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Why SLI sucks and is a waste of time:
- Thread starter dderidex
- Start date
So basically nVidia has made us believe (or at least didn't try to disspel the illlusion) that SLI would make every game out there run 20 - 60% faster than with a single card, and now it turns out that this is only true for 'supported' games?
I'm glad I wasn't going to buy into this SLI-hype, anyway.
I'm glad I wasn't going to buy into this SLI-hype, anyway.
What really is going to "Make" or "Break" SLI or ATI's upcoming Multi-Rendering is the support these companies lend to these technologies. SLI is a new technology, barely a month old and we are complaining that it doesnt work in alot of games. However, If I spent $1000+ dollars on a vid card setup, I'd want it to work great also. The fact is right now, the ends don't justify the means, save your thousand dollars or maybe go on a nice vacation.
DemonDiablo
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DandyBear said:
Theres this thing called the "bleeding edge of technology" thats what a lot of these SLI owners are on right now. If you buy any type of new tech when it first comes out then it goes with out saying that you should be prepared for the worst.
Even if SLI did work in every game without a hitch, it would still be a waste of money. First lets identify the market of SLI, Nvidia says it aims it at every customer so that they may easily upgrade in the future by buying another card when the prices drop. The problem is you are only upgrading frames per second, not new technology such as shader 4.0 when it comes out. Thanks to this little website called ebay, it would then make more sense to sell your old 6600/6800 and buy the new generation card when it comes out, thus getting the speed of two and the latest technology in OpenGL and DirectX. I didn't even mention it costs $100 more for an SLI equipped MB and probably $50 more to upgrade your PS which would probably be necessary for the "common" man who wants to run two vid cards.
So that leaves us with the real market SLI will capture, the ultra enthusiasts with money to burn. Those who spend more time benchmarking and posting statistics on these forums than playing the games. Yes I realize thats what some of you like to do which I have no problem with, but from a business persepective SLI does not succeed.
So that leaves us with the real market SLI will capture, the ultra enthusiasts with money to burn. Those who spend more time benchmarking and posting statistics on these forums than playing the games. Yes I realize thats what some of you like to do which I have no problem with, but from a business persepective SLI does not succeed.
killerD said:
my thoughts exactly. i have an sli system on order i am actually going for this motherboard
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Socket_939.html
and these two msi 6600 gts http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/6600_GT.html
but i am worried about this "buying a second card when prices drop business" If i went for 2 6800gts by the time i can afford them, nvidia might have bought out something better so at the moment i am playing it safe with these two 6600 gts
killerD said:
More generally that argument might work, but sm3.0 will likely be the standard for a while. Probably like 2 years. But I do see where you guys are coming from, but I completely disagree that a card will come out in six months that will top the performance of two 6800ultras.
And even when it does get to that point, you can sell off your two vid cards, buy the new one which will most likely be compatible with SLI and start the process over again.
geekcomputing
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fun fact.
30% of voodoo 2 owners went SLI.
30% of voodoo 2 owners went SLI.
geekcomputing
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SLI if for people that.
1. want performance at any cost.
2. have cash (unlike you if your pissed)
3. like options
4. like to be on the cutting edge.
SLI is not for.
1. people that dont have cash and have graphics card penis envy.
1. want performance at any cost.
2. have cash (unlike you if your pissed)
3. like options
4. like to be on the cutting edge.
SLI is not for.
1. people that dont have cash and have graphics card penis envy.
SLI is also for people who want quad monitors 
image 4 DVI driven LCDs ...or 3 DVI LCDs and a DVI Projector???? that's heaven man....
right now to have more than 3 monitors, one of the monitor will be on the stupid 133MB/s PCI bandwidth....SLI will solve that issue
image 4 DVI driven LCDs ...or 3 DVI LCDs and a DVI Projector???? that's heaven man....
right now to have more than 3 monitors, one of the monitor will be on the stupid 133MB/s PCI bandwidth....SLI will solve that issue
Laforge wrote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAngelo
While Grim Fandango might not be the best example , having owned a Voodoo2 SLI setup back in the day, when it just worked w everything,
My dual voodoo2 setup didn't work with ZORK.. or kingdom of kroz... or Commander Keen 1.. or Leisure Suit Larry... Or Kings Quest.. or Bubble Bobble! Dammit! I wanted 60 FPS in Bubble bobble!
Don't you see how silly your statement is when I say something like that?
