Chad_Thunder
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Plasmas still have better colors, however, have you seen either of these two technologies which has even less motion blur than plasma:Anyone know anything about this unit? I had a play around with this monitor at work and I've never seen a flat panel handle motion so fluidly without interpolation, it was completely mesmerizing watching things bounce around without motion blur and there was a richness or depth to the picture that I have only seen on local dimming lcds, also as far as I can tell there was no chroma subsampling which would be immediately apparent because I do not use cleartype
Mark Rejhon said:New Interpolation-Free LCD's With Less Motion Blur Than Plasma
For people interested in eliminating motion blur during video gaming, there is some good news in new displays. The CRT feeling is back!
This is in regards to MOTION quality (not color quality, black quality), with the brand new strobe-backlight LCD's that finally produce true CRT motion resolution in an LCD. LCD still has poor black levels compared to CRT, but the LCD motion blur dragon has been finally slayed. This article is not for people who prefer motion blur; this article is not for people who disliked CRT's. This is for people who wants maximum motion resolution in a display -- clearest and sharpest fast motion during video games.
I'm well known in other areas of the forum, but not in this section. I wanted to mention two major new developments as of year 2013 for people who want the maximum possible motion resolution in video games out of an LCD display. Recently, new strobe backlights have been invented that manage to allow LCD to have better motion resolution than a plasma, without the disadvantage of plasma input lag. (Plasma is still better for color quality, but this is for people who care more about maximum motion resolution).
What are Strobe Backlights???
Strobe backlights are backlights/edgelights that flash once per refresh, which makes the LCD flicker like a CRT. The backlight is turned off while waiting for pixel transitions (unseen by human eyes), and the backlight is strobed only on fully-refreshed LCD frames (seen by human eyes). The strobes can be shorter than pixel transitions, breaking the pixel transition speed barrier! In addition, it eliminates the sample-and-hold effect.
High speed video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hD5gjAs1A2s
Several good articles about strobe backlights include TFTCentral: Motion Blur Reduction Backlights. For a long time, there was scanning backlights that were commonly used by Sony, Samsung, Panasonic, etc HDTV's. Most of them combined interpolation so these created lots of input lag, and created a fake "soap opera" effect. But the brand new strobe backlights are low-lag and 100% interpolation free, which is slowly starting to revolutionize video gaming for motion-blur-sensitive people. These finally bring CRT motion resolution to LCD displays, with a lot of amazed testimonials that are similiar to:
original post (Transsive)
Then yesterday I, for some reason, disabled the 3d and noticed there was no ghosting to be spotted at all in titan quest. It's like playing on my old CRT.original post (Inu)
I can confirm this works on BENQ XL2420TX
EDIT: And OMG i can play scout so much better now in TF2, this is borderline cheating.original post (TerrorHead)
Thanks for this, it really works! Just tried it on my VG278H. Its like a CRT now!original post (Vega)
Oh my, I just got Skyrim AFK camera spinning (which I used to test LCD's versus the [Sony CRT] FW900) to run without stutters and VSYNC locked to 120. This Benq with Lightboost is just as crystal clear if not clearer than the FW900 motion. I am in awe. More testing tomorrow. Any of my doubts about this Lightboost technology have been vaporized! I've been playing around with this fluid motion on this monitor for like 6-hours straight, that is how impressive it is.OCN post (Baxter299)
way to go vega enjoyed your review and pics ..thanks for taking the time .got my VG248QE last friday .replacing my fw900 witch is finally taking a rest in my closet ....And dozens others rave reviews by gamers...OCN post (Romir)
Thanks for the timely review Vega.
I went ahead and opened mine and WOW, it really does feel like my FW900. I haven't tried a game yet but it's down right eerie seeing 2d text move without going blurry.
If you care more about black levels and maximum color quality, you may not be interested. However, if you want fast pans that are as perfectly sharp as stationary images, without using motion interpolation, and without the input lag, strobe backlights are becoming an increasingly popular solution. If want perfect sharpness during fast motion (e.g. being able to see fast panning motion similiar to www.testufo.com/#test=photo with zero motion blur) whie playing video games, you need a flicker display technology such as a CRT, a LightBoost display, or a Motionflow Impulse display. Even the best plasma displays still create too much motion blur for some people who are extremely sensitive to motion blur. Also, for best motion fludiity without interpolation, you need to run a framerate matching display refresh rate.
There are some good web based animations that helps people understand motion blur better, and why strobe backlights reduce motion blur.
View these animations in Google Chrome on a recent computer (everything in chrome://gpu enabled):
- Animation that shows higher framerate has less motion blur: www.testufo.com/#test=framerates
- Animation that shows how eye tracking can create motion blur: www.testufo.com/#test=eyetracking
- Animation that shows how flicker reduce motion blur: www.testufo.com/#test=blackframes
Mathematically, for high-efficiency strobe backlights, motion blur is directly proportional to strobe length. Both TFTCentral and Blur Busters measured the strobe lengths of LightBoost, as well as looked at motion tests such as PixPerAn and TestUFO.com.
