Maaaan. Why are my gradients so uncool? I keep hearing people claim that their LP2475w handles gradients like a champ, but I'm suffering noticeable banding on certain colors, especially black to green. I visit GameSpy a few times a week and it always irks me that the background gradient is so band-o-licious. Does anyone else have this problem? I've calibrated with a i1 Display 2, using Windows 7 64-bit (the banding was present in Vista as well), connected via DVI. Is it simply a calibration issue?
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HP LP2475w (Possible new IPS)
- Thread starter worthless808
- Start date
That's not your monitor's fault! GameSpy's background gradient is not really a gradient at all. It looks like a patterned dither that was resampled and generally butchered, with the final insult-added-to-injury of being saved as a JPEG. Maybe they intentionally wanted a background that looked bad? Anyway, if you want to check for banding, try this.
If a grayscale gradient looks smooth, all the others will too: Red Gradient, Green Gradient, Blue Gradient
ghostchild
Limp Gawd
- Joined
- Jan 24, 2006
- Messages
- 455
well guys, i tried really really hard to like this monitor, I got an eye1 display calibrator to calibrate it and all but all the photos still turned out too undersaturated since the monitor displayed colors too vibrant. the red and green tint on the left and right sides of the monitor were very apparent. there was a couple dead pixels that were forgettable. there were no drivers out for macs, or even any mac support at all. It would not auto detect my 1 dvi connection even though I set it to auto detect. a few days after owning it for half a year it died on me the way a light bulb does. the monitor flickered wildly and just blanked out. i tried powering off/on, unplug and plug back, no response from monitor or even the little led in the front. it just won't power on and so its dead. I only used it for 825 hours or so when i checked right before it died. i had a very frustrating time contacting HP with their phone number provided on their site, and live chat does not work on mac. I finally got a hold of a rep by email. Now I await on my replacement unit, which I will sell as brand new. I will use the money to get the Apple LED display instead 
Short version:
1. Tried to use/like monitor, bought cause great price. (Feb 09 unit)
2. Noticed red/pink and green tints
3. Found a few forgettable dead pixels
4. No mac support/drivers
5. Would not auto detect even when auto detect was on
6. Always displayed colors too vibrantly, even with calibration
7. Suddenly died/blanked out on me after ~825hrs (half a year) of use
8. Extremely frustrating time contacting HP directly
9. Awaiting further RMA instructions and brand new unit
10. Will buy Apple LED 24" Display after selling new replacement unit
Short version:
1. Tried to use/like monitor, bought cause great price. (Feb 09 unit)
2. Noticed red/pink and green tints
3. Found a few forgettable dead pixels
4. No mac support/drivers
5. Would not auto detect even when auto detect was on
6. Always displayed colors too vibrantly, even with calibration
7. Suddenly died/blanked out on me after ~825hrs (half a year) of use
8. Extremely frustrating time contacting HP directly
9. Awaiting further RMA instructions and brand new unit
10. Will buy Apple LED 24" Display after selling new replacement unit
I ordered an LP2475w three days ago, after reading various mostly very positive professional reviews. My original intent was to replace my aging Samsung 226BW with a 26" TN panel monitor, eg. the Samsung T260, but after seeing my fathers new 22" Eizo in action when I visited during the holidays, I got a strong urge to try a better panel type - even if it meant settling for a 24" model.
And then the day after placing my order I started coming across all these complaints about problems with the LP2475w, and I started wondering if I had just made a very big mistake when I ordered this monitor.
It arrived yesterday (GIG173, Poland November 2009, FW GIG 077), and while I've only been using it for 12 hours and have had to settle for using the calibration tips and files provided at tftcentral.co.uk (their monitor settings were however a bit too green for my liking, so I'm using 251 222 242, plus green black level lowered to 30 through the HP Display Assistant) rather than a hardware calibration tool, it's definitely obvious that with white or other very light colors, there's a slight but still noticable difference in color temperature(?) between left and right side of the screen - and calling it a green-pink "tint" probably isn't too far of the mark (at least the green tint on the left side, the right side of the screen is actually how I would like the full image to be).
