Send Sapphire a message

[Grim Incarnation]

I HAD NO IDEA ABOUT THIS!!!!

I just orderd a 9800pro and Got it, its a sapphire Atlantis 9800pro 256Meg with HL2 cupon. I orderd it from allstarshop.com for 275. I was thinking that it was an ok Deal because it wasn't that much more than a what I've found else where but it still had an HL2 cupon too. I just DLed Rivaturner and looked at the main tab and it says 128bit Now I feel like a jackass all just for a HL cupon.

I haven't tried to push the card but it runs Ok, I haven't pused the IQ settings yet or anything above 1024x768

Oh woe, woe is me.

Edit: this is the page I ordered from: http://www.allstarshop.com/shop/product.asp?pid=8652&sid=29VJG46VP6PP8NA5CKD6VK14HHADEHUA

It didn't have this much information on it when I was ordering, I followed the product link and read the whole sale page when i was selecting, it didn't say that the memory was 128 bit, In fact it didn't mention more than the ammount of memory and the product link of course is the updated page for the updated product and 256 bit memory. I had rejected a card earlier when I was searching for one, (I was still looking at 128 Meg cards and a very lower price range then and not even the pro models)

RADEON 9800 Pro Series of visual processors is the most visually advanced 3D performer on the planet, delivering an immersive, cinematic experience for the most demanding next-generation games with 256MB of DDR memory and a 128-bit memory interface. Merging advanced stability with revolutionary features, RADEON 9800 PRO Series is the only Visual Processing family in its 2nd generation.


Taken direct from the site

 

[vanquished]

275 dollars as well, ouch. for 24 more you could have gotten a 6800. Just goes to show that it helps a lot if you just read the entire page

 

[RedShirt]

I HAD NO IDEA ABOUT THIS!!!!

I just orderd a 9800pro and Got it, its a sapphire Atlantis 9800pro 256Meg with HL2 cupon. I orderd it from allstarshop.com for 275. I was thinking that it was an ok Deal because it wasn't that much more than a what I've found else where but it still had an HL2 cupon too. I just DLed Rivaturner and looked at the main tab and it says 128bit Now I feel like a jackass all just for a HL cupon.

I haven't tried to push the card but it runs Ok, I haven't pused the IQ settings yet or anything above 1024x768

Oh woe, woe is me.

Edit: this is the page I ordered from: http://www.allstarshop.com/shop/product.asp?pid=8652&sid=29VJG46VP6PP8NA5CKD6VK14HHADEHUA

It didn't have this much information on it when I was ordering, I followed the product link and read the whole sale page when i was selecting, it didn't say that the memory was 128 bit, In fact it didn't mention more than the ammount of memory and the product link of course is the updated page for the updated product and 256 bit memory. I had rejected a card earlier when I was searching for one, (I was still looking at 128 Meg cards and a very lower price range then and not even the pro models)

Here is a PERFECT example as to the confusion this causes. It said it was a 9800pro, so bigstusexy assumed it was like all other 9800pros. In past experiances when Sapphire labeled a product it followed ATI's advertised specs. Sure, an OEM card may have lower clock speeds, but that would have been the only difference. This is a completly different product.

 

[Tordek]

Im still not sure why some people are still saying sapphire or newegg are not guilty about this...

These are misleading tactics... Nothing less nothing more. Think who in the world would want to get a crippled version of the 9800pro right now... With all the next gen cards right around the corner...

I think sapphire is just getting rid of their 9800pro parts stock. Maybe they have twice the amount of pcbs as pipelines...

Makes you think though. Sapphire, not long ago gave an excellent deal on the $200 REAL 9800pros. I remmember how often newegg ran out of stock when the deal was up. Sapphire would have needed to increase is production of 9800pro fast. But at some in the first quarter of the year, almost everyone that wanted a 9800pro, already had it (most of them made by sapphire). So demand on the cards dropped significantly. Maybe sapphire just didnt get the catch on the situation until it was too late. Maybe in order to cover the high demand for xmas and the start of 2004 they made some deals with memory, pcb, pipelines, etc manufactures that they shouldnt have made. And right now they are sitting on top of a lot of extra 9800pro parts that pretty much no one really needs now.

