NVIDIA Roadmap Outline for 1H08

The PC market itself, as even the NPD says, is dominant (the reason I say even is the North America vs. International issue). It just doesn't move new games as rapidly as consoles do.

As far as games you can pick-up right now that might give your system some problems:
-Company of Heroes in DX10 w/Max Settings
-World in Conflict
-Crysis (duh)
-Call of Juarez
-Sins of a Solar Empire (max out the settings/AA and then pit 2000+ ships against each other; either way, the game is set-up so that there is no hard performance cap, meaning the game can expand along with your system's capabilities)

Those are just the ones I've run across. As far as '08 goes, there will always be some games that are just flat-out console ports. But Far Cry 2 and Alan Wake I know for certain are doing something special for the PC, and I'm certain they're not the only ones. Left 4 Dead likely will as well because a different development team is handling the 360 port.
 
Sunin said:
Hmm what are the #'s of consoles? I'm Highly suspicious of the arguement that the PC market is small...

Considering a game like WOW has 10million subscribers alone it makes you wonder how many PCs are truly built for gaming...

Or are you saying small pc market meaning the Enthusiast that gets the best cards upon release? Please clarify a bit.
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LOL thats only one game mate. at an average i can safely say that the majority of console games sells millions EACH copy mate. consoles are more mainstream and there is no denying that.

wow can be played on a onboard gpu card thats why its popular. almost every pc spread across for the last 5-6 years can play wow weather crysis currently NO1 can play the game its meant to be played without tweaks, loss of res, SLI etc...

i doubt alan wake will be that demanding because i bet you that will be yet another port from a console. do realise alan wake is out on the consoles too and the graphics on the pc version will only be slightly better.
 
jonneymendoza said:
LOL thats only one game mate. at an average i can safely say that the majority of console games sells millions EACH copy mate. consoles are more mainstream and there is no denying that.

wow can be played on a onboard gpu card thats why its popular. almost every pc spread across for the last 5-6 years can play wow weather crysis currently NO1 can play the game its meant to be played without tweaks, loss of res, SLI etc...

i doubt alan wake will be that demanding because i bet you that will be yet another port from a console. do realise alan wake is out on the consoles too and the graphics on the pc version will only be slightly better.
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Far Cry 2 is also hitting the consoles but is a PC-first title, as is Alan Wake. I should also mention that there are some rumors that Alan Wake PC will require a quad core to play. Dunno how that's going to work out, b/c even a lot of enthusiasts atm only have a dual core.

Anyway, you're still missing the point. The fact of the matter isn't that PC games don't sell any worse than console games, it's just that they sell at a slower rate. The majority of console game sales come within the first month and their success is measured solely on those sales- much like how a blockbuster movie relies on its first week sales with the rest of its tenure being irrelevant. PC games are different. Games like Half-Life 2, UT 2004, StarCraft, Battlefield 2, etc... have sold millions of copies over the span of many months and even many years. If you compare the sales of Halo 2 and Half-Life 2 in their first weeks, Halo 2 wins by a landslide. But look at those same sales over time and...

And, btw, few console games break the one million sales mark. But most of those that do need to thanks to massive advertising budgets. So now you're getting into what is basically the unequal playing field...

And, finally, for Crysis, it was purposely designed to scale into the future so that it would still look good even on future hardware (and, no doubt, also to accelerate the arrival of that future hardware).
 
Sunin said:
Wow some people need to head back to business school.. its called extended a product life cycle. It means they get more $$$ for a sunk cost investment. Almost all companies do it, especially if they already have a competitive advantage.
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In business school they also teach you that an extended product life cycle can conflict with that typical Silicon Valley curiosity called 'Creative Destruction'.

Nvidia doesn't only compete with ATI, it also competes with itself: contrary to popular believe, there is a lot of profit in the high-end cards. Anyone who's currently sitting on a 8800GTX or 8800Ultra and doesn't like SLI has no reason to upgrade right now.

Even if ATI has no competitor whatsoever in the high-end, eventually Nvida has to come out with a new high-end card to get that high-margin money.
 
I read somewhere that the PC gaming accounts for merely 17% of entire gaming industry.
 
I think we've been hearing "PC-gaming is dead" since 1999 or so when the XBox, PS2, etc were in hype. It's true that the newest generation of consoles offer a lot and for casual gamers, they probably suffice. Also, console gamers are easier to punch out so they probably have a good deal higher profit margin. However, PC-gaming is what drives the industry and is also what has the biggest die-hards. Also note that many of those polls on the industry don't follow games, but only take first week or month of sales for comparison, which favors more the console industry. Also note that they many times don't include downloadable games, which is really where the PC market is going (steam, direct2drive or whatever its called, etc.). Always take statistics with a grain of salt until you know the fine print ;).

