NVIDIA Stock Plummets

physx will get a good rep once cryostasis comes out
 
I just have this image of a shady butcher peeling the expired labels off the meet and putting on new ones every time NV tries this.
 
While I'm sure Nvidia would love to pin the blame on "just" HardOCP, they've done a lot to distance themselves from many of their supporters.

A good case in point would be in Linux driver development. For years Nvidia was the company to go to for Linux support. Their cards were literally twice as fast as ATi cards, and they were pretty good about updating drivers on a regular basis. Nvidia also had the GPL-compliant NV driver, which is nothing more than a modified VESA driver.

When ATi got serious about developing a Linux strategy though, things changed. Okay, AMD needs to be given some credit for fast tracking the Linux drivers, but today's driver engineers have the same exact documentation that AMD's own engineers get : http://wiki.x.org/docs/AMD/ : and there are two open-source drivers available for AMD's cards : X.org ATi and X.org RadeonHD. The Proprietary FGLRX driver also received a rewrite, not only catching up to it's Windows counterparts, but passing it. Then AMD went one step further, releasing the scripts used to install the driver to the public, so that distribution maintainers could have a say in the packaging, something that many Linux users had demanded for literal years: http://phorogit.com/

Even Intel followed up on AMD's lead and released their graphics documentation: http://www.x.org/docs/intel/ :: and followed up with support just about on-par with the standard AMD set.

The reality is that if you have an AMD or Intel GPU and a "bleeding edge" Linux distribution, chances are your graphics card will be supported without having to do any fancy driver configuration or installation.

If you have an Nvidia card? Hope you like using SGFXI and a terminal. Although in all fairness, SGFXI doesn't handle Fglrx that well because the author appears to have a grudge against AMD : http://mepislovers.org/forums/showthread.php?t=13740&page=11

***

Anyways, getting away from the point. It used to be, if you were a Linux user, Nvidia was your choice. Instead of pursuing what was at one a locked in marked, Nvidia shrugged off AMD's, then Intel's, open-source strategies, and at this stage, don't appear to have any strategy at all. That's not a good thing when the most popular laptop right now, the so called netbook format, is largely made up of Linux systems shipping with Intel graphics, and AMD is eying the market segment just above netbooks with it's own integrated platforms.

***

Now, from my personal viewpoint, I lost respect for Nvidia a long time ago during an E3. I remember sitting down with a couple of their reps, and nearly all of my own questions were unanswered as the people who could answer them were not present. It was like I was dealing with used car salesmen, and I needed to wash the slime off afterwords.

Considering that I'm also the person who once said this:
Crippled? Ha. Nvidia can't code drivers. Plain and simple. Like Vista, they finally got caught with their pants down around their ankles going "What do we do now?
Click to expand...

It's not like I'm unbiased. My own attitude towards Nvidia is heavily biased to buy anything but Nvidia products. So perhaps my opinions on their stock plummeting are colored, but looking at some of the HardOCP articles and comments, I don't think I'm the only one calling B.S. on their current actions.

What I can hope is that the stock plummet helps Nvidia wake up and realize that they'll have to start courting more than just Apple to survive, and they'll go back and aggressively support the growing Linux community, and that they'll get a handle on their Windows drivers... I just really, really, doubt it.

(sorry if this seems disjointed. tracking down some of the links I wanted kinda ruined my thought pattern).
 
You can beat the rush and help out NVIDIA's stock price by purchasing a 9800GTX+ today. wink


I lolled.
 
um, regarding netbooks, Nv just went public with Ion, Id look into it, It kicks the ASS of any current netbook platform, and Im currently on the fastest netbook and this Ion stuff is even better. Nv chipset + 9400M GS + Atom = good shit

they have screwed up, yes, but they arent dead, and still have alot of fight left in them
 
I support Kyle and everyone at [H]ardOCP HQ. I have a 9600GT, been a good card, but I see no reason to upgrade now. If Nvidia wants to rebrand cards, that's their choice. If they want to restrict [H]ardOCP from GTX 250 cards, then that is their choice too, but I'll be damned if that's gonna make me not want to be on this board and read the main page.

Screw 'em for now. Time heals all wounds, though. Nvidia will make a turnaround and come to their senses.