I kinda like this theory... What do you people think....?


EDIT: I dont really know much of a card's internal arquitecture, so if i spoke bs in some part of my post by kind to laugh internally and point it out.

 

[vanquished]

Here is a PERFECT example as to the confusion this causes. It said it was a 9800pro, so bigstusexy assumed it was like all other 9800pros. In past experiances when Sapphire labeled a product it followed ATI's advertised specs. Sure, an OEM card may have lower clock speeds, but that would have been the only difference. This is a completly different product.

You can't assume anything when you're buying something. That's just being a stupid consumer. Going back to my car analogy, just becasue it's a V8 doesn't mean that it'll pump out 300+ horsepower.

 

[akanafene]

You guys are too soft on Sappire. I think the bastards should be sued by consumers for deceptive advertising and at the very least required to refund the money of the consumers who have been misled by the company. Class action suit anyone ?

 

[HitMan-sC]

I bought a Sapphire 9800Pro 128MB off of newegg, I think back in February. After reading this, I panicked, but AIDA32 confirmed it was a 256-bit bus. When did Sapphire start rolling out the "crippled" versions? That was a real bastard move on their part; there should have at least been a fair warning. Changing fine print and selling a different product isn't really being fair to the consumer, although it's just sneaky marketing. Adding 128MB of RAM and then crippling the bus doesn't really justify a $60 increase over the 128MB, 256-bit version, in my opinion.

 

[Koslov]

they shouldn't labal it as a Pro....totaly lame IMH

 

[chrislg]

Some of you guys are really underestimating how confusing this is even to the average educated consumer. I am by no means ignorant when it comes to computers, but I doubt I would have noticed the diffference of 128-bit and 256-bit in the product description. When you buy something labeled as a 9800 Pro, you expect to get a 9800 Pro. Just like when you buy a Range Rover, you expect to get a Range Rover and not a Jeep. This is deliberately misleading and particularly pisses me off because I was about to buy a 9800 Pro for myself. I've been more interested in actually playing games than reading benchmarks so I had to do a little reading before buying and Sapphire had gotten good marks from the ATI crowd.

I'm just as dissapointed in Newegg for carrying it as I am in Sapphire. I'd had such good experiences with Newegg in the past but hearing about this sours me on them even though I was warned before falling for it.

 

[pirateface]

I have to agree, you can't blame Sapphire for any of this. Just because the made a 128bit version and sell it cheaper than the 256bit version is logical and in no way them trying to rip ppl. You get what you payed for, if your misinformed it's not the company who makes the card's/product's their fault.

ppl who fell victim to this, was misinformed by the retailer/third party sellers, so I can't see how it's Sapphire's fault. It's like someone buying a Flat Screen CRT but they thought they were getting an LCD, it happens believe me, I work at a computer store. If anything you have to blame the retailer not the manufacturer of the cards.

Besides there's a saying:
If it's too good to be true, then it probably is.

or something like that

 

[retardedchicken]

i concur with pirateface

im going to get my SECOND halflife2 coupon with the sapphire x800pro im getting tomorrow

 

[CrimandEvil]

I hardly think your example is valid seeings how the difference between a CRT and LCD is like night and day. Remember the difference in size? Hell my aunt and uncle (two people who know virtually nothing about PCs) know what a CRT and LCD look like, it's not like the only way to tell them apart was a little sticker on the box that said "128bits!" .

 

[sackowitz]

The problem is with people who aren't into computer hardware as much as us and don't even realize there is a difference.

I agree that deceipt is very uncool on the part of Sapphire and / or the retailer, but i feel that anyone smart enough to install internal peripherals should be smart enough to verify the specifications of what they are buying and test for proper operation of what they are installing. i'm not trying to defend any of the above corporations, i still believe they're dead wrong and should make good on the situation.

it really is sad to realize that you can't trust anyone, and it doesnt just go for video cards.... think about the deceipt involved in car sales for example. bottom line is that it makes ya wonder if human nature is essentially evil... cuz it sure feels like we're being overtaken by a world of assholes.