Sorry to go off topic. As far as the 9800GX2 goes, it could be a beast, but it all really depends on nVidia's driver team. The silence maybe means that they're all locked in their offices coding like mad as zero hour comes upon us :p.
 
Mr. K6 said:
The silence maybe means that they're all locked in their offices coding like mad as zero hour comes upon us :p.
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Hopefully. I think drivers are going to be the decisive factor behind the success of the 9800GX2.
 
9800gx2 is so meh, I'm waiting for the true next gen part, not an 8800 refresh.
 
mathman said:
Nvidia doesn't only compete with ATI, it also competes with itself: contrary to popular believe, there is a lot of profit in the high-end cards. Anyone who's currently sitting on a 8800GTX or 8800Ultra and doesn't like SLI has no reason to upgrade right now.

Even if ATI has no competitor whatsoever in the high-end, eventually Nvida has to come out with a new high-end card to get that high-margin money.
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I'm running GTXs SLI'd and not spending any money on refresh releases.
"Build it and they will come..." :p
 
Well when they get to the point of allowing us to modify games, like in oblivion, and hooking up a keyboard mouse, then yes consoles will reign. I'm guessing this revision or next will truly merge computers and consoles with full on demand ability and huge storage HD included...
 
I don't think that even consolites will really want the consoles to reign. Without PC gaming, you lose pretty much all demand for high-end graphics cards and for graphics cards to push the envelope. Therefore, the consoles lose some "free r+d" and if they stay on the 5-year cycle the technological increments are going to decrease. Why? Because they're competing against PC's as much as they are competing against other consoles, and if they only need to compete once every five years with tech they themselves develop... At the very least, the price of those consoles will rise. Or the price of the games (which would be worse really).

Anyway, I feel the PC is about ready for a revolution, and this in distribution. No, I'm not just talking about digital distribution ala Steam. There are other ways of turning a profit off of digital distribution that you're not going to see on the consoles but which you will see on the PC. And, I must say, those methods are much more consumer-friendly than present distribution models. And, even the lumbering giant, EA- best known for its derivative sequels- is stepping-up to the plate and testing out this new type of distribution. I direct your attention to a little game called, "Battlefield: Heroes". Now, you say- "that's not a AAA title and the graphics suck!" True, but there is no reason this distribution model cannot be adopted by more ambitious development endeavors. If Battlefield: Heroes succeeds, I think you may be looking at a brand new way of distributing games. And that would kill the consoles, because they cannot emulate this distribution model with their present system, which is to sell the consoles themselves for a loss and make a profit on the games.
 
Vorazan said:
I read somewhere that the PC gaming accounts for merely 17% of entire gaming industry.
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That's innacurate. It's much worse than that. The gaming industry in North America last year was about $18.9 billion of which only $911 million was from PC gaming. That's 5%.. You can bet that of that 5%, about 3% of it came from World of Warcraft, the SIMs and one or two other big franchises. That leaves about 2% for everybody else. It's simply not worth it for developers, especially smaller ones when they could be releasing console games instead.
 
Spare-Flair said:
That's innacurate. It's much worse than that. The gaming industry in North America last year was about $18.9 billion of which only $911 million was from PC gaming. That's 5%.. You can bet that of that 5%, about 3% of it came from World of Warcraft, the SIMs and one or two other big franchises. That leaves about 2% for everybody else. It's simply not worth it for developers, especially smaller ones when they could be releasing console games instead.
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Hey, dumbass- that's from the NPD which admits it does not accurately reflect all or even most PC purchases (we've kinda been talking about that for a few posts now).
 
It also doesn't take into account that console games are what 60+ and most PC games are under 50.

 
Its a shame they cant have all of the version of the game on the same disc.

Have the PC/360 Version on one side of the disc and the PS3 on the other or something similar..
 
TheBluePill said:
Its a shame they cant have all of the version of the game on the same disc.

Have the PC/360 Version on one side of the disc and the PS3 on the other or something similar..
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How would you combine DVD and bluray? Most PCs are DVD right now, and they are two different processes...Its not a bad idea, but it would require that there be one standard format i would imagine along with everyone needing the drives to support it, which isnt really cost effecient a this point.
 
nissanztt90 said:
How would you combine DVD and bluray? They are two different processes...Its not a bad idea, but it would require that there be one standard format i would imagine.
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That might be a Hurdle.. I would imagine that several formats could be combined, even if the PS3 version would have to be stand alone.

Is the Wii DVD capable or CD based?
 
Oh,

the 9800 GX2 will be $599 acording to Fud;

Geforce 9800GX2 to cost $599
Written by Fuad Abazovic
Monday, 25 February 2008 08:59



600MHz/2000MHz memory


The Geforce 9800 GX2 has finally got its final specification. It has two G92 chips clocked at 600MHz and both of them have 128 Shader units clocked at 1,500MHz.

