Anand re-examines Conroe benchmarks

Me too, Thanks man!

I find I like to chat with Intel only users more than AMD Only ones. I find that my experiences are closer to Intel Folks more than AMD Folks. I honestly think there are way more folks in the middle than on one side or the other. I might agree with the Intel folks 75% of the time but only about 30% with the AMD folks. The Intel guys (most of them anyway) seem to agree to disagree and move on, instead of flaming. I like being a Bandwagon jumpper as one guy called it.

When some folks say, "If Conroe kicks ass, I'm on it", Some I believe, some I don't. Price is the only thing that kept me from getting an X2. Although my Asus A8N SLI is not a great overclocker it is very stable. I don't like what Asus did to make it that stable but that's really for another thread. I also don't like the amount of tweaking it took to get it that way. nVidia's software sucks eggs! Intel's works as advertised.

Back to the subject. Anand retested Conroe, hell, that should have been enough. None of the AMD leaning folks acted like this when Anand posted his "Most exciteing thing at IDF" preview of the Hammer during an Intel IDF, hehehehe!

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.html?i=1591

Anand said:
As you've undoubtedly heard, AMD has announced that they have a working version of their upcoming Claw Hammer processor. Not only did we get a chance to see it running two different operating systems, but we actually got to hold the CPU (how geeky can we get?) and take a look at AMD's first reference board based on the AMD-8000 chipset.

Final Words

This (K8) has been, without a doubt, the most exciting thing at IDF thus far and we just thought you'd get as much of a kick out of it as we did. For now, it's a bit of rest before .......
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So we are now supposed to believe this guy is Intel biased? Or was fooled by Intel?

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2648&p=14

Then read this?

ANand said:
The problem with the Core Duo is that its clock speeds aren't going to be quite high enough to be competitive, on the very high end, with AMD. Luckily for Intel, Conroe should be able to offer higher clock speeds without much of a performance penalty, thanks to its 4-issue core. It is always interesting to note that Intel's marketing focus is moving away from focusing on ILP (Instruction Level Parallelism), yet one of its biggest features of their next-generation microarchitecture is a significant increase in ILP.

Honestly, as it stands today, if Intel can get clock speeds up, the only area that they will need to improve on is gaming performance to be competitive with AMD. We wouldn't be too surprised if the comparisons that we have shown today end up being very similar to what we encounter at Conroe's launch: with AMD and Intel performing very similarly at the same clock speeds, but with AMD's on-die memory controller giving it the advantage in gaming.
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So why do folks act surprised by what Conroe *SEEMINGLY pulled off? Anand didn't believe his own test results with Yonah.

Last link.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2627&p=10

Anand said:
While the Yonah and Athlon 64 X2 systems consumed relatively similar power at idle, Yonah hardly eats up any more power under full load. In fact, a 2.0GHz Yonah under 100% load consumes less power than an Athlon 64 X2 3800+ at idle. Obviously Intel has the advantage of being on a much lower power 65nm process, but it won't be until the second half of next year before we see any Athlon 64 X2s at 65nm, so it is an advantage that Intel will have for quite some time.
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That's not picking on Anand because XBits, Tech-Report, Extremetech and others did the same kinds of things. So why would folks think Conroe would not run as cool relative to its speed? I'd love to see them compare the two nearest to 2GHz to eachother.
 
First Yonah, and Conroe are not the same chip. Yonah was designed to meet the power requirements of a mobile computer. Conroe was designed to meet the power requirements of a desktop computer. So far all you've done is thrown around numbers for Yonah. What about Conroe? Where are those numbers?

I think your right about Anand and others. But you see that is the whole point I was trying to say from the beginning. Why doesnt Intel let Anand and others configure the test setup? I'm sure that if we had at least three INDEPENDANT sources build, configure, bench, and compare individually, without Intel interfering, then it would be possible to get a clear picture. Until then its nothing more then FUD.

I really dont think that will happen until launch day tho.
 
$BangforThe$ said:
I on the other hand am intel only. With me its not really about the most FPS its all around usage. Even thow I can afford to buy new every 6 months I don't . I buy for the long term . Intel to me with the northy's had a great cpu and platform to match. Thats not to say I haven't had setbacks but for the mostpart those were directly linked to MS.

I am getting pretty old so I want conroe to be perfect for me. I want this to be my last personnel computer. I also want a PC I can sell that I can point to a say this is as good as it gets period. The last generation had to many doudts for me from both Intel and AMD

Intel was a bit slower and heat was an issue . AMD have to many problems on the platform side of things.
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Which is why your opinion doesn't count
;)
 
MrGuvernment said:
Prior to Nforce4 - chipset problems - i am sure makers (dfi et cetera) comtributed but a AMD system never seemd to be put in all the parts, turn it on and off you go - seemed more like - turn it on, flash the bios, tweak the bios, then try this ram, or that ram, and eventually you can then install windows.