 

[CrimandEvil]

but i feel that anyone smart enough to install internal peripherals should be smart enough to verify the specifications of what they are buying and test for proper operation of what they are installing.

I get paid by a few people I know to install parts they bought so I would imagine that a few people do that too (I see a few ads in the paper by other people that do this too). Most of the time I go along with them to make sure they are getting what they need/ want but other times they just ask me to install things that they bought on their own.

 

[illig]

I completely agree with blackwind, this might be a bit silly, but you can compare it to buying a car. Even if you don't know what all the specs mean, you will try to learn. ABS, EMS..etc, you don't see car owners complaining when they've bought a car only to find that i only has 1 air bag. As a consumer, you must know about what you're doing, or else everything will become a gamble

most people out there think that same name==same product... to use your car analogy, if ford started selling Mustang GT's with the same exact options... except one had a V6, and the other had a V8... no difference in name, just a mention in small print that it's a V6

most people buying the cars wouldn't know the difference... and it's the same with video cards... there are naming differences for a reason: 9800, 9800Pro, LE, XT, SLOW-VERSION, NEUTERED-VERSION, whatever... if a company sells an inferior product with the same exact name as a full-featured version elsewhere, it's pure fraudulent marketing... i'm sure there's no law against it, but there should be

just think... every time you buy a computer component, do you check all the specs? what if it's a spec you don't fully understand? would you notice if a radeon description left out something like Hyper Z II or some other minor spec? and wouldn't you be pissed if after buying the card and opening it, you noticed it didn't have Hyper Z which your current game happens to need for good visual quality? and you'd have to pay a restocking fee to return the damn neutered card b/c of your own oversight? think about it

 

[pirateface]

I hardly think your example is valid seeings how the difference between a CRT and LCD is like night and day. Remember the difference in size? Hell my aunt and uncle (two people who know virtually nothing about PCs) know what a CRT and LCD look like, it's not like the only way to tell them apart was a little sticker on the box that said "128bits!" .

When ppl say "Flat Screen" they usually refer to LCDs, but CRTs have Flat Screen as well, and ppl like saving money, so if they see a Flat Screen monitor selling for a hundred something they think their getting a LCD for a wicked price, when it's actually a CRT. This is why at work, I would tell those ppl do you mean CRT as in the blocky monitors or LCDs like this (*points to the one on the desk*). My example is perfectly sound, as we had this mishap before with a customer, who ordered a Viewsonic 17" Flat Screen CRT thinking their getting a viewsonic 17" LCD. Lucky for me, I wasn't the one who sold that to the customer.

Again, like I said before, you CAN ONLY blame the retailer for misleading the product, and in noway can you blame the manufacturer of the cards. If the Retailer wasn't clear or had mis-informed the customer you can only blame them.

However the manufacturer could have a problem where they mis-labbeled a product, and if that was the case, they probably mislabbeld the 9800SE with the 9800PRO stickers. Which then you can blame the Manufacturer, but even then that would be just an accident, which they usually apologize for and give exchanges for.

Like I said before, you get what you paid for. It's like paying 25Cents for a no name cola and it gives you stomach cramps which you didn't expect it would, instead of paying 50cents for Coca-Cola or Pepsi where it wouldn't. You only get what you paid for. And I would never trust online stores where a price for such a product was a bit too good to be true, it's likely that it is too good to be true.

Besides I'd expect anyone who posts here at [H] to be educated enough to do some homework before purchasing such as high end product and to do a price comparison of what the market price is. If you see the market price is around a $10 difference then take the lowest, but if there's usually a $50 or some high difference it's likely a trick or some kind of catch such as mail in rebate or some crap like that. In the Free Market, to keep in business you have to follow suite, and companies will always sell the same product for relatively the same price give or take a few bucks usually a $10-$20 difference give or take depending on the product.

For such a video card (9800Pro 128mb) that has dropped a lot over the last few months, to see it drop even more and have the price tag around $140 USD is rediculous and too good to be true. Usually for such an end product such as the 9800PRO the price difference is usually no where more than a $10 difference, after it's been stablized in value.

