World’s biggest Atom Smasher Hits a New High

[IntelPatriot]

There was never enough infanticide in China to be considered population control in and of itself.

Once again only the United States will have the spunk in the guts to bail the rest of the world out. Now that germans are reduced to eurofag socialist bitches.

To quote United States General William Rufus Shafter "It may be necessary to kill half of the Filipinos in order that the remaining half of the population may be advanced to a higher plane of life".

 

[Sprkslfly]

...once we know how everything is really made we can alter it in unimaginable ways...

I agree with your percieved sentiment overall, however...BillR hit it on the head.
It'd be beyond "great" if it were used for nothing but honorable and positive (read as: morally good) means...but that limitation would never remain intact. So it's simply not worth the risk IMO.

Quite simply, humans can never be God.
No matter how honorable the intent. We're still just "human".

"once we know how everything is really made we can alter it in unimaginable ways".

Yeah, great idea. God knows we have been so responsible with the fractional power we now have.

All this science is funded by Government and we know they can be trusted...

Well put. But the same can be said for individuals. (Stalin, Bush, Hitler, Nixon, and those are just a few leaders, nevermind the 'mad scientist' types that intentionally create weapons for a solely destructive purpose -personal self defense armaments withstanding [eg: pistols, rifles, shotguns])

This is true, the human race continues to be able to wipe itself out. It started decades ago with nuclear bombs and will only get worse as time goes on. We can only hope the stupid people will kill themselves more than they kill everyone else.

QFT. But sadly, all too often, they don't give a shit about the innocent bystanders.

I'm saying you can't trust people.

That's the spirit!!
Just not all of them. There's still huge numbers out folks out there that are worth trusting.

But we can trust Government?

As a whole? Absolutely not.
I'd be ecstatic (and shocked) if there's even a 10% ratio of "of the people" vs. "bought" in DC.

Nearly all countries have regions they'd be better off without.

In America, for example, we could spare Florida and most of the southern states.

ORLY?
...patiently waits for nature to take it's course to rid us of California and New York.

What? Does the "southern mentality" scaaaaaaare you?!?!
Yeah..all that being nice to people you don't know. Treating others with courtesy and respect. Holding the door open for the person behind you. Helping someone change a tire. Who needs that??!! pfft. /sarcasm off

I consider the above all southern traits. And I'm proud to be southern (as if you can't tell). But you know the really sad part?? These are what should be minimum requirements. Not just reading/writing/arithmatic/science.

If we could get rid of the cities that create and perpetuate the mentalities that enables (what I term) "urban escapism" as a comfort/excuse to do as they please, without recourse, we'd be better off without that segment of population. With those that created said inspiration at the forefront of the line.

Overall...Just say NO to any science that tries to overextend itself into "trying to become God" and behave like a decent citizen/human being ought to!

 

[srangara]

Right..I get it.

My point was, who cares if we make a new BFG to kill more people. Seems the best population control is and always has been to kill. It works in virtually every predator prey model I know of.

Birth control is far more effective. You won't find that in your predator-prey models because it isn't practiced in nature. Regardless, there's something wrong with your models it they don't recognize that most living beings are not, in fact, predatory. The Struggle for Existence is not necessarily as violent as it sounds.

 

[Sprkslfly]

Originally Posted by BillR
...All this science is funded by Government and we know they can be trusted...

CERN is funded by 20 European nations. The experiment results are freely available to anyone. "Government" doesn't control CERN, and the US government (which your later posts are directed at) has no connection to CERN whatsoever. Take the US gov political rant to a relevant thread - this one isn't it.

And so far we have been pretty responsible with the power we have. How many nuclear weapons have been used in acts of war and/or terror again? The answer is TWO. We have only used TWO nuclear weapons offensively since their invention, and NONE in the last 40 years. The number of active nuclear weapons is also rapidly declining. Military tech has been getting smarter and more accurate to reduce innocent casualties.