Nforce 4 was a god send - the amd systems i have @ work now are flawless! But the intel based ones have always been for me, assemble and go, done.
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Erm, maybe for overclocking it would be beneficial to flash the bios. However other than that every amd has had no issue running at stock and just installing windows o_O Intel seems to have the same issue, my buddy's epox 945g (I think) has some issues ocing with the def. bios, I flashed and it was fine.
 
duby229 said:
First Yonah, and Conroe are not the same chip. Yonah was designed to meet the power requirements of a mobile computer. Conroe was designed to meet the power requirements of a desktop computer. So far all you've done is thrown around numbers for Yonah. What about Conroe? Where are those numbers?

I think your right about Anand and others. But you see that is the whole point I was trying to say from the beginning. Why doesnt Intel let Anand and others configure the test setup? I'm sure that if we had at least three INDEPENDANT sources build, configure, bench, and compare individually, without Intel interfering, then it would be possible to get a clear picture. Until then its nothing more then FUD.

I really dont think that will happen until launch day tho.
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what would intel lose if the processor is so great?
 
duby229 said:
First Yonah, and Conroe are not the same chip. Yonah was designed to meet the power requirements of a mobile computer. Conroe was designed to meet the power requirements of a desktop computer. So far all you've done is thrown around numbers for Yonah. What about Conroe? Where are those numbers?

I think your right about Anand and others. But you see that is the whole point I was trying to say from the beginning. Why doesnt Intel let Anand and others configure the test setup? I'm sure that if we had at least three INDEPENDANT sources build, configure, bench, and compare individually, without Intel interfering, then it would be possible to get a clear picture. Until then its nothing more then FUD.

I really dont think that will happen until launch day tho.
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Yes they are different Processors but not as different as Yonah to Pentium D, not even close IMHO. Intel worked just as hard on making sure Conroe ran cool and used less power than they did on making it fast. I say again, they couldn't show temps because the FX was overclocked. IMHO Conroe will be much like Yonah.

I want to see at least 8 sites do independant tests and in this order.
[H] and not trying to kiss up to them.
PC Perspective
GamePC
Lost Circuits
Anantech tied Tom's
ExtremeTech
Tech-Report

They use just enough different software to get a better Performance Picture and enough of the same to compare to eachother.

Then later read others like Hot Hardware, Ace's and etc... I like to read Anti, Pro and Nutrual sites. Fansites like the AMDZone is a waste of a click!

Nope, I don't have Conroe temps and have only estimated what it MIGHT do.

I wouldn't call it FUB since the folks at the Inq have never been friends of Intel. That other site tested AMD2 and didn't get much different results than Tom's. Maybe there's a problem with the controller and Higher latency DDR2?

XtremeSystems "3GHz is faster than 3.4GHz X2."
AMD (117 Viewing)
Intel (34 Viewing)

Dewd I visit their forums, they are full of AMD Fan boys, hell even the mods are AMD biased. Almost as bad as the AMDZone and way worse that AMDMobo. Best case so far for AMD2 has been 5% on one app, -2 to 2.5% on a lot of others.

http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=30290

The guys that ran some benchmarks on those machines confirmed that you can expect three to five per cent performance increase and that is about it.
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Donnie27 said:
XtremeSystems "3GHz is faster than 3.4GHz X2."
AMD (117 Viewing)
Intel (34 Viewing)

Dewd I visit their forums, they are full of AMD Fan boys, hell even the mods are AMD biased. Almost as bad as the AMDZone and way worse that AMDMobo. Best case so far for AMD2 has been 5% on one app, -2 to 2.5% on a lot of others.

http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=30290
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Fugger, the owner is intel only... XS seems to alternate depending on who's leader... back in the p4c days it was the opposite.In fact I haven't seen ANY of them badmouth dothan, they like what's performing best in 3dmark :eek:
 
sabrewolf732 said:
Fugger, the owner is intel only... XS seems to alternate depending on who's leader... back in the p4c days it was the opposite.In fact I haven't seen ANY of them badmouth dothan, they like what's performing best in 3dmark :eek:
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I like Fugger but I did say Mods didn't I? saaya for example?
 
sabrewolf732 said:
Fugger, the owner is intel only... XS seems to alternate depending on who's leader... back in the p4c days it was the opposite.In fact I haven't seen ANY of them badmouth dothan, they like what's performing best in 3dmark :eek:
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Oh wait, the Index page showed something like AMD= 92 and Intel = 19 during the highest point of the Northwood C kicking AthlonXP's ass. Like this one, that Site has never shown more folks on the Intel side unless they were AMD fans bashing Intel LOL!
 
duby229 said:
First Yonah, and Conroe are not the same chip. Yonah was designed to meet the power requirements of a mobile computer. Conroe was designed to meet the power requirements of a desktop computer. So far all you've done is thrown around numbers for Yonah. What about Conroe? Where are those numbers?