Since it looks like something I'll quickly learn to ignore once I'm a few days past the new monitor phase (I've pretty much already stopped noticing it, and additionally moving my desk lamp from it's usual place right next to me on the left side, to a place where it provides more indirect background lighting instead, also helped considerably), and since I won't be using the monitor for color critical work, I won't bother asking for a replacement, but it's a little disappointing none the less.
Aside from that issue - and buttons on the monitor that have a rather cheap feel to them - this is a huge step up in quality from my old 226BW. No detectable backlight bleeding, only minor white glow at night with a full black screen, vastly better viewing angles and fantastic colors that are very different but much more nuanced and to my eyes much more natural than what I've been used to from TN panels.
Well, the excessive wide gamut reds aside - using color aware applications (such as one of my image viewers) really do show a rather large difference between the desktop colors and programs that can utilize the ICC profile I downloaded from TFT Central.
I'm still trying to wrap my head around all this stuff that I've been reading about color profiles, but if I've understood it correctly, even Windows 7 (I'm on Vista x64) isn't able to use color profiles system wide, but still "suffers" from wide gamut over saturation on the desktop and applications that aren't color aware (ie. no different from Vista at all)?
Oh, and I love the 1920x1200 resolution. I never thought it would feel like this much of a step up from 1680x1050, but it really does provide a whole lot of extra screen space and has already entirely changed the way I resize and place windows.
Now there's actually room for having another window next to the web browser, something I never quite felt was possible on my old screen, so I always ended up running most applications maximized.
So overall I'm very happy with my purchase, but I have to admit that if I had come across this thread before I ordered the LP2475w, I imagine there's a very good chance I would have opted for something else.
All these horror stories from people having received two, three or even four replacements are pretty scary. And as mentioned even mine has one of the common problems brought up, just fortunately not so bad I can't live with it.
And then the day after placing my order I started coming across all these complaints about problems with the LP2475w, and I started wondering if I had just made a very big mistake when I ordered this monitor.
It arrived yesterday (GIG173, Poland November 2009, FW GIG 077), and while I've only been using it for 12 hours and have had to settle for using the calibration tips and files provided at tftcentral.co.uk (their monitor settings were however a bit too green for my liking, so I'm using 251 222 242, plus green black level lowered to 30 through the HP Display Assistant) rather than a hardware calibration tool, it's definitely obvious that with white or other very light colors, there's a slight but still noticable difference in color temperature(?) between left and right side of the screen - and calling it a green-pink "tint" probably isn't too far of the mark (at least the green tint on the left side, the right side of the screen is actually how I would like the full image to be).
Since it looks like something I'll quickly learn to ignore once I'm a few days past the new monitor phase (I've pretty much already stopped noticing it, and additionally moving my desk lamp from it's usual place right next to me on the left side, to a place where it provides more indirect background lighting instead, also helped considerably), and since I won't be using the monitor for color critical work, I won't bother asking for a replacement, but it's a little disappointing none the less.
Aside from that issue - and buttons on the monitor that have a rather cheap feel to them - this is a huge step up in quality from my old 226BW. No detectable backlight bleeding, only minor white glow at night with a full black screen, vastly better viewing angles and fantastic colors that are very different but much more nuanced and to my eyes much more natural than what I've been used to from TN panels.
Well, the excessive wide gamut reds aside - using color aware applications (such as one of my image viewers) really do show a rather large difference between the desktop colors and programs that can utilize the ICC profile I downloaded from TFT Central.
I'm still trying to wrap my head around all this stuff that I've been reading about color profiles, but if I've understood it correctly, even Windows 7 (I'm on Vista x64) isn't able to use color profiles system wide, but still "suffers" from wide gamut over saturation on the desktop and applications that aren't color aware (ie. no different from Vista at all)?
Oh, and I love the 1920x1200 resolution. I never thought it would feel like this much of a step up from 1680x1050, but it really does provide a whole lot of extra screen space and has already entirely changed the way I resize and place windows.
Now there's actually room for having another window next to the web browser, something I never quite felt was possible on my old screen, so I always ended up running most applications maximized.