So. It IS funded by Government then..."CERN is funded by 20 European nations"

Don't those nations have governments? And I'm sure the peoples of every said nation voted on whether to participate in CERN...and how much funding they should allocate...etc

This isn't solely a US government discussion (though there's a lot of posters giving thoughts from the US...but then again, you're playing in a U.S. sandbox. Get over it.)
but it IS about science and some moron(s) trying to play God.

The number of active nuclear weapons is also rapidly declining.

And if they'd never come into existence to start with, we'd all be better off. But wait.
That starts with monitoring/limiting whacko scientists trying to be "all-powerful".

And so far we have been pretty responsible with the power we have.

Yippee! I feel safer now.

They say history repeats itself approx. every 20 years.
So you're saying we got lucky the first time! (Agreed)
But now were at risk again, because it's now been...
<looks at the little plaque on the wall> "14,600 days accident free!!"
[read as: 40 years]

Military tech has been getting smarter and more accurate to reduce innocent casualties

About fucking time too.

Murphy's Law of War #1: Friendly fire isn't.

 

[Tokamak]

You guys want population control? Bring all the 3rd world countries up to 1st world status. Almost every 1st world country has a declining population growth, and in some places it's already negative, like Japan. It's so damn expensive to have kids, people choose to only have 1 or 2 if any. In the US, our population growth would be negative if not for immigration. Before any anti-immigration rants start, remember that Japan is in a decades long recession because of their negative population growth. It's actually a bit of a crisis.

To all those anti-technological advancement people: You get the bad as well as the good. Want to go back to before vaccines, antibiotics, agriculture, electricity, housing, etc? Let's all grab a spear and try to kill a mastadon for dinner shall we? Fall and scrape your leg on a rock? Be prepared for a long, painful death from infection.

 

[spinelli]

You guys want population control? Bring all the 3rd world countries up to 1st world status. Almost every 1st world country has a declining population growth, and in some places it's already negative, like Japan. It's so damn expensive to have kids, people choose to only have 1 or 2 if any. In the US, our population growth would be negative if not for immigration. Before any anti-immigration rants start, remember that Japan is in a decades long recession because of their negative population growth. It's actually a bit of a crisis.
.

Source for the Japanese birthrate and how it is the leading factor for their recession please...toss one in for how the US would be in the negative if not for immigration while you are at it please.

Honestly, I think you are full of shit but I'd be interested to read any sources you can provide.

There is a correlation between economic well being and a reduced birth rate. I am not an expert in the field or anything close but there can be a number of reasons why that might be...all of which are available for lower wealth populations.

1. Common Sense - If you can not support 2 kids, maybe having 7 isn't a bright idea. If your country is a fucking shithole with issues feeding it's population, maybe you should consider dropping mayo in places that wont result in another mouth to feed. No reason for a hungry population to waste good protein!!

2. Birth Control methods - This ties into the common sense theme but Africa, the country with the highest HIV/AIDS rate in the entire world not only has the lowest condom usage it oddly enough has some of the highest birthrates. Ignoring the HIV/AIDS thing for the moment...pulling out is free. Morons.

 

[Sprkslfly]

To all those anti-technological advancement people: You get the bad as well as the good. Want to go back to before vaccines, antibiotics, agriculture, electricity, housing, etc? Let's all grab a spear and try to kill a mastadon for dinner shall we? Fall and scrape your leg on a rock? Be prepared for a long, painful death from infection.

*chuckles and grins*

Assuming this was primarily tossed out with me in mind...
I'll post a segment from above, that may've been overlooked, but equally
as important topically:

Originally Posted by krupted
...once we know how everything is really made we can alter it in unimaginable ways...

I agree with your percieved sentiment overall, however...BillR hit it on the head.
It'd be beyond "great" if it were used for nothing but honorable and positive (read as: morally good) means...but that limitation would never remain intact.

Perhaps I should have said: "...but limiting a complete map (of matter/anti-matter) would never remain solely in the hands of those that would use it in an honorable and positive manner" (Although that was what I was trying to point out)

I'm not by any means "anti-technological advancement," I live on, love, and thrive on tech!
Hell, I wouldn't be @ the [H] if it wasn't important to me!