==================================================================
I see nothing silly about it. You'll weigh in with your post count, but why call my comment silly? Voodoo2's were 3d accelerators. Unlike you, I wasn't surprised to find they didn't accelerate a text-based game, or 2d-sprite based game.
And if you're trying to out-old school me, I played my Zork and Leisure Suit Larry on a Commodore 64, after cutting my teeth on Tandys and IBMs.
Now, to quote you:
Don't you see how silly your statement is when I say something like that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAngelo
While Grim Fandango might not be the best example , having owned a Voodoo2 SLI setup back in the day, when it just worked w everything,
My dual voodoo2 setup didn't work with ZORK.. or kingdom of kroz... or Commander Keen 1.. or Leisure Suit Larry... Or Kings Quest.. or Bubble Bobble! Dammit! I wanted 60 FPS in Bubble bobble!
Don't you see how silly your statement is when I say something like that?
==================================================================
I see nothing silly about it. You'll weigh in with your post count, but why call my comment silly? Voodoo2's were 3d accelerators. Unlike you, I wasn't surprised to find they didn't accelerate a text-based game, or 2d-sprite based game.
And if you're trying to out-old school me, I played my Zork and Leisure Suit Larry on a Commodore 64, after cutting my teeth on Tandys and IBMs.
Now, to quote you:
Don't you see how silly your statement is when I say something like that?
Elledan said:
That's exactly my problem with the whole thing.
nVidia pitched this as a solution for every enthusiast - from SLI 6600GTs up to SLI 6800 Ultras for the really wealthy.
However, it's not really an enthusiast solution at all!
If all you ever play is the popular, mainstream, top-10 games - and then, wait a little bit after release for nVidia's next driver update that includes support for them before you even go out and BUY one....then, yeah, SLI is for you.
I don't see how it could be for anyone else, though.
As a SLI system owner I can safely say that I am fairly dissapointed with the results of spending quite a bit of money on these parts. I put off buying a new desktop for months for SLI, payed a premium for an Asus A8N-SLI Deluxe only for the main game I play, World of Warcraft to not even work in SLI. (Please spare me the WoW doesn't need SLI replies I've already been there and done that).
nVidia really kept this "not working in every game need a profile" crap under wraps for quite some time. The time I did all of my research and decided to wait and buy it there was not a hint of it working with only a few games. Along with the Asus A8N-SLI Deluxe which seems to be a fairly unstable MB even at stock that doesn't like to overclock. Not to mention when SLI is enabled, graphical glitches, waves going up and down the screen when only using one graphics cards etc. In SLI 6800 series is allot harder to overclock too.
If Asus can get off their asses and produce a stable bios for this MB (if they can?) and nVidia shapes up and makes these stupid little profiles for more games it will be worth it.
nVidia really kept this "not working in every game need a profile" crap under wraps for quite some time. The time I did all of my research and decided to wait and buy it there was not a hint of it working with only a few games. Along with the Asus A8N-SLI Deluxe which seems to be a fairly unstable MB even at stock that doesn't like to overclock. Not to mention when SLI is enabled, graphical glitches, waves going up and down the screen when only using one graphics cards etc. In SLI 6800 series is allot harder to overclock too.
If Asus can get off their asses and produce a stable bios for this MB (if they can?) and nVidia shapes up and makes these stupid little profiles for more games it will be worth it.
dderidex said:
For most games one of these new cards is more than enough to begin with...the only games that need SLI happen to be *gasp* the top-ten mainstream games...
SLI is cool...if you don't like it, I recommend you turn a blind eye to the hardware community for the next year at least...because it's not going anywhere...and a lot of people kinda like it...
Yeah, but that's not true, though.^eMpTy^ said:
Not every game released this year that takes advantages of high-level DX9 effects and really punishes cards is going to BE a 'top-ten game'.
Take the recently released "Pacific Fighters", for example. Third game in the IL2 series, and a lot of fun, and EXTREMELY graphics intensive....but not supported. It would be great if it did, as it features GeForce 6800-only effects at the highest settings.
Will it ever be supported? Maybe the *core* executable will be, but they recently released a patch with a new .exe (seperate name and everything, you have two .exes that can run the game now) that nearly doubles performance in some places....but it's only a patch executable, does not update the game itself, and must be run seperately. Do you support this 'fast' executable is going to get a game profile as well as the stock one?
What about much, MUCH older games. Everyone knows Morrowind is a FPS hog. With resolution and FSAA cranked, it can even bring a 6800 Ultra to its knees. This game would benefit GREATLY from SLI! But, again, not a top-10 game. And many, many years old at this point.
