason you BUY from an integrator is so you don't have to take that much time out of your life to deal with your computer.)
 
Great article as usual.
Overall ABS seems to be OK, the process of the RMA really stinks though. If I just plopped down two grand + and had to wait for parts longer than it would take to just order new ones from NewEgg, that would frost my shorts a bit. It's not like they dont have access to inventory.:eek:
I'd just have to say "meh" to these guys.....average in an industry that has higher standards and customers with greater expectations.
 
Good article, I bought 2 budget ABS pcs (around $500 each). One was over 5 years old and ran strong until I started messing around with last year and the mobo got fried, and this current one, where I just put in a vid card has been running solid. Its too bad this happened to you guys.
 
Ugh..Why can't ABS take some hints from NewEgg in their RMA department?

Great review, keep them coming! Can' t wait to read about the one with the three week waiting period!

Has [H] ever thought of making a Systems Chart, like a list of encoding times, World Bench Scores, FPS or something like that? Maybe a price/preformance ratio and a full list of systems reviewed with score/rating. Just an idea!

~Ibrahim~
 
ikjadoon said:
Ugh..Why can't ABS take some hints from NewEgg in their RMA department?

Great review, keep them coming! Can' t wait to read about the one with the three week waiting period!

Has [H] ever thought of making a Systems Chart, like a list of encoding times, World Bench Scores, FPS or something like that? Maybe a price/preformance ratio and a full list of systems reviewed with score/rating. Just an idea!

~Ibrahim~
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yea, like a worldbench point/dollar score... with a letter after it representing whether the system was reccommended or not. That way you could get the synthetic numbers, price AND the subjective opinion at the same time....
 
Modred189 said:
yea, like a worldbench point/dollar score... with a letter after it representing whether the system was reccommended or not. That way you could get the synthetic numbers, price AND the subjective opinion at the same time....
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i actually like this idea a lot. i love looking at some benchtest and such but since i have not really used them myself very much, i just kinda stare and enjoy the pictures having no idea what it actually means, i really like this idea :)
 
a chart generally wouldnt work for very long :) by the time they review a system, it usually ends up being revised, or the price point changes enough to justify a slight upgrade making its score pointless :p
 
Jason_Wall said:
ABS is back in the [H] Consumer offices after coming off of an Editor's Choice Gold Award. But things have changed at ABS, most notably in the support of RMAs and defective hardware. If you get a solid system, then you may never have to worry about it, but if you need ABS' help, you might be in trouble.

The market is desperately seeking a company to replace Monarch. ABS is the logical alternative given its association with Newegg.com, but should we be looking elsewhere?



Thanks for reading!
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Even Maximum Pc magazine reveiwed a PC from ABS that got a 4 out of 10 for being unstable even after under clocking it to stock speeds and replacing faulty videocards. THey got bad tech support and if anyhting happnes you are out of luck. they don;t even offer extended warranties and when they did offer extended service plans it was outsourced to another company called 2DNet. You cna save money with ABS but I would rather pay the extra for a velocity micro, Falcon-nw, or an alienware.
 
ikjadoon said:
Has [H] ever thought of making a Systems Chart, like a list of encoding times, World Bench Scores, FPS or something like that? Maybe a price/preformance ratio and a full list of systems reviewed with score/rating. Just an idea!

~Ibrahim~
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We've got a very comprehensive system in the works for this type of thing. I'm programming stupid, so our gurus are working on it. Not sure what the ETA is on it, though.
 
Though it was a good review as usual, the system itself bored me into depression...Can't wait to see a non-vanilla system integrator being reviewed again.





 
adonn78 said:
Even Maximum Pc magazine reveiwed a PC from ABS that got a 4 out of 10 for being unstable even after under clocking it to stock speeds and replacing faulty videocards. THey got bad tech support and if anyhting happnes you are out of luck. they don;t even offer extended warranties and when they did offer extended service plans it was outsourced to another company called 2DNet. You cna save money with ABS but I would rather pay the extra for a velocity micro, Falcon-nw, or an alienware.
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just to let you know, for the money, there are way better builders than both F-NW and alienware. (alienware is quite crap actually... :p )
 
Jason_Wall said:
We've got a very comprehensive system in the works for this type of thing. I'm programming stupid, so our gurus are working on it. Not sure what the ETA is on it, though.
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Awesome! Can't wait for it!