 

[RedShirt]

When ppl say "Flat Screen" they usually refer to LCDs, but CRTs have Flat Screen as well, and ppl like saving money, so if they see a Flat Screen monitor selling for a hundred something they think their getting a LCD for a wicked price, when it's actually a CRT. This is why at work, I would tell those ppl do you mean CRT as in the blocky monitors or LCDs like this (*points to the one on the desk*). My example is perfectly sound, as we had this mishap before with a customer, who ordered a Viewsonic 17" Flat Screen CRT thinking their getting a viewsonic 17" LCD. Lucky for me, I wasn't the one who sold that to the customer.

Again, like I said before, you CAN ONLY blame the retailer for misleading the product, and in noway can you blame the manufacturer of the cards. If the Retailer wasn't clear or had mis-informed the customer you can only blame them.

However the manufacturer could have a problem where they mis-labbeled a product, and if that was the case, they probably mislabbeld the 9800SE with the 9800PRO stickers. Which then you can blame the Manufacturer, but even then that would be just an accident, which they usually apologize for and give exchanges for.

Like I said before, you get what you paid for. It's like paying 25Cents for a no name cola and it gives you stomach cramps which you didn't expect it would, instead of paying 50cents for Coca-Cola or Pepsi where it wouldn't. You only get what you paid for. And I would never trust online stores where a price for such a product was a bit too good to be true, it's likely that it is too good to be true.

Besides I'd expect anyone who posts here at [H] to be educated enough to do some homework before purchasing such as high end product and to do a price comparison of what the market price is. If you see the market price is around a $10 difference then take the lowest, but if there's usually a $50 or some high difference it's likely a trick or some kind of catch such as mail in rebate or some crap like that. In the Free Market, to keep in business you have to follow suite, and companies will always sell the same product for relatively the same price give or take a few bucks usually a $10-$20 difference give or take depending on the product.

For such a video card (9800Pro 128mb) that has dropped a lot over the last few months, to see it drop even more and have the price tag around $140 USD is rediculous and too good to be true. Usually for such an end product such as the 9800PRO the price difference is usually no where more than a $10 difference, after it's been stablized in value.

What if you bought "Pepsi" for about 10% less than normal pepsi and you opened the can and drank it and it was the store brand labeled as pepsi. You then look at the fine print and it says it's an imitation of Pepsi. Well, it's your fault for not reading the fine print I guess (yeah right).

Now I know this couldn't be done in the real world becasue this example is illegal. These 128-bit Pros sell for 170 and you could find a REAL 9800 pro a few weeks ago for 180. The price doesn't seem too good to be true for me. It's labeled as a 9800pro, but it is NOT a 9800pro.

 

[PrkChpXprss]

I remember reading (I think on HardOCP) that the ATI specs didn't require manufacturers (i.e. Sapphire, PowerColor, etc) to make their Radeon 9800 Pros 256-bit -- hence the big question as to WHEN or IF we were going to start seeing these 'crippled' cards in the near future. The future has arrived

Now I gotta search the archives for that news posting... Anyone with linkage?

 

[RedShirt]

I remember reading (I think on HardOCP) that the ATI specs didn't require manufacturers (i.e. Sapphire, PowerColor, etc) to make their Radeon 9800 Pros 256-bit -- hence the big question as to WHEN or IF we were going to start seeing these 'crippled' cards in the near future. The future has arrived

Now I gotta search the archives for that news posting... Anyone with linkage?

Whoo Hooo! I personally can't wait for the 64-bit edition. That'd probably knock off another 20 bucks.

 

[PrkChpXprss]

Straight from ATI's web site:

RADEON™ 9800 series of visual processors is the most visually advanced 3D performer on the planet, delivering an immersive, cinematic experience for the most demanding next-generation games with up to 256MB of DDR memory and a 256-bit memory interface.

Straight from Allstarshop's web site:

RADEON 9800 Pro Series of visual processors is the most visually advanced 3D performer on the planet, delivering an immersive, cinematic experience for the most demanding next-generation games with 256MB of DDR memory and a 128-bit memory interface.

snippet of Atlantis Radeon 9800 Pro specs -- Straight from SapphireTech.com:

Features:
256MB DDR-2 or 128MB DDR memory accelerates the latest 3D games
256-bit memory interface removes hardware performance bottleneck and provides end users with faster 3D graphics

Come on now -- if you visit the Sapphire web site, it says the memory interface for the Sapphire Atlantis Radeon 9800 Pro is 256 bit. Even the product specs / comparison chart doesn't say anything about it being 128-bit interface.