So overall I'm very happy with my purchase, but I have to admit that if I had come across this thread before I ordered the LP2475w, I imagine there's a very good chance I would have opted for something else.
All these horror stories from people having received two, three or even four replacements are pretty scary. And as mentioned even mine has one of the common problems brought up, just fortunately not so bad I can't live with it.
There are no desktop saturation controls in the Nvidia drivers (just noticed there are saturation controls for video though, which I'll look into now as neither WMP nor VLC seem to want to save saturation settings between sessions).
Well, there is - "Digital Vibrance" - but it doesn't allow negative values, unless that has changed in more recent driver versions (I'm using 182.60, even as a gamer I don't update a good and stable display driver unless needed or if I read about significant performance gains in games I'm playing)?
Well, there is - "Digital Vibrance" - but it doesn't allow negative values, unless that has changed in more recent driver versions (I'm using 182.60, even as a gamer I don't update a good and stable display driver unless needed or if I read about significant performance gains in games I'm playing)?
Yep, it's there alright - 50% rather than 0% is now the new default, and turning it down to around 40% (will experiment some more) works wonders on particularly those radioactive reds.
Here's why I don't like updating drivers that have proven themselves stable and entirely unlikely to cause user headaches though. After updating through Windows update (which gave me a 191.something driver), Windows Explorer (ie. the whole shell) would crash and restart every time I right clicked the desktop.
I uninstalled the driver (and unlike what I've seen on older Windows versions, after rebooting Vista then promptly restored the old 182.06 driver my computer had shipped with - and which still didn't cause any crashing), downloaded 195.62 from the Nvidia site and ran the installer. The driver is now properly updated - and the digital vibrance controls working as they should - but I still can't right click the desktop without Explorer crashing and restarting.
I hate these things.
I've been googling the issue a bit, and it seems like the problem is caused by "a bad context menu handler" (http://windowsxp.mvps.org/slowrightclick.htm). I hate not having a working desktop right click menu - but I would also hate reverting to 182.06 and lose the saturation control - so now I'm considering whether it's safe deleting that entry from the registration database to get rid of the Nvidia shortcut there (I very much assume it should still be accessible through the control panel).
HKCR\Directory\Background\shellex\ContextMenuHandlers\NvCplDesktopContext
Edit: I took the chance and deleted it - seems to be working. It still irks me knowing that I'm now using a driver that didn't want to play nice with my OS even on such a seemingly simple matter.
Here's why I don't like updating drivers that have proven themselves stable and entirely unlikely to cause user headaches though. After updating through Windows update (which gave me a 191.something driver), Windows Explorer (ie. the whole shell) would crash and restart every time I right clicked the desktop.
I uninstalled the driver (and unlike what I've seen on older Windows versions, after rebooting Vista then promptly restored the old 182.06 driver my computer had shipped with - and which still didn't cause any crashing), downloaded 195.62 from the Nvidia site and ran the installer. The driver is now properly updated - and the digital vibrance controls working as they should - but I still can't right click the desktop without Explorer crashing and restarting.
I hate these things
.I've been googling the issue a bit, and it seems like the problem is caused by "a bad context menu handler" (http://windowsxp.mvps.org/slowrightclick.htm). I hate not having a working desktop right click menu - but I would also hate reverting to 182.06 and lose the saturation control - so now I'm considering whether it's safe deleting that entry from the registration database to get rid of the Nvidia shortcut there (I very much assume it should still be accessible through the control panel).
HKCR\Directory\Background\shellex\ContextMenuHandlers\NvCplDesktopContext
Edit: I took the chance and deleted it - seems to be working. It still irks me knowing that I'm now using a driver that didn't want to play nice with my OS even on such a seemingly simple matter.
vick1000
2[H]4U
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2007
- Messages
- 2,443
I believe you can remove the context option from the shell by unchecking the option under view in the nVidia control panel.
Better compared to what? I just tried them and my screen now has the ugliest green tint I've seen in on yet during all my settings experimentations.
But then as I mentioned in my first post, even the TFT Central settings gives my screen a greenish tint (certainly not as bad as this one though), so perhaps mine is leaning a bit more towards that part of the color scale than what's typical for the LP2475w.