The memory on a reference card runs at 2,000MHz and it has a 2 x 256-bit memory interface.

Naturally many partners will overclock their cards, but the manufacturer suggested retail price is set at $599 which is $150 more than the current price of a Radeon HD 3870 X2. This is the price for non overclocked Geforce 9800 GX2's while the overclocked models should end up even more expensive.
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TheBluePill said:
That might be a Hurdle.. I would imagine that several formats could be combined, even if the PS3 version would have to be stand alone.

Is the Wii DVD capable or CD based?
Click to expand...

Wikipedia says its a proprietary format, but there is speculation that future players may be DVD. That was just at a quick glance, might have missed a few things.

I hate FUD.
 
jonneymendoza said:
with that specs how can it be 30% faster then an ultra? lol
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As it was said there's two of those cards and since 8800 GT 512 SLI beats 8800 ultra clearly: 1600x1200 4xAA 16xAF 34%, 1920x1200 4xAA 16xAF 43%... then i think that this 9800 GX2 should do well..those extra SP and TMU units shouldn't hinder it's performance..and neither should it's most likely higher mem bandwith.
 
If the $599 retail is true, it better be one helluva performer, and significantly better than the 3870 X2.
 
Spare-Flair said:
That's innacurate. It's much worse than that. The gaming industry in North America last year was about $18.9 billion of which only $911 million was from PC gaming. That's 5%.. You can bet that of that 5%, about 3% of it came from World of Warcraft, the SIMs and one or two other big franchises. That leaves about 2% for everybody else. It's simply not worth it for developers, especially smaller ones when they could be releasing console games instead.
Click to expand...

More importantly, that 18 billion number includes all console 'extras', like controllers, memory cards and console hardware itself, and handhelds, cell phone games and other random crap. PC hardware, online sales and subscriptions arent included in the $911 million figure. For that you have to look at sales figures for NVDA, AMD, INTC etc and try to guess which are for gaming, something that is basically impossible. I'm not just making this up btw, its in the NPD reports.
 
Vegasr said:
If the $599 retail is true, it better be one helluva performer, and significantly better than the 3870 X2.
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I think it will be (on hell of a....) I dont think it will be 599... ! Not that I care much,but still,I do see it running roughshod over the 3870X2's.
 
Remember that Fud also previously said that the 9800GX2 would have 1024MB of memory per a card.
 
TheBluePill said:
Oh,

the 9800 GX2 will be $599 acording to Fud;
Click to expand...

If that is true, then compared to the $449.00 HD3870x2, the price difference is 1/3rd more for the 9800GX2, so the new nVidia will have to be 33% faster than the 3870x2 to be competitive, any slower and it is a rip off. Will the 9800GX2 be that much faster, I doubt it ?
 
Zorachus said:
If that is true, then compared to the $449.00 HD3870x2, the price difference is 1/3rd more for the 9800GX2, so the new nVidia will have to be 33% faster than the 3870x2 to be competitive, any slower and it is a rip off. Will the 9800GX2 be that much faster, I doubt it ?
Click to expand...

Considering that the HD 3870X2 is roughly on par with the 8800GTX and the 9800GX2 is supposed to be ~40% better than the 8800GTX...
 
Zorachus said:
If that is true, then compared to the $449.00 HD3870x2, the price difference is 1/3rd more for the 9800GX2, so the new nVidia will have to be 33% faster than the 3870x2 to be competitive, any slower and it is a rip off. Will the 9800GX2 be that much faster, I doubt it ?
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Well Geforce 9600 GT SLI is still 10% faster than HD3870 X2 so there's small chance that this 9800 GX2 could be 33% faster than HD3870 X2
 
Niceone said:
Well Geforce 9600 GT SLI is still 10% faster than HD3870 X2 so there's small chance that this 9800 GX2 could be 33% faster than HD3870 X2
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How so ? The 9800 GX2 is rumored to be "at least" 30 faster than the 8800 Ultra, The X2 performs as a single GTX/Ultra, so the GX2 should be "at least" 30% faster than the X2...
 
Just wanted to bump this thread a bit, since I've got a question..

A lot of time had passed, and I'd just point to my early post from the start of January.. So, almost full three months later - where did I go wrong? :p Ok, I did miss with 9600GT as it wasn't just 8800GT (256MB) tweaked and re-released, it's new chip based on G92, cut in half, tweaked to excel in low-mid resolutions - and in SLI. Cudos to nVidia here.. But other than this chip/card, I've guessed correctly all other 9xxx series cards.

So, not to be rude or anything, but - Silus and others, where is your fabled 9800 GTX? I know, I know, it's coming in summer, won't be called 9800 GTX, and will be a new chip called GT200.. Right? Hmm.. Haven't I said that long time before as well? :)

OK, I've had my good time, I'll leave you all alone now ;) Cya! And - NHF, OK? :)
 
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