Give the guys a break -- they can do their homework all day long. The information is not consistent, so I would say that it could be seen as deceptive, 'hidden', or misleading...

 

[RedShirt]

The site is now allowing for people to sign up saying that they will boycott.

 

[Stugots]

guess this means i cant join cause i just bought a sapphire card

 

[SEALTeamSix]

All SAPPHIRE ATI video boards are manufactured under 100% ATI production criteria including QC and outgoing system. Our monthly video board production capacity can reach a lofty 1.8 million. Our factory has always been the major manufacturer on ATI boards for most of the top ten tier 1 OEMs worldwide. With this background, you should undoubtedly be guaranteed of the impeccable quality, production capacity and product reliability of all ATI video boards from SAPPHIRE. We look forward to an exciting and prosperous relationship with you!

Direct your complaints to:

USA Office:
Tel: 909-594-0597
Fax: 909-594-9771
e-mail: [email protected]

-SEAL

 

[Helmut]

Basically, it all boils down to PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. We have become a nation of whiners. . .own up to your screwup. None of us like to admit we're stupid, but it's human nature ladies and gentlemen.

 

[7718]

Yeah i bought one of those cards from newegg, unfortunately it was listed as a 256bit retail mistakenly. Newegg offered to credit my account for it if i sent it back , but like a fol i kept it. It actually seems to work pretty good, despite its handicapped memory bus. At least it wasn't a 64bit mem bus. I will never ever buy another anything from saphire, but i might get something again from newegg in the future, probably after HL2 comes out.

my email to sapphire:

I mistakenly purchased one of your 128bit 9800pros because i was under the impression that a 9800pro was a 9800pro. According to ati's website their is no 9800pro with 128bit memory, so i DEMAND that you discontinue selling them as 9800pros and call them 9800SE's or something like that. If you do not wish to rectify the situation in the manner i requested i will go to every webforum that speaks english and post horrible things about how sapphire ripped me off and how all the cards you guys sell are mislabeled underclocked garbage.

You could always send me the other 128bits i thought i was getting. All joking aside i think your company is decietfull, and you are praying off of misinformed consumers. You are even worse than Intel, selling all those people 2.6ghz celerons, thinking they will get better performance than a 2ghz athlon. You guys are awefull videocard manufacturers.

 

[IdiotInCharge]

I read through this entire thread to make sure I am not repeating anyone.

I have a new perspective to submit- I do not believe there is a problem here, from the manufacturer's perspective. When they say "9800 Pro," they mean there is an ATi made chipset, specifically R350, on the board. That, while implying 256bit memory interface capability, does not mean that it has a 256bit bus. The fact that the listing in question on Newegg (which I have seen) clearly marks it as a 128bit product only bolsters this point. We're talking about manufacturers that cater to an enthusiest's market- there is always too much jargon for most people to sort through, it's just the way it is. Because an expected feature was bent does not mean someone is a criminal; the card is as stated.

And to the poster above I send my condolences. No doubt it was a mistake on Newegg's part, probably making the same mistake that many people looking at this card would. Oh well, it is a mistake, and Newegg offered to rectify it; you chose not to get what you wanted, it's your own damn fault. In no way was this Saphire's fault, as the listing was wrong per Newegg, and I continue to say they are not at any fault.

While I know I would be pissed too, I would have the balls and sight to acknowledge that it was my screwup and no anyone else's, as many in this forum already have.

 

[bigstusexy]

Alright to the person that quoted me then quoted all start shops page... you did just as I did, you either missed or didn't see (in my case as I said, it wasn't there when I ordered or when I was selecting the card) if you look at the quote you'll see where I said the page wasn't that detailed.