But then as I mentioned in my first post, even the TFT Central settings gives my screen a greenish tint (certainly not as bad as this one though), so perhaps mine is leaning a bit more towards that part of the color scale than what's typical for the LP2475w.
Even though I'm quite satisfied with the settings I've arrived at (still tweaking a little, but only very minor adjustments), and won't be doing any color critical work, I'm awfully tempted to buy a Spyder 3 Express (seems like the cheapest hardware calibration option?) just to see how close to - or far away from - calibrated settings I actually am.
I suspect my current color temperature is slightly on the cold (blue) side, but better that than an awful green - or red - tint. Or at least that's what my eyes prefer.
But I guess the whole point of proper color calibration is to arrive at settings where no color is dominant?
I suspect my current color temperature is slightly on the cold (blue) side, but better that than an awful green - or red - tint. Or at least that's what my eyes prefer.
But I guess the whole point of proper color calibration is to arrive at settings where no color is dominant?
Just got one of these for myself for Christmas and I figured I'd provide some impressions on it. I ordered it from Provantage, FYI. The return policy is great there and shipping was incredibly fast (shipped from a warehouse in GA and I'm in FL.) No complaints at all. So if anyone was wondering if they're a valid alternative to the 'Egg for monitors, I'd say they are.
Since I'm coming from an NEC 20WMGX2, it's my basis for comparison when trying to come up with pros and cons. Moreover, some of my remarks are specifically aimed at 20WMGX2 owners looking to replace that aging beauty, but remain uncertain if any of the 1920x1200 offerings are a true upgrade to it. I used the 20WMGX2 for about four years and I was reluctant to part with it for various reasons, the matte vs. glossy issue being my biggest concern (huge fan of glossy monitors.) Thankfully, I find the LP2475W is a true upgrade
to it and only have a few minor gripes with it, the matte finish not being one of them.
Anyway, here are my impressions so far. Keep in mind that I'm not a graphics professional and simply a hardcore gamer looking for a great 1920x1200 screen to suit me. Thus, I'm only commenting on things relevant to gaming and general use.
Panel revision: GIG 163
Firmware: GIG 076
Based on what I've read on various forums, this appears to be the latest firmware and panel revision, possibly from October or November 09. Lucky me, as I've heard the newer versions have 6ms of input lag vs. 30ms+ in previous (before June 09) versions.
Input lag: Subjectively, it seems the same as the NEC. In other words, there's no noticeable lag with it. I'm a hardcore FPS gamer and I'd probably notice if there was 30ms+ of input lag. I'll test it in clone mode with my CRT if anyone wants me to.
Colors: The problems with wide gamut in games are apparent but not a deal breaker for me. Calibrated and in a color aware program, everything looks great. However, in games the nuclear reds are taking some time to adjust to. For example,
the Red Team's side of TF2 maps looks kind of ridiculous.
The green / pink tinting issue is also present with my screen. The left side has a slight greenish tint while the right is pinkish. The center area has accurate color. To me, it's only noticeable on a solid white background, so I'm not too upset about it given that my panel is otherwise perfect. There's zero dead pixels, it has the latest firmware, and there's no scratches or dents on it. As much as I'd like to have uniform colors, IMO it's probably best not to risk returning it and playing the panel lottery, only to find yourself possibly receiving a worse unit the second time around.
Glossy vs. matte: This was easily my biggest concern when finding a replacement for the NEC. I'm a huge fan of glossy displays and thought the matte finish of the LP2475W would kill my hopes of liking this monitor, IPS or not. But surprisingly I find its a non-issue. It's not grainy at all like my friends U2410 and colors seem natural on it. Overall, the coating is not really noticeable to me when put side-by-side with my 20WMGX2.
That's all that comes to mind after about 20 hours of use. If anyone has any questions, let me know. I'll also try to post some pics soon.