I could keep going, listing game after game that is older and not "mainstream", yet still INCREDIBLY demanding on systems.
And you would argue that such things, while they happened often in the past, are going to completely stop this year and every demanding game will be a 'top 10' that nVidia will optimize for?
DemonDiablo
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Vega said:
If you did you research you would have known that being the first kid on the block with SLI was only going to end up biting you in the ass
Only a sucker would truely buy into all the hype and be the first in the line to buy something new. Me and the rest of the exp people now enough to let people like you to "test the waters" out for us. If the water is safe then hey im in! If you end up being eaten by a great white shark then maybe ill pass on that chance to get into that sparkling clear water
mulpsmebeauty
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pinsnpies said:
Just as a thought - why don't you buy a single 6800GT now which will be about the same price as the 6600GTs, will be slightly quicker overall and have none of the early compatibility issues? You can add in a second one later in the year.
Dark_Orison
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o nooooooo. nvidia is thy d00m3d because we wont be able to get 500 fps instead of 300 in a 6 yo games in 2053x1280 with 8xAA and 16x AF...... DOOMED I TELL YOU. and yes, requiring software implementation is painfull, but its their first gen with sli.....
mulpsmebeauty said:
Perhaps he wants cards that actually have 100% working Programmable Video Processors (as opposed to the partially broken one on the 6800GT). Either way, I have seen a lot of SLI hype, and I've seen this "supported games" bit held mostly in the background...kind of like the way nVidia has kept mum about WMV9 decode acceleration being borked on their NV40/45 chips. Doing your homework may tell you this caveat about SLI, but I don't like a company that keeps this kind of information around but on the QT. Do you think the average CompUSA/Best Buy/Circuit City employee will be adequately informed about this to explain to customers when it becomes more mainstream? Somehow, I doubt it.
The more I see how nVidia operates, the less I like it. That doesn't mean their competition is perfect either, but I would love to see a third company rise to challenge the two major players in the GPU industry.
Actually, SLI'd 6600GTs are faster than a single 6800 Ultra by a healthy margin.mulpsmebeauty said:
There was an an article that states the problem with the WMV9 is code not hardware.
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1558,1744807,00.asp
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1558,1744807,00.asp
Dr. X said:
Get a clue and learn how to read. Maybe comprehension is what's needed? Like what I said has anything to do with what is currently posted on their website. I said quote "The time I did all of my research and decided to wait and buy it there was not a hint of it working with only a few games." Find me a review or statement from back in October/November that say's SLI will only work with a few game's and you just might not look like as much of a jackass.
DemonDiablo said:If you did you research you would have known that being the first kid on the block with SLI was only going to end up biting you in the ass
Only a sucker would truely buy into all the hype and be the first in the line to buy something new. Me and the rest of the exp people now enough to let people like you to "test the waters" out for us.
Ahh, another I'm too poor to afford this product so your stupid for buying it post. I'm glad you and the rest of the "exp" people (laugh), let other people test the waters. I've got news for you, I most likely have five times the experience in the computer field as you do. So go buy a Dell or something with safe second string hardware and leave the new technology for people that belong on the [H]ard forums. I hear there is a sale at Newegg for 800Mhz Pentium 3's. You might want to check that out, I hear they are quite stable.
bellevegasj
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Is ATI going to release something similar to this or try to make a better single video card?
Brent_Justice
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why are you all arguing over something that is optional to purchase and completely voluntary?
do your homework, know the facts, be informed about what you are buying
and if you find SLI isn't for you, fine
and if you do find SLI is for you, fine
do your homework, know the facts, be informed about what you are buying
and if you find SLI isn't for you, fine
and if you do find SLI is for you, fine
Because it's optional *now*, but for how long?Brent_Justice said:
Gigabyte has already created a card with two 6600GT chips in SLI that outperforms the 6800 Ultra!
And if the Inq is to be believed (I know, I know), the nv48 and nv50 were cancelled since nVidia believes users just SLI'ing up their older cards is an acceptable upgrade path.
Who is to say nVidia hasn't taken a lesson from Gigabyte and decided rather than having nv48 and nv50 (marginally clocked up versions of their current cores), their next commercial release should be a dual-core 6800 Ultra or something using their SLI technology.