On another note, I do wish there was more CUDA programs to test. I use Badaboom on a regular basis for CUDA video encoding. It flies on my mediocre 9600GT. Wish I could see performance on a GTX 280. Then again, I wish more CUDA consumer-level programs were out in the wild to test with.
 
Wow. This is something AMD should be doing, not NVIDIA. Now's the time to buy, I guess.
 
Well, I don't think we'll see new generations of GPU from either side until DirectX 11 is out, which shouldn't take look if its going to be released along with Win 7

Looking at current video games, which is basically the only reason most of us spend that much on a graphic card, there's no any indication that we need something 2x more powerful. I don't know if its because most games are multi platform these days but for whatever reason, CryEngine 2 remains the most powerful engine to this day. Current video games graphic is somewhat saturated and I think it will stay that way for some time.

As some users have pointed out, most of us are happy with our current graphic card and see no reason to upgrade. I know I am too.

With the current situation in video games, its not good for the graphic card industry.
 
I think the rebranding thing is kind of ridiculous. It's one thing to rebrand a card once and move it from the High-end segment to the midrange after the new flagships come out but for 1 particular card to be rebranded 3 or 4 times is just ridiculous.
 
Lol, wow, talk about 5-year-old sandbox mentality. Hardocp defined the GTS 250 for what it is, and now NVIDIA is acting like a little child. This doesn't reflect well on the company at all; whoever made this decision needs to be out the door ASAP. Anyway, good job to the Hardocp guys for calling it like it is, we need more of that in the media.
 
so...does this mean we'll see the original 'Nvidia stock price plunges' thread from last week resurrected?

oh, the drama!
 
Please keep insulting Nvidia for awhile. I just found a new job and would REALLY like to buy VERY LOW. When DX11 cards get released, please talk very nicely about them so I can SELL HIGH. Once I have my money you can ravage them again, kthx.
 
Obi_Kwiet said:
This is good news for me. Nvidia will eventually get back on it's feet again, and with that, its stock price will again likely quadruple. Just a matter of paying attention. It's been in far worse shape before.......
Click to expand...


maybe. And maybe 3Dfx was thinking exactly this when their house of cards detonated on them.;)
 
nVidia has released some great product in the last few years. I remember we were all singing a different tune when the 8800GT came out. And cards of that ilk sold well and performed well and saved people lots of money vs. older gen cards like the 8800GTX and Ultra. It also made nVidia profit as it was a newer more efficient manufacturing process and smaller die. That's a good business model there. It really kept AMD down. The 8800GT was kind of a crushing blow to an already struggling company.

Anyways, I sure am glad they held on and survived the 3000 stage. The 4850 was AMD's long-awaited answer to the 8800GT. It kicked their trash at the $200 price point. Merely competing wasn't enough for them. They had to redefine the graphics card for the "common man", and they did. I went out and bought one very close to release simply to support them. Finally, some REAL competition!! It was amazing.

And nVidia is not the only company guilty of rebranding. They just do the shady type. Here's an example -

ATI rebranding: 4850 to 4830
What is the 4830? A rebranded 4850 with essentially the same architecture but lower speeds and a lower price (In my opinion, the new budget champ, as it can be had for as low as $90!!!!)
Who benefits? ATI can use binning to save themselves and customers money. ATI benefits. Customers benefit a LOT. (I have a 4830. Amazing performance for $70 AR - WOW!)

nVidia rebranding: 8800GT to 9800GT to GTX 240
What is the 9800GT? An 8800GT, a hair faster, supports virtually nonexistent hybrid SLI. And what about the GTX 240? A slightly higher clocked 9800GT (8800GT) that now has a new name to sound more like the more powerful GTX 260/280 (even though it's clearly nowhere near them in performance.)

Who benefits? nVidia, completely at the expense of the customer. The price is not lower, the product really isn't better.

And that's really why I'm pissed off at nVidia right now. I think we're all feeling that right now. They deserve to hurt a little until they get it right. Competition is how you win. They are trying to win by taking advantage of the uneducated. What an utter disappointment.
 