As a comparison, plasma displays has 5ms of motion blur due to red/green phosphor decay, and the medium-persistence Sony GDM-W900 CRT has about 1-2ms of motion blur, due to phosphor decay. The numbers measured for LightBoost has less motion blur than plasma (and it actually shows up in motion tests such as www.testufo.com/#test=photo that LightBoost has clearer motion than plasma). This finally puts LCD truly in CRT ballpark -- both from a subjective AND objective/measured perspective -- At least for medium-persistence phosphor type. Provided you have a GPU capable of running framerates matching refresh rates, since you're avoiding interpolation with these types of strobe backlights.
Strobe backlights generally improves motion of games with a fast panning motion (such as www.testufo.com/#test=photo ...) so it benefits games that has fast panning, such as strafing and turns in FPS games, fast flybys such as low helicoptor-flybys in Battlefield 3, and things like racing games (arcade racers, sim racers, etc). In addition beyond gaming, it can also benefit a small minority of people who get eyestrain from motion blur (e.g. like scrolling a web browser window and getting eyestrain because of the blur). Be noted that strobe backlights aren't for people who hated CRT, though the LightBoost behaves like a high-refresh-rate 120Hz CRT.
1. LightBoost Monitors
Supported 120Hz Computer Monitors:
ASUS: VG248QE, ASUS VG278H, ASUS VG278HE, BENQ XL2411T, BENQ XL2420T, BENQ XL2420TX, BENQ XL2420TE, BENQ XL2720T, Acer HN274HBbmiiid
LightBoost is a strobe backlight that is now available in several 120Hz computer monitors (google "LightBoost monitors"). It is normally used as part of nVidia 3D Vision to synchronize strobe flashes with the timings of shutter glasses. However, it also additionally eliminates motion blur too, independently of its original stereoscopic purpose. Recently in 2013, LightBoost became more popular for 2D motion blur elimination. It has recently gotten coverage in several media websites such as ArsTechnica, AnandTech, TFTCentral, etc.
The definitive guide is the LightBoost HOWTO. The newest and most popular method of enabling LightBoost is the new ToastyX Strobelight utility, which is a software utility that allows you to use LightBoost with almost any graphics card (nVidia or AMD) on almost any LightBoost monitor. Bear in mind Lightboost doesn't look good at 60fps@120Hz, it only looks amazing at 120fps@120Hz. LightBoost is hardware-locked to strobe at 100-to-120Hz, so it is like a CRT that's locked to flicker only at a 100-to-120Hz refresh rate. So it will only benefit computer sources, since those are the only mainstream sources capable of outputting 120Hz.
Experiment with your VSYNC setting (e.g. use Adaptive VSYNC) so that your game panning motion can look as perfectly zero motion blur as possible. This can be challenging with more recent games, but not impossible with Titan's and Geforce 770/7880 GPU's. Older games such as Source Engine games can run at 120fps easily on cheaper 600-series GeForce GPU's. A favourite setting by LightBoost users is Adaptive VSYNC, since it is an input-lag-reduced VSYNC ON, while providing the perfect zero motion blur motion fluidity whenever framerates matches refresh rates. Disable your game's artificial motion blur feature, so you can enjoy gaming unfettered by artificial motion blur.
Main Pros:
+ Elimination of motion blur. CRT perfect clarity motion.
+ Improved competitive advantage by faster human reaction times.
+ Far more fluid than regular 120Hz or 144Hz.
+ Fast motion is more immersive.
Main Cons:
- Reduced brightness.
- Degradation of color quality. (Can be calibrated)
- Minor flicker, if you are flicker sensitive. (like a 120Hz CRT)
- Requires a powerful GPU to get full benefits. You need 120fps@120Hz for full benefits.
2. Sony Motionflow Impulse
Supported Sony Televisions:
HX920 Series, HX923 Series, HX925 Series, HX929 Series, XBR-55HX950, XBR-65HX950, KDL-47W802A (Budget), KDL-55w802A (Budget), KDL-55W900A, W905A Series, XBR-55X900A (4K Ultra), XBR-65X900A (4K Ultra)
The Motionflow Impulse Mode is a new Sony strobe backlight now available in Game Mode on several newer higher-end Sony HDTV's. What is amazing about it is that it is one of the world's first low-latency motion blur reduction technology to hit an LCD HDTV, that is available during Game Mode. No interpolation lag! It flickers a LOT like a 60Hz CRT, so it is not as easy on everybody's eyes as LightBoost. However, if you turn the lights down a little bit, and also turn off the ambient light sensor, the image becomes brighter than a projector screen, and when you play video games -- you have an amazing 4x less motion blur (4 times the motion resolution! All blu-rays motion tests show full 1080 lines of motion resolution with zero interpolation artifacts). Motionflow Impulse is doing the equivalent of a 3:1 black frame insertion (75% dark, 25% bright).