Since I'm coming from an NEC 20WMGX2, it's my basis for comparison when trying to come up with pros and cons. Moreover, some of my remarks are specifically aimed at 20WMGX2 owners looking to replace that aging beauty, but remain uncertain if any of the 1920x1200 offerings are a true upgrade to it. I used the 20WMGX2 for about four years and I was reluctant to part with it for various reasons, the matte vs. glossy issue being my biggest concern (huge fan of glossy monitors.) Thankfully, I find the LP2475W is a true upgrade
to it and only have a few minor gripes with it, the matte finish not being one of them.
Anyway, here are my impressions so far. Keep in mind that I'm not a graphics professional and simply a hardcore gamer looking for a great 1920x1200 screen to suit me. Thus, I'm only commenting on things relevant to gaming and general use.
Panel revision: GIG 163
Firmware: GIG 076
Based on what I've read on various forums, this appears to be the latest firmware and panel revision, possibly from October or November 09. Lucky me, as I've heard the newer versions have 6ms of input lag vs. 30ms+ in previous (before June 09) versions.
Input lag: Subjectively, it seems the same as the NEC. In other words, there's no noticeable lag with it. I'm a hardcore FPS gamer and I'd probably notice if there was 30ms+ of input lag. I'll test it in clone mode with my CRT if anyone wants me to.
Colors: The problems with wide gamut in games are apparent but not a deal breaker for me. Calibrated and in a color aware program, everything looks great. However, in games the nuclear reds are taking some time to adjust to. For example,
the Red Team's side of TF2 maps looks kind of ridiculous.
The green / pink tinting issue is also present with my screen. The left side has a slight greenish tint while the right is pinkish. The center area has accurate color. To me, it's only noticeable on a solid white background, so I'm not too upset about it given that my panel is otherwise perfect. There's zero dead pixels, it has the latest firmware, and there's no scratches or dents on it. As much as I'd like to have uniform colors, IMO it's probably best not to risk returning it and playing the panel lottery, only to find yourself possibly receiving a worse unit the second time around.
Glossy vs. matte: This was easily my biggest concern when finding a replacement for the NEC. I'm a huge fan of glossy displays and thought the matte finish of the LP2475W would kill my hopes of liking this monitor, IPS or not. But surprisingly I find its a non-issue. It's not grainy at all like my friends U2410 and colors seem natural on it. Overall, the coating is not really noticeable to me when put side-by-side with my 20WMGX2.
That's all that comes to mind after about 20 hours of use. If anyone has any questions, let me know. I'll also try to post some pics soon.
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That can't be possible.. 6ms vs 30ms+ is a HUGE difference.
I think if it would be like that then EVERYONE would try to get the newer versions like obsessed, and HP would go bankrupt because people would send back their monitors all the time, lol.
Does anyone know if a Spyder 3 Pro can calibrate wide gamut monitors?
It can easily be possible. Early versions, like mine, had problems with negative ghosting in some situations which are caused by improperly done overdrive. Later ones apparently has none which indicates that there has been adjustments, perhaps even turning it off, and this might very well show as reduced input lag. Am I right?
Yes it can.
After 4 replacements (5 monitors total) I still have the pink tint problem on the right side of the display. I thought it was gone with the 2nd monitor, but it got worse after about 300 hours on the backlight. I think I will just wait and see if HP solves the problem and then replace it. Fortunately, the pink hue is only noticeable on a white or light-gray background. This problem does not seem to be limited to any specific hardware revision or firmware. All 5 of the monitors I got had various manufacturing dates and revision (but the same firmware) and were made in China.
Below are the 5 monitors information:
Monitor Revision Firmware Manufacturing Date
1 (new) GIG153 GIG072 Sep-09
2 GIG111 GIG076 late 2008 (I forgot the record the date)
3 GIG143 GIG076 Mar-09
4 GIG133 GIG076 Jan-09
5 GIG133 GIG076 Feb-09
Below are the 5 monitors information:
Monitor Revision Firmware Manufacturing Date
1 (new) GIG153 GIG072 Sep-09
2 GIG111 GIG076 late 2008 (I forgot the record the date)
3 GIG143 GIG076 Mar-09
4 GIG133 GIG076 Jan-09
5 GIG133 GIG076 Feb-09
That doesn't sound too good. I have now my first replacement and on monday I'll call another one. Both monitors had the green-pink tint. Left side is greenish and right is pinkish.