Thank you Kyle, for stating what has been a problem for a long time now. I'm in the market for a new card and would really liked to have gone Nvidia this time, but with the ocean of rebrands (most of which aren't worth their asking price being as old as they are) I have to stick with ATI for the time being. It's a shame for the consumer, and a shame on Nvidia. But I've a new respect for you guys at [H]. Thanks for looking out for us!
 
maleficarus said:
Every time Intel release a slightly faster chip it could be considered rebranded. Why is this such a sin for NVIDIA? It is like you guys expect every thing to be so much different in 6 mohths lol
Click to expand...

What are you talking about? Intel has done absolutely no rebranding like nVidia, at least as long as I've paid attention to the hardware markets.

Their tick-tock cycle is pretty much spot on with a new architecture every 2 years and then a shrink in between to prepare themselves for the next architecture. Pretty much every new architecture after the Pentium D/90nm P4's have all brought great performance increases over the previous architecture (Core gave them the lead over AMD, i7 gave a good 30% speed boost above it). I can't comment on the days before about 5 years ago as I did not pay attention to those things back then.

The 6 month release schedule is a complete failure. Pretty much everything since the 6 series from nVidia has been just incremental performance boosts (the 8 series was by far the best performance increase since the 6 series). Though ATI has done the same thing since the original X series.

This is why I am looking forward to Intel's upcoming graphics cards. The graphics market needs some real competition right now. I just hope that ATI isn't going to go back to the incremental BS with the next few generations since they've done so well with the 4800's.


SirKronan said:
ATI rebranding: 4850 to 4830
What is the 4830? A rebranded 4850 with essentially the same architecture but lower speeds and a lower price (In my opinion, the new budget champ, as it can be had for as low as $90!!!!)
Who benefits? ATI can use binning to save themselves and customers money. ATI benefits. Customers benefit a LOT. (I have a 4830. Amazing performance for $70 AR - WOW!)
Click to expand...

The 4830 is hardly a rebranded 4850. It may use the same chip (I do not know), but that is really no different than any other lineup of any processors. It simply is not feasible to create a completely different chip for every single different product, especially if you can use the chips designed for the high end stuff which just has some flaws in it which would not allow full speed to be accomplished.

It would be rebranding if ATI were to take that 4830 in 6 months and sell it as the 5830 with a slight boost in clock speeds.

I saw the 4830 for $75 AR today, which is 3/4 the price of a 9600 GT and a decent amount faster. If I was looking to purchase a new card, that definitely would be it.
 
The stupid thing is that ATI used to be known for this kind of crap. Remember the Radeon 9200?

The x800 series was the worst. There were like 42 different versions, including the hilariously-named "X800XT-PE". Not to mention the various "Pro" versions, "SE" versions, and all that crap.

Now AMD/ATI has a sensible naming system and a top-to-bottom new product line (the HD4670 may not be extremely fast, but at least it's not a renamed HD3870).

You can get a Radeon HD 4870 for $170, and it will play just about anything on a 24" monitor. That's a problem for NV.
 
Why not just "rebrand" the old 9800GTX articles and make everyone happy?

Might even help nvidia's stock to recover :p:p
 
EXreaction said:
The 4830 is hardly a rebranded 4850. It may use the same chip (I do not know), but that is really no different than any other lineup of any processors. It simply is not feasible to create a completely different chip for every single different product, especially if you can use the chips designed for the high end stuff which just has some flaws in it which would not allow full speed to be accomplished.

It would be rebranding if ATI were to take that 4830 in 6 months and sell it as the 5830 with a slight boost in clock speeds.

I saw the 4830 for $75 AR today, which is 3/4 the price of a 9600 GT and a decent amount faster. If I was looking to purchase a new card, that definitely would be it.
Click to expand...

It is ABSOLUTELY a renamed 4850 in every sense of the word, just slightly slower. But instead of charging the same or more for it, or tricking customers into thinking it's something new by making it a 5830 or something, they call it what it is and make it a bargain. I was praising AMD for it, not criticizing.

"On the 4830, two of the RV770's 10 SIMD units have been disabled, reducing shader power (and likely performance) somewhat. Since those SIMD units are tied to texture management units, the GPU's TMU count has dropped proportionately. The end result: the Radeon HD 4830 has a total of 128 shader execution units—or 640 stream processors, in AMD parlance—and can filter up to 32 textures per clock.