The advantage of Motionflow Impulse is that it works with all 60Hz sources, including video game consoles. Bear in mind that most console games only run at 30fps, so you won't get the full benefits from 30fps games (you get a double-image effect like when playing on plasma). You will probably want to stick to 60fps games, which is easier to get from a HTPC running a powerful GPU.
Main Pros:
+ Elimination of motion blur. CRT perfect clarity motion.
+ No interpolation. Low lag.
+ About 4x less motion blur than regular 60Hz
+ Better color quality than a computer monitor
Main Cons:
- Greatly reduced brightness in strobe mode. (Disabling ambient light sensor helps)
- Flickers a lot like a 60Hz CRT
- You need 60fps @ 60Hz for full benefits (since you're avoiding interpolation)
Testing Motion on a Strobe Backlight
Find material that does fast panning motion during framerates matching refresh rate.
One good test is the TestUFO Moving Photo Test at www.testufo.com/#test=photo
(View on a recent computer with ATI/nVidia, running Chrome browser, for perfect framerate=Hz motion)
On a short persistence display -- such as a CRT or one of the high-efficiency strobe backlight displays -- the moving photo at www.testufo.com/#test=photo looks exactly as sharp as a stationary photo at www.testufo.com/#test=photo&pps=0 ... Fast panning motion would appear perfectly sharp, just like on a CRT. Turn on/off your display's strobe mode while viewing the panning motion. When strobes are enabled, you will be able to count the windows in the castle at the top of the moving photo, for example.
Be noted that in your video games, you may not benefit very much from a strobe backlight unless you can run at framerates matching refresh rates. A good test of multiple framerates can be done by viewing www.testufo.com/#test=framerates&count=3 (while using a CRT or strobe backlight display); you will observe that maximum game motion quality literally demands framerate=Hz
All the other Motionflow modes are not good for games, except for Motionflow "Impulse".Hi Mark, I've seen Motionflow on the HX950
The 42PF50U that you mention, is a NeoPlasma panel.Could you expand a bit on that? I saw no mention of neoplasma but "advanced motion resolution" is one of the options which is absent on the older panel
Was that at 60hz? I think it's possible the 3D models are much faster than 2D models
do Panasonic display 4:4:4 yet? or do you still need to buy one of their broadcast monitors for that luxury?
Sometimes you can do HDMI-to-HDMI (bypass receiver) and get 1080p@120Hz, see HDTV Overclocking HOWTO: 120Hz from PC to TV.I wonder if it's possible to hack a DVI port onto the consumer models
To keep refresh rate high, use Reduced Blanking instead of Automatic. (smaller Porch and Sync values). That gives you slightly higher refresh rates while staying under 165Mhz dotclock. You should be able to do approximately 75Hz at 1920x1080 with less than a 165Mhz dotclock, by using reduced blanking.120hz works at any resolution up to 1280 x 720, beyond that you simply bump the hertz until the pixel clock reaches 165mhz and back it down one tap
No drawbacks, just that the picture may disappear if you reduce blanking too much. Just keep reducing porches / sync until picture destabilizes or disappears, then back off a bit. Voila!Does reduced blanking have any drawbacks?
European model would be 42PF50ER
Naming scheme goes like follows
42/50/60/65 size
PF/BT300/VX300 model
20/30/50 series
U/ER/W for America / Europe / Asia
Yeah mine says 24 pin as well but who knows, I can display a signal past 165Mhz but it is garbled
BT300 and VX300 has a bit better picture (12,288 vs 6,144 grayscale) more calibration options and 10-bit processing, it's a studio quality monitor but even without seeing it I would say the PF is better value
Here is a quick video review
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgZhlRkjdUw
Maybe they are still selling PF30 in your country?
Where did you find the info that 42BT300U can do 120hz@1080p ?Please see my update
Panasonic 42PF50U (120hz@720p,91hz@1440x1080,71hz@1920x1080, Full RGB, frame sequential 3D, 8bit color per channel)
Panasonic 50PF50U (120hz@720p,91hz@1440x1080,71hz@1920x1080, Full RGB, frame sequential 3D, 8bit color per channel)
Panasonic 60PF50U (120hz@720p,91hz@1440x1080,71hz@1920x1080, Full RGB, frame sequential 3D, 8bit color per channel)
Panasonic 65PF50U (120hz@720p,91hz@1440x1080,71hz@1920x1080, Full RGB, frame sequential 3D, 8bit color per channel)
Panasonic 42BT300U (120hz@1080p, Full RGB, frame sequential 3D, 10bit per channel, scaler optional)
Panasonic 50BT300U (120hz@1080p, Full RGB, frame sequential 3D, 10bit per channel, scaler optional)
Panasonic 65VX300U (120hz@1080p, Full RGB, frame sequential 3D, 10bit per channel, scaler optional)
It even says in the post you quoted to "see update"... And on top of that OP linked to it for you...
Long story short, he figured that out...