I think your right about Anand and others. But you see that is the whole point I was trying to say from the beginning. Why doesnt Intel let Anand and others configure the test setup? I'm sure that if we had at least three INDEPENDANT sources build, configure, bench, and compare individually, without Intel interfering, then it would be possible to get a clear picture. Until then its nothing more then FUD.

I really dont think that will happen until launch day tho.
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First you say that conroe is a P3 than you say that Conroe and Yonah are differant but yonah comes from the same P3 core so are they the same P3 cores or did Intel make 2 of them . Be consistant man your all over the place either their glorified P3 or their not.

I think we well see benchies long before the release.
 
$BangforThe$ said:
First you say that conroe is a P3 than you say that Conroe and Yonah are differant but yonah comes from the same P3 core so are they the same P3 cores or did Intel make 2 of them . Be consistant man your all over the place either their glorified P3 or their not.

I think we well see benchies long before the release.
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Because they're derived off of the same tech. does not make them the SAME. That's like saying a p3 is a yonah. Obviously there are differances. Way to be a hypocrite and attempt to call me primitive huh? When I've obviously tried both companies. Only thing I have issues with is inconsistent, half assed, and or bullshit information. A64 is extremely similar to the AXP, and is based off of AXP design. But you can't call them the same :eek: And what I don't understand is how you people that flame somehow don't get banned even though it's explicitely stated that no flaming is allowed.
 
sabrewolf732 said:
Because they're derived off of the same tech. does not make them the SAME. That's like saying a p3 is a yonah. Obviously there are differances. Way to be a hypocrite and attempt to call me primitive huh? When I've obviously tried both companies. Only thing I have issues with is inconsistent, half assed, and or bullshit information. A64 is extremely similar to the AXP, and is based off of AXP design. But you can't call them the same :eek: And what I don't understand is how you people that flame somehow don't get banned even though it's explicitely stated that no flaming is allowed.
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No they're not. Soon we'll see that the 14 pipes and 4 issue core is completely different than P3. That's like saying Athlon64 X2 is nothing but a glorified Dual core K6-2. It's said t that the P3 was used as a guide, not a mold!

I just wish folks stop having short memories to suit their point. Last month, before IDF we were saying Conroe *should be kick ass.
 
Donnie27 said:
No they're not. Soon we'll see that the 14 pipes and 4 issue core is completely different than P3. That's like saying Athlon64 X2 is nothing but a glorified Dual core K6-2. It's said t that the P3 was used as a guide, not a mold!

I just wish folks stop having short memories to suit their point. Last month, before IDF we were saying Conroe *should be kick ass.
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Well, i think the idea of it having similarities comes from P-M having SEVERAL (ALOT) of similarities to the p3 and yonah and conroh stemmed off of the p3. The similar architecture is there, just expanded over two generations. Much like how grandchildren can look nothing like their grandfather, but they still share some things genetically. Horrible analogy I know but only thing I could think of :p
 
sabrewolf732 said:
Well, i think the idea of it having similarities comes from P-M having SEVERAL (ALOT) of similarities to the p3 and yonah and conroh stemmed off of the p3. The similar architecture is there, just expanded over two generations. Much like how grandchildren can look nothing like their grandfather, but they still share some things genetically. Horrible analogy I know but only thing I could think of :p
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Conroe does borrow some things from Pioneered on NetBurst Architecture such as EM64T, SSE2, Quad Pumped FSB, the branch prediction lessons of Prescott.

However it's more similar to Yonah as both those processors adopt the High IPC philosophy with low power consumption.
 
coldpower27 said:
Conroe does borrow some things from Pioneered on NetBurst Architecture such as EM64T, SSE2, Quad Pumped FSB, the branch prediction lessons of Prescott.

However it's more similar to Yonah as both those processors adopt the High IPC philosophy with low power consumption.
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Most of those were pioneered on Netburst, except EM64T. That was pioneered on the K8 IIRC :p

I want to see CSI replace the 4xFSB though. That will be an interesting bus
 
robberbaron said:
Most of those were pioneered on Netburst, except EM64T. That was pioneered on the K8 IIRC :p

I want to see CSI replace the 4xFSB though. That will be an interesting bus
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Well first Intel based architecture to have it I am refering AMD, AMD need not apply. And for X86-64 NetBurst got it first for the Intel side.
 
sabrewolf732 said:
Well, i think the idea of it having similarities comes from P-M having SEVERAL (ALOT) of similarities to the p3 and yonah and conroh stemmed off of the p3. The similar architecture is there, just expanded over two generations. Much like how grandchildren can look nothing like their grandfather, but they still share some things genetically. Horrible analogy I know but only thing I could think of :p
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Actually a good analogy, now add to that Family tree one Parent that's half P4 and another that's half AMD since it has all of the 64bit registers?
 
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