Sorry to hear about your bad luck. Flawless IPS panels are hard to come by, from what I can deduce. My first LP2475w had the green/pink tint issue and fortunately my first replacement was free of any visible defects.
ghostchild
Limp Gawd
- Joined
- Jan 24, 2006
- Messages
- 455
if anyones interested in a good calibrator for this monitor I have an eye-one display 2 for sale...
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1487180
I used it with this monitor and god great results thanks to everyone in this thread who referred it to me.
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1487180
I used it with this monitor and god great results thanks to everyone in this thread who referred it to me.
Uhh, no one can make that call for you but I know if I had to go through 3x of anything for any reason I'd be asking for my money back and be looking at it's competition. I must have good fortune cause I rarely have to return/exchange electronics.
Regarding the input lag, this is the review I'm basing my statement on: http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/monitors/2009/07/28/hp-lp2475w-24in-widescreen-tft-review/4
Here's the quote:
"Something that's important for those who play fast paced FPS games is input lag, or rather, a lack of it. Using a stopwatch program when we first looked at the LP2475w in Custom PC (Issue 70), we found the LP2475w lagged 31ms behind our control monitor - a Dell 3007WFP-HC which suffers from next to no input lag. This is a noticeable amount of input lag, so the old version of the screen wasn't great if you play a lot of Unreal Tournament 3 or CS:S.
However, as HP has updated the panel, the new revision of the LP2475w has only 4ms of input lag. This is fantastic news, as the high input lag was one of the few flies in the ointment for the LP2475w when we looked at it earlier in the year."
From what I understand, it's the Q2 2009 and later panel revisions which have next to no input lag compared to the prior versions.
There is some basic specs listed on hp's website regarding the new zr24w released in February.
Keen to get some more info, ill definitely be buying one or the other
the zr24w is not wide gamut so for people who are colour critical it may just be the answer
Keen to get some more info, ill definitely be buying one or the other
the zr24w is not wide gamut so for people who are colour critical it may just be the answer
Mr. Bluntman
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- Jun 25, 2007
- Messages
- 7,100
Well I was going to order the U2410 after Dell has started shipping A01 panels, but after reading that this monitor has 1/4 to 1/5th the input lag over the Dell, I think I'll be ordering this one instead. Although the HP Direct/TD price is a bit high over Newegg's ($30-40 more), I hate Newegg's LCD return policy with a passion.
*counts down the days until I recieve my tax return*
*counts down the days until I recieve my tax return*
Mr. Bluntman
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- Jun 25, 2007
- Messages
- 7,100
Reference?
Mr. Bluntman
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- Jun 25, 2007
- Messages
- 7,100
Thought these were to be released in April? My Google-fu can't muster up a release date.
According to this article, it's supposed to be available in the US in February. It says $289 for the 22 so maybe 350 for the 24?
http://www.cnet.com.au/dell-ultrasharp-u2410-339298064.htm
According to this article, 0ms min, 14ms avg input lag in game mode for the U2410. Other measurements by users on this forum had it at 12ms avg in game mode. My understanding is the HP 2475 has 25ms input lag on average (I have it noted in my monitor spreadsheet, no link - I will search for one.) Edit - I see the bit-tech article that compared it to a 3007WFP, which is very strange, since the 3007WFP has it's own input lag (avg ~12ms). Here's a link to the what I remember being the source of my 25ms number for the HP - http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/content/hp_lp2475w.htm
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Mr. Bluntman
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- Jun 25, 2007
- Messages
- 7,100
The TFTCentral review was the original revision that was equipped with an older S-IPS panel. The bit-tech review model has a similar panel to the U2410 but with a less grainy AG coating, hence the difference...
triple_digital
n00b
- Joined
- Jan 20, 2010
- Messages
- 4
Yes, the HP2475w firmware very likely got updated since its release, so the newer revision(s) could have lower input lag. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find a review which describes the unit with newest available firmware (PRAD, TFTcentral, Bit-tech...) to compare it to the older one