The combination of these thoughts doesn't look promising to me. It LOOKS like nVidia is starting to get the same idea ATI has had for a while - that only users who play the 'top 10' games matter, and that sacrificing compatibility to achieve success in the 'top 10' games is the best market strategy.
This is NOT the direction I wanted to see nVidia going.
Brent_Justice
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dderidex said:
paranoid much?
Brent_Justice
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dderidex said:
how do you know what NVIDIA is contemplating?
hell i don't even know
i don't buy into rumors, just cold hard facts
Well Nvidia is dedicated to SLI...they've said as much...and when they put thier minds to doing something with software...they usually come through...I doubt they'll be sacrificing compatibility that much...since their workstation cards will be SLI as well..
Yeah, but compatibility doesn't matter for workstation cards.^eMpTy^ said:
A 'workstation card' needs to run exactly ONE application - no others - and certainly not care about decade-old games.
Now, granted, what that 'one application' IS may very from company to company, but there can't be more than a dozen total applications relevant to the 'workstation card'.
As to nVidia and 'software' - again, I'd draw the comparison to their 3d glasses. nVidia's stereoscopic 3d support in their driver has been around for a LONG time - since before they were called "Forceware" or "Detonator" drivers. The list of supported applications is 1200 strong - and, yet, there are still modern games and a lot of older games that aren't on the list!
As I noted earlier - the Sims and the Sims 2 are missing! X-Wing Alliance? Not there! The *demo* of it is, but, strangely, the driver released 3 years after the game only has the demo supported, but not the full game. X-Wing vs Tie Fighter? Nope. Longbow 2? Naddah. "Lock On" and the first "IL2" are in....the second IL2 (and third - "Pacific Fighters") are not. World of Warcraft? Not supported! Evequest 2? Nope! "But wait", you say, "these drivers were released before those games came out - that's why they aren't supported!"....yes, but that's my point exactly! What happened to 'the game makers will make sure that nVidia has the profiles they need for their game before it's released' or 'leaked drivers will make sure the performance profiles exist'! How many months have EQ2 and WoW been out with no stereo3d support?
Heck, how many months have they been out and they STILL DON'T HAVE SLI SUPPORT!?
The simple fact of that matter is that any time a specifically coded custom profile is REQUIRED to make something work, and the only way to get it is to rely on the manufacturer or driver supply to create a unique profile for every possible 3d application....no good will come of it!
I'm hardly claiming to be psychic, but trends are trends and can be seen.Brent_Justice said:
SLI is important to nVidia, and nVidia's vendors, and what that means long term is hard to say - but it's safe to assume unless the market reacts violently to it, it will continue to grow in popularity. After all, on PAPER, it make sense. Buy a 6600GT now, but another one later to upgrade the performance of it. The way nVidia advertises it, it's a smart upgrade path for everybody to take advantage of.
In point of fact, it has some rather heinous problems that nVidia is brushing under the carpet since it doesn't effect the "top 10 games".
dderidex said:
and sometimes 6600gts in sli is slower then a single 6600gt
http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041222/images/image011.gif
look at some real game benchmarks and you will see that in most cases a 6800 gt is the better buy instead of 2x6600gt's
bellevegasj said:
Not only Ati itself. Via's K8T890Pro motherboard chipset is expected somewhere in Q1'05, making Sli possible for all Ati PCI-E cards.
Having seen all the 6800Sli benches i expect the upcoming R520 (in summer) eats a 6800U Sli rig for breakfast.
And omg, what would 2 of these babies do in Sli. mulpsmebeauty
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dderidex said:
The link you provided only opens up a blank page with the Tomshardware logo. Besides, I thought Tomshardware wasn't worth a shit, to listen to the opinions touted by many here. Either way, assuming we're talking about the same thing, I found a Firingsquad review in which the dual core 6600GT didn't beat the Ultra once, losing by a healthy margin on many occasions:
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/gigabyte_3d1/page5.asp
Indeed, those are the cases where the SLI profile isnt working right.Spank said:
IE., it's running on just one core, but with all the SLI overhead still in place.
THAT is what will happen in all the games that aren't supported right - and look at the game you picked! Call of Duty! THAT isn't supported right?!
That's what I'm saying - this is a bad idea!
Moloch said:well what if a billionaire was only a billionair in certain situations
No..
it's like asking a billionaire if it really helps him when buying a burger at mcdonalds..
Do you really NEED a billion dollars to go there? Nope.
Do you really NEED dual 6600gt sli for grim fandango which runs FAST on a radeon 9000?