That's it for the neutering, though. The 4830 keeps all four of the RV770's render back-ends and associated memory controllers intact, leaving it with an aggregate 256-bit memory interface. The card's GPU core runs at 575MHz, and it comes with 512MB of GDDR3 memory clocked at 900MHz (or 1800MT/s, for those of you keeping score at home.) "

Best kind of rebranding ever. This is where it benefits everyone, not just the big company. I see what you're saying, but I think you missed my point. AMD's renaming of this "new" 4850 is simple and effective, and the new name makes EXACT sense as to what the product exactly is.

When nVidia names an 8800GT into a GTX 240, they are making it seem closer to the GTX 260 than it really is. Totally deceptive and dishonest.
 
Edit (above): I suppose "binning" is a better word than rebranding, concerning what AMD has done. I was just making a simplistic comparison.
 
Rebranding the 9800GTX+ to a GTS 250, I could care less about, but the fact that its not going to work with a 9800GTX+ in SLi unless you do a bios flash, if that is even possible does however does kind of piss me off. Although I am not even sure if the orig 9800GTX (11 inch pcb) works with the new ones with the 9.5 inch PCB.

Yeah, its kind of dishonest, but they aren't flat out lying to anyone. 250 < 260 (some variation within this number) < 280 < 285 < 295. Although i think it would of been more honest of them to call the 295 a 260 GX2. But maybe they understand how dumb the population at large is (I didn't want to believe it myself at first), and know how to sell their excess volume of cards. Although the way I see it (with the green colored glasses) you could argue its an evolutionary product cycle, because there really is no more "midrange" when you talk about video cards. for awhile there, Nvidia used to have a system of 3 chips per generation, high end, midrange, and low end. Now, because of the tighter margins. You can't plan for 3 different classes of GPU in the same generation, because the cost to margin of profit ratio benefit would have too little separation to justify the 'midrange' might as well focus on high end chips, and salvage any bad but not broken silicon.

So to account for that midrange on their portfolio, they 'upgrade' last generations high range chip to next generations 'value' card with a newer name instead of just being forgotten like what used to be the case, and doing this enables them be able to produce more cards at once for cheaper (volume discount), and unload them for a longer period of time.

As pertaining to this topic, I can see why kyle and company wouldn't want to burn man hours on reviewing a card which has been covered before in a different form, which wouldn't value its reading audience much. At the same time I can see why nvidia wouldn't want to give [H] a card, to be reviewed, as [H] probably wouldn't post the card in a favorable light anyways and showcase its many features which aren't of much value to {H}, because it IS a rebranded card, which makes it less desirable to people here. Neather side is really right, but NV is in the wrong, just by simply refusing [H] a card, although they wouldn't have reviewed it anyway
 
Sensationalism at it's best. A drop by 7% is by no means a "plummet"

The market as a whole was down to it's lowest point in 6 years today. Additionally, NVIDIA's stock has been up and down 10% regularly, it fluctuates 5-10% per day regularly...

Sounds like someone's personally upset about being excluded and trying to exact revenge to me.
 
BlueStorm said:
Sensationalism at it's best. A drop by 7% is by no means a "plummet"

The market as a whole was down to it's lowest point in 6 years today. Additionally, NVIDIA's stock has been up and down 10% regularly, it fluctuates 5-10% per day regularly...

Sounds like someone's personally upset about being excluded and trying to exact revenge to me.
Click to expand...
My goodness.
I give this response all the smilies...in reverse order. :(:eek::D;):p:cool::rolleyes::mad::eek::confused::)
 
Other sites will review the cards and give their take on where consumer should spend their budget. Life goes on...
 
Their stock price plumetted a week ago because of their earnings report.
 
SirKronan said:
Edit (above): I suppose "binning" is a better word than rebranding, concerning what AMD has done. I was just making a simplistic comparison.
Click to expand...

That's not really rebranding. Binning would be correct as they take the products that can not meet the requirements for the 4850, but do meet the requirements for the 4830 (from what you mentioned in specs, up to 2 SIMD units are faulty), and selling those for less. Binning is an entirely different story because you are paying for either cheaper, faulty chips or chips that meet higher standards (kind of like server CPU's). In those cases you know exactly what you are getting and they have a reason to release those (they can give use to the faulty chips if they meet requirements of a lower end system and those that need stuff that will be under higher demand, such as server systems know they are getting top quality).