When I went there the description wasn't on there just the table of details and the other links. As PrkChpXprss pointed out Ordering page (now says) 128 bit, Sapphire's page says 256. When looking at that page if you look at the feature table, I aways get if confused if RAMDAC == Core clock speed or !=, RAMDAC is reported as 400 if its supposed to be core clock I'm missing MHz and there is no mention of the memory speed so.... You follow the product link and check out the info... only thats for the newer version.

I'm not saying that I have no blame and I'm ready to live with it however there is most definitely some mis-communication that happening.

 

[SEALTeamSix]

I think this is worth looking at:

All SAPPHIRE ATI video boards are manufactured under 100% ATI production criteria including QC and outgoing system.

What does this mean, really? What are the "ATI production criteria"? ATI has never produced a card with the number 9800 that didn't have a 256-bit bus.

Looking at the clock speeds of the 128-bit "9800 Pro" (340 core / 580 memory), they are equivalent to an ATI 9800 Non-Pro (325 core / 580 memory) with a 15 MHz core overclock. Just to keep in mind, a real 9800Pro has 380 core / 680 memory, 256-bit memory bus.

This card is a slightly-OCed 9800 Non-Pro with a crippled bus.

-SEAL

 

[Tordek]

The manufacturer and retailer is in service of costumer, not the other way around.

Its unbelievable how some people here truly believe that if someone wants to get a vid card, they SHOULD be able to detect fine print scams like this... Not everyone shares our interest in hardware.

It is the OBLIGATION of the manufacturer and retail to clearly state what they enhance or cripple in their products.

Imagine if this was not about vid cards, but about medicines. Medicines for the elderly for example. Imagine if a medicine lab like Pfizer decided to produce the same type of medicine but one had all the props on it, and the other while still healing, would give you slight nausea and headaches. Now the medicines are called the same, but one of them has been crippled and this cripple is stated in the fine print. Which of course most elderly can't really read...
Now imagine we are a forum of doctors, who also bought the medicine for testing but some of us didnt quite read the fine print and ended up with something we didnt want.

How in the hell are you going to tell me that it is alright for Pfizer to name the two products the same way just because people who are not supposed to or otherwise cant MAKE THEIR HOMEWORK, should have known better....

I mean damn people, i don't care if someone calls me a whiner.

THIS SHIT IS WRONG PERIOD.

 

[chrislg]

People who think the entire blame for purchasing this lands on the consumer need to learn to stand up for themselves. If you are tricked, yes, shame on you for falling for it but also shame on the company for deliberately doing so. This product is purposely marketed deceitfully. Note that lying and being deceitful are two different things. There is no outright lying in the current listing on newegg but it is most definitely deceiving. On every other page/benchmark/whatever - *including* ATI's page listing the specifications of the various 9800 versions - a Radeon 9800 Pro is 256 bit and performs at a certain level. This card was deliberately marketed as a 9800 Pro and a customer has a right to expect a certain level of performance from such a card.

Sapphire decided it would be more profitable for them to be deceitful in this case, but that does not mean you have to have a shred of respect for the company now. Business decisions are financial ones, some companies survive on customer loyalty and some try to push their wares anyway possible. I think it's obvious which way Sapphire went. My money is going to another company.

 

[IdiotInCharge]

You keep saying 'deliberate.' By the fact that, when their error is pointed out both the error is fixed and the customer is offered compensation, we cannot sit here and say that it was deliberate. They have a possible motive, yes, but that hasn't changed with the centuries that people have been marketing products. The reality is, a product was made that appears decieving by it's existance, just like a V6 in a Mustang or Camero. That does not make it a bad product or the comany that made it evil. No doubt they made it in order to clear supplies; and they did (eventually) market it as it should be. Also, has anyone seen one of these on a RETAIL shelf? This I seriously doubt.

 

[fugu]

it's definately a bit misleading, and pretty irritating. i almost told my friend to pick up the saphire until he read the fine print on the newegg site and realized it was the 128 bit one.

 

[MemoryInAGarden]

Regardless, even though the manufacturer may not be clear on the capabilities of the product, the buyer should do enough research and read the fine print to know the difference.

 

[[Tripod]MajorPayne]

In case you didn't notice, the heading on the $170 9800 Pro specifically states, and I quote, "Sapphire Radeon "9800 Atlantis" Video Card, 128MB DDR 128bit, DVI/TV-Out, 8X AGP, Model 594L 1024-1C47, OEM" No where in that heading is the word "Pro", and right after the RAM specifications the 128 bit memory interface is noted.