~Ibrahim~
 
0mega said:
just to let you know, for the money, there are way better builders than both F-NW and alienware. (alienware is quite crap actually... :p )
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definitely agree, stay away from alienware, i recently went through hell with them, everything turned out alright eventually but it was such a nightmare, ill never ever buy from them again
 
It's like an inverse relationship:

More advertising = Bad Support
No advertising = Amazing Support

WTF?!

~Ibrahim~
 
Spartacus said:
The ram problem should not have happened, that should have been caught and fixed at the factory. The mobo may be more sensitive on some of the memory slots. I know I've seen that on several mobos, so the mobo (or the RAM) might not be "bad". We've all also seen mobos that don't like specific brands/models of RAM, need timing or voltage tweaks, etc. Whatever, that should have been caught and fixed at the factory.

They also maybe should have offered expedited RMA service (and charged extra for overnight shipping).

Those items aside, I think the reviewer is a bit too picky and unrealistic about some of his expectations. I saw no problems at all with the wiring and I think it's silly to expect it to be "stealthed" or hidden. Likewise on picking about the not flashy but effective packing, icons on the desktop, etc. The tech support sounded responsive and effective to me too.

Many of the complaints did not affect the functionality or value of the system at all, they were a matter of personal preference or taste. I think ABS responded fairly on the memory problem and fixed it. I personally do not see a problem doing business with them.
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if you spend 2200 on a computer, and dont expect to get something as simple as clean wiring, you need to go find a different website :p its a very nice touch, and improves airflow in the case...

as to the icons, all of that stuff is in the start menu, so it's redundant... and that desktop is HIDEOUS!

yes, they do not affect the FUNCTIONALITY of the system, but its not like it mattered, it WASNT FUCTIONAL... and it took them WAY too long to make the RAM issue right...

theyre tech support is great, theyre policies are retarded, and their builders need to spend more time building and testing
 
Noliving said:
You guys still left level of detail on in world of warcraft.
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this review would have been started WELL before that discussion happened...

where the hell is an ABS rep? with newegg as an ad holder, youd figure theyd respond to us...
 
0mega said:
this review would have been started WELL before that discussion happened...

where the hell is an ABS rep? with newegg as an ad holder, youd figure theyd respond to us...
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Is it hard to make an editors note saying that in this review level of detail was enabled and that all future reviews will not have level of detailed enabled on wow?
 
Noliving said:
Is it hard to make an editors note saying that in this review level of detail was enabled and that all future reviews will not have level of detailed enabled on wow?
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Not the end of the world, my friend. This is a beast of a computer - it's going to run WoW just fine. I wasn't going to have my editor spend several hours installing and patching only that one game just to prove that.

All future evals will have that detail setting disabled. Thanks again for the note.
 
Noliving said:
Is it hard to make an editors note saying that in this review level of detail was enabled and that all future reviews will not have level of detailed enabled on wow?
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does it really matter that much? it still aced it at max settings...

and you want them to note it in the review... whats wrong with noting in youre head that these reviews sometimes take months?
 
No, I think he meant the system had already been in the shop and tested by the time people discussed a change in the system evaluation.

~Ibrahim~
 
Jason, have you talked to ABS at all about this review? dont need to tell us what about if they want to be secretive... (which is retarded IMO...) but just let us know if they are actually "working" towards something...
 
Yes, I've spoken with our contact there.

They're quite concerned and have been getting a little bit extra feedback on a few things - it's a long fall from an Editor's Gold Award to a "Not Recommended." They want to fix some things and are working behind the scenes a bit with us. At this point, they want to handle things internally, but as always, I invite them to comment on the forums.
 
Jason_Wall said:
Yes, I've spoken with our contact there.

They're quite concerned and have been getting a little bit extra feedback on a few things - it's a long fall from an Editor's Gold Award to a "Not Recommended." They want to fix some things and are working behind the scenes a bit with us. At this point, they want to handle things internally, but as always, I invite them to comment on the forums.
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Well into my fourth week of having a defective out-of-the-box X8, I think I can say confidently that all they can do from here is improve.
 
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