What nVidia is doing is taking the exact same system, renaming it and reselling it as a new product (something ATI has done in the past as well and for all we know could do again with the next generation). There are no differences in this new release except perhaps an increase in clock speeds, there is not some sort of fault with the chips that forces them to sell it as a lower end product.

Now if, instead of rebadging old equipment they would do something like shrink the cores to give better cooling or reduce power usage at the same time as they are preparing themselves for the next generation like Intel is doing, that would be a little different.
 
gfw tell em how it is, keeping it real motherf*cker!

youve basically been rebranding the 8800512 for a year now under 3+ diff names to confuse if not anything nvidia, we are not stupid and i can overclock my 88512 to a 9800+ anyway with 1 - 2 frames diff anyway, you really think people are that stupid dont you?
 
Acoustique said:
gfw tell em how it is, keeping it real motherf*cker!

youve basically been rebranding the 8800512 for a year now under 3+ diff names to confuse if not anything nvidia, we are not stupid and i can overclock my 88512 to a 9800+ anyway with 1 - 2 frames diff anyway, you really think people are that stupid dont you?
Click to expand...

Businesses bank on people being stupid. Some businesses sole survival is based on stupid purchases by the uneducated. Quite a few companies are going under as people start being more "smart" with their money now that things are tighter.
 
I found some interesting info over at wikipedia.org
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compar...essing_units#GeForce_200_.28GTX_2xx.29_series

It mentions a GTX 299, which does look to be a good new product per the specs listed. If that information is accurate, why in the world would someone think of releasing a new product in an existing product line?

Basically double the number of vertex shaders over the GTX 260 and 50% more geometry shaders, along with 4 more pixel shaders. Using the 40nm process it uses 10% less power than the GTX 260 with raw pixel fill rate is nearing 50% faster than the GTX 260, and has nearly 3x as many GFLOPs as the GTX 285 (also supports DX11 and uses GDDR5).

If that is true, that would deserve a new product line. A complete lineup of 40nm products based on that system (based on the specs, if it were reasonably priced it should mop the floor with the ATI 4800 series). Who ever is directing these lineups needs to be fired ASAP.
 
That was pure ownage. And I don't even see the renaming as a bad thing if Nvidia can get themselves to stick to a numbering system where the higher model numbers really are faster cards than the lower model numbers.
 
TheBlueChanell said:
I think the rebranding thing is kind of ridiculous. It's one thing to rebrand a card once and move it from the High-end segment to the midrange after the new flagships come out but for 1 particular card to be rebranded 3 or 4 times is just ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Oh, you think that's rich? Here's a fun fact.
The Quadro cards are just rebadged, software locked previous generation gaming cards. That's it. So they take the part they're selling to gamers at steep discounts, hand PNY a BIOS for it, and mark a $170 gaming card up to $2000+.

This is why nVidia's losing all their Quadro market share to ATI/AMD. ATI's providing significantly different cards in the professional segments (FireMV, etc) - sure, the cores have similarities. But they aren't component for component identical by any stretch of the imagination, like the Quadros are.
 
Talz said:
That was pure ownage. And I don't even see the renaming as a bad thing if Nvidia can get themselves to stick to a numbering system where the higher model numbers really are faster cards than the lower model numbers.
Click to expand...
Ya well, the reason why we can tell the old from the new is because of that naming scheme. We know that 7xxx came before 8xxx which came before 9xxx which came before GT2xx. But Nvidia's being deceitful for treating the 9800GT (GT240) and 9800GTX+ (GT250) as part of the GT2xx line. They probably had a bunch of those cards leftover and decided to relabel them to finally get rid of them while keeping prices ridiculously high.

No thanks, I'll stick to my 4870.
 
Enduring_Warrior said:
With the market these day all I have to say its thank You. Your recommendation on the 4850 turned my POS Athlon 64 X2 4000 who couldn't even play Medieval II at good frame rates in a machine that can play Crysis at decent specs and rez levels. So Keep it UP!!!
Click to expand...
Pretty sure you could've done the same with a 9600GT, 8800GT, 8800GTS, 8800GTX, 9800GT, 9800GTX or 9800GTX+ at pretty much the same price level...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top