I ordered the "correct" 9800 Pro yesterday for $217. I almost bought the 128 bit, because I thought it was such a great deal, but I checked my specs like a good little hardware shopper. Unless they changed the header since the fiasco, that's what it said. Although, the card I bought yesterday is mysteriously missing from the list of Sapphire products. Hmmm...trying to cover their tracks but not rectify the situation maybe?

It's kinda fishy, but if you look at a real ATI 9800 Pro, see the price and the specs, then shop for a Sapphire, see a much lower price with lower specs, then find an equal one for more money, it only takes common sense (which unfortunately isn't that common) to decide that the cheap one is, in fact, cheap.

Finding a 9800 Pro at that price without a rebate or overstock label is unusual, so most people with any video-card buying experience would immediately check the info. Of course, some computer-illiterate people could be confused, and that's Sapphire's fault for not making a better distinction, but you cannot fault them for anything else. The specs clearly show a distinction between the two, and all the 9800 Pro means is that they used the same GPU, not the same mem interface or clock speeds. It's like you can get a 2.4 GHz P4, or you can get a 3.2 Ghz P4, it's still a P4.

 

[fugu]

well, in this case it's more like you see "pentium 4" for sale and then in some fine print you see "128KB L2 cache" In most other places they'd call that a celeron. they did advertise it, but if you're not paying attention it's easy to make a mistake because you'd assume that as a p4, it'd have 512KB.

i'm not trying to say that consumers don't have a responsibility to research their purchases; i'm' just saying that saphire isn't making things any easier for us when they call that card a 9800 pro

 

[Blackwind]

Basically, it all boils down to PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. We have become a nation of whiners. . .own up to your screwup. None of us like to admit we're stupid, but it's human nature ladies and gentlemen.

Bingo.

well, in this case it's more like you see "pentium 4" for sale and then in some fine print you see "128KB L2 cache" In most other places they'd call that a celeron. they did advertise it, but if you're not paying attention it's easy to make a mistake because you'd assume that as a p4, it'd have 512KB.

i'm not trying to say that consumers don't have a responsibility to research their purchases; i'm' just saying that saphire isn't making things any easier for us when they call that card a 9800 pro

True.

Companies who don't make our life easy...

Intel and AMD
nVidia and ATI

Who said life was easy?

Not everyone is all knowing. If I'm in the market for a:

A) new car
B) a washer and dryer
C) a new TV
D) home theatre equipment
E) 1000 other things I don't know a lot about

...... I go to someone who knows. If someone is 'duped" by their lack of computer shopping skills....thats life. Live and learn. Our society over the years has become a genration of "give me" rather then "go get." Pretty damn sad really. I don't know jack crap about washers and dryers......but rather then going out and getting duped I go to the experts. How the heck do you think I ended up on [H]ardforums way back in 1999?? I needed to know........



People need to stop whining and learn from their mistakes rather then blaming everyone else for their lack of effort IMO.

 

[MiXdNuTs]

OOps, My 9700PRO is a Saphire. But I bought it back in december so I guess its ok. I wanna kick them in the nuts. I know millions of people who buy neutered hardware from shady companies like saphire all the time and it drives me nuts.

 

[joemama]

Sorry, didn't read the entire thread but....is Sapphire selling the 128bit version alongside the 256bit without making any distinction between the two except for the specs listed on the box? Or did they simply stop making the 256bit without changing the name...

 

[HitMan-sC]

If any of you other guys who are calling them "whiners" got ripped off the same way, I think you'd have a much different view on the issue.

 

[[Tripod]MajorPayne]

Bottom line, thumbs-down Sapphire for bad/misleading marketing, boo-hoo for the consumers because they didn't have the foresight to FIND OUT. Ever heard of "buyer beware?" That's not the way it really should work, but it works that way everywhere else, whether we like it or not. And anyway, if you're spending 200+ dollars on a video card, you should at least find out what the specs are, and you should have some experience/be a gamer to be in the market for that much power anyway.