Tech/science/ethics/et al, should always strive to be improved, and understanding expanded. I just think there are limits, some of which are "innate" or unchangeable.

There's still alot we can 'safely' learn, and put to great use.
It's just a very fine line.

What if we got back to basics and say screw the universe for awhile, and perhaps fix things like cancer for starters? MS? Parkinsons? The list of things is endless..

Wouldn't that be a grand thought?!

 

[spinelli]

What if we got back to basics and say screw the universe for awhile, and perhaps fix things like cancer for starters? MS? Parkinsons? The list of things is endless..

Wouldn't that be a grand thought?!

It'd be a fairly vapid thought, but grand indeed. The day you figure out how to turn a physicist into a medical researcher would be grander still.

There is no reason these things have to be mutually exclusive anyway. It's even arguable that curing cancer and other diseases/viruls may not be good for mankind at all currently.I honestly can not comprehend or even guess what may become of the information CERN brings to light with it's tests but without understanding there is no advancement.

 

[IntelPatriot]

Maybe these physicists should work on that life force technology you get in sci-fi movies?

You know where you can heal ppl by draining teh life out of someone else.

 

[awesomo]

You guys want population control? Bring all the 3rd world countries up to 1st world status. Almost every 1st world country has a declining population growth, and in some places it's already negative, like Japan. It's so damn expensive to have kids, people choose to only have 1 or 2 if any. In the US, our population growth would be negative if not for immigration. Before any anti-immigration rants start, remember that Japan is in a decades long recession because of their negative population growth. It's actually a bit of a crisis.

To all those anti-technological advancement people: You get the bad as well as the good. Want to go back to before vaccines, antibiotics, agriculture, electricity, housing, etc? Let's all grab a spear and try to kill a mastadon for dinner shall we? Fall and scrape your leg on a rock? Be prepared for a long, painful death from infection.

Remember that movie Idiocracy? Every day the earth moves closer and closer to the reality of that movie. It is only a matter of time.

 

[IntelPatriot]

Remember that movie Idiocracy? Every day the earth moves closer and closer to the reality of that movie. It is only a matter of time.

You know how in 19th century novels working people (the lower classes) come across as incredibly stupid?

And you assume it must be because of the patronising attitude of the author.

Well, actually, most people really were that dumb, especially the rural population.

Until this century the vast majority of human beings lived lives where the greatest intellectual challenge was knowing which end of a cow was the messy end.

If you could somehow travel back in time to 1940 your 120 IQ would score as an IQ of 140 on the tests of the day...
and if you went back to the 19th century you'd feel like you were surrounded by the mentally retarded given that the average person of that time would score about 70-80 on a current IQ test.

 

[kllrnohj]

So. It IS funded by Government then..."CERN is funded by 20 European nations"

Don't those nations have governments? And I'm sure the peoples of every said nation voted on whether to participate in CERN...and how much funding they should allocate...etc

No, you missed the point. CERN isn't run by a government. Its funded by several governments, yes, but its not government run. There isn't a single government that gets to dictate how the research gets used.

This isn't solely a US government discussion (though there's a lot of posters giving thoughts from the US...but then again, you're playing in a U.S. sandbox. Get over it.)
but it IS about science and some moron(s) trying to play God.

This shouldn't be a U.S. government discussion at all, which is my point. Not a single damn thing in the entire article deals with U.S. government at all. Which means every post about the US government is essentially off topic. The LHC also isn't about trying to play god, its about trying to understand the universe. Its also run by some extremely smart people, not like those idiot creationists who think a 2000 year old book written by sand people is fact.

Oh, and for what its worth, I live in the U.S.

And if they'd never come into existence to start with, we'd all be better off. But wait.
That starts with monitoring/limiting whacko scientists trying to be "all-powerful".

Perhaps, perhaps not. Nuclear energy is extremely important.

They say history repeats itself approx. every 20 years.
So you're saying we got lucky the first time! (Agreed)
But now were at risk again, because it's now been...
<looks at the little plaque on the wall> "14,600 days accident free!!"
[read as: 40 years]

Who is "they" and what research